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Nuking team mates in co-op

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So. I've read all the other posts about how it's never alright to torp an ally. Seems pretty obvious.......But it's not. I'm referring to co-op, so no major impact to your team if you act like a tit. every post leans the same way, DD needs to know where all his mates are, never fire if any ally might get hit, etc. [edited]. I've watched players intentionally cut between a DD and a target hoping for the kill. DD shoots, he's a douchbag for hitting a mate. He doesn't, he gets deleted because he's detected and an idiot team mate screwed things up. I'm not even a DD player and it irritates me so I can't imagine how they feel.

Actually I can. I was in my cruiser, lined up for the shot.........dude raced in between us.........fired anyway......killed the bad guy, planted 2 torps in the friendly, and giggled my [edited]off. 

Agree players need to take care when launching torps if it puts a team mate at risk, but those team mates also need to pay attention to the DD's. If a DD is on an attack run and you figure rushing the gap will stop them from firing and give you the kill, hope I'm not driving the DD. Friendly fire from torps is not always the attackers fault.

 

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Don't assume that Co-Op players are deliberately trying to kill steal when they rush in between you and the bots. Many are genuinely oblivious. 

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1 minute ago, Rocketpacman said:

Don't assume that Co-Op players are deliberately trying to kill steal when they rush in between you and the bots. Many are genuinely oblivious. 

In that case...

images.jpg

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13 minutes ago, Rocketpacman said:

Don't assume that Co-Op players are deliberately trying to kill steal when they rush in between you and the bots. Many are genuinely oblivious. 

Not really.a player who has reached T6 in either random or co-op should know what's going on. If not, I'm the first one to defend the DD when the inevitable whining starts. 

14 minutes ago, Doombeagle said:

In that case...

images.jpg

Love it!

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The pixel protection league wants you to know that green is green no matter who is in command.

Also, there is no such thing as kill stealing. A good red is a red on the bottom. The fastest way to put s red on the bottom is through focused fire. Remember to say thank you when a green provides a kill assist.

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Having recently started spending a decent amount of time in Coop; I have to say that I continue to be shocked and amazed at the cavalier attitude that some coop players have when it comes to rushing in front of another ship. 

I asked a few people about it; one said he does it on purpose because DD's are basically taking all the kills...(I was in my Akizuki)...so he deliberately moved so I couldn't use my torps and to take the kill. 

Most other didn't respond, but it seems it's done purposely by a few of the coop folks. They don't like someone coming in and racking up 3 to 5 kills it seems.  

Having said that, the kill blockers seem to be a minority. Most of the coop players are cheerful and pleasant team players. 

Edited by RevTKS
Most coop players are nice folks :)
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42 minutes ago, RevTKS said:

Having recently started spending a decent amount of time in Coop; I have to say that I continue to be shocked and amazed at the cavalier attitude that some coop players have when it comes to rushing in front of another ship. 

I asked a few people about it; one said he does it on purpose because DD's are basically taking all the kills...(I was in my Akizuki)...so he deliberately moved so I couldn't use my torps and to take the kill. 

Most other didn't respond, but it seems it's done purposely by a few of the coop folks. They don't like someone coming in and racking up 3 to 5 kills it seems.  

Having said that, the kill blockers seem to be a minority. Most of the coop players are cheerful and pleasant team players. 

Co-op is a mentality that you have to get all the kills / damage you possibly can if you want any sort of rewards, and Co-op rewards are very low to begin with.

 

8 vs 8 ships and matches on average take 6-7 minutes long.  If you have lots of players, it's over even quicker, 4 minutes tops.  The bots are so dumb, the targets so few the match is over very quickly.  This isn't like PVP where you may not even get 1 kill, but due to the long match where enemy players stay alive, repair their damage, and matches taking 10, 15, 20 minutes, you can walk away with lots of Credits & XPs.  Co-op is over so quickly, the bots don't even repair much, if at all.  They don't even live long enough.  So, when looking at the total HP pool of bot ships compared to players, it's not the same.  The players will Repair, stay alive, and you can farm damage off them.  Not in Co-op.  They're dead quick.  Co-op is over so quickly that in the majority of cases, capping is of zero value.

 

So, one had best get everything they can, more than your teammates if you want something out of Co-op.  Otherwise with mediocre performance of just not getting in enough damage, you will lose Credits and get nothing in XPs.  If I'm late to the party or RNG hasn't favored my gun salvos, you can easily walk out with 200 or so XPs and lose Credits.  200 BaseXPs is well within reason to happen when you got a full player roster and the match is done in 4 minutes.

 

The best case scenario in Co-op is if you are the only player.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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37 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Co-op is a mentality that you have to get all the kills / damage you possibly can if you want any sort of rewards, and Co-op rewards are very low to begin with.

 

8 vs 8 ships and matches on average take 6-7 minutes long.  If you have lots of players, it's over even quicker, 4 minutes tops.  The bots are so dumb, the targets so few the match is over very quickly.  This isn't like PVP where you may not even get 1 kill, but due to the long match where enemy players stay alive, repair their damage, and matches taking 10, 15, 20 minutes, you can walk away with lots of Credits & XPs.  Co-op is over so quickly, the bots don't even repair much, if at all.  They don't even live long enough.  So, when looking at the total HP pool of bot ships compared to players, it's not the same.  The players will Repair, stay alive, and you can farm damage off them.  Not in Co-op.  They're dead quick.  Co-op is over so quickly that in the majority of cases, capping is of zero value.

 

So, one had best get everything they can, more than your teammates if you want something out of Co-op.  Otherwise with mediocre performance of just not getting in enough damage, you will lose Credits and get nothing in XPs.  If I'm late to the party or RNG hasn't favored my gun salvos, you can easily walk out with 200 or so XPs and lose Credits.  200 BaseXPs is well within reason to happen when you got a full player roster and the match is done in 4 minutes.

 

The best case scenario in Co-op is if you are the only player.

Yeah in co-op you are really competing against the other human players for damage and the like. Not like in PvP at all, well maybe a little but not in most cases. Playing against bots means you have to be far more aggressive than when fighting humans so it can get down and dirty so you have to be careful. 


Never avoid capping, you get as much xp for getting a cap than you do a kill. Haven't been in too many matches where you win by capping, they are truly rare, but you need them to boost your score. It really makes a big difference on how much you earn. 

I have noticed recently a large influx of players who I assume normally play PvP. Some are quite good and just slaughter the bots, some not so good at it because it is totally different play. So many matches are ending BEFORE the 5 minute mark now, just have to laugh. The fastest I can remember was a while ago, it was 4 minutes and 17 seconds but had one yesterday that was 4 minutes and 26 seconds... You don't have lots of time to farm those points!  BTW this isn't a complaint, happy to have more players in PvE and it is really testing my abilities to farm damage quickly. Zooming thru my "first win" farming though! 

Edited by Taylor3006

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34 minutes ago, Taylor3006 said:

Yeah in co-op you are really competing against the other human players for damage and the like. Not like in PvP at all, well maybe a little but not in most cases. Playing against bots means you have to be far more aggressive than when fighting humans so it can get down and dirty so you have to be careful. 


Never avoid capping, you get as much xp for getting a cap than you do a kill. Haven't been in too many matches where you win by capping, they are truly rare, but you need them to boost your score. It really makes a big difference on how much you earn. 

I have noticed recently a large influx of players who I assume normally play PvP. Some are quite good and just slaughter the bots, some not so good at it because it is totally different play. So many matches are ending BEFORE the 5 minute mark now, just have to laugh. The fastest I can remember was a while ago, it was 4 minutes and 17 seconds but had one yesterday that was 4 minutes and 26 seconds... You don't have lots of time to farm those points!  BTW this isn't a complaint, happy to have more players in PvE and it is really testing my abilities to farm damage quickly. Zooming thru my "first win" farming though! 

A lot of guys working Legendaries.  Not to mention some missions are best done in Co-op.  This stuff can be over quick.  There are many times that if I play a Destroyer, I only have time to fire 1 set of torpedoes before the match is over.  Enough time to send 1-2 CV airstrikes before it's over.

 

Because these matches are over so quick, DDs have to be super aggressive and do those crazy close range drops to guarantee lots of hits and lots of damage + kills in as short as time possible.  Playing like in Randoms by standing off at 9km+ doesn't work.  Too unreliable.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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6 hours ago, Dolphin48 said:

Not really.a player who has reached T6 in either random or co-op should know what's going on. If not, I'm the first one to defend the DD when the inevitable whining starts. 

I've been team torped several times in T6 and above.  And I've also had stray torps hit friendlies.  It happens.  Just do your pink penance and move on.  

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Gonna have to side with Dolphin here.  It is always the fault of the one launching torpedoes if an ally gets hit, but those allies are equally responsible for not acting in ways that cripple or otherwise hamstring their comrades' ability to operate.

Conversely, if an ally fires stupid torps that cut off my escape where I need to broadside enemies or enemy fish to dodge the "friendly" ones-- sorry bud, but you're turning pink.  Comes back to not acting in ways that cripple or otherwise hamstring their comrades' ability to operate.  :cap_like:

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I don't really play much co-op but the good old rule of thumb from PvP is always valid, only fire torpedoes from first line (some exceptional and rare situations may allow from just behind 1st). Makes me wonder if those firing from second, and even third line, in PvP are people straight out of Co-op.

Had a guy on the enemy team tell both teams in chat how he thought all people that did not move when he fired torpedoes were '[edited]' and everyone should look out for torpedoes and move when they were coming by, my guess is he was pink and wanted an excuse, though both teams opened up on him and pretty much said 'how about no' and only fire from first line. He still did not get it though and carried on ranting.

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7 hours ago, RevTKS said:

Having recently started spending a decent amount of time in Coop; I have to say that I continue to be shocked and amazed at the cavalier attitude that some coop players have when it comes to rushing in front of another ship. 

I asked a few people about it; one said he does it on purpose because DD's are basically taking all the kills...(I was in my Akizuki)...so he deliberately moved so I couldn't use my torps and to take the kill. 

Most other didn't respond, but it seems it's done purposely by a few of the coop folks. They don't like someone coming in and racking up 3 to 5 kills it seems.  

Having said that, the kill blockers seem to be a minority. Most of the coop players are cheerful and pleasant team players. 

I would remember their names and act accordingly if you don't mind being pink for a bit. They are trying to grief you so return the favor.

6 hours ago, Taylor3006 said:

Yeah in co-op you are really competing against the other human players for damage and the like. Not like in PvP at all, well maybe a little but not in most cases. Playing against bots means you have to be far more aggressive than when fighting humans so it can get down and dirty so you have to be careful. 


Never avoid capping, you get as much xp for getting a cap than you do a kill. Haven't been in too many matches where you win by capping, they are truly rare, but you need them to boost your score. It really makes a big difference on how much you earn. 

I have noticed recently a large influx of players who I assume normally play PvP. Some are quite good and just slaughter the bots, some not so good at it because it is totally different play. So many matches are ending BEFORE the 5 minute mark now, just have to laugh. The fastest I can remember was a while ago, it was 4 minutes and 17 seconds but had one yesterday that was 4 minutes and 26 seconds... You don't have lots of time to farm those points!  BTW this isn't a complaint, happy to have more players in PvE and it is really testing my abilities to farm damage quickly. Zooming thru my "first win" farming though! 

It's the 4 wins + base exp challenge. If I'm just 100 exp or so short of the required amount I'll jump into coop to get that 100 exp in 5 minutes rather than playing a whole 20 minute game and have it be a defeat and have to play another 20 minute match.

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19 minutes ago, Mainerd said:

I would remember their names and act accordingly if you don't mind being pink for a bit. They are trying to grief you so return the favor.

Intentionally Tk'ing someone is against WG rules, no matter the provocation. Take a screenshot and submit the replay for egregious acts and use the report functions otherwise.

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See signature for my opinion on WG's lazy, know-nothing"punishment" system, propped up by a steady stream of simple-minded platitudes like "you fire it you own it" that part of the player-base gobbles up and regurgitates. SOME team damage is caused by the person who gets hit, any policy or statement that doesn't acknowledge that simple fact is wrong.

 

Co-Op pointers, based on 1000s of matches of observation of bad decisions causing collisions or friendly fire:

Stay out of other player's smoke if they're still in it -- it's not for you, and they need to move around in it. 

Don't drop smoke and/or park in a "pinch point" that's going to force teammates to have to squeeze through to get past you.

Don't cut between a ship and enemy targets, if he's lining up the shot you're probably going to eat it instead of the enemy.

Don't try to park behind a ship and try to fire over it, you're just going to clip their rigging and cause team damage. 

Don't try to "formation sail" half a kilometer off another ship's rear quarter, you're just making it impossible for them to maneuver without you running into them, and you're probably the type to then blame them for "blocking you", but really it's your damn fault. 

Don't cut across all the other ships at battle start because you didn't get the spawn location you wanted, either take what you get or be patient and cross behind the other ships. 

 

Edited by KilljoyCutter
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Just now, Kizarvexis said:

Intentionally Tk'ing someone is against WG rules, no matter the provocation. Take a screenshot and submit the replay for egregious acts and use the report functions otherwise.

Accidents happen. They accidently cut me off on a torp run and they accidently drove into my torps. I'm not saying to do it every time someone does this but you learn the ones who are trying to grief and I say give it back. Wargaming won't do squat about sailing in front of someone but if they get removed early reducing their final damage. score and earning they may start playing nice. That's why I said remember their names. Sometimes it's truly an accident so it shouldn't be reoccuring. I'll even take a ban if it means a friendlier game environment. I know that sounds strange but sometimes people need a spanking to show them the error of their ways.

Normally I wouldn't encourage TKing but how else are they going to learn to play nice? Now if the OP is a cruiser player trying to use his torps at max range then complaining he needs to realize cruiser torps are "Hail Mary" weapons that mainly miss. I tend to think a person blocking torps in coop wouldn't be a normal coop player as I find most of them very helpful. 

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11 hours ago, Rocketpacman said:

Don't assume that Co-Op players are deliberately trying to kill steal when they rush in between you and the bots. Many are genuinely oblivious. 

Just as a lot of PVP players are oblivious when it happens

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4 minutes ago, Mainerd said:

Accidents happen. They accidently cut me off on a torp run and they accidently drove into my torps. I'm not saying to do it every time someone does this but you learn the ones who are trying to grief and I say give it back. Wargaming won't do squat about sailing in front of someone but if they get removed early reducing their final damage. score and earning they may start playing nice. That's why I said remember their names. Sometimes it's truly an accident so it shouldn't be reoccuring. I'll even take a ban if it means a friendlier game environment. I know that sounds strange but sometimes people need a spanking to show them the error of their ways.

Normally I wouldn't encourage TKing but how else are they going to learn to play nice? Now if the OP is a cruiser player trying to use his torps at max range then complaining he needs to realize cruiser torps are "Hail Mary" weapons that mainly miss. I tend to think a person blocking torps in coop wouldn't be a normal coop player as I find most of them very helpful. 

You didn't see them and accidently torp'ing them is one thing. Intentionally firing torps knowing they will hit a friendly is against the rules. If someone is cutting in front of you, use the in-game report system as they may not have seen you. If someone uses chat to admit that they are blocking you, send in a support ticket with a replay. But intentionally TK'ing someone because you are mad at them, just means you are part of the problem now.

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8 hours ago, RevTKS said:

Having recently started spending a decent amount of time in Coop; I have to say that I continue to be shocked and amazed at the cavalier attitude that some coop players have when it comes to rushing in front of another ship. 

I asked a few people about it; one said he does it on purpose because DD's are basically taking all the kills...(I was in my Akizuki)...so he deliberately moved so I couldn't use my torps and to take the kill. 

Most other didn't respond, but it seems it's done purposely by a few of the coop folks. They don't like someone coming in and racking up 3 to 5 kills it seems.  

Having said that, the kill blockers seem to be a minority. Most of the coop players are cheerful and pleasant team players. 

That cavalier attitude may not be from a Co-op main. Lots of PVP folks come to Co-op to get a specific thing done and they don't care about the game and wining and such. All that matters is their mission and they will even tell you right in chat they don't care and are just going to do X.  They are far more likely to act reckless and risk TK damage for a kill or some other goal than a true Co-op main.

The PVP mains are the ones I see routinely with the cavalier attitudes. Co-op mains such as myself play the same (ie; to win and to best of ability) as PVP mains. Please don't characterize Co-op players like that. Thanks. And I am not complaining about PVP players in Co-op either. They are welcome as far as I am concerned. Just discussing.

Edited by AdmiralThunder
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Most people aren't dumb enough to incriminate themselves. I don't believe in looking for a fight but I sure won't allow myself to be pushed around to avoid one.

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2 hours ago, Krautjaeger said:

I don't really play much co-op but the good old rule of thumb from PvP is always valid, only fire torpedoes from first line (some exceptional and rare situations may allow from just behind 1st). Makes me wonder if those firing from second, and even third line, in PvP are people straight out of Co-op.

Had a guy on the enemy team tell both teams in chat how he thought all people that did not move when he fired torpedoes were '[edited]' and everyone should look out for torpedoes and move when they were coming by, my guess is he was pink and wanted an excuse, though both teams opened up on him and pretty much said 'how about no' and only fire from first line. He still did not get it though and carried on ranting.

At least as it relates to Co-op, there are no "lines".  Bots don't island-hump or mess around, they're coming to get you.  

Most battles turn into a melee because one side (the bots) has no patience and no fear.

 

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8 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Co-op is a mentality that you have to get all the kills / damage you possibly can if you want any sort of rewards, and Co-op rewards are very low to begin with.

 

8 vs 8 ships and matches on average take 6-7 minutes long.  If you have lots of players, it's over even quicker, 4 minutes tops.  The bots are so dumb, the targets so few the match is over very quickly.  This isn't like PVP where you may not even get 1 kill, but due to the long match where enemy players stay alive, repair their damage, and matches taking 10, 15, 20 minutes, you can walk away with lots of Credits & XPs.  Co-op is over so quickly, the bots don't even repair much, if at all.  They don't even live long enough.  So, when looking at the total HP pool of bot ships compared to players, it's not the same.  The players will Repair, stay alive, and you can farm damage off them.  Not in Co-op.  They're dead quick.  Co-op is over so quickly that in the majority of cases, capping is of zero value.

 

So, one had best get everything they can, more than your teammates if you want something out of Co-op.  Otherwise with mediocre performance of just not getting in enough damage, you will lose Credits and get nothing in XPs.  If I'm late to the party or RNG hasn't favored my gun salvos, you can easily walk out with 200 or so XPs and lose Credits.  200 BaseXPs is well within reason to happen when you got a full player roster and the match is done in 4 minutes.

 

The best case scenario in Co-op is if you are the only player.

While the low rewards and need for "greed" are real issues, I rarely see co-op battles that end that fast.   10 minutes is more common than 4.

One thing that could be done to mitigate the low rewards in some battles is to eliminate the "0 point rule" in co-op -- stop ending battles when one side gets to 0 points.  In co-op, this can and routinely does result in battles ending with 1 or 2 enemy ships still afloat, often with most of their "hull points" still intact. 

 

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