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COOP achievments

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Being able to get an achievement in the coop battles with the four bag haul is nice. Is there any way after the event that includes this ends to keep a achievement like this or add others to coop games it is nice to receive a reward for doing well in coops. I stopped playing pvp games after 8500 battles due to tiredness of mad people who do nothing but complain and report lowering your karma. Not that I was a great player or bad player I had a high 54% win rate but got sick of the constant nagging. I play coop strictly now and am enjoying the much more pleasant people in it and way more people play it then I thought. Some sort of achievements and rewards would be nice.

shot-18.10.22_03.01.59-0520.jpg

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Heck, even rewardless achievements. It'd be nice to have positive reinforcement and all that, as it just feels good.

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Sure would be nice for coop to get some love.  Performance acheesements that improve earnings would be nice.  Nothing quite like playing my New Orleans and Atlanta and losing money cuz coop earnings suck and repairs take it all and then some....

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Admiral Thunder has a whole system worked out.  A pretty good system, too.

I got my first Leviathan in my Shchors (actually got 7 kills that time).  Leviathan is 6 kills.

Happy reading. :)

CS

Edited by Captain_Slattery
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I play co op almost exclusively due to having a barely adequate lap top and ISP and the venomous rants of a few players in Randoms. I like the idea of these occasional awards in co op and agree it would be great if they are retained and expanded. However they should not become as rewarding as those in randoms. 

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II don’t think it’s actually a good idea to gives my additional positive reinforcement in coop matches. Coop, based on its form and rewards, isn’t meant to be played often. It’s introduced as more or less the tutorial+, showing players gameplay, without being too hard on them. You’re not meant to play it very often after the first few tiers, because the economy is crippling as service costs rise much more than rewards. There’s also an issue of false confidence, from playing too much coop in the beginning. Consistently good finishes in coop mean almost nothing against real players, and the meta is entirely different from the cautious play style pvp players possess. Extended pve play traps players, and makes it difficult, if not impossible to transition into the pvp matches that the devs designed the economy around. By providing players in coop with any more than just the most basic rewards, you are reinforcing the notion that they are playing well. In the best majority of cases, this is not true, they are clubbing unintelligent machines less skilled than even a beginner player. Rewards in coop will only provide players with false accomplishments, and any attempt to integrate into the “intended” community of pvp players, results in the pve player being hammered by veteran pvp players. Their ship destroyed and their ego bruised, they retreat back into pve, and unable to properly build up the skills they need in pvp. They are often trapped, unable to enter pvp for fear of being killed as they were the last time they tried. Achievements in pve would only serve to exacerbate the issue, and so I don’t consider them helpful to the playerbase

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11 minutes ago, Q___________Q said:

II don’t think it’s actually a good idea to gives my additional positive reinforcement in coop matches. Coop, based on its form and rewards, isn’t meant to be played often. It’s introduced as more or less the tutorial+, showing players gameplay, without being too hard on them. You’re not meant to play it very often after the first few tiers, because the economy is crippling as service costs rise much more than rewards. There’s also an issue of false confidence, from playing too much coop in the beginning. Consistently good finishes in coop mean almost nothing against real players, and the meta is entirely different from the cautious play style pvp players possess. Extended pve play traps players, and makes it difficult, if not impossible to transition into the pvp matches that the devs designed the economy around. By providing players in coop with any more than just the most basic rewards, you are reinforcing the notion that they are playing well. In the best majority of cases, this is not true, they are clubbing unintelligent machines less skilled than even a beginner player. Rewards in coop will only provide players with false accomplishments, and any attempt to integrate into the “intended” community of pvp players, results in the pve player being hammered by veteran pvp players. Their ship destroyed and their ego bruised, they retreat back into pve, and unable to properly build up the skills they need in pvp. They are often trapped, unable to enter pvp for fear of being killed as they were the last time they tried. Achievements in pve would only serve to exacerbate the issue, and so I don’t consider them helpful to the playerbase

Except that a significant portion of the player base has decided that Co-op is a viable game mode on its own. So offering some achievements to co-op players keeps that part of the player base happy. And since the payout for co-op is greatly reduced, the incentive for getting premium time starts sooner than in PvP. The name of the game for WG is making money, so if enough of the paying player base are co-op mains, then doing things for co-op makes good business sense.

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@Q___________Q

You are right about one thing.  The Meta is completely different.  Cautious playstyle.  That equals boring playstyle to me.  I prefer a barfight to playing "hide and seek" without any seeking for the first 10 minutes.  That's just one of the reasons I don't like to play random battles.  Another would be the absolute ACID bath that passes for chat in those games.  Extended queue times would be another.

Why do you care?  You don't play co-op, do you?  Why does it even matter to you?  Because some players won't get good enough to play randoms?  You have zero evidence to support that claim.  I could say that having a lot of experience in co-op shortens the learning curve for random play.  I could say it, but I can't prove it and neither can you.

Players that want to random will random.  Players that want to co-op will co-op.  Why should WG care about co-op players?  Because we spend money on this game too.  We tell our friends about it.  Co-op may have originally started out as a "training aid" but it's much more than that now.

I'm pretty sure that I'm not the only one who would pack it in if there were no co-op mode here.

Besides, if co-op was originally intended to be a low to mid tier training aid, why allow tiers 7-10 to play it at all.  There are training rooms that you can set up to do whatever kind of practice you need.

It all boils down to this...

If WG thinks it would be a smart financial decision to enhance the enjoyment of a game mode that a small but not insignificant group of people are paying money to enjoy then they will.

One last thing, I would be willing to bet that if you were to set up a co-op team comprised of 4 veteran random players and 4 veteran co-op players, the PvE mains would be tops on the leader board every time.  The meta is different.  You have to get stuck in or get left out.  It's actually fun to play and there isn't any vitriol in the chat either.

Just my 0.02,

CS

Edited by Captain_Slattery
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45 minutes ago, Q___________Q said:

II don’t think it’s actually a good idea to gives my additional positive reinforcement in coop matches. Coop, based on its form and rewards, isn’t meant to be played often. It’s introduced as more or less the tutorial+, showing players gameplay, without being too hard on them. You’re not meant to play it very often after the first few tiers, because the economy is crippling as service costs rise much more than rewards. There’s also an issue of false confidence, from playing too much coop in the beginning. Consistently good finishes in coop mean almost nothing against real players, and the meta is entirely different from the cautious play style pvp players possess. Extended pve play traps players, and makes it difficult, if not impossible to transition into the pvp matches that the devs designed the economy around. By providing players in coop with any more than just the most basic rewards, you are reinforcing the notion that they are playing well. In the best majority of cases, this is not true, they are clubbing unintelligent machines less skilled than even a beginner player. Rewards in coop will only provide players with false accomplishments, and any attempt to integrate into the “intended” community of pvp players, results in the pve player being hammered by veteran pvp players. Their ship destroyed and their ego bruised, they retreat back into pve, and unable to properly build up the skills they need in pvp. They are often trapped, unable to enter pvp for fear of being killed as they were the last time they tried. Achievements in pve would only serve to exacerbate the issue, and so I don’t consider them helpful to the playerbase

Much, although not all by any stretch, of what you say is true IF and only IF a player actually wants to play PVP too. However for many of us the passive playstyle/meta you refer to re: PVP is one of the big reasons many of us don't like it and actually prefer Co-op where the games are faster and much more brawl/fight oriented. That and the friendlier atmosphere with so much less salt.

What Co-op was intended to be when the game launched is no longer relevant today 3 years down the road. Don't base opinions on how things originally were thought to work and instead look at what the game is NOW. Things change and evolve and WOWS is no different. Co-op has become a very popular mode with a good sized portion of the player base. Some play it occasionally, some play it a lot, and some such as myself only play it. It is played enough that it is included now in just about every aspect of the game so why is adding some achievements to it too, for those who play there, such a bad idea?

People need to realize that at this point Co-op is where a lot of players prefer to play and have no desire to move over to (or back to) PVP. Many such as myself would rather just leave the game entirely than play PVP. No offense or insult intended there. It is just fact. I do not like how PVP games go in WOWS. I find Co-op and it's arcade blow em up style way more enjoyable and thus it is where I play. Nothing wrong with that either just as there is nothing wrong with you (OP) liking PVP.

There is nothing about having Co-op be a part of the game that is bad for WOWS, WG, or the PVP mains. Let folks play the game where they wish just as you can do. There is also nothing bad about making every mode as fun and enjoyable as possible for those who want to play it either. Co-op players contribute money to this game as well and that is nothing but good for the game and those who play it.

WG seems to have come around to this line of thought finally and is including Co-op in most things now and is trying to improve it and make it better for those who prefer to play there (they struggle on this one but at least try). Why would adding some achievements for that mode be bad? Every mode BUT Co-op has them. 

Again, play where you enjoy playing and allow others the same option. Achievements in Co-op hurt nothing and do not affect PVP in anyway. All they do is add to the fun for those who play the mode.

:Smile_honoring:

Edited by AdmiralThunder
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12 minutes ago, Captain_Slattery said:

It's actually fun to play and there isn't any vitriol in the chat either.

Just my 0.02,

CS

The bots have filthy, filthy mouths. The bots are permanently chat banned and if you were to lift the ban, then you would get a lot of things like this...

01010011 01110100 01101001 01100011 01101011 00100000 01100001 00100000 00110001 00101110 00110100 00110100 01001101 01000010 00100000 01100110 01101100 01101111 01110000 01110000 01111001 00100000 01101001 01101110 00100000 01111001 01101111 01110101 01110010 00100000 01000011 01000100 00100000 01100100 01110010 01101001 01110110 01100101 00100001

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Ok.  Now some Glavinator (aka computer nerd) needs to translate that code and then we'll be able to see what those bots are up to!

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1 hour ago, Q___________Q said:

II don’t think it’s actually a good idea to gives my additional positive reinforcement in coop matches. Coop, based on its form and rewards, isn’t meant to be played often. It’s introduced as more or less the tutorial+, showing players gameplay, without being too hard on them. You’re not meant to play it very often after the first few tiers, because the economy is crippling as service costs rise much more than rewards. There’s also an issue of false confidence, from playing too much coop in the beginning. Consistently good finishes in coop mean almost nothing against real players, and the meta is entirely different from the cautious play style pvp players possess. Extended pve play traps players, and makes it difficult, if not impossible to transition into the pvp matches that the devs designed the economy around. By providing players in coop with any more than just the most basic rewards, you are reinforcing the notion that they are playing well. In the best majority of cases, this is not true, they are clubbing unintelligent machines less skilled than even a beginner player. Rewards in coop will only provide players with false accomplishments, and any attempt to integrate into the “intended” community of pvp players, results in the pve player being hammered by veteran pvp players. Their ship destroyed and their ego bruised, they retreat back into pve, and unable to properly build up the skills they need in pvp. They are often trapped, unable to enter pvp for fear of being killed as they were the last time they tried. Achievements in pve would only serve to exacerbate the issue, and so I don’t consider them helpful to the playerbase

I play more PVE than PVP because the meta is different. 

As for "real players" and "skill"... meh... from what I've seen, the skill distribution is about the same between Co-op battles and Random battles.   As an opponent, the average red Rando is just about as challenging as the red Bots, just for different reasons.  The only difference is that there aren't any brilliant Bots, and sometimes you do run into brilliant Randos (and sometimes you run into Randos who make the bots look brilliant in comparison. 

The meta in Randoms is, frankly, horrible, and reminds me too much of some of the reasons I quit playing WOT... the entire meta is built around manipulating the spotting mechanics and trying to see without being seen, leading to a long drawn-out contest of about 3/4 of each team poking about furtively hoping to not get nuked out of the blue.    Look at all the complaint threads about BBs hiding or hanging back or having the longest range and trying to snipe... all the threads about DD smoke vs cruiser radar... all the posts about CVs being "too good at spotting"... etc... what do they call have in common?  The sad-sack spotting system and the vision-manipulation meta. 

If the PVE part of WOWS were, as some PVP-zealots demand, removed from the game or significantly downgraded as an experience, there are a lot of us who just aren't interested enough (or at all) in PVP to keep playing.

 

E:  and by the way, it's easy to tell when a lot of Randos are "slumming it" ( :Smile_smile: ) in Co-Op... they're the ones who try to escort the CV (not needed in Co-Op), put their BB in reverse at battle start (just removes you from the battle in Co-Op), rush forward to seize a "strategic" spot as if there won't be 4+ bots doing the same and ready to focus on them, or otherwise engage in the behaviors they think are helping them in Randoms. 

 

 

 

Edited by KilljoyCutter

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PvE is easy mode. AI is too predictable and evidently inflates the assumption that the skills translate well to randoms.

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5 minutes ago, mr_angry_eyes said:

PvE is easy mode. AI is too predictable and evidently inflates the assumption that the skills translate well to randoms.

On the other hand, you'll never catch bots humping the back of an island or the edge of a map soiling themselves in panic trying to avoid contact with the enemy.  

The bots are fearless, ruthless, aggressive, and have impeccable aim... unlike at least half of the human playerbase.  

What they lack in creativity they make up for in being able do things like lob a volley over two mountains at a target spotted by another bot and slot the rounds right into that narrow space where they clear the mountain and still hit the target.    They take a ship with big lobby slow arcs and make it into a napalm firehouse, so that ships human players often struggle with become burninators.  

 

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I actually quit playing PvP and moved to co-op because I was bone tired of being up tiered in my Omaha. Add to that the boring, stagnant, stale meta and I almost quit playing altogether. Co-op is super fun, lots of action and matches end quickly. It is a bit more of an arcade game requiring very little finesse but one only has to look at the history of video/computer games to realize there is a definite market for games like that. Many of the people I started out playing the game with are gone. They tried sticking with PvP and got bored with it and quit the game including a friend of mine whom I have played online computer games with since Starfleet Command came out (we were old friends who played SFB back in the 80's).  He didn't like the idea of being up tiered all the time either, found it a bit unfair as well as not fun. I tried getting him into PvE play but he was done, successfully pushed out of the game by how it was structured. It isn't surprising that the game bleeds players around this tier. 

One reason I never bothered with WoT much is that there is no PvE play and very little instruction on how to play the game. I always have to laugh at the first video tutorial I sat down to watch and the first comment from the "instructor" was to go play a match........ I was pretty much done at that point and only mess with it to earn prizes like gold or premium time that I can use in WoWS. The funny thing is now it looks like they are testing a new AI to add co-op to gameplay there. A bit late to capture my attention but better late than never. 

I like the idea of mini rewards/achievements for co-op play and Thunder did a great job of coming up with some really good material. Someone mentioned a co-op Kraken called the "Cuttlefish" or "Quacken" which just makes me laugh every time I think about it. 

Honestly I only go into PvP play now to farm rewards, complete missions, and to grind stock ships quickly. It isn't especially hard once you learn to run every time someone shoots at you. Once you get used to shooting fleeing players, it is no more difficult than PvE. Just different, not harder. 

Edited by Taylor3006

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18 minutes ago, Kizarvexis said:

The bots have filthy, filthy mouths. The bots are permanently chat banned and if you were to lift the ban, then you would get a lot of things like this...

01010011 01110100 01101001 01100011 01101011 00100000 01100001 00100000 00110001 00101110 00110100 00110100 01001101 01000010 00100000 01100110 01101100 01101111 01110000 01110000 01111001 00100000 01101001 01101110 00100000 01111001 01101111 01110101 01110010 00100000 01000011 01000100 00100000 01100100 01110010 01101001 01110110 01100101 00100001

11 minutes ago, Captain_Slattery said:

Ok.  Now some Glavinator (aka computer nerd) needs to translate that code and then we'll be able to see what those bots are up to!

Since @IfYouSeeKhaos knows from experience my rapport with the bots, hehehe, I can translate it. 

If you are under 13, do NOT read the text in the spoiler tag. :fish_glass:

Spoiler

Stick a 1.44MB floppy in your CD drive!

 

7 minutes ago, mr_angry_eyes said:

PvE is easy mode. AI is too predictable and evidently inflates the assumption that the skills translate well to randoms.

The meta is different, but angling, shooting, managing DC, etcetera are the same. You can get away with being WAY more aggressive in PvE than you can in PvP. But you can play both and succeed. Of course you won't succeed at PvP as much as PvE, but it can be done.

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Oh my!  That is salty!

Major league LOLZ on that one, my friend!  You made my day.:Smile_veryhappy:

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6 minutes ago, Kizarvexis said:

The meta is different, but angling, shooting, managing DC, etcetera are the same. You can get away with being WAY more aggressive in PvE than you can in PvP. But you can play both and succeed. Of course you won't succeed at PvP as much as PvE, but it can be done.

This is one reason I really miss yUPatriot. He was a dedicated PvE player and staunch defender of the mode and had really good PvP stats. People who poked fun at him often were put to shame by his skill at the game. There was a reason we called him "PvE Overlord". 

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7 minutes ago, Captain_Slattery said:

Oh my!  That is salty!

Major league LOLZ on that one, my friend!  You made my day.:Smile_veryhappy:

:Smile_teethhappy:

 

Just now, Taylor3006 said:

 

This is one reason I really miss yUPatriot. He was a dedicated PvE player and staunch defender of the mode and had really good PvP stats. People who poked fun at him often were put to shame by his skill at the game. There was a reason we called him "PvE Overlord". 

:Smile_sad:

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14 minutes ago, Kizarvexis said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Stick a 1.44MB floppy in your CD drive!

 

 

Man, that is goblin hunter level harsh.

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Just now, DrHolmes52 said:

Man, that is goblin hunter level harsh.

:Smile_teethhappy:

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4 hours ago, Q___________Q said:

II don’t think it’s actually a good idea to gives my additional positive reinforcement in coop matches. Coop, based on its form and rewards, isn’t meant to be played often. It’s introduced as more or less the tutorial+, showing players gameplay, without being too hard on them. You’re not meant to play it very often after the first few tiers, because the economy is crippling as service costs rise much more than rewards. There’s also an issue of false confidence, from playing too much coop in the beginning. Consistently good finishes in coop mean almost nothing against real players, and the meta is entirely different from the cautious play style pvp players possess. Extended pve play traps players, and makes it difficult, if not impossible to transition into the pvp matches that the devs designed the economy around. By providing players in coop with any more than just the most basic rewards, you are reinforcing the notion that they are playing well. In the best majority of cases, this is not true, they are clubbing unintelligent machines less skilled than even a beginner player. Rewards in coop will only provide players with false accomplishments, and any attempt to integrate into the “intended” community of pvp players, results in the pve player being hammered by veteran pvp players. Their ship destroyed and their ego bruised, they retreat back into pve, and unable to properly build up the skills they need in pvp. They are often trapped, unable to enter pvp for fear of being killed as they were the last time they tried. Achievements in pve would only serve to exacerbate the issue, and so I don’t consider them helpful to the playerbase

So I play in Random matches on the losing team (or sometimes even on a winning team) and am told in chat to go back to Co-Op (by the guys who are already sunk, mind you), then I come here and am told I shouldn't be playing Co-Op, but Random...I'm so confused! :Smile_facepalm:

Unfortunately, my friend, there are very few people in Random that are willing to give good advice or spell out a plan ahead of time, but they are sure quick to point out your apparent mistakes and overall lack of telepathy while you're the last ship standing, which distracts you from staying alive further and possibly winning the match.

Here's a good quote from over on the WoT forum, from Meathead Militia, the community manager who is leaving WG for another career opportunity: " To you Veterans – Do me a favor, instead of sending that angry and aggressive message to a player who did poorly, don’t. Teach them something. Send them a YouTube link on the tank or class they were playing, or just don’t say anything at all. "

People say Random chat in WoT is saltier than WoWs, but since I've started playing both just in the last few months, I really can't say I've seen much of a difference.

 

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15 minutes ago, Bonfor said:

People say Random chat in WoT is saltier than WoWs, but since I've started playing both just in the last few months, I really can't say I've seen much of a difference.

I have very few games played in World of Tanks but honestly I never have seen anyone say anything in chat there other than pinging the map. The few times I have asked questions, never got responses. It is very much like playing with a team of bots but again, my experience is very limited there. Same with WoWP, asked if anyone on the team was human and got nothing back. 

Edited by Taylor3006

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If there was no co-op, I would stop playing.

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9 minutes ago, Taylor3006 said:

I have very few games played in World of Tanks but honestly I never have seen anyone say anything in chat there other than pinging the map. The few times I have asked questions, never got responses. It is very much like playing with a team of bots but again, my experience is very limited there. Same with WoWP, asked if anyone on the team was human and got nothing back. 

That reminds me, there have been a few times where a light tank will suicide up the middle trying to reach the enemy base right off the bat...just like running up the middle in Two Brothers...sometimes it works, but mostly it fails horribly! :Smile_teethhappy:

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