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Sou1forge

Ranked and the Worcester

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Ok, so how do you solve for this ship? It seems more meta than even the Hindenburg was last season, and I'm not sure how one deals with it. You can't just git gud in a DD and perma spot it for your teammates like in a Des Moines. Flanking stuff doesn't seem to work either. You have to be far enough out that it cant force a trade, and that's out of its conceal, which means it dictates when that happens. And if you catch one in the open it still isn't an easy kill, as it handles pretty well, usually allowing it to get undetected after doing a bit of a butt wiggle.

BB or bust? As someone who's choices are Gearing, Hindenburg, and Moskva (but really just Gearing + occasional Hindy) it's a little disheartening to frequently play against 2-3 of them in a lobby, most often after people see a CV in the queue. I can take solace in the fact that I'm good enough to not insta die to the things, but they can make certain flanks unplayable.

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Minotaur or Moskvagrad are both good counters.  Really though the Worcester is a high skill ceiling ship that when played perfectly there's not much you can do about it, if you are up against a good Worcester player and can't beat him in skill then you have to focus on other objectives instead, like control points of having better teamplay.

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As a DD, just call target and relocate.  Eventually he’ll start shooting and increase his own detect radius.

As anything other than a DD, focus him like you would any other toolbox ship barring an either threatening or sitting duck DD.

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These things are obnoxious, try hitting kiting woos while they are knifing you to death in a bb. Cant close to secondary range and if you cant precision delete them in three salvos time you’re dead. You cant disengage either because they outrun you, and if youre in this position they’ve already killed your dd and probably a ca or two.

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Henri's reload booster works wonders against the ship. Not sure if it was luck or something else but managed to gain three citidels on a woos head on. 

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3 hours ago, SteeLeviathan said:

Henri's reload booster works wonders against the ship. Not sure if it was luck or something else but managed to gain three citidels on a woos head on. 

Started using the Henri after going from rank 9 and 3 stars down to rank 11 and 2 stars. That reload booster allows for some crazy burst damage. I've noticed that if spotted, the Henri can absolutely tear apart the worcester. Had several 3/4 cit salvos against worcester's with the Henri. Thanks to her I'm up to rank 8.

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Not defending the Worcester because it does look like it needs a bit of a nerf and the kiddie mechanic of island lobbing has no place in T10.......but...

If a Worcester makes a single mistake in open water vs a BB he's done. He has to land a lot of shots and everything right.....a T10 or T9 BB just has to do one thing right with a single salvo.

If he's firing from cover somebody is spotting for him. Remove the spotter.

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Don't worry, as people to progress they will end up dumping the sauce for Zao or Hindy to save their star. 

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IMO the Sauce is pretty situational. Right map/situation/player & its brutal all others & it becomes meh. My way of dealing with them is I either dont let them play their game (stay away from islands so they cant hill hump) or take their game away from them (push into the island to delete them). 

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I'm sure it's been said before, it's an Atlanta on steroids.

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Worcester could use a slight concealment nerf (12.42km to 12.7km) and a slightly slower rudder (8.1s to 9s).

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I don't see it as a major problem.  It can exaggerate a problem, but it isn't a problem by itself.

The major problem a Wooster presents is that it can fire safely from cover because of its high arc shots.  It cannot do this on its own.  If you are getting lit up by a Wooster, you need to find the ship that is spotting you.  Push him back, and the game opens up for you.  The Wooster can be easily pounded into oblivion if located and spotted. 

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The wooster is a utility ship like the DM. Especially if it has the extended time radar module. The counter I have for it a flanker like the Zao or the Hindenburg. A Hindy with the legendary mod is tough to set on fire. The Zao with the legendary mod can punish the Wooster by while dodging the shells easily. 

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The thing about the Worcester is that It is not really being used to Save a Star.

Its being used to win games because of all its utility.

But if you do force one into open water and you yourself are in open water as well.

Then you better be a really good shot because you gonna wish you had stayed near cover.

I personally like to drag Hindes and Henrys and some Zaos out of cover and keep them detected.

I let my BBs do the rest of the work.

 

 

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Worcester is very position dependent and it really needs to expose its side to do damage. If it is entrenched in island cover and raining shells on you with no one spotting it, you are just going to die. To deal with Worcester you have to flank it, spot it, and force it out. I usually play USN CAs and I've been playing the CLs including Worcester quite a bit lately and I've found DM is Worcester's worst enemy. It has a rather good stealth making it hard to spot outside of its danger range and it can put a lot of firepower across its bow while minimizing its target profile for Worcester to hit in return.  Worcester can only bring 4 guns to bear forward or aft. If it exposes enough side to fire additional guns  DM, with USN auto bounce angles, can usually citadel it … repeatedly. It's basically the same thing why DM works well against Minotaur.  If Worcester doesn't try to unmask more guns, DM is hitting him with 6x8" guns to his 4x6" guns and has better armor and more health. Worcester's ROF is a bit faster but not enough that it will ever win that engagement. (Also if DM is close enough the secondaries will join in as well.) I've found out that if there is a DM lurking close by Worcester really has to vacate. 

Zao is pretty stealthy and fast and can get into flanking position on a Worcester without being spotted too early, as can Minotaur. Both of them can stealth torpedo as part of a fast flanking maneuver to force Worcester to move out of cover. Worcester will probably spot the torpedoes but it will still likely have to move. Those two work well against Worcester too although they aren't as overwhelming as DM is. People have suggested Moskva, Henri, and Hindi. I disagree those are good at it. They are all too easy to spot. Henri at least is very fast and has the reload booster, but if the Worcester is in a good position (and he should be if he is firing) they will usually get spotted and take a lot of damage before they get close enough and on the flank enough to really do damage in return. 

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So it sounds a bit like I just don't have the ships to deal with it. Kinda what I figured.

I do disagree when people talk about how it doesn't do the save a star game. It saves a star real easy. Your plan isn't damage, it's an early DD kill from an unsuspecting (or just not good) captain, then as much HE fire from behind a rock as you can. Kind of like how the Loyang saves a star a lot of the time down at tier 8 by smoke + hydroing a DD, then getting a cap. Both of these actions usually put you in save a star territory, because if one or more of you teammates does MORE than that, you probably won.

Well, on a more personal note I'll just have to resign myself to the fact that Gearing + Hindy has a pretty big meta hole, and one that's pretty prevalent this season. One would hope Moskva could help with that, but as always I perform significantly worse in that ship than those other two (the conspiracy theorist in me thinks it's because playing a Moskva makes people give better angles to everyone but you, and not without no evidence), I don't think it's really an option.

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 Worcester's AP is not a threat at medium range which allows me to get all my DM guns into action while he has to angle at all times and use limited gun power. I can also spec SE on DM while Worcester has to invest into IFHE which puts me almost 10k hit points ahead. Of course I have to pick where when and how to engage them very carefully but I am heavily outtrading the majority of them so far.

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17 hours ago, Sou1forge said:

Ok, so how do you solve for this ship? It seems more meta than even the Hindenburg was last season, and I'm not sure how one deals with it. You can't just git gud in a DD and perma spot it for your teammates like in a Des Moines. Flanking stuff doesn't seem to work either. You have to be far enough out that it cant force a trade, and that's out of its conceal, which means it dictates when that happens. And if you catch one in the open it still isn't an easy kill, as it handles pretty well, usually allowing it to get undetected after doing a bit of a butt wiggle.

BB or bust? As someone who's choices are Gearing, Hindenburg, and Moskva (but really just Gearing + occasional Hindy) it's a little disheartening to frequently play against 2-3 of them in a lobby, most often after people see a CV in the queue. I can take solace in the fact that I'm good enough to not insta die to the things, but they can make certain flanks unplayable.

Based on the comments it looks like [(Minotaur + Moskva) x (Hindenburg + Zao)] divided by flanking. :Smile_glasses:

Edited by Kizarvexis

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I haven't seen them doing well. With so few, if any, destroyers their radar is largely worthless. No torpedos, so our Yammy one game just went around the island and kicked him in the face.

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16 minutes ago, HazardDrake said:

I haven't seen them doing well. With so few, if any, destroyers their radar is largely worthless. No torpedos, so our Yammy one game just went around the island and kicked him in the face.

How far up are you? It could be an issue of player performance, or it could just be my destroyer bias, but I seem to see them doing very well. In my experience players are pretty evenly distributed between the 3 usual ship classes, with a slight bias towards cruiser numbers, so there's almost always 2-3 DDs a side to munch on. I could see at lower tiers it being less of an issue, as you need to have some amount of skill to pilot one well. I see them doing especially well on some maps like the one with the A and B caps inside each other (Warriors Path?). 

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6 hours ago, Murcc said:

I don't see it as a major problem.  It can exaggerate a problem, but it isn't a problem by itself.

The major problem a Wooster presents is that it can fire safely from cover because of its high arc shots.  It cannot do this on its own.  If you are getting lit up by a Wooster, you need to find the ship that is spotting you.  Push him back, and the game opens up for you.  The Wooster can be easily pounded into oblivion if located and spotted. 

Quiet you.

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The thing no one mentions about "utility" combat directing warships like Des Moines and Worcester is that they do best as such with groups to support them. They live and die by the grade of the team, as lone combatants they're both vulnerable and squishy to side hits and can be punished by about anything in the open.  Basically you can judge the quality of team by how a decent player makes out with one of these boats. 

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