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Lert

Two thoughts about the CV rework

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Thought the first: The CV reworks are a buff to DDs.

One of the things about the current CV gameplay is that with multiple squadrons a well played CV can scout out DDs and keep them lit. With only one playable squadron this ability is severely curtailed, and with only one squadron who's focus is on doing damage, the CV will be oftentimes too preoccupied to keep destroyers lit since doing so would preclude them from doing damage.

Thought the second: The CV reworks are the death knell to Ise, Tone and any other hybrid CV ship proposal.

Since the focus is on directly controlling a single squadron precluding being able to directly control the launching ship, any hybrid ship will be impossible to properly implement keeping the CV gameplay as shown in the rework video. Launching planes would mean no more direct control over your ship or its weapons, and piloting the ship would mean no planes. A CV hybrid ship would need a completely different and unique set of gameplay, which WG cites as one of the reasons they're stepping away from the overhead, RTS style of CV play and implementing direct squadron control in the first place.

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1 minute ago, Lert said:

Thought the first: The CV reworks are a buff to DDs.

One of the things about the current CV gameplay is that with multiple squadrons a well played CV can scout out DDs and keep them lit. With only one playable squadron this ability is severely curtailed, and with only one squadron who's focus is on doing damage, the CV will be oftentimes too preoccupied to keep destroyers lit since doing so would preclude them from doing damage.

Thought the seconds: The CV reworks are the death knell to ISE, TONE and any other hybrid CV ship proposal.

Since the focus is on directly controlling a single squadron precluding being able to directly control the launching ship, any hybrid ship will be impossible to properly implement keeping the CV gameplay as shown in the rework video. Launching planes would mean no more direct control over your ship or its weapons, and piloting the ship would mean no planes. A CV hybrid ship would need a completely different and unique set of gameplay, which WG cites as one of the reasons they're stepping away from the overhead, RTS style of CV play and implementing direct squadron control in the first place.

1.  WG gets their wish and has more CV's (3?) per match, it may make DD lives worse.  Gotta kill the little CV snipers first.  Or go for big damage BB's.  Hard to tell without an understanding of the new AA workup.

2.  Yep

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It would be cool to see hybrids, but I think most people would have trouble with them, unless they just clicked an auto-drop target when the planes launched.

I know in NavyField, the only hybrid commonly seen was the Oyodo and the Mogami conversion, and that was just because it gave early access to a CV. Most players didn't even mount the main guns.

You couldn't use the guns when you were making an attack run, and if you used the guns, your planes were sitting ducks.

 

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Well, regarding the DDs it would be barely different than current non-CV matches, so...

About the second... I only hope that WG allows direct control of the CV also, in such case the foundation will be there for hybrids, otherwise :Smile_sad:

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4 minutes ago, DrHolmes52 said:

1.  WG gets their wish and has more CV's (3?) per match, it may make DD lives worse.  Gotta kill the little CV snipers first.  Or go for big damage BB's.  Hard to tell without an understanding of the new AA workup.

2.  Yep

1. Still, even with 3 CVs after the rework, they still can't be in any more places at once than one Langley with three squads can be now.  A current Hakuryu can be in 7 or 8 places at once.  I don't think we'll see 7 or 8 CV matches very often if at all.  IMO, the biggest change is exactly this.  Flamu mentioned this yesterday as well.  I current Midway can have squads in many places doing things at once, including harassing DDs.  New way, one carrier can observe or attack in one place at one time.  They can move really fast, true, but, they can't spot the DD, AND attack the BB half a screen away at the same time.  Takes 2 CVs to do that after the rework.

2, Yes, true, but, really, those weren't very powerful anyway.  If you want a spotting ship, get Tone/Chikuma...

 

Edited by mavfin87

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2 minutes ago, CO_Valle said:

About the second... I only hope that WG allows direct control of the CV also, in such case the foundation will be there for hybrids, otherwise :Smile_sad:

That would get in the way of homogenizing gameplay between the PC and console / mobile variants of WoWS.

I mean, I don't know why we PC mustard rice players should be concerned with that either, but there you have it.

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14 minutes ago, Lert said:

Thought the first: The CV reworks are a buff to DDs.

One of the things about the current CV gameplay is that with multiple squadrons a well played CV can scout out DDs and keep them lit. With only one playable squadron this ability is severely curtailed, and with only one squadron who's focus is on doing damage, the CV will be oftentimes too preoccupied to keep destroyers lit since doing so would preclude them from doing damage.

Thought the second: The CV reworks are the death knell to Ise, Tone and any other hybrid CV ship proposal.

Since the focus is on directly controlling a single squadron precluding being able to directly control the launching ship, any hybrid ship will be impossible to properly implement keeping the CV gameplay as shown in the rework video. Launching planes would mean no more direct control over your ship or its weapons, and piloting the ship would mean no planes. A CV hybrid ship would need a completely different and unique set of gameplay, which WG cites as one of the reasons they're stepping away from the overhead, RTS style of CV play and implementing direct squadron control in the first place.

>CV Reworks are a buff to DDs

It's a step in the right direction at least.  Planes spotting torpedoes is 100% buzzkill.

>The CV reworks are the death knell to Ise, Tone and any other hybrid CV ship proposal.

The death knell to Ise and Tone were when WG said they would never be in the game during CBT.

Edited by TheSeventhSeeker
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1 minute ago, mavfin87 said:

1. Still, even with 3 CVs after the rework, they still can't be in any more places at once than one Langley with three squads can be now.  A current Hakuryu can be in 7 or 8 places at once.  I don't think we'll see 7 or 8 CV matches very often if at all.

2, Yes, true, but, really, those weren't very powerful anyway.  If you want a spotting ship, get Tone/Chikuma...

 

Now that I think about it, 3 CV's would have to work together to make spotting a thing.

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1 minute ago, Lert said:

That would get in the way of homogenizing gameplay between the PC and console / mobile variants of WoWS.

I mean, I don't know why we PC mustard rice players should be concerned with that either, but there you have it.

Well Ise was announced yesterday (I think) for WoWS Blitz ... so, if a phone can handle it...

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1 minute ago, TheSeventhSeeker said:

The death knell to Ise and Tone were when WG said they would never be in the game during CBT.

And IIRC, there were no Ise and Tone in the game during CBT.

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Just now, DrHolmes52 said:

Now that I think about it, 3 CV's would have to work together to make spotting a thing.

See my edits.  IMO the biggest change in the rework is that it makes CVs a ship that, like the others, can influence one area at one time.  No more controlling the whole map.  People are getting hung up on the plane thing, but, what is the main battery of the carrier, after all?

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4 minutes ago, DrHolmes52 said:

1.  WG gets their wish and has more CV's (3?) per match, it may make DD lives worse. 

I don't see it getting that bad. We get one CV every so many matches now.

We'd need a huge influx of new CV players just to get one in every match.

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4 minutes ago, TheSeventhSeeker said:

 

The death knell to Ise and Tone were when WG said they would never be in the game during CBT.

Like subs?

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4 minutes ago, mavfin87 said:

See my edits.  IMO the biggest change in the rework is that it makes CVs a ship that, like the others, can influence one area at one time.  No more controlling the whole map.  People are getting hung up on the plane thing, but, what is the main battery of the carrier, after all?

Only issue I can see there is, they may have to adjust (or remove) HE shells degrading AA ability.

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3 minutes ago, Skpstr said:

I don't see it getting that bad. We get one CV every so many matches now.

We'd need a huge influx of new CV players just to get one in every match.

3 reworked CVs can spot 3 DDs.  Also, those 3 CVs can't do anything else while they're spotting those DDs.

One Langley with 3 squadrons can do that alone now.  Midway or Hak can do that and still have half their squads doing other tasks at the same time. 

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21 minutes ago, Lert said:

Thought the first: The CV reworks are a buff to DDs.

One of the things about the current CV gameplay is that with multiple squadrons a well played CV can scout out DDs and keep them lit. With only one playable squadron this ability is severely curtailed, and with only one squadron who's focus is on doing damage, the CV will be oftentimes too preoccupied to keep destroyers lit since doing so would preclude them from doing damage.

Thought the second: The CV reworks are the death knell to Ise, Tone and any other hybrid CV ship proposal.

Since the focus is on directly controlling a single squadron precluding being able to directly control the launching ship, any hybrid ship will be impossible to properly implement keeping the CV gameplay as shown in the rework video. Launching planes would mean no more direct control over your ship or its weapons, and piloting the ship would mean no planes. A CV hybrid ship would need a completely different and unique set of gameplay, which WG cites as one of the reasons they're stepping away from the overhead, RTS style of CV play and implementing direct squadron control in the first place.

and the death knell to German raider BattleCarriers.

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5 minutes ago, Lert said:

And IIRC, there were no Ise and Tone in the game during CBT.

As carrier hybrids, I mean - Tone was in the game for a while, but not as a carrier hybrid, just as an ordinary CA.

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1 minute ago, Skpstr said:

Only issue I can see there is, they may have to adjust (or remove) HE shells degrading AA ability.

That is true, but, that's all tune-able.  I usually don't like Flamu, but he showed a whole co-op match with the CV rework gameplay, and his comments were quite interesting.

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1. Yep. And a nerf to one player dominating (or losing) an entire game. Which is as it should be.

2. Ise/Hyuga, Tone, etc hybrid aviation vessels would still be a great addition to the game for their unique gameplay. Using the new CV mechanic with them wouldn't work at all, but using the 'old' system with them would make sense (and be a selling point). They could use the old system because they have realitively few planes that are weak by CV standards and therefore wouldn't have the same impact as a full CV. These ships were primarily 'scout aviation' ships for the fleet and would fulfill that role with the old mechanics (Ise/Hyuuga having 'one shot' bomber squadrons as well). Or simply use the controllable comsumable float plane mechanics from Alpha/Beta testing times for their planes.

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1 minute ago, LoveBote said:

and the death knell to German raider BattleCarriers.

Well, I imagine if they keep those rocket penetrating AP bombs, they can still be useful, just not in the mass way it is now.

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3 minutes ago, TheSeventhSeeker said:

As carrier hybrids, I mean - Tone was in the game for a while, but not as a carrier hybrid, just as an ordinary CA.

It was in ST. It was never in 'the game', IE, the live product.

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14 minutes ago, TheSeventhSeeker said:

The death knell to Ise and Tone were when WG said they would never be in the game during CBT.

They also said no submarines, but I think the biggest issue is now indeed the rework interface. The only way to handle it with the rework coming would be to have them keyed as multiple spotter or catapult fighter consumables.

Edited by Ensign_Cthulhu

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2 minutes ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

They also said no submarines, but I think the biggest issue is now indeed the rework interface. The only way to handle it with the rework coming would be to have them keyed as multiple spotter or catapult fighter consumables.

They could also use a consumable like the new squadrons do with fighters. Could just use an AI wing (not complete squadron) for a one-shot attack)

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Just now, TheSeventhSeeker said:

It was in China, supposedly.

China does what China does. They're not under WG's say.

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