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Kagero — Japanese Tier VIII destroyer.

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Kagero — Japanese Tier VIII destroyer.

Due to a good balance of her main characteristics, Kagero was the most successful destroyer design in the Imperial Japanese Navy. She had extremely long-range, high-speed, oxygen-fueled torpedoes that made her considerably superior to all ships of her type in terms of torpedo armament power.
Kagero_wows_main.jpg
WGWiki

This topic is the starting point for discussing this type of destroyers.
When a full-fledged guide appears, this topic will be replaced.

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Worthless heap of slag just like every torpedo-dependent IJN DD past Fubuki except MAYBE Shima. The torpedoes are absurdly visible (ludicrous), the reload is obscenely long (historical except only IJN DDs even HAD reloads, so by that metric they should be the only ones that can reload at all), the guns don't exist(historical), the speed is bad and bleeds hard in turns (historical), and the durability is a joke (historical).

If the torpedoes had DWT-level stealth, the IJN DDs that aren't Akizuki on up or Shima might actually be playable.

As is?

It just fulfills what seems to be the real purpose of this game: Making Russians seem like they are still mad about Tsushima... but then why would the Type 5 Heavy be so absurdly OP in WoT?

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Is there a torpedo visibility chart somewhere? Obviously I could look them all up one by one but thought that would be a waste if this already exists.

Thanks!

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This boat is now useless in games with more than 1 enemy carrier, if the enemy is at all competent.

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40 minutes ago, Destroyer_KuroshioKai said:

Thanks for the effort. However, I found nothing here that showed me torpedo visibility ranges or a chart. In fact, there was just a kind of table of contents with nothing linked.

Perhaps I am missing something......

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image.thumb.png.8e074fdcd13354d1df7346911d14b606.png

If you so needed you could compare other DDs to their closest competition under the Ship Comparison tab.  The level of detail goes far beyond torp reaction times.  Like here:

image.thumb.png.33ea37dbc6475abec7248722c3ea5dfe.png

You need to select what you wish to review, for example comparing gun performance between US, IJN and RU DDs under the Artillery tab:

image.thumb.png.eea2bb1f1d6de0d561b7f5afb74f36c3.png

I spend a lot of time on here working out and comparing builds and performance between different ships.

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On 1/26/2019 at 5:59 PM, Guardian54 said:

Worthless heap of slag just like every torpedo-dependent IJN DD past Fubuki except MAYBE Shima. The torpedoes are absurdly visible (ludicrous), the reload is obscenely long (historical except only IJN DDs even HAD reloads, so by that metric they should be the only ones that can reload at all), the guns don't exist(historical), the speed is bad and bleeds hard in turns (historical), and the durability is a joke (historical).

If the torpedoes had DWT-level stealth, the IJN DDs that aren't Akizuki on up or Shima might actually be playable.

As is?

It just fulfills what seems to be the real purpose of this game: Making Russians seem like they are still mad about Tsushima... but then why would the Type 5 Heavy be so absurdly OP in WoT?

I have over 300 games in the Kagero, over 300 kills, with over 15 million in total damage. She has more Krakens for me than any other ship in the entire game.

She's a gem, when handled correctly.

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On 2/8/2019 at 11:33 PM, Grflrgl said:

I have over 300 games in the Kagero, over 300 kills, with over 15 million in total damage. She has more Krakens for me than any other ship in the entire game.

She's a gem, when handled correctly.

WOWS Numbers has Kagero as third from last for All, Top 10%, and Top 5%, Top 50% is 5th from last, top 25% is 4th from last.

However, those numbers all have Old Fubuki ranking worse than Kagero.

So of 15 Tier 8 DDs not counting Old Tashkent and Old Fubuki, Kagero is 2nd last for Overall, Top 10%, and Top 5%, and still within the last few places for Top 50% and Top 25% of players. This indicates poor skill floor AND poor skill ceiling. And the reason? VISIBLE FROM ORBIT TORPEDOES.

I'm citing Win Rate BTW, the most important stat by far.

You happen to click well with the boat, so good for you, but the mass numbers say that it's pretty bad.

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1 minute ago, Guardian54 said:

WOWS Numbers has Kagero as third from last for All, Top 10%, and Top 5%, Top 50% is 5th from last, top 25% is 4th from last.

However, those numbers all have Old Fubuki ranking worse than Kagero.

So of 15 Tier 8 DDs not counting Old Tashkent and Old Fubuki, Kagero is 2nd last for Overall, Top 10%, and Top 5%, and still within the last few places for Top 50% and Top 25% of players. This indicates poor skill floor AND poor skill ceiling. And the reason? VISIBLE FROM ORBIT TORPEDOES.

I'm citing Win Rate BTW, the most important stat by far.

You happen to click well with the boat, so good for you, but the mass numbers say that it's pretty bad.

Well, ok, but another interpretation is that the masses are the problem, not the boat. The skill floor is higher on IJN DDs, of that there is no question. But that still makes it a matter of skill, and the boat is not responsible for the skill of the player. I can't play the Russian DDs worth anything, but that doesn't mean they aren't capable ships.

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12 minutes ago, Guardian54 said:

WOWS Numbers has Kagero as third from last for All, Top 10%, and Top 5%, Top 50% is 5th from last, top 25% is 4th from last.

But then the WR% is very even across the board with the exception of top 4 ships. The difference between 49.6% and 51% is very tiny.

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1 hour ago, Grflrgl said:

Well, ok, but another interpretation is that the masses are the problem, not the boat. The skill floor is higher on IJN DDs, of that there is no question. But that still makes it a matter of skill, and the boat is not responsible for the skill of the player. I can't play the Russian DDs worth anything, but that doesn't mean they aren't capable ships.

"All the customers are wrong!" -TLDR version of that idiot at EA justifying the decisions made for Battlefield V.

I don't think blaming the users who bother foruming and trying to figure things out is a Good Idea.

...Though "bad commander skill set" is a potentail serious problem. For example, a Khab not boosting its range as much as possible to pretend to be a light cruiser is User Error to the Nth degree.

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Pre-CV apocalypse I had a lot of fun in Kagero. She has the best concealment available in high tiers (5.4km) which was extremely valuable. She was excellent for vision control. The tricky thing was getting around radar. I found the best way to play her was to be extremely cautious at the start of the round, be turned away from the cap and ready to bolt at a moments notice. If an enemy DD shows up, just run for it because chances are you'll be able to get the cap later.

Also just dump torps as much as possible down expected enemy paths. You can either do a massive dump with TRB, or reserve TRB for when you have a target you can see. You'll be surprised how many hits you get from blind launches. Maximize the minimap with "Numpad+" to help plot your launches and try to predict enemy paths. If you're a team player you can also shoot your guns to reveal yourself to the enemy to force them into maneuvering in ways that are good for your team. Even if your torps are still reloading, you can make an enemy turn towards or away from you because they're afraid of eating a torpedo, you'll have to keep an eye on which way their guns are facing before you do this though.

Since Yugumo is almost the same ship, if you can get comfortable in Kagero you'll be very happy in Yugumo.

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Kagero desperately needs 12km torps, the 10km torps and 9.4km guns means the ship needs to constantly be inside radar range to have a chance at doing damage, and when bottom tier that's simple not possible due to the mass radar - the ship is such a slug it's too easy to hit.

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On 2/18/2019 at 4:01 AM, wimpb said:

Pre-CV apocalypse I had a lot of fun in Kagero. She has the best concealment available in high tiers (5.4km) which was extremely valuable. She was excellent for vision control. The tricky thing was getting around radar. I found the best way to play her was to be extremely cautious at the start of the round, be turned away from the cap and ready to bolt at a moments notice. If an enemy DD shows up, just run for it because chances are you'll be able to get the cap later.

Also just dump torps as much as possible down expected enemy paths. You can either do a massive dump with TRB, or reserve TRB for when you have a target you can see. You'll be surprised how many hits you get from blind launches. Maximize the minimap with "Numpad+" to help plot your launches and try to predict enemy paths. If you're a team player you can also shoot your guns to reveal yourself to the enemy to force them into maneuvering in ways that are good for your team. Even if your torps are still reloading, you can make an enemy turn towards or away from you because they're afraid of eating a torpedo, you'll have to keep an eye on which way their guns are facing before you do this though.

Since Yugumo is almost the same ship, if you can get comfortable in Kagero you'll be very happy in Yugumo.

I am thankful to have Harekaze which gives the Kagero hull the much needed AA and main gun firepower courtesy of being able to mount 3x dual 100mm turrets. So if discovered by aircraft I can simply switch onnthe AA guns to discourage the attacking planes from continuing their attacks.

I have not taken the regular Kagero out as much since getting Harekaze, but the main protection against air attacks still is the same. Staying out of sight if at all possible by keeping the AA guns turned off unless the aircraft happen to find you in which case you need to turn the AA guns back on until the planes move just outside your minimum air detection range. And with a little practice you can alter course to avoid getting detected in the first place and shaking off planes attempting to attack. Plus with CV popularity dropping the TRB Kagero will not have to worry about air attacks quite as often.

A fun trick about Kagero and Harekaze is their main gun range being less than10Km, this allows them to destroy damaged enemy ships and immediately go dark if the other enemy ships are beyond your main gun range. This is something the other DDs at tier 8 don’t get with their longer gun ranges is the ability to strike like a ninja. And so many people will complain about the short main guns n range without even realizing how useful it can be.

So the days of Kagero being heavily used are not over, not by a long shot. After all the regular Kagero is the ship that holds the 3rd highest enemy ships sunk total after my Bismarck and Gneisenau. And Kagero did not accomplish that by not being able to fight in many battle conditions including with CVs present, after all many of those ships sunk were weekend players I went hunting fir since they are not as smart in avoiding torpedoes on average. But the downside to Weekend battles is you usually have always seen increased numbers of CVs, so you get used to playing with them in battles.

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On 2/8/2019 at 11:24 PM, Destroyer_KuroshioKai said:

image.thumb.png.8e074fdcd13354d1df7346911d14b606.png

If you so needed you could compare other DDs to their closest competition under the Ship Comparison tab.  The level of detail goes far beyond torp reaction times.  Like here:

image.thumb.png.33ea37dbc6475abec7248722c3ea5dfe.png

You need to select what you wish to review, for example comparing gun performance between US, IJN and RU DDs under the Artillery tab:

image.thumb.png.eea2bb1f1d6de0d561b7f5afb74f36c3.png

I spend a lot of time on here working out and comparing builds and performance between different ships.

:Smile_great:Nice  TYVM   for going to that trouble you are awesome:Smile_medal:

Salute_Emoji.png

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Given I find Yugumo quite acceptable with 12km torps, I can only conclude that my Bad Times with Kagero were due to two main things:

1. The main gun refire rate being too slow.

2. The 10km torps not having enough range.

Edited by Guardian54

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