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Carbapenem_17

Massachusetts 3rd skill BFT v. SI

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So while opting for a full secondary build I am kind of unable to pick between BFT and SI. SI gives me 5 heals with premium, and BFT would give rapid firing secondaries. But I am not sure how much buff is BFT to the secondaries. 4 to 3.6 seconds reload doesn't look much.. Any suggestions? (currently using PT + AR + SI + AFT + MS)

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5 minutes ago, Carbapenem_17 said:

But I am not sure how much buff is BFT to the secondaries.

About 10%.

How often do you run out of heals?

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3 minutes ago, Lert said:

About 10%.

How often do you run out of heals?

I''ve been testing it  without premium. Haven't written them down. I do quite poorly in T10 battles and was unable to see if the extra heal is worth it. 4 standard heals are enough to win a T8 or even a T9 game with over 10k damage. This made me think of running BFT instead of SI but wasn't sure.

Edited by Carbapenem_17

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21 minutes ago, Carbapenem_17 said:

+ MS)

 Personally I do not use Manual Secondary skill with my Massachusetts as I do not think the 4 points are worth it as they are accurate enough without it and put those points elsewhere . I have Bull Halsey as commander and he is at 19 points . 

 I use :  level : 1 PT and EL /  level 2 : EM and AR / level 3 : SE(this could be not the best use of points) and SI and Vig /  level 4 : AFT  .  So far I like this and it worked well for ranked . Hope this helps .

:Smile_honoring:

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23 minutes ago, Chien_Lu_Anderman said:

 Personally I do not use Manual Secondary skill with my Massachusetts as I do not think the 4 points are worth it as they are accurate enough without it and put those points elsewhere . I have Bull Halsey as commander and he is at 19 points . 

 I use :  level : 1 PT and EL /  level 2 : EM and AR / level 3 : SE(this could be not the best use of points) and SI and Vig /  level 4 : AFT  .  So far I like this and it worked well for ranked . Hope this helps .

:Smile_honoring:

Thanks for the tip! But I found MS great on the bismarck. I never thought of not using it on the Mass.

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2 minutes ago, Carbapenem_17 said:

Thanks for the tip! But I found MS great on the bismarck. I never thought of not using it on the Mass.

 Oh yes I definitely use it on my non-identical twins ( Tirpitz and Bismarck )  but did not on the Mass. as it does not seem necessary what with the better accuracy of the Mass.'s secondary guns and the secondary upgrade added in . 

:Smile_honoring:

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BoS, then SI later.  You're going to be in close, you're going to be lit on fire and you're going to eat tops.  I found basics of survivability helps mitigate a lot of that damage in combination with the reduced fire and flooding module.

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SI is more important for her as a brawler. Besides, her secs already reload in like 2.8 seconds, you won't get a difference you can see or feel with BFT, and it doesn't even help her AA all that much. Having access to longer range and more RP more often, however, is going to save you, at times. BFT isn't going to save you, ever.

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I never have to use 5 heals so it's a waste of 3 points. If you mouse over the skills it tells you what they do.

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I can break it down for you mathematically -

BFT would reduce the reload of the secondaries to roughly 3.6, resulting in an extra 1.6 rounds per minute (so if that's 10 guns from 1 side, an extra 10 rounds, nearly 20 per minute). As well as taking the DPS of AA to 181 on the DP's, 285.6 on the 40 mm's, and 144.6 for the combined 20 mm's. Without the 30% for focusing a target (x1.3), 10% from the flag (x1.1), and if for some reason you have it as well manual AA (181x2).

SI is another 14% HP of any repairable damage, 16.8% with the flag. That translates to an additional  9282 (no flag) or 11138.4 hp (with flag) you can heal. 

 

On my brawlers (so, namely Germany) I have both BFT and SI, though usually go SI first. But that's because I'm an extremely aggressive player, sometimes overly so, and if I don't get sunk will actually burn through all the repairs of a BB with premium repair and Si. I don't have Mass (have considered buying one though) and my play style though, maybe not the best example on direction. Especially in the camp and shoot meta. 

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1 hour ago, Carbapenem_17 said:

So while opting for a full secondary build I am kind of unable to pick between BFT and SI. SI gives me 5 heals with premium, and BFT would give rapid firing secondaries. But I am not sure how much buff is BFT to the secondaries. 4 to 3.6 seconds reload doesn't look much.. Any suggestions? (currently using PT + AR + SI + AFT + MS)

Depends on you, if you actually run out of heals often then SI, if you die to torps often the Vig, if you want stronger AA/Secondaries then BFT. I could tell you what I'd use, but you're not me, and likely dont play the way I do. There are many good skills at the third tier.

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Use Manuel Secondaries on Mass. 
Seriously, do it. I'm not even kidding when I'm saying that it is the most hilarious thing you could do in this ship, other than getting IFHE. 

See, the thing is, the secondaries are already pretty accurate, right? The fact that they're already accurate means that adding in MS creates a monster. Your shells will blot out the sky, and rain down upon enemy ships with prenatural accuracy. I can't go back to secondary spec Bismarck or Tirpitz anymore, since Mass eclipses them. I used to think that hitting 150 secondary shells in a match was good, but now that's just not enough anymore. 

For maximum funage, try the balls-to-the-walls build. IFHE, AFT, and MS. Go into matches and watch enemy ships melt. I'm not even joking—if there's a cruiser in range, he won't be there for long. DD trying to rush you? Give him a few moments to realise how stupid he's being. Brawling another battleship? Giggle as your secondaries rip through his health.  

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1 hour ago, RivertheRoyal said:

Use Manuel Secondaries on Mass. 
Seriously, do it. I'm not even kidding when I'm saying that it is the most hilarious thing you could do in this ship, other than getting IFHE. 

See, the thing is, the secondaries are already pretty accurate, right? The fact that they're already accurate means that adding in MS creates a monster. Your shells will blot out the sky, and rain down upon enemy ships with prenatural accuracy. I can't go back to secondary spec Bismarck or Tirpitz anymore, since Mass eclipses them. I used to think that hitting 150 secondary shells in a match was good, but now that's just not enough anymore. 

For maximum funage, try the balls-to-the-walls build. IFHE, AFT, and MS. Go into matches and watch enemy ships melt. I'm not even joking—if there's a cruiser in range, he won't be there for long. DD trying to rush you? Give him a few moments to realise how stupid he's being. Brawling another battleship? Giggle as your secondaries rip through his health.  

What this guy said.  Manual Secondaries for the Massachusetts is amazing.

Edited by Ranari

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6 hours ago, RivertheRoyal said:

Use Manuel Secondaries on Mass. 
Seriously, do it. I'm not even kidding when I'm saying that it is the most hilarious thing you could do in this ship, other than getting IFHE. 

See, the thing is, the secondaries are already pretty accurate, right? The fact that they're already accurate means that adding in MS creates a monster. Your shells will blot out the sky, and rain down upon enemy ships with prenatural accuracy. I can't go back to secondary spec Bismarck or Tirpitz anymore, since Mass eclipses them. I used to think that hitting 150 secondary shells in a match was good, but now that's just not enough anymore. 

For maximum funage, try the balls-to-the-walls build. IFHE, AFT, and MS. Go into matches and watch enemy ships melt. I'm not even joking—if there's a cruiser in range, he won't be there for long. DD trying to rush you? Give him a few moments to realise how stupid he's being. Brawling another battleship? Giggle as your secondaries rip through his health.  

Exactly what I was thinking! And can't wait to get IFHE!

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I installed an 18-Point Captain tonight with the following skills:

DCCA, AR, BFT, MCFSB, IFHE, AFT

It was simply brutal to Tier VI and VII cruisers and destroyers in Coop matches. It was really captivating to see the hit and damage counters continually roll up and to watch the hailstorm of shells rain down on the designated ship. This sure looks like the build with which I will be staying.

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On ‎8‎/‎28‎/‎2018 at 9:20 PM, DJC_499 said:

I installed an 18-Point Captain tonight with the following skills:

DCCA, AR, BFT, MCFSB, IFHE, AFT

It was simply brutal to Tier VI and VII cruisers and destroyers in Coop matches. It was really captivating to see the hit and damage counters continually roll up and to watch the hailstorm of shells rain down on the designated ship. This sure looks like the build with which I will be staying.

As I follow up I am averaging roughly 60,000 damage per Coop battle for combined secondaries and fires...

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15 minutes ago, DJC_499 said:

As I follow up I am averaging roughly 60,000 damage per Coop battle for combined secondaries and fires...

Just had my highest damage game yet in the Massachusetts with 239k damage.  Random battle.  I think between fires and secondaries I did 70k of that total.  No IFHE, but I do have DE.

I swap my 19pt captain between my Arizona, Massachusetts, and Montana.  The captain has PT, EM, AR, BFT, DE, AFT, and MFCSA.  I used to have IFHE, but that was before I started swapping, and IFHE doesn't make much sense for the Montana. 

  • Arizona is a total joke to even attempt a secondary build in.  Don't even try rofl.  I just do it for the elite exp.  A real Arizona captain build would have FP, CE, BoS, etc. 
  • Massachusetts gains the most benefit from IFHE, but honestly haven't noticed too much of a difference now that I traded it (and PM) for EM and DE.
  • Montana is nowhere near as accurate, or has the range, that Massachusetts has.  But, it does start fires like crazy (11% w/ DE), and it does surprise people when they start opening up at 9km with reasonable accuracy. 

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On 8/28/2018 at 11:54 AM, RivertheRoyal said:

Use Manuel Secondaries on Mass. 
Seriously, do it. I'm not even kidding when I'm saying that it is the most hilarious thing you could do in this ship, other than getting IFHE. 

See, the thing is, the secondaries are already pretty accurate, right? The fact that they're already accurate means that adding in MS creates a monster. Your shells will blot out the sky, and rain down upon enemy ships with prenatural accuracy. I can't go back to secondary spec Bismarck or Tirpitz anymore, since Mass eclipses them. I used to think that hitting 150 secondary shells in a match was good, but now that's just not enough anymore. 

For maximum funage, try the balls-to-the-walls build. IFHE, AFT, and MS. Go into matches and watch enemy ships melt. I'm not even joking—if there's a cruiser in range, he won't be there for long. DD trying to rush you? Give him a few moments to realise how stupid he's being. Brawling another battleship? Giggle as your secondaries rip through his health.  

This is all so, so true.  My Mass captain is:

PT, PM

AR

SI

AFT, IFHE, MS

I tried leaving off MS in favor of CE, since I like sneaky BB's.  But MS just makes the ship a monster.  Any DD and most cruisers inside 11.3 km just MELT.

Re SI vs BFT, I've tried the ship with BFT, and it's nice.  But I've had any number of games that I've burned through 5 heals and STILL could have tanked more.  I had two tonight that gave me dreadnought and fireproof medals, and in both games I spent the last few minutes being very careful not to attract attention, as I was low health and out of heals.  The odd thing is that neither got me a CQE!  Luck of the draw, I guess.

Edit to add:  my only gripe with the ship is that she didn't REALLY come into her own until the capt had 18 pts.  And with the 4 pointers crowding out CE, there really isn't another US ship that you can use him on.  I'd LIKE to put him on my Atlanta, but driving that without CE feels suicidal.  

All of that means that while she's a very fun ship, dedicating an 18 or 19 pt captain to her is expensive.

Edited by Rorik64

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For the meme build I'm actually debating whether to add Manual Secondaries.  Right now I have AFT and IFHE.  Without manual secondaries, my Mass can fire at targets on both sides with decent accuracy.  And If I have to, I can set focus my secondaries on one target.  Understand that without manuals, the side not facing the target will still fire at any enemy ships in range.

So if you have a DD on one side and two enemies on the other, focus that DD, and it will melt, but the other side will also keep firing.

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On 8/28/2018 at 9:54 AM, RivertheRoyal said:

Use Manuel Secondaries on Mass. 
Seriously, do it. I'm not even kidding when I'm saying that it is the most hilarious thing you could do in this ship, other than getting IFHE. 

See, the thing is, the secondaries are already pretty accurate, right? The fact that they're already accurate means that adding in MS creates a monster. Your shells will blot out the sky, and rain down upon enemy ships with prenatural accuracy. I can't go back to secondary spec Bismarck or Tirpitz anymore, since Mass eclipses them. I used to think that hitting 150 secondary shells in a match was good, but now that's just not enough anymore. 

For maximum funage, try the balls-to-the-walls build. IFHE, AFT, and MS. Go into matches and watch enemy ships melt. I'm not even joking—if there's a cruiser in range, he won't be there for long. DD trying to rush you? Give him a few moments to realise how stupid he's being. Brawling another battleship? Giggle as your secondaries rip through his health.  

Agree 100%.  The hardest part about playing the mass is learning to play it unlike any other us bb.  I play mine almost like a cruiser.  Use mountains and islands to close distance until ships are in secondary range then use them to make sure you never have more than 1 ship shooting at you.  You can dominate a cap from safety while your secondaries RIP up dd's and cruisers that get in range.  Once they are gone start on the softened bb targets.  Bow tank and burn them to the ground.

Tier 8, 9 or 10 does not matter.  Play smart and you won't need the extra repair party and you will see smooth sailing.

Edited by HallaSnackbar
Typo

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1 hour ago, HallaSnackbar said:

Agree 100%.  The hardest part about playing the mass is learning to play it unlike any other us bb.  I play mine almost like a cruiser.  Use mountains and islands to close distance until ships are in secondary range then use them to make sure you never have more than 1 ship shooting at you.  You can dominate a cap from safety while your secondaries RIP up dd's and cruisers that get in range.  Once they are gone start on the softened bb targets.  Bow tank and burn them to the ground.

Tier 8, 9 or 10 does not matter.  Play smart and you won't need the extra repair party and you will see smooth sailing.

This is important.  If you are hesitating to add MS because you see your secondaries fire from both sides often, you are probably overextending to often.  Play more like a cruiser, keep one side of your ship protected as much as possible, so you can focus everything...your secondaries, your main batteries, AND your angling...on fewer ships.  This also helps you concentrate on keeping your targets about 9-11KM away, so your secondaries rain down on decks instead of crashing into belt armor.  Side shots are for German BBs. Mass needs the plunging secondary fire to really increase the shatter-to-damage ratio.

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umm, yes manual 2ndaries and ifhe. Full 2ndary build all the way. Hell I have had entire krakens from 2ndaries alone...

5b68e215bfff6_2ndarykraken.png.1961d97f2b2cf3364020d6f214a9cd1c.png

 

Mass 2.png

Edited by Sepia

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Yes to all on full secondary build.   The Mass won't be a captain trainer, it'll be a one of a kind USN ship.   Have fun and be sure to do AFT, BFT, IFHE and MS. The below is a Co op match)5ba121651000a_Mass5k-1.thumb.PNG.ca14edd4f6809bfa0c737af4520b511a.PNG

Mass 5k-2.PNG

Mass5k-3.PNG

Edited by nagasakee

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