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Helmut__Kohl

Le Terrible: Short Review

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There seems to be a lot of uncertainty about this ship (no LWM review yet), so lets do a quick review.

Since I played DD at the highest level of Clan Wars and Ranked (EU Server), I have some experience to judge this ship. I am not trying to replace @LittleWhiteMouse though, who is probably working on a full review right now.


1. Guns

Le Terrible has 120k HE DPM.
That is not as good as Bensons (B-hull) 160k, but the ballistics on Le Terrible are better. They are in fact comparable to German DDs. Z-23 (T8) has 98k, Z-52 (TX) has 135k.
So the base DPM is actually quite decent, not far from Z-52 with similar ballistics.

Reload booster doubles that DPM for 15 seconds, giving you 240k.
To put this into perspective: Gearing/Yueyang have 216k, Harugumo has 240k.
Yes, your Harugumo DPM lasts only 15 seconds, but in that time you can do 22.200 HE damage to an enemy DD, if you hit every shot.

Base firechance is 10%, so very high even with 5 guns only.
Reload Booster enables you to quickly set perma-fires on a BB that just repaired a flooding.

Gun range is 12.3 without AFT and 14.7 with AFT. (Khaba with AFT has 13.5, Grozo with AFT has 14.7.)
German ballistics enable you to work those 14.7 if you want, but they are not railguns like Khaba has.

AP penetration is actually comparable to Khaba at 10km, but I will have to do more testing on that.

Gun traverse is very slow, but EM (especially on the unique captain) makes it alright.

The gun angles are not good, but still workable, especially at that kind of speed.
In 1v1 DD fights they can be a problem however, as it will force you to show more side, which makes it easier for you to be a victim of AP or torpedoes.
The strength of this ship is hunting down wounded DDs with insane speed and finishing them quickly with reload boost. It is not a cage-fighter.

2. Torpedoes

They have 8 km range. Your concealment is 6.7 km, allowing you to safely stealth torp. You cannot torpedo ships easily from behind, or safe-torp radar cruisers though.
You can only use 6 torps at each side and have to turn your ship around to use all 9.

But they are fast (65 knots) and hit as hard as Gearing torps at 18.4k dmg. Reaction time is also comparable to that of Gearing torps.
Overall they are still good for a Khaba-ish ship at T8, allowing you to play it like a hybrid.

3. Concealment

At 6.7 you will not be outspotting anything at the cap, but you can still chase them down and spot them quickly with your speed, especially if you have RPF.
You can actually spec RPF instead of AFT btw, because speed and maneuverability allow you to work with 12.3 km gun range, even without a heal - if you know what you are doing.

This ship will never dominate the caps, but in the late game, it can chase down wounded enemy DDs like a mothertrucker and gun them down furiously with reload boost.

4. Survivability

18.500 HP (Yueyang has 18.400).
Maneuverability (rudder und truning circle) is inbetween Gearing(3,3s/640m) and Grozovoi(4,6s/720m), at 4,3s/690m, but your speed is mad compared to them.

When the speed boost is active, this is the fastest ship in the game at 53.8 knots and feels very responsive.
Even without the speed boost, you can reach 45 knots (with Sierra Mike signal ofc).

Overall the speed allowed me to Khaba around easily, even without the heal/armor.
But you have to know what you are doing to be honest, just like in the Khaba itself.

AA is garbage, but you don't have Defensive Fire anyway.
Your speed will allow you to outrun CV torpedoes easily though, even without speed boost.

This has no smoke.
That means you will have to rely on your speed.

5. Key notes:

This will never be the cap dominator.
This will never be the CV devastator.

This is a Hybrid that can play like a T8 Khaba, but trades heal/smoke for a main gun reload booster, which enables you to get Harugumo HE DPM for 15 seconds.
Main difference to Khaba playstyle is that you have workable concealment at 6.7, decent torpedoes with 8 km range, and can get away with using RPF to hunt down DDs in the lategame.

Is it a "good" ship?
The performance is at least decent and the combination of speed+reload booster is unique and fun.
But this will never be an insane carry ship, because it lacks cap control.

This is also not a beginner ship. Just like Khaba, it requires experience and awareness.

Edited by Helmut__Kohl
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You have to trust that your speed will save you in this ship. You are so fast that enemy DDs can't even lock torpedoes on you, and cruisers can't track you, as long as you are keeping your speed in a straight line. 54 knots makes you a menace against even higher tier cruisers with low velocity shells. Similar problem to Aigle here though as even with IFHE, your damage output against bigger ships is ignorable. To everything that's not a DD you're just a nuisance. 

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7 minutes ago, Taichunger said:

Gun range?

Nice review. 

12.3 without AFT.

14.7 with AFT.

Ballistics are german, so you can work 14.7 if you want, but it doesn't have railguns just like Khaba.

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2 hours ago, Helmut__Kohl said:

a main gun reload booster, which enables you to get Harugumo HE DPM for 15 seconds.

Potentially against Tier 6 ships. Ouch.

 

A nicely written review. Like the ones Mouse writes, it lays all the ups and downs out for people to decide whether this ship is right for them.

Like the British destroyers, and to a certain extent Aigle, I get the feeling Le Terrible is a weird beast that needs to be played to a different set of rules from other destroyers. I suspect the salt miners are the ones who haven't realised that yet.

Edited by Ensign_Cthulhu
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Thank you for this review Helmut. 

It seems this boat is a mediocre in all but one thing - it excels at acceleration.  But from what the reports have been, even a hard landing seagull could damage the engines or rudder so ...... hmm.  

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Another niche non-Destroyer that can’t contest objectives in the current meta. I think it’s interesting that WG rushed this out without CC reviews. I suspect they knew this would be received poorly. 

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4 hours ago, Helmut__Kohl said:

 

As much as I love purchasing historical ships. Spending 50+ $ on decent is a no go for me. 

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4 hours ago, Helmut__Kohl said:

Reload booster doubles that DPM for 15 seconds, giving you 240k.
To put this into perspective: Gearing/Yueyang have 216k, Harugumo has 240k.
Yes, your Harugumo DPM lasts only 15 seconds, but in that time you can do 22.200 HE damage to an enemy DD, if you hit every shot.

The downside: The target has to be visible when MRB is active. I've seen videos where the target drops off and you end up wasting the MRB.

 

 

4 hours ago, Helmut__Kohl said:

Overall the speed allowed me to Khaba around easily, even without the heal/armor.
But you have to know what you are doing to be honest, just like in the Khaba itself.

The downside is that the engine steering modules break too easily based on some early reports.

4 hours ago, Helmut__Kohl said:

Main difference to Khaba playstyle is that you have workable concealment at 6.7, decent torpedoes with 8 km range, and can get away with using RPF to hunt down DDs in the lategame.

That's what I'm beginning to think the role of this ship is going to be; CL/DD hunter. You're not going to be a cap contester. 

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Nice review.   Personally, though, I don't see how this would fit in my fleet.  Speaking as someone who runs Harekaze and Akizuki at Tier VIII, and once had both Asashio and Kidd in the past.

Cheers.

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3 minutes ago, Bill_Halsey said:

That's what I'm beginning to think the role of this ship is going to be; CL/DD hunter. You're not going to be a cap contester. 

then we should see le terrible with a different mindset. she can't work as a DD, i think.

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6 minutes ago, Cruxdei said:

then we should see le terrible with a different mindset. she can't work as a DD, i think.

I said DD hunter. Something to hunt down and kill DD's. Ship's lousy in the cap contesting role.  

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7 minutes ago, Ann_Darrow said:

Personally, though, I don't see how this would fit in my fleet. 

That's the decision people need to make for themselves, isn't it? I think too often this aspect can be forgotten. When French destroyers eventually arrive, I can retrain their captains in my Aigle unless their playstyle and national flavour are so radically different that she's unsuitable (and even then I might be able to grin and bear it), and even then I might have more Elite Commander XP than God by that time and not even need a retrainer.

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48 minutes ago, Bill_Halsey said:

I said DD hunter. Something to hunt down and kill DD's. Ship's lousy in the cap contesting role.  

For lower tiers, maybe. With this reload, same or higher tiers won’t struggle with it much. 

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32 minutes ago, Thornir said:

With this reload, same or higher tiers won’t struggle with it much. 

This thing is super deadly for a T8 DD, if it fights enemy DDs on its own terms. 

6.7 concealment combined with that speed and maneuverability enables you to engage with your Harugumo DPM and then disengage again. 

You can also hunt down wounded DDs and finish them off like no other ship (if you spec RPF). 

But still it is lacking that most important cap control in the end. 

 

 

Edited by Helmut__Kohl

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I was anticipating the release of these ship as I enjoy the Aigle but highly disappointed how they released this. Speed seems to be its only forte. But what good is a DD without smoke? All you need is to be constantly radared or a good enemy CV keeping their planes on you and you have no chance at all in this thing. No heal...no smoke..bad AA. So what do we have here? Just a fast ship that turns like a truck?  What was WG thinking? Especially when all your CCs were saying it should not be released this way.

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I seem to like it. It is a different play style with the speed and no smoke. If you team up with another DD this thing can be deadly, with the 139mm Guns when you switch it to AP and Hit the reload boost after hunting someone you can wreck their whole day. I took at Atlanta down with 6 Citadels last night. At the end of the day this is more of a DD support ship with blazing speed. I play it more this weekend and mess with my captain a bit to get more out of it. 

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I sometimes look at the number of “DDs” out there that are really as much Cruisers, and wonder what WG is trying to tell us about the future of the game. 

The thing DDs get rewarded for, historically (in this game) is contesting objectives. With more radar and all these new, big gunboats that have massive DPM and/or speed...wth?

RN DDs are a step back in the right direction, but are they they future, or the Terrible types?

Edited by Thornir

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2 hours ago, Thornir said:

I sometimes look at the number of “DDs” out there that are really as much Cruisers, and wonder what WG is trying to tell us about the future of the game. 

The thing DDs get rewarded for, historically (in this game) is contesting objectives. With more radar and all these new, big gunboats that have massive DPM and/or speed...wth?

RN DDs are a step back in the right direction, but are they they future, or the Terrible types?

I like to have both, proper cap-controlling DDs as well as super-lightcruisers.

Different ship flavors and odd ducks is what keeps the game interesting. 

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Thanks for the overview OP.  Still not sold.  It looks like it's supposed to be like Kiev, but Kiev has useful shell arcs, shell speed, and smoke making her a more rounded DD.

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3 hours ago, Helmut__Kohl said:

I like to have both, proper cap-controlling DDs as well as super-lightcruisers.

Different ship flavors and odd ducks is what keeps the game interesting. 

Sure, if they are good ships. 

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Thanks for the review! 

Much shorter than mouse, but of course missing the subtle sexual inuendos and cute anime...

 

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