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Prkl8r

RN CL's still worth using in the current meta?

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I haven't played my RN CLs for awhile and I was wondering how they do these days.

From everything I see, smoke camping is dead as you will get torped/radared almost immediately.

From what I remember though, if you try and do anything in the open in an RN CL you will immediately become the focus of every ship in gun range because everybody knows how easy they are to kill.

Is this a dead line now?

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why would anyone play a RN CL when the worcester is better in every aspect? 

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Fiji is still very strong.  Would rather play Neptune more than Minotaur these days.

Still a good line for Randoms and t7 ranked if it ever  comes back.

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Just now, SmokeHenge said:

Fiji is still very strong.  Would rather play Neptune more than Minotaur these days.

Still a good line for Randoms and t7 ranked if it ever  comes back.

IMHO, Fiji is still a strong contender, she rivals Helena as my favorite tier 7 CL. She's also my most played ship. I like Fiji (and Helena) more than Belfast. I tried Minotaur and wasn't impressed. Her RoF is awesome but it's no good if the ship is mega-squishy, she makes Atlanta look tanky. I too think that Neptune is better than Minotaur.

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15 minutes ago, Hanger_18 said:

why would anyone play a RN CL when the worcester is better in every aspect? 

So basically, power creep ruined the line?

Cool...

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Just now, Prkl8r said:

So basically, power creep ruined the line?

Cool...

Actually im expecting IFHE to be outright removed at some point. at which point the worcester might actually be balanced.

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19 minutes ago, Hanger_18 said:

why would anyone play a RN CL when the worcester is better in every aspect? 

Cause it isn't? Mino absolutely rapes the Wooster.

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I think smoke actually hurts this line more than it helps at this point.

One because smoking and shooting is more of a trap now than it is a strategy.

Two because it was used as an excuse to make these ships super squishy with massive citadels. The problem being that smoke is currently not really a usable tactic.

 

If I did play my RN CLs at this point, I'd bring radar instead of smoke.

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I don't see how RN CLs are made irrelevant by USN CLs and other Radar Cruisers.


The solution was always simple.

 

Don't smoke up so d*mn close to the enemy.  In addition, the presence of teammates makes the prospect of a Radar Cruiser pushing up for a smoked up RN CL dangerous for the Radar Cruiser.

 

Problem solved.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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1 minute ago, Vaffu said:

Cause it isn't? Mino absolutely rapes the Wooster.

In a one v one fight, probably, that's not what we're talking about though.

We're talking about the general effectiveness of the ships as whole. 

Now I haven't played the Worcaster, but based on the stats and how it looks, I'd believe that it is, generally, better than the Mino, can't say for certain though.

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Just now, Prkl8r said:

In a one v one fight, probably, that's not what we're talking about though.

We're talking about the general effectiveness of the ships as whole. 

Now I haven't played the Worcaster, but based on the stats and how it looks, I'd believe that it is, generally, better than the Mino, can't say for certain though.

Win rate wise I do believe the Mino is behind the Wooster but I have not checked lately. 

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Just now, HazeGrayUnderway said:

I don't see how RN CLs are made irrelevant by USN CLs and other Radar Cruisers.


The solution was always simple.

 

Don't smoke up so d*mn close to the enemy.

 

Problem solved.

I mean you can do that, but they have really short effective ranges. I mean the max range on Mino is ~15km, but it's difficult to really do great damage at anything greater than 12-14km, depending on what ship type you are shooting at.

Basically RN CLs do more damage the closer you get. Without the ability to get close, they do kinda meh damage.

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Just now, Prkl8r said:

I mean you can do that, but they have really short effective ranges. I mean the max range on Mino is ~15km, but it's difficult to really do great damage at anything greater than 12-14km, depending on what ship type you are shooting at.

Basically RN CLs do more damage the closer you get. Without the ability to get close, they do kinda meh damage.

Max range on a Mino is 18.3 KM and is effective right up to that range so long as your shells are landing on the superstructure.

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1 minute ago, Vaffu said:

Cause it isn't? Mino absolutely rapes the Wooster.

unless the mino catches it broadside, money on the worcester. 

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2 minutes ago, Vaffu said:

Max range on a Mino is 18.3 KM and is effective right up to that range so long as your shells are landing on the superstructure.

I think you're looking at a different ship, I literally have my game open right now and it says 15.8 km.

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7 minutes ago, Prkl8r said:

I mean you can do that, but they have really short effective ranges. I mean the max range on Mino is ~15km, but it's difficult to really do great damage at anything greater than 12-14km, depending on what ship type you are shooting at.

Basically RN CLs do more damage the closer you get. Without the ability to get close, they do kinda meh damage.

Those shells will still cause lots of problems on any ship caught by Mino.  When those RN CL AP shells are raining down on superstructures, BB or Cruiser, people won't like the effects on their ships.  12-14km is still super easy.  Minotaur especially with her high ROF makes it easy as all you do is hold the LMB down and walk the shells around until they start hitting.

 

In addition, when WoWS decides to shaft you with map locations with little to no island cover, that RN CL smoke is a godsend, all while the USN Cruisers are running around with no cover to protect their fragile, short engagement range ships.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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I'll also never understand why Mino has less armor than the average T10 destroyer.

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33 minutes ago, Prkl8r said:

From everything I see, smoke camping is dead as you will get torped/radared almost immediately.

This is an oversimplification. It can be done, but you have to be careful about it.

35 minutes ago, Prkl8r said:

you try and do anything in the open in an RN CL you will immediately become the focus of every ship in gun range because everybody knows how easy they are to kill.

This IS more or less true, so if you're going to do open-water stuff, be in the neighbourhood of more lethal threats and simply add your fire to their own. 

It requires a much more careful and exquisite knowledge of which enemy ships might be where, who wants to kill you and what tools they have (including friends who can fire on you when you've been radar-spotted or hydro'd in smoke). This is why you don't leave a friendly RN cruiser to fend for itself if you can help it; they are dependent on friends to not only ID targets for them but also let them know whether it's safe to reposition.

My nightmare as a British cruiser driver is a team that follows me in somewhere, then as soon as I'm smoked up they either hide behind the smoke (which blinds me and makes me useless), ram me broadside out of it in the enemy's full view to act as their meatshield (at least twice that I can remember), or scatter behind some other island (see point #1). If you're going to hide in my smoke in some confined space, FFS bring radar and trigger it so I can see to shoot something for as long as the radar is up.

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39 minutes ago, Hanger_18 said:

why would anyone play a RN CL when the worcester is better in every aspect? 

because the rest of the usn light cruiser line is not made of woosters 

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19 minutes ago, Prkl8r said:

I think you're looking at a different ship, I literally have my game open right now and it says 15.8 km.

Mods and captain skills make 18.3

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22 minutes ago, Hanger_18 said:

unless the mino catches it broadside, money on the worcester. 

I tear them up daily in my Mino and I am not good in cruisers at all.

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17 minutes ago, Prkl8r said:

I'll also never understand why Mino has less armor than the average T10 destroyer.

She's still a terrifying ship.  One of the worst Cruisers even for a BB to fall into a positional trap laid by a Mino.  Even BBs will see their HP quickly deplete.

 

There's also been an uptick over time of Radar Minotaurs.  It's not for the faint of heart and novice player, but those catch lots of people off guard.

 

Despite the paper armor, this is a very dangerous ship.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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26 minutes ago, Vaffu said:

Cause it isn't? Mino absolutely rapes the Wooster.

Unless you’re me, then it would be the opposite.

Ground up to Eddy, just barely, then sold everything except Emerald. Can’t deal with RN cruisers; can’t stand the inconsistency of SAP.

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4 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

She's still a terrifying ship.  One of the worst Cruisers even for a BB to fall into a positional trap laid by a Mino.  Even BBs will see their HP quickly deplete.

 

There's also been an uptick over time of Radar Minotaurs.  It's not for the faint of heart and novice player, but those catch lots of people off guard.

 

Despite the paper armor, this is a very dangerous ship.

I'm not debating that it's not a dangerous ship.

I'm just wondering if it's an effective ship these days. 

Back when I was playing these a lot, it was pretty easy to get 100k + damage per game in any of these ships from the Fiji up.

I doubt that's still the case, but was wondering, especially considering how much has changed and how much the radar meta has taken hold.

 

 

Another thing that seems to make it more difficult as well, is that people seem to be much better at blind firing into smoke now, with the map indicator and practice.

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4 minutes ago, Prkl8r said:

I'm not debating that it's not a dangerous ship.

I'm just wondering if it's an effective ship these days. 

Back when I was playing these a lot, it was pretty easy to get 100k + damage per game in any of these ships from the Fiji up.

I doubt that's still the case, but was wondering, especially considering how much has changed and how much the radar meta has taken hold.

Radar was always a threat before the USN CL Split happened.  Des Moines, Chapayev (decent stealth for a RU Cruiser and long range RU radar), Moskva., Old VIII NOLA (9.0km radar, 9.1km stealth build), Old IX Baltimore.

 

Nothing has changed.  There's only so many team roster slots available and not all these Radar Cruisers are popular.

 

The threat of Radar Cruisers to a Smoke Camping Cruiser is vastly different than to a Destroyer.  Smoke Camping Cruisers don't need to get so close to do decent work.  In contrast, DDs by nature of their job and weapons, are the ones that actually dive into those dangerous Radar ranges.  The threat of High Stealth Radar Cruisers with Radar range matching or surpassing their stealth detection ranges is also going out the window soon when the CE changes hit.  The only one able to do Stealth Radar will be... Radar Minotaur.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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