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Rednecks_Slayer

POLL: My idea for RADAR and HYDRO, like in real life

Radar and Hydro like in the real life: shoe discovered ships (position, movement) on the mini-map only.  

27 members have voted

  1. 1. After you read my proposition below, do you think this is a good, decent, more real proposition for a Radar and Hydro?

    • Yes, I like to keep thing close to reality, even if this is a game.
      4
    • No, I grinded those ships with radar (or I bought them) and now i want to profit, so I like the unrealistic aspect of the radar and hydro.
      23

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In real life, RADAR and HYDRO-ACOUSTIC SEARCH don't make objects magically appear in front of your eyes! You can't see what you can't see! Radar and Hydro make objects appear on a monitor screen. Radar and Hydro show the position and the movement of an object on a screen.

So:

- give Radar and Hydro longer ranges (like 20 km) and longer times (like 2-3 minutes);

- for the seek of the arcade aspect of this game, let them even discover ships behind islands;

But:

- make those discovered enemy ships appear ONLY on the mini-map, so the team can see the position and the movement of that ship!

This way, we keep the aspect of game more realistic and the benefits are: teammates can see on the mini-map where an enemy DD is, where it moves, behind which island it hides.

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If 'real life' is your justification, it's worth mentioning that Radar was always on and could give not just location and bearing, but also speed, and in the US and RN case, fed into an FCS Range Clock to allow guns to automatically fire at where the enemy unit was, and land *first* salvo hits on ships that they couldn't even see, including DD sized vessels.

Edited by _RC1138

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The poll options are extremely biased. Plus since WW2 there has been radar fire control, they didnt need to see the targets proven by the USS West Virginia hitting with the first salve using radar at 22,800 yards in the dark.

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4 minutes ago, 1nv4d3rZ1m said:

The poll options are extremely biased. Plus since WW2 there has been radar fire control, they didnt need to see the targets proven by the USS West Virginia hitting with the first salve using radar at 22,800 yards in the dark.

But the ships didn't magically appear in front of their eyes.

Regarding my poll, if you are not able to feel the joke and the irony, just take it like a YES or NO. YES OR NO are not biased. Thank you!

Edited by Rednecks_Slayer

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5 minutes ago, _RC1138 said:

If 'real life' is your justification, it's worth mentioning that Radar was always on and could give not just location and bearing, but also speed. .

Very well, noted.

But I have a question for you: what good is for you to know the speed of a ship? You can see the ship anyway, moving on the mini-map. So, what is your point here?

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1 minute ago, Rednecks_Slayer said:

But the ships didn't magically appear in front of their eyes.

I'll make a deal, you can make enemy ships not draw (as in, be shown visually) on the ocean, but I can still target and shoot them with the guaranteed ability to land at least a few shells. Sure, I'll make that trade. Cause that's how it actually worked in reality.

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Just now, Rednecks_Slayer said:

Very well, noted.

But I have a question for you: what good is for you to know the speed of a ship? You can see the ship anyway, moving on the mini-map. So, what is your point here?

Among other things, can give up the ability range a shot in the dark at them. And assuming you make radar work the way it did in real life, my guns should automatically target the invisible ship and land a few shells since that's how radar worked in real life.

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Just now, Rednecks_Slayer said:

But the ships didn't magically appear in front of their eyes.

Of course radar does not make the targets glow, however the radar figured directly into a firing solution. The closest analog would probably be auto aiming ships lit by radar since the minimap does not give enough information to aim at maneuvering targets.

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8 minutes ago, Rednecks_Slayer said:

In real life, RADAR and HYDRO-ACOUSTIC SEARCH don't make objects magically appear in front of your eyes! You can't see what you can't see! Radar and Hydro make objects appear on a monitor screen. Radar and Hydro show the position and the movement of an object on a screen.

So:

- give Radar and Hydro longer ranges (like 20 km) and longer times (like 2-3 minutes);

- for the seek of the arcade aspect of this game, let them even discover ships behind islands;

But:

- make those discovered enemy ships appear ONLY on the mini-map, so the team can see the position and the movement of that ship!

This way, we keep the aspect of game more realistic and the benefits are: teammates can see on the mini-map where an enemy DD is, where it moves, behind which island it hides.

Don't take this the wrong way, but discussions about the game being more realistic (something I strongly wish was the case) is a waste of time.  Other than ship's visual appearances, World of Warships has next to nothing to do with reality.  If anything, WoWS has become less realistic over time!  So don't get your hopes up.

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1 minute ago, 1nv4d3rZ1m said:

Of course radar does not make the targets glow, however the radar figured directly into a firing solution. The closest analog would probably be auto aiming ships lit by radar since the minimap does not give enough information to aim at maneuvering targets.

Pretty much exactly this. Have radar give guns basically hard mode quality bot auto-aim and you've pretty much got EXACTLY how radar worked on the USN and RN ships in real life. Oh and out to the full range of the guns (since most sets could see PAST gun range in reality).

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1 minute ago, Kuckoo said:

Don't take this the wrong way, but discussions about the game being more realistic (something I strongly wish was the case) is a waste of time.  Other than ship's visual appearances, World of Warships has next to nothing to do with reality.  If anything, WoWS has become less realistic over time!  So don't get your hopes up.

I always said WoWs has about as much in common with real life as Star Wars does. The physics in WoWs is so wonky it's genuinely disturbing. I mean things like momentum genuinely don't exist.

Edited by _RC1138

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1 minute ago, _RC1138 said:

Among other things, can give up the ability range a shot in the dark at them. And assuming you make radar work the way it did in real life, my guns should automatically target the invisible ship and land a few shells since that's how radar worked in real life.

Man, you can shoot your guns wherever you want in this game, ok? The real problem here, with this radar, is that it makes ships magically appear in front of our eyes!

Of course, developers could think something like a shade on the ocean to shoot at, or whatever, but not a brand new shinny ship who magically appear in smoke or in open water.

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7 minutes ago, Rednecks_Slayer said:

Man, you can shoot your guns wherever you want in this game, ok? The real problem here, with this radar, is that it makes ships magically appear in front of our eyes!

No, the only problem with radar is pedantic little [edited] don't understand what a HUGE game changer it was in real life, and warfare ISN"T fair. Nor do they understand, in literally NOT a single game (PvE or PvP) does a Stealth unit get to stay stealthed at ALL times while spamming attacks. Even in ME2, a Single Player game, if you cloak and fire, you decloak. Only in WoWs do some players EXPECT to remain invisible at all times. There is NO version of the argument against radar that doesn't boil down to pissed off ninja-wanabes pissed off that their HIGHLY unreasonable desire to be stealthed 100% of the time is being hindered.

Edited by _RC1138
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You people are really toxic.

You are AGAINST everything, you simply negate everything!

If it's WHITE you want it BLACK, if it's BLACK you want it WHITE, if it's WHITE WITH BLACK STRIPES OR BLACK WITH WHITE STRIPES you want it GREY!

How can you live with yourselves?

OMG, I already can feel the poison in my veins. I made 2 polls here and I already can feel your negative energy and thoughts who poison my life.

I'M OUT OF HERE, GOOD BYE!

Edited by Rednecks_Slayer
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14 minutes ago, Kuckoo said:

Don't take this the wrong way, but discussions about the game being more realistic (something I strongly wish was the case) is a waste of time.  Other than ship's visual appearances, World of Warships has next to nothing to do with reality.  If anything, WoWS has become less realistic over time!  So don't get your hopes up.

And the ship names!  Don't forget those, those are very real!

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Instead of changing radar I would just get rid of proxy spotting. If you don't have a line of site to the target you don't see it although you could still use map firing.

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7 minutes ago, Rednecks_Slayer said:

You people are really toxic.

You are AGAINST everything, you simply negate everything!

If it's WHITE you want it BLACK, if it's BLACK you want it WHITE, if it's WHITE WITH BLACK STRIPES OR BLACK WITH WHITE STRIPES you want it GREY!

How can you live with yourselves?

Disagreeing with you =/= toxicity. Believe it or not, and I know in the modern world this has gotten hard to understand, but people can think differently and/or know things that you don't.

The only reason YOU and others hate radar is that you have the (unreasonable) expectation that an invisible unit/rouge unit/letsbehonestandjustsayDD can REMAIN invisible at all times, spamming attacks. From a *gameplay* standpoint, this is literally unheard of; there are no games where a stealth unit can cast an attack and remain stealthed. Even in SINGLE PLAYER GAMES this isn't how it works. And if gameplay reasons are not enough, then historically radar was enough of a game changer than Japanese Captains cite it as the number 1 cause of their defeat; radar having OVER THE HORIZON capabilities, and tied into FCS's, could allow ships to fire at a targets, and HIT those targets, without being able to see the fall of their own shells. Radar is super powerful because RADAR IS SUPER POWERFUL. If you all have such a [edited]problem with being spotted by radar, and want to kill targets without threat to your own ship's body, WHY THE [edited] do you people not play CV's?

Edited by _RC1138

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4 minutes ago, _RC1138 said:

I always said WoWs has about as much in common with real life as Star Wars does. The physics in WoWs is so wonky it's genuinely disturbing. I mean things like momentum genuinely don't exist.

One of the things that has annoyed me about this game since day one is the kinetic prowess of the ships.  They all move with an almost slot-car like scale.  Acceleration, top speed,turning, stopping; it's all over the top.  Sure, the bigger boats are scaled to move more sluggish relative to smaller boats, but even they are other-worldly maneuverable compared to their real-world counterparts.  That the visual ship models look as good as they do only emphasizes their cartoony performance.

...and don't get me started on how stupidly out of scale the ships are with the environment.  Land masses and all the objects on them look like LEGO Land next to the ships.  With respect to the environment the ships are visually twice as large as they should be, and move around roughly four times as fast.

Without even getting into the gimmicks, one could write a paper on what is "off" about WoWS.

 

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28 minutes ago, Rednecks_Slayer said:

In real life, RADAR and HYDRO-ACOUSTIC SEARCH don't make objects magically appear in front of your eyes! You can't see what you can't see! Radar and Hydro make objects appear on a monitor screen. Radar and Hydro show the position and the movement of an object on a screen.

So:

- give Radar and Hydro longer ranges (like 20 km) and longer times (like 2-3 minutes);

- for the seek of the arcade aspect of this game, let them even discover ships behind islands;

But:

- make those discovered enemy ships appear ONLY on the mini-map, so the team can see the position and the movement of that ship!

This way, we keep the aspect of game more realistic and the benefits are: teammates can see on the mini-map where an enemy DD is, where it moves, behind which island it hides.

There is nothing realistic about this proposal  IRL, hydro didn't work unless the ship was going under 14 knots, the sound of the cavitation from the ships own propellers drowned it out.

Radar was new, it couldn't detect the difference between a ship and a coral reef. Not to mention ships operated under radio silence so the only ships you would see is what you detected 

If we have good suggestions to make changes that's fine, but the rationale of realism doesn't hold water. And its not a simulator

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"No, I grinded those ships with radar (or I bought them) and now i want to profit, so I like the unrealistic aspect of the radar and hydro."

:cap_yes:

Fair and balance poll...

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14 minutes ago, Rednecks_Slayer said:

You people are really toxic.

You are AGAINST everything, you simply negate everything!

If it's WHITE you want it BLACK, if it's BLACK you want it WHITE, if it's WHITE WITH BLACK STRIPES OR BLACK WITH WHITE STRIPES you want it GREY!

How can you live with yourselves?

OMG, I already can feel the poison in my veins. I made 2 polls here and I already can feel your negative energy and thoughts who poison my life.

I'M OUT OF HERE, GOOD BYE!

So people disagreeing, having a different viewpoint or opinion, or simply calling something as it is, is being toxic?

Lol, ok.

The game is what it is.  Most of us recognize that.  Live with it or gtfo.

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How do you shoot the DD then? Blind firing involves having a bad, slow opponent, and a little luck.

There is no way to track and fire on a target moving simply on the mini map.

Furthermore, it doesn't help you spot the DD to fire either because you have to catch them. Unless you're in a French Cruiser that's not exactly easy.

This would make Cruisers much worse at hunting DDs.

On the other hand it might lower DD damage as well, with torps being easier to predict. Which would mean the BBs do better which they don't really need help with. 

It would make Cruisers worse, and they're basically the underdogs of the 3 ships.

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Actually judging by the poll choices this dude is not listening to feedback on this...

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6 minutes ago, Madwolf05 said:

How do you shoot the DD then? Blind firing involves having a bad, slow opponent, and a little luck.

There is no way to track and fire on a target moving simply on the mini map.

Furthermore, it doesn't help you spot the DD to fire either because you have to catch them. Unless you're in a French Cruiser that's not exactly easy.

This would make Cruisers much worse at hunting DDs.

On the other hand it might lower DD damage as well, with torps being easier to predict. Which would mean the BBs do better which they don't really need help with. 

It would make Cruisers worse, and they're basically the underdogs of the 3 ships.

According to the DD mafia, just knowing where the DD is counters DDs too hard already. You know where the torps are coming from so the DD is not going to be able to accomplish anything. If you want to actually get the DD then get your own DD.

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