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goldeagle1123

Will we ever get a good Italian premium? (That isn't a tier 5)

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Guess this just more or less me complaining but hey I'll own it. Can we get an Italian ship that isn't hot garbage like D'aosta and Abruzzi, or mediocre in the case of Roma? With the obvious exception being the  OP Cesare, but that's a tier 5. I have thing for Italian ships, and they were a legitimate naval power, moreso at least than what one might call "Pan-Asia", at least for time period of this game. 

There are plenty of Italian cruisers to pick from and there were 4 Littorio-class battleships,  and as with the tier 8 American BBs WG has shown they have no problem releasing de facto clones of ships already in the game and just making up stats to make them unique. So why not give us Vittorio Veneto, or perhaps a destroyer.

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Just now, goldeagle1123 said:

 So why not give us Vittorio Veneto, or perhaps a destroyer.

You asked for good, what makes these good? honest question

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5 minutes ago, CriMiNaL__ said:

You asked for good, what makes these good? honest question

Whatever arbitrary stats Wargaming decides to give them, is what makes them good.

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1 minute ago, goldeagle1123 said:

Whatever arbitrary stats Wargaming decides to give them, is what makes them good.

well not really, if their dd was slow poor rate of fire and short range torps with no smoke abilities and wg made it the same, I do not think anyone would think it was good, you asked for good, and named a ship, but what makes this one good

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1 minute ago, CriMiNaL__ said:

well not really, if their dd was slow poor rate of fire and short range torps with no smoke abilities and wg made it the same, I do not think anyone would think it was good, you asked for good, and named a ship, but what makes this one good

WG takes "liberties" with these ships all of the time. They give ahistorical consumables, equipment, gimmicks, etc. to ships all of the time. Same goes for stats. They just pull the in-game secondary ranges, detection values, sigma, etc. basically out of thin air, or determine them arbitrarily, with little or no basis at all in reality. They could easily just decide to give Veneto a 1.9 or 2.0 sigma as her gimmick, or something just as arbitrary. That's my point.

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If WG would fix Abruzzi AP so it wasn't complete and utter trash outside of around 8km, Abruzzi would be better. If they didn't have garbage HE stats, the line would be better. If the broken USN CL didn't absorb the gimmick of hydro + dfaa, the cruisers would still be unique.

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But you still haven't said whats good about these particular ships, fair enough wg changes things, but they still go off what it had, your asking for good, is this for the sake of just making a fake good one, or was it good in reality.

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Well, since the glorious achievements of the Italian navy seem to consist of being sunk at anchor by biplanes, and fleeing from anything flying a Union Jack, it may be a while.

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10 minutes ago, CriMiNaL__ said:

well not really, if their dd was slow poor rate of fire and short range torps with no smoke abilities and wg made it the same, I do not think anyone would think it was good, you asked for good, and named a ship, but what makes this one good

No smoke? Do you know something about Italian destroyer development you would like to share with the class?

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Just now, Sparviero said:

No smoke? Do you know something about Italian destroyer development you would like to share with the class?

that was only an example of what it might have had, I'm not asking for a good Italian DD, for all I know they might have been complete trash, so you would be hard pressed by suddenly making it good in wows

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7 minutes ago, CriMiNaL__ said:

that was only an example of what it might have had, I'm not asking for a good Italian DD, for all I know they might have been complete trash, so you would be hard pressed by suddenly making it good in wows

Could you try again in some way that might actually make sense?

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3 minutes ago, Sparviero said:

Could you try again in some way that might actually make sense?

I apologise if you cannot comprehend what was written, i will type slower for you.

well the OP is asking for a good premium italian ship, he has named one but not said how good the real one was, just that they want a good one regardless of how it actually performed.

You would probably find that most of the iti ships were trash and wg is reflecting that in the ships they have produced so far, so asking for a good one might be a huge stretch

 

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Roma just needs its HE removed and replaced with Semi-Armor Piercing. Which is a shell it actually carried for lightly armored targets like cruisers.

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Abruzzi actually plays ok, from my experiance. If we get the Zara as a tier 8, i would think it would play similar to a hipper but more accurate guns that fire slower and no torpedoes, basicilly a less powerful hipper. Perhaps wargames would give it a gimick to increase its power but who knows.

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1 minute ago, SteeLeviathan said:

Abruzzi actually plays ok, from my experiance. If we get the Zara as a tier 8, i would think it would play similar to a hipper but more accurate guns that fire slower and no torpedoes, basicilly a less powerful hipper. Perhaps wargames would give it a gimick to increase its power but who knows.

Abruzzi AP is still absolutely unforgivably garbage beyond 8km and needs to be fixed.

Zara would hopefully involve some actual bow plating to bounce anything non-yamato and become an exceptionally tanky cruiser like she actually was in life.

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Wargaming really missed a golden opportunity here....two types of AP shell...one for BB and one for CA/DD NO HE AT ALL

But nah we gotta cater to the morons who can't work out how AP penetration works...so gotta throw fire at someone like a moron. 

Roma was a spectacular turd...with gimmicks to make it good...Abruzzi was a joke (heal....really?) Duca is moderately a good ship, depending on if you're paid up with Satan...and the Ceaser is a straight up bribe to keep the Italophiles happy. 

I've been begging-pleading-hoping for a good ship that has armor and guns that isn't a F'ed up gimmick.

Gimmie a solid tier 8 cruiser with 8 inch guns, and that sexy candy cane on the front...and I'll happily shut up. 

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9 minutes ago, DoIphin_Princess said:

image.thumb.png.9f4376df8b5a63a25b1bdc26df4e4bc0.png

Since when was Duca "hot garbage"?

Its quite good with IFHE

Ive found both Italian cruisers rely heavily on high skill point captains (at least 14 points) and a player that can take advantage of their strengths.  Theyre very demanding ships.  I think thats why people dont like them.

Hell, i hated Duca till i got my captain to the 14 point mark.  Theyre definitely not new player friendly, so that equates to garbage to some.

Of course, once you get your captain and your personal skills up, those ships are tons of fun to play.

 

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16 hours ago, DoIphin_Princess said:

image.thumb.png.9f4376df8b5a63a25b1bdc26df4e4bc0.png

Since when was Duca "hot garbage"?

Its quite good with IFHE

That's insane. 

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3 hours ago, KiyoSenkan said:

Roma just needs its HE removed and replaced with Semi-Armor Piercing. Which is a shell it actually carried for lightly armored targets like cruisers.

While that would make Roma much more playable, my biggest issue isn't her complete inability to engage cruisers, due to overpens, but her unbeleivably bad dispersion. I literally consistently miss full broadside Bismarcks and North Carolinas at 8km due to her atrocious dispersion, god forbid I try to hit anything smaller, or that has a citadel.

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2 hours ago, DoIphin_Princess said:

image.thumb.png.9f4376df8b5a63a25b1bdc26df4e4bc0.png

Since when was Duca "hot garbage"?

Its quite good with IFHE

Anecdotal minuscule sample size data.< The fact that her stats make her objectively the worst T6 cruiser, no to mention the consensus built the community and every major reviewer.

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13 hours ago, goldeagle1123 said:

While that would make Roma much more playable, my biggest issue isn't her complete inability to engage cruisers, due to overpens, but her unbeleivably bad dispersion. I literally consistently miss full broadside Bismarcks and North Carolinas at 8km due to her atrocious dispersion, god forbid I try to hit anything smaller, or that has a citadel.

Her dispersion isn't that bad, hyperbole helps nobody.

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To use a football/soccer term I would say the work rate for results in regards to D'Aosta, Abruzzi and Roma seem a bit off. However because they all have small specialized communities I don't see any changes being made. Roma especially would be a pickle to Balans™. Abruzzi would probably be the easiest of all. Needing a bit of drag/penetration improvement for AP as I could only dream of an armor rework that allows for actual overpen. :cap_like:

Honestly D'Aosta is probably fine. You just have to be prepared to giphy.gif if destroyers don't just line themselves up for the slaughter. :fish_viking:


The discussion point was new premiums.

Destroyers would need a gimmick or a paper/construction started not finished premium. TRB with the sea mines would be interesting.

Heavy cruisers could definitely work.

One of the battlecruiser projects would make a fun tier VII premium.

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