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Bluffrat_2018

Confused Now

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Ok.. I'm confused...

1) when did a 14 inch gunned battleship rank a higher tier than a 16 in gunned battleship?

2) Why does a tier 7 BB cost 375000 xp?

3) I had the Kii.. To go up in tier on the Jap line... I have to get the Amagi to get to the Izumo when I have the Kii (will get back)?

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1.  When the 14" has more barrels than the 16" BB (ie: Lyon). 

1a.  When the British are historically afraid of making the rest of the world mad and arm the KGV with 14" guns.  In game this is overcome with firestarting percentage and reload time.

2.  I am assuming you are speaking of Nelson which is a premium ship and its credit and XP earning are better than normal.  Others like it (tier IX) cost 750,000.

3.  The Kii is a premium ship - it does not count towards line progress, unless you spend real money to convert its XP to FXP.

 

Hope this helps

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11 minutes ago, Bluffrat_2018 said:

Ok.. I'm confused...

1) when did a 14 inch gunned battleship rank a higher tier than a 16 in gunned battleship?

2) Why does a tier 7 BB cost 375000 xp?

3) I had the Kii.. To go up in tier on the Jap line... I have to get the Amagi to get to the Izumo when I have the Kii (will get back)?

1) They don't, except maybe for the Mutsu at T6 which is a scaled down earlier version of the Nagato.  KGV is a T7 and Lyon is a T7 as well which would be the only tech tree ships that would carry 14 inch guns at a higher tier than Mutsu. 

2) Tier VII ships cost more XP than lower tier ships.  Wait till you get to Tier X if you think that's a lot. 

3) Kii is a Premium ship.  You can't use a Premium ship to advance up the tech tree because it's not part of the tech tree.  You didn't earn it, you bought it which gives you the right to use it, but that's about it.  No, you don't get refunds for Premium ships.  You spent your money to have access to use it, nothing more, and it sounds like that is exactly what you have.  

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3 minutes ago, BB3_Oregon_Steel said:

1) They don't, except maybe for the Mutsu at T6 which is a scaled down earlier version of the Nagato.  KGV is a T7 and Lyon is a T7 as well which would be the only tech tree ships that would carry 14 inch guns at a higher tier than Mutsu. 

2) Tier VII ships cost more XP than lower tier ships.  Wait till you get to Tier X if you think that's a lot. 

3) Kii is a Premium ship.  You can't use a Premium ship to advance up the tech tree because it's not part of the tech tree.  You didn't earn it, you bought it which gives you the right to use it, but that's about it.  No, you don't get refunds for Premium ships.  You spent your money to have access to use it, nothing more, and it sounds like that is exactly what you have.  

Actually, if I'm not mistaken, the Lyon is armed with 12" guns, not 14" guns.  Also, the Queen Elizabeth at tier 6 has 15" guns, while the KGV at tier 7 has 14" guns.

Also, on point #2, he's referring to the FXP requirement of the Nelson, a FXP premium, not a tech tree ship.

 

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5 minutes ago, Crucis said:

Actually, if I'm not mistaken, the Lyon is armed with 12" guns, not 14" guns.  Also, the Queen Elizabeth at tier 6 has 15" guns, while the KGV at tier 7 has 14" guns.

Also, on point #2, he's referring to the FXP requirement of the Nelson, a FXP premium, not a tech tree ship.

 

Lyon actually has 340mm guns, which translates to roughly 13.5".

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10 minutes ago, Crucis said:

Actually, if I'm not mistaken, the Lyon is armed with 12" guns, not 14" guns.  Also, the Queen Elizabeth at tier 6 has 15" guns, while the KGV at tier 7 has 14" guns.

Also, on point #2, he's referring to the FXP requirement of the Nelson, a FXP premium, not a tech tree ship.

 

The Lyon has 340mm guns which converts to 13.4". The Queen Elizabeth is a WWI ship, laid down in 1912, where the KGV is a modern late 1930's design, laid down in 1937, with a modern 14" gun that outperforms the WWI era gun of the QE. Tiering is based on performance.

Ace be me to the Lyon and actually it converts to 13.38". :Smile-_tongue:

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1 minute ago, BrushWolf said:

The Lyon has 340mm guns which converts to 13.4". The Queen Elizabeth is a WWI ship, laid down in 1912, where the KGV is a modern late 1930's design, laid down in 1937, with a modern 14" gun that outperforms the WWI era gun of the QE. Tiering is based on performance.

I was only replying to the details of the post.  Not about the quality of the guns in question.

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1 minute ago, Crucis said:

I was only replying to the details of the post.  Not about the quality of the guns in question.

While I quoted you I was also replying to the OP so quality had to come in. :Smile_honoring:

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1 hour ago, Bluffrat_2018 said:

To go up in tier on the Jap line...

You need to change that to either Japanese or IJN as "Jap" is considered a racial slur by the game and the moderators.

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Please do not use cursive fonts on the internet. It provides zero benefits and actively hinders readability.

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2 hours ago, BrushWolf said:

The Lyon has 340mm guns which converts to 13.4". The Queen Elizabeth is a WWI ship, laid down in 1912, where the KGV is a modern late 1930's design, laid down in 1937, with a modern 14" gun that outperforms the WWI era gun of the QE. Tiering is based on performance.

Ace be me to the Lyon and actually it converts to 13.38". :Smile-_tongue:

The interwar rework of the QE BB gun system, increased elevation and new shells made the 15 gun much better than the WW1 version.  The gun still couldn't shoot as far as the new 14 but of course could hit much harder....Tiering is based more on displacement than on "performance"... more tons, higher tier...thats pretty universal.  Thus the KGV, a much bigger ship tonnage wise than the QE, is a tier higher.

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2 hours ago, jmanII said:

1.  When the 14" has more barrels than the 16" BB (ie: Lyon). 

1a.  When the British are historically afraid of making the rest of the world mad and arm the KGV with 14" guns.  In game this is overcome with firestarting percentage and reload time.

2.  I am assuming you are speaking of Nelson which is a premium ship and its credit and XP earning are better than normal.  Others like it (tier IX) cost 750,000.

3.  The Kii is a premium ship - it does not count towards line progress, unless you spend real money to convert its XP to FXP.

 

Hope this helps

1a is incorrect.  The British were never afraid of making the rest of the world mad.  The KGV class was armed with 14 guns because the British were unsure the Washington treaty was going to be extended, so they had to make a decision to modernize their old ships or wait another year...they went ahead with the 14, though the original designs were for a 15 gun.

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33 minutes ago, Compassghost said:

Please do not use cursive fonts on the internet. It provides zero benefits and actively hinders readability.

ab630eeb48895a1f65851452fee2384b.jpg.1515f31a92fafe92053521b6ff2ead8c.jpg

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A note about Nelson: It costs 375k FXP because it's essentially 'filling' an imaginary tree under it. That's the cumulative cost of reaching T7.

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1 hour ago, Morpheous said:

1a is incorrect.  The British were never afraid of making the rest of the world mad.  The KGV class was armed with 14 guns because the British were unsure the Washington treaty was going to be extended, so they had to make a decision to modernize their old ships or wait another year...they went ahead with the 14, though the original designs were for a 15 gun.

That is being afraid of pissing off rest of world.

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7 hours ago, Crucis said:

Actually, if I'm not mistaken, the Lyon is armed with 12" guns, not 14" guns.  Also, the Queen Elizabeth at tier 6 has 15" guns, while the KGV at tier 7 has 14" guns.

Also, on point #2, he's referring to the FXP requirement of the Nelson, a FXP premium, not a tech tree ship.

 

The Lyon is armed with 13.4 inch guns so I was approximating.  She and KGV are the only tech tree battleships I'm aware of with guns of 14 inch or smaller caliber that exist above Tier VI. 

I forgot about Nelson but the comments I made for Mutsu apply equally to her. I purposefully ignored Scharnhorst at T7 since she really is a different kettle of fish.

I think most of the post comes down to this. 

1) The OP doesn't understand how Premiums ships work in the game as opposed to tech tree ships. 

2) Since you've reminded me about Nelson, I would also say that the OP doesn't understand how free XP ships work either or, in a more general statement, the OP doesn't understand how any of the ships that are not part to the tech tree fit into the WOWS system. 

Hopefully after reading the posts on this thread, those issues have been corrected. 

Edited by BB3_Oregon_Steel

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3 hours ago, jmanII said:

That is being afraid of pissing off rest of world.

Not really. 

The British gained huge benefits to continuing to limit the size and firepower of Battleships and Cruisers as well as large destroyers. . 

The British position was that they had a vast world stretching empire to protect and vulnerable sea trade lanes that they needed to control if they were going to be a world power rather than just the inhabitants to a fairly large island off the coast of Europe.  To do this the British needed lots and lots of ships, far more than any of the other major naval powers.  The British simply couldn't afford to build a few really really big powerful ships, what they needed were lots and lots of smaller ships but to do that, they needed everyone else to play along. 

The British saw the KGV's as an example of leading from the front under the idea that they couldn't push other's to adopt restrictions that they themselves were not willing to be limited by.  

As it turned out, the London Treaty didn't have the support it needed to actually be effective.  Germany was not limited by it and Japan, detested the 5.5.3 ratio of battleships that it and the Washington Treaty imposed on it.  The Japanese felt that they needed at least to at least match the naval power of the US and England, otherwise it would forever be a second rate naval power.  As such, they began to abrogate the treaty before the ink was even dry. Italy was interested in flexing it's muscles as well. 

Fortunately for the British, the KGV's turned out to be excellent vessels well capable of operating effectively in WWII.  

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9 hours ago, Bluffrat_2018 said:

Ok.. I'm confused...

1) when did a 14 inch gunned battleship rank a higher tier than a 16 in gunned battleship?

2) Why does a tier 7 BB cost 375000 xp?

3) I had the Kii.. To go up in tier on the Jap line... I have to get the Amagi to get to the Izumo when I have the Kii (will get back)?

The 375k XP is because Nelson is a uniquely designed ship that I am sure wargaming didn't know where to put in the main BB line. 375K XP is actually rather reasonable and a lot more doable than the 750k free XP ships for the average player. As far as the first question goes sometimes 14 inchers are better to have in a fight than 16 inchers it depends on the situation. I'd rather fight enemy cruisers with 14 inch guns than 16 inch guns because the 14 inchers won't overpen as much. And when it comes to the third question about the japanese line I am rather confused on that one. Yes you will need Amagi to get to Izumo unless you want to convert the XP from Kii into free XP to get her with. But if you got Kii down pat then you should be okay in Amagi since as I recall Amagi is just Kii but better,

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7 hours ago, Umikami said:

You need to change that to either Japanese or IJN as "Jap" is considered a racial slur by the game and the moderators.

Look at that; my personal troll down voted me trying to help someone NOT get a strike for racial slurs. How hilarious! How disturbed do you have to be to go through every post to give someone a down vote which means absolutely nothing. But hang in there buddy, I'm enjoying every moment!

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1 hour ago, Umikami said:

Look at that; my personal troll down voted me trying to help someone NOT get a strike for racial slurs. How hilarious! How disturbed do you have to be to go through every post to give someone a down vote which means absolutely nothing. But hang in there buddy, I'm enjoying every moment!

I just don't agree with it there. He obviously wasn't meaning it as a racial slur. Context is important when it comes to these things. A lot of people are just lazy and it's easier to type that than Japanese every single time. Don't go flinging things at people like that. That's all my point is. On top of that I just came across this post randomly. I don't know you very well I think we've only interacted one other time?

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But back at the topic at hand instead of unrelated things. I think everyone has answered all of his questions and then some :)

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6 hours ago, jmanII said:

That is being afraid of pissing off rest of world.

No, that is being afraid of annoying the United States into an arms race the Brits couldn't afford.

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7 hours ago, jmanII said:

That is being afraid of pissing off rest of world.

still have to disagree :)

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1 hour ago, Imperialist_Loli said:

Don't go flinging things at people like that.

I didn't fling anything; regardless of intent WoW moderators will censor the post and the author for using that term. But hey, if you think I should just let him get hammered well sure, why not. I'm sure when he asks "Why didn't someone tell me?" you'll speak up and let him know "Umi was going to but I told him not to because you intended no harm and that shouldn't have been a problem." QUACK!

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16 hours ago, Umikami said:

I didn't fling anything; regardless of intent WoW moderators will censor the post and the author for using that term. But hey, if you think I should just let him get hammered well sure, why not. I'm sure when he asks "Why didn't someone tell me?" you'll speak up and let him know "Umi was going to but I told him not to because you intended no harm and that shouldn't have been a problem." QUACK!

Ok fair point. 

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