Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
You need to play a total of 5 battles to post in this section.
1Sherman

The new CV gameplay looks quite interesting.

22 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

1,045
Alpha Tester
4,736 posts
2,411 battles

 

It definitely looks enticing for new players while also allowing the existing CV veterans to flourish. The new rocket-armed attack planes look cool as anything. My big concern, however, is that iChase says that you can dodge the long-range AA fire. This may just be me, but I'm a little worried that that will mean that Defensive Fire on cruisers like the Baltimore I just bought will be largely useless until it's too late. Otherwise, I think it looks OK.

  • Cool 2
  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
343
[S0L0]
[S0L0]
Alpha Tester
1,386 posts
1,491 battles

Well..  AA may need to be a bit toned down on Some ships really...especially at 1st look.   Early impression watching this,   It appears that really good CV players may have lost the ability to manual TB drop delete pretty much any ship at will..   So squadron auto delete AA might be overly punitive.  I'm sure this will take a good bit of balancing.    

  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
240
[NUWES]
Members
1,641 posts
5,494 battles
1 hour ago, RA6E_ said:

Well..  AA may need to be a bit toned down on Some ships really...especially at 1st look.   Early impression watching this,   It appears that really good CV players may have lost the ability to manual TB drop delete pretty much any ship at will..   So squadron auto delete AA might be overly punitive.  I'm sure this will take a good bit of balancing.    

You are still manual dropping, you just can't cross drop. I think the rework is a good start. Basically what they did is turn the constellation of plane waves that you have to manage under the old system, into one big plane wave that behaves more like a very fast ship that scoots through the air. The plane wave is like very small, fragile, fast DD which swoops in and out quickly and gets one salvo per pass. It's an interesting way to bring carrier gameplay closer to the gameplay for the rest of the game. It can definitely work. The biggest observations for me are:

1. The turnaround time on the wave seems rather fast, although it may just have been sped-up to not leave the audience waiting while the planes turn around for another pass.

2. The attack runs were all against stationary target ships or ships moving in a straight line with minimal AA. Again the video was for gameplay display purposes so that is understandable. I suspect the attacks are much more difficult against moving targets with good AA. There was a point in the video where a flak blast from a heavy AA gun shredded 3 planes out of a wave. I suspect that will happen quite a bit in realtime use. (And it should.) The penalty for that is you may have to wait a while before the planes regenerate.

3. The targeting reticule for the DBs needs some work. The small dot moves then jumps back a bit and transforms into the large oblong reticule when the plane climbs for a dive. Real DBs don't skim the water like that then pop-up and dive. They just fly high and dive down. Having them travel higher and just dive may simplify the animation and also fix the jumping reticule problem. 

4. I wonder if you can create mixed swarms, say 1x3 pack of rocket planes, 2x 3 packs of TB, and 1x3 pack of DBs for example and chose the order in which they attack. I suspect not, but that would be interesting. 

5. The rocket planes seemed like they were having an easy time setting fires. They also seemed to be easy to hit with although the damage they did was absolutely tiny. It may just be RNG since we only saw 2-3 attack runs with them. 

6. We didn't see anything about how to manage the CV itself. I suspect it is basically the same as before and there is some way to toggle back but that will be interesting to see. Also, I don't recall if there is one, but there should be a recall button to summon the waves back to the carrier if it needs to defend itself. 

7. I didn't hear anything about the AP DBs. I think AP bombs should stay. They will be more manageable with only 3 planes dropping. You won't have KM battleships evaporating like happened before. (People forget that usually required most of the wave hitting and citadeling to do that.)

8. It isn't clear from the video how the individual carriers will be differentiated from each other. That is also understandable because it is just a gameplay video, but Kaga and Saipan, for example, were very different beasts at opposite ends of the CV spectrum on the same tier. I can think of ways to do this by chancing the number of planes  making the attack and changing the tier of the planes (4 plane waves with lower tier planes like for Kaga vs. say 2 plane waves with late-war planes for Saipan for example). 

9. I look forward to this for the American CVs. Ranger and Lexington in particular certainly couldn't get worse than they are now. 

Overall, I am very excited for this. I had given up on CVs because I simply can't multitask well enough to play a RTS game in the middle of a FPS. I am now interested again. I had  Commodore 64 game many years ago where you controlled attack planes like this. I couldn't hit a thing with the DBs in that game but it was fun trying. To Wargaming, if you happen to stumble across this post, please consider me for the closed beta. I would love to test this. I will also happily bring my AA rigged ships to be on the target-ed side.  :cap_rambo:Also thank you in advance for all the effort you all put in. :Smile_medal:

Edited by Tzarevitch
Grammar
  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26
[WHS]
[WHS]
Members
245 posts
8,197 battles
1 hour ago, Tzarevitch said:

3. The targeting reticule for the DBs needs some work. The small dot moves then jumps back a bit and transforms into the large oblong reticule when the plane climbs for a dive. Real DBs don't skim the water like that then pop-up and dive. They just fly high and dive down. Having them travel higher and just dive may simplify the animation and also fix the jumping reticule problem.

I share this same concern, it takes a long time to aim in which the squadron is pretty much stationary, then it starts moving a bit forward. Combined with the other point about all attacks shown being on stationary / straight lining targets, I assume this attack will be very unlikely to work due to any steering action invalidating the set up you create and it might only work against actual island camping targets...

Since this new gameplay is a lot more maneuverable and fast paced, I'm a bit worried about how it will play at 100ms+ ping counts. I tried WoT a few times and I felt like it plays like absolute garbage because of the oversteering of the tanks due to the completely server-side movement control. I hope for this new mode there will be some degree of negotiation between the client and the server controller to make gameplay smoother

Edited by ElvenRed

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
618
[WOLF1]
[WOLF1]
Members
2,765 posts
1,320 battles
5 minutes ago, ElvenRed said:

I assume this attack will be very unlikely to work due to any steering action invalidating the set up you create and it might only work against actual island camping targets...

Think about the actual mechanics of diving from 16000 feet, and pulling out at 2500, to drop a bomb on a maneuvering target. Was not easy, and yes, you're exposed to AA once you're in the dive, and yes, you'll have to correct if they maneuver, and may not get the drop you really wanted.

That's why coordinated VB and VT attacks were good; the air version of the BB dodging torps and exposing his broadside because of it.

Try the dive-bombing a destroyer or cruiser in a game that has that kind of simulation. Warbirds did this.  I suspect simulation mode of WT will allow this as well.  In comparison, the mode shown in the video is still pretty simplified.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
240
[NUWES]
Members
1,641 posts
5,494 battles
10 minutes ago, mavfin87 said:

Think about the actual mechanics of diving from 16000 feet, and pulling out at 2500, to drop a bomb on a maneuvering target. Was not easy, and yes, you're exposed to AA once you're in the dive, and yes, you'll have to correct if they maneuver, and may not get the drop you really wanted.

That's why coordinated VB and VT attacks were good; the air version of the BB dodging torps and exposing his broadside because of it.

Try the dive-bombing a destroyer or cruiser in a game that has that kind of simulation. Warbirds did this.  I suspect simulation mode of WT will allow this as well.  In comparison, the mode shown in the video is still pretty simplified.

I had an old C64 game that did it too. It was hard has hell to aim and apparently it was pretty hard in real life but it was a lot of fun.

I was just commenting that their targeting reticule in the video starts like a small circle, tracks along with the plane movement, then jumps back when the plane pulls up and then transforms into a larger oblong shape. That doesn't make sense. It should stay oblong shape throughout and track along normally without the strange jump. One of the CCs (either Flamu or Notser) noted the same thing. The first circle doesn't really reflect the actual bomb drop location or the size of the drop zone. It is really just a graphical problem that they need to fix that will make it hard for people to target bombs. It should probably start  as a large oblong then shrink to smaller size as the plane gets closer like the torp bomber cone to reflect greater accuracy. The planes should then risk taking greater damage if they want to reduce the reticle to minimum size for maximum precision. That would add an element of player skill to survive to get close enough to drop without losing all the planes. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,433
[OPGS]
Beta Testers
3,207 posts
5,669 battles
3 hours ago, Tzarevitch said:

You are still manual dropping, you just can't cross drop. I think the rework is a good start. Basically what they did is turn the constellation of plane waves that you have to manage under the old system, into one big plane wave that behaves more like a very fast ship that scoots through the air. The plane wave is like very small, fragile, fast DD which swoops in and out quickly and gets one salvo per pass. It's an interesting way to bring carrier gameplay closer to the gameplay for the rest of the game. It can definitely work. The biggest observations for me are:

1. The turnaround time on the wave seems rather fast, although it may just have been sped-up to not leave the audience waiting while the planes turn around for another pass.

2. The attack runs were all against stationary target ships or ships moving in a straight line with minimal AA. Again the video was for gameplay display purposes so that is understandable. I suspect the attacks are much more difficult against moving targets with good AA. There was a point in the video where a flak blast from a heavy AA gun shredded 3 planes out of a wave. I suspect that will happen quite a bit in realtime use. (And it should.) The penalty for that is you may have to wait a while before the planes regenerate.

3. The targeting reticule for the DBs needs some work. The small dot moves then jumps back a bit and transforms into the large oblong reticule when the plane climbs for a dive. Real DBs don't skim the water like that then pop-up and dive. They just fly high and dive down. Having them travel higher and just dive may simplify the animation and also fix the jumping reticule problem. 

4. I wonder if you can create mixed swarms, say 1x3 pack of rocket planes, 2x 3 packs of TB, and 1x3 pack of DBs for example and chose the order in which they attack. I suspect not, but that would be interesting. 

5. The rocket planes seemed like they were having an easy time setting fires. They also seemed to be easy to hit with although the damage they did was absolutely tiny. It may just be RNG since we only saw 2-3 attack runs with them. 

6. We didn't see anything about how to manage the CV itself. I suspect it is basically the same as before and there is some way to toggle back but that will be interesting to see. Also, I don't recall if there is one, but there should be a recall button to summon the waves back to the carrier if it needs to defend itself. 

7. I didn't hear anything about the AP DBs. I think AP bombs should stay. They will be more manageable with only 3 planes dropping. You won't have KM battleships evaporating like happened before. (People forget that usually required most of the wave hitting and citadeling to do that.)

8. It isn't clear from the video how the individual carriers will be differentiated from each other. That is also understandable because it is just a gameplay video, but Kaga and Saipan, for example, were very different beasts at opposite ends of the CV spectrum on the same tier. I can think of ways to do this by chancing the number of planes  making the attack and changing the tier of the planes (4 plane waves with lower tier planes like for Kaga vs. say 2 plane waves with late-war planes for Saipan for example). 

9. I look forward to this for the American CVs. Ranger and Lexington in particular certainly couldn't get worse than they are now. 

Overall, I am very excited for this. I had given up on CVs because I simply can't multitask well enough to play a RTS game in the middle of a FPS. I am now interested again. I had  Commodore 64 game many years ago where you controlled attack planes like this. I couldn't hit a thing with the DBs in that game but it was fun trying. To Wargaming, if you happen to stumble across this post, please consider me for the closed beta. I would love to test this. I will also happily bring my AA rigged ships to be on the target-ed side.  :cap_rambo:Also thank you in advance for all the effort you all put in. :Smile_medal:

Do you remember the name of that Commodore 64 game? I am an OG gamer like you and probably played it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
258
[WOLF1]
Members
1,984 posts

i like this first person attack, much better than RTS that seems so out of place

i might start playing CV god mode for a change, lol

but i agree the perma flooding has be go, make it time limited just like fire

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,433
[OPGS]
Beta Testers
3,207 posts
5,669 battles

It will be interesting to see if the unicum CV players will still play CV's. They were unicum players because they had God like ability to multitask so will the new CV system make them just another CV player.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
240
[NUWES]
Members
1,641 posts
5,494 battles
36 minutes ago, Belthorian said:

Do you remember the name of that Commodore 64 game? I am an OG gamer like you and probably played it.

Unfortunately no. I've been wracking my brain but it was so long ago. lol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,433
[OPGS]
Beta Testers
3,207 posts
5,669 battles
2 minutes ago, Tzarevitch said:

Unfortunately no. I've been wracking my brain but it was so long ago. lol

LOL The one downside to being a OG Gamer....is we can't remember a lot of things today hehehehe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
618
[WOLF1]
[WOLF1]
Members
2,765 posts
1,320 battles
2 minutes ago, Belthorian said:

LOL The one downside to being a OG Gamer....is we can't remember a lot of things today hehehehe

Yeah, as we get older, we suffer from CRS more and more...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,433
[OPGS]
Beta Testers
3,207 posts
5,669 battles
3 minutes ago, Tzarevitch said:

Unfortunately no. I've been wracking my brain but it was so long ago. lol

Of course your description makes me think of the Dynamix game Aces of the Pacific. You controlled Torpedo Bombers and Dive bombers. LOL The Torpedo bomber was so hard I had zero hits in about 100 drops lol.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,433
[OPGS]
Beta Testers
3,207 posts
5,669 battles
8 minutes ago, mavfin87 said:

Yeah, as we get older, we suffer from CRS more and more...

I choose to look at the bright side of my eventual slide into senility........At least I will get to meet new people every day.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
240
[NUWES]
Members
1,641 posts
5,494 battles
1 hour ago, mavfin87 said:

Yeah, as we get older, we suffer from CRS more and more...

Indeed. lol. I really wish I could remember it though. I just remember trying to line ships up with the dive bombing sights and how hard it was with the planes that couldn't dive that steeply. It was damn hard. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
691
[DRACS]
Members
3,351 posts
On 04/09/2018 at 1:49 PM, Belthorian said:

It will be interesting to see if the unicum CV players will still play CV's. They were unicum players because they had God like ability to multitask so will the new CV system make them just another CV player.

My worry is that many of them will quit out of spite without actually trying the new system when it goes live. After all, they won't be so unicum anymore given they'll have just as much experience with CVs as everyone else ... which is to say, none.

As for Defensive Fire ... I don't know what they plan on doing here, but my 'guess' is that they'll make it so that the flak area gets doubled or tripled while the consumable is active, making dodging the flak very very difficult.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
276
[LHG]
Members
1,190 posts
4,924 battles
7 minutes ago, KaptainKaybe said:

My worry is that many of them will quit out of spite without actually trying the new system when it goes live. After all, they won't be so unicum anymore given they'll have just as much experience with CVs as everyone else ... which is to say, none.

Most players driven out of a game don't leave because of a drop in their stats, they leave because they don't like how the game plays anymore. I don't know what kind of people you think play CVs.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
83
[WOLF1]
[WOLF1]
Beta Testers
1,106 posts
11,848 battles
On 9/4/2018 at 6:35 AM, LemonadeWarrior said:

I want to be able to control my AA guns :3

Really that could have the potential to be pretty sweet counter play if you had the option to let the AI take care of it as shown or operate short range AA machine guns yourself to take out the three planes while on their attack run.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
83
[WOLF1]
[WOLF1]
Beta Testers
1,106 posts
11,848 battles
34 minutes ago, Flashtirade said:

Most players driven out of a game don't leave because of a drop in their stats, they leave because they don't like how the game plays anymore. I don't know what kind of people you think play CVs.

Yeah we will likely loose those here primarily for the current RTS style of CV play that aren't so much interested in the shooter style of the other lines.  I didn't like the RTS style but play CVs once in awhile just so I can drive one, understand how to counter them, and get the full WOWS experience.  I don't have a whole lot of time invested in them having only just made it to T8 on both lines, but I welcome the change.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
950 posts
5,555 battles

So you can set barrage fire with heavy flak - that's interesting as that means you can effectively foil any TB attack if you pay attention - and manual AA finally will have some meaning.

 

This is actually realistic as well - part of the USN's success against IJN aircraft was layered AA fire, beginning with long ranged barrage fire from the 5"s.

Edited by reaper_swpz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
46
[RNJR]
Members
200 posts
4,157 battles

I want to get back into my Shokaku or Taihou. i was one of those filthy casual CVs that had three torpedo squads and three dive bombers deleting BBs and cruisers.  When they buffed AA, increased everyone's rudder shift, and forced fighters into everyones loadouts i gave up. Manual strafe was a dumb mechanic and ive seen fighters engage in one on one nd an unscrupulus Captain strafing his own planes just to kill mine.  And DDs getting Defensive AA and BBs with more AA than some cruisers it just was a pain to manual drop on people.

 

This new game mode - i like it already. Ace Combat 4 it is not - but its a step in the right direction. take the squadron leader's seat and have the flyboys keep formation and fly with direct control. Maybe flight stick compatible in the future?  And i like the thrill of diving down to sea level to release torps or gaining altitude to drop down dive towards all that AA and Flak.  

 

New CV mode - im hyped... but cautious. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×