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Aetreus

Make Casemate Hits Better(and upper hull hits weaker)

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Mostly inspired by two kinds of complaints, that with the introduction of more 6" ships that IFHE spam battleships, and the IJN 100mm 1/4 HE pen gun, we're seeing a detrimental amount of HE spam against battleships, and that certain battleship lines are extremely difficult to kill with AP, due to the near-impossibility of citadeling them and heal being able to clean up most of their damage.

 

Basically, most battleships at the present time have a single central hull zone outside of the citadel, which has about 1/8 of the total HP of the ship in it. This zone includes both the ship above the armor belt and below it. It takes both HE pens to the upper belt and deck, and AP full pens through the main belt. This zone is repairable for 50% of its health, 60% on UK BB. The issue is that first off, this zone saturates very quickly. It's very large, everyone aims at it, and therefore by the time the ship has taken 20-30% damage, it saturates and all damage gets reduced to 0.165 times the shell damage.

 

If you're firing HE at a battleship, that's mostly fine. Good even. Yes, you deal less damage, but you still are dealing damage, and you can also hit the bow/stern and superstructure zones for damage as well. Also fires will deal damage, which doesn't come out of any specific hull zone. Sure it can be full-repaired, but there's a good chance they won't always be fully repaired from that and you can kill them via burning down.

 

If you're firing AP, things are less wonderful. Generally, there are only two zones a BB that can't overmatch its target can damage, the casemate and the citadel. Your shells won't arm anywhere else, meaning 10% overpen damage only. If you can't hit the citadel- because its buried deep in the ship, or turtleback, or some combination of factors, you're stuck dealing 10% overpens and 16.5% full pens for 3/4 of a ship's health which, uh, takes a long time. And then they heal 50% of that damage away, just as if you'd been HE spamming them. Which let's be fair, maybe you should be! You won't have to focus on only the central zone and can deal 33% damage to most of the ship, even if it is lower HE damage. And you set fires as well.

 

The proposed change is to split the casemate and upper hull zones at the armored deck(as they are on New Mexico, Colorado, and Izumo for example), and make the casemate have more HP and a lower repair percentage. This would mean that a full AP pen would be more serious, and that you would receive and dish out 33% hits longer. On the flipside it would mean that with less HP in the upper hull, HE spam would deal less direct damage, relying more on fires, and battleships that can overmatch would deal less damage via full pens of the upper hull.

 

There's a couple lines that would probably merit significant balance consideration in this. UK BB is the first- it would make sense to roll back some of the nerfs they received to their super repair party, and the accuracy on their high-tier guns. Even with the old super repair, they would be much more vulnerable to AP damage. However, by that same token they would be less vulnerable to HE damage across their large expanses of plating. German BB would probably be the one line that should be totally exempt from this change. They don't have the sort of heavy armored deck followed by a thin splinter deck that the USN, UK, and even French BB lines do.

 

TLDR; battleships should all be set up like French/Mid tier USN are. Nerf HE spam damage to decks, buff AP damage on belt pens and make them harder to repair.

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5 minutes ago, Aetreus said:

TLDR; battleships should all be set up like French/Mid tier USN are. Nerf HE spam damage to decks, buff AP damage on belt pens and make them harder to repair.

So, another thinly-disguised 'Buff BBs so they can't burn!!' thread.  BBs do not need buffs.

No.

 

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If BBs don't want cruisers and DDs to fire HE, they can always turn broadside.

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1 minute ago, mavfin87 said:

So, another thinly-disguised 'Buff BBs so they can't burn!!' thread.  BBs do not need buffs.

No.

 

Fire or more accurately how fires are fought could use some changes from the all or nothing options we have now.

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Just now, BrushWolf said:

Fire or more accurately how fires are fought could use some changes from the all or nothing options we have now.

That is true, but that's not what the OP was talking about.  He's wanting to reduce overall damage taken to BBs because of...whatever.  Which isn't needed.

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13 minutes ago, mavfin87 said:

So, another thinly-disguised 'Buff BBs so they can't burn!!' thread.  BBs do not need buffs.

No.

 

Unless WG makes the upper hull not take hull damage somehow(not proposed, and unlikely), this is not an overall buff to BB. It means that they take 33% pens from HE to the deck for slightly less long, but they still take 33% pens to all other zones in the same way, burn the same, and heal it away the same. Indeed this doesn't matter to HE spam against USN, German, and Yamatos, because these ships do not take HE pen damage to the upper deck and belt except from German cruisers. Izumo could use a buff anyways(poor ship), and this is mostly as a buff to UK BB's who are taking the biggest hit to their survivability.

Just now, mavfin87 said:

That is true, but that's not what the OP was talking about.  He's wanting to reduce overall damage taken to BBs because of...whatever.  Which isn't needed.

That's not what I'm meaning to do here.

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5 minutes ago, mavfin87 said:

That is true, but that's not what the OP was talking about.  He's wanting to reduce overall damage taken to BBs because of...whatever.  Which isn't needed.

HE spam means fires so he was talking about fire even if he didn't realize it.

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1 minute ago, BrushWolf said:

HE spam means fires so he was talking about fire even if he didn't realize it.

 

41 minutes ago, Aetreus said:

TLDR; battleships should all be set up like French/Mid tier USN are. Nerf HE spam damage to decks, buff AP damage on belt pens and make them harder to repair.

Not if I use specifiers it doesn't.

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