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UssIowaSailor

Limiting captain skill points by tier to protect new players

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I think Wargamming should put a hard cap on how many captain points you can have by tier. This will help prevent seal clubbing and protect new players coming into the game. The way it sits now is as a new player you enjoy protected matchmaking until level 10 and then you are released into the wild to fend for yourself. I created a Steam account to play WOW's on and noticed that as a "New" player during my first 10 levels I was the only live person in random battles 95% of the time occasionally I would see two live people out of 12 on the other team. That is a very easy environment in 30 battles in the Black Swan against bots I had over 20 Krackens. 

 

The MOMENT I hit level 11 and was released into the deep end I was running into seal clubbers with 19 point captains. When I was located with RDF the MOMENT the battle started I knew I was in trouble. There is no way you are going to keep new players at a high rate when they go from one extreme to another, killing bots with impunity to getting massacred by 19 point seal clubbers in T-1-4 ships.

 

Put hard caps of three captain points at tier one, four captain points at tier two, five captain points at tier three and six captain points at tier four. Make tier five the new release point into the deep end where the sharks are waiting in the shallows for the baby seals. Having guys running around at tier 1-4 with 19 point captains smashing your new players over and over is pretty ridiculous and should be stopped. It won't stop seal clubbing as experienced players will snack on newer players every time. They just shouldn't be doing it with concealment expert, BFT, AFT, skills that allow them to attack new players with 3 point captains with impunity.  

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An experienced player is still going to be able to seal club new or lesser skilled players in low tiers no matter how many captain points they have on the captain in the low tier ship....

It’s not the captain that matters, it’s the player.

Edited by renegadestatuz
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No. Many ships that they sell in the premium shop or arsenal are low-tier. The number of players who actually seal-club like that is tiny, and not worth limiting the learning potential of new players. Bear in mind that new players generally don't have good WRs anyways.

Also, you can't possibly know this yet, but T5 is horrible anyways, making it worse is not a priority.

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Not a bad idea considering the only way to stop Cv captains from coming down to tier 4 and 5 was to remove manual drop - the same tier a new CV captain would need to practice his/her own manual drops Before running into t6 defensive AA.

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Yeah..   Three of us seal clubbers div'd together and went down to Tier 1 to do some clubbing.

The T1 lifer ghouls cleaned our clocks.  Our side won, but just barely.

You've got to be careful down there...  Some folks have thousands of missions - and never got out of T1.

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19 minutes ago, renegadestatuz said:

An experienced player is still going to be able to seal club new or lesser skilled players in low tiers no matter how many captain points they have on the captain in the low tier ship....

It’s not the captain that matters, it’s the player.

By that rational the seal clubbers don't need 19 point captains at low tiers....you are making my point for me.

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Just now, UssIowaSailor said:

By that rational the seal clubbers don't need 19 point captains at low tiers....you are making my point for me.

Removing/not allowing the 19 point captains still won’t do anything or help either. They’ll still get wrecked by more skilled and experienced players either way. So there’s no point.

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18 minutes ago, pewpewpew42 said:

No. Many ships that they sell in the premium shop or arsenal are low-tier. The number of players who actually seal-club like that is tiny, and not worth limiting the learning potential of new players. Bear in mind that new players generally don't have good WRs anyways.

Also, you can't possibly know this yet, but T5 is horrible anyways, making it worse is not a priority.

lol this is an alt account, I have not played the game in a few months. I had a three game stretch in the Japanese t4 BB Ich......where I had 14 kills....and yes I had a 19 point Yammy captain at the helm.

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2 minutes ago, UssIowaSailor said:

By that rational the seal clubbers don't need 19 point captains at low tiers....you are making my point for me.

Newbies get protected matchmaking. "Seal Clubbing" is much more difficult than popular opinion makes it seem. I would rather see them stop people from taking useless skills to combat craplike fake troll builds on shipcomrade (maybe not an issue soon).

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1 minute ago, renegadestatuz said:

Removing/not allowing the 19 point captains still won’t do anything or help either. They’ll still get wrecked by more skilled and experienced players either way. So there’s no point.

So you have a seal clubber in ship A and a new player in ship B. They are in the same cruiser, the seal clubber has BFT, AFT, CE and he can fire away at the new player while sitting out of range, safe from counter attack.......there is no point in allowing that to happen. By allowing 19 point captains at low tiers you are taking an already STRONG advantage for the clubber and turning it into near god mode. 

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Thus completely obliterating any use of low tier premiums as captain trainer.

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Didn't WG a long time ago put in a system where people with something like 300 or less battles (don't remember the exact number) won't get matched against people with more battles, specifically to prevent people clubbing on total newbs?

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4 minutes ago, UssIowaSailor said:

lol this is an alt account, I have not played the game in a few months. I had a three game stretch in the Japanese t4 BB Ich......where I had 14 kills....and yes I had a 19 point Yammy captain at the helm.

Why don't you want to post using your real account? 

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6 minutes ago, UssIowaSailor said:

So you have a seal clubber in ship A and a new player in ship B. They are in the same cruiser, the seal clubber has BFT, AFT, CE and he can fire away at the new player while sitting out of range, safe from counter attack.......there is no point in allowing that to happen. By allowing 19 point captains at low tiers you are taking an already STRONG advantage for the clubber and turning it into near god mode. 

The experienced player will always have a strong advatbge over a brand new player. So what’s the point in removing something if it isn’t going to make it any better for the newer player? There isn’t a point since new player will still get wrecked. It’s a waste. Also, as has been pointed out, it would wipe out any point of low tier premiums being used as capatin trainers. Another waste. Granted they don’t donwell as captain trainers, but still captain trainers.

5 minutes ago, Lert said:

Thus completely obliterating any use of low tier premiums as captain trainer.

:Smile_great: This.

Edited by renegadestatuz

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Using a low tier ship as a captain trainer is dumb to start off with as you get very little experience.  I don't see why we have to wall off part of the game for experienced players because some other people haven't put in the work yet.  All of us who aren't new had to do it, and keeping it provides incentive for new players to level their captains instead of having a bunch of low ones on each ship they get.  Without seeing those benefits new players might not see the importance of doing that.

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3 minutes ago, RedRushian said:

Using a low tier ship as a captain trainer is dumb to start off with as you get very little experience.

So, you're personally volunteering to buy everyone a mid / high tier captain trainer? People are limited to what they can afford, not to what someone else across the internet thinks they should be running instead.

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34 minutes ago, UssIowaSailor said:

I think Wargamming should put a hard cap on how many captain points you can have by tier. This will help prevent seal clubbing and protect new players coming into the game. The way it sits now is as a new player you enjoy protected matchmaking until level 10 and then you are released into the wild to fend for yourself. I created a Steam account to play WOW's on and noticed that as a "New" player during my first 10 levels I was the only live person in random battles 95% of the time occasionally I would see two live people out of 12 on the other team. That is a very easy environment in 30 battles in the Black Swan against bots I had over 20 Krackens. 

 

The MOMENT I hit level 11 and was released into the deep end I was running into seal clubbers with 19 point captains. When I was located with RDF the MOMENT the battle started I knew I was in trouble. There is no way you are going to keep new players at a high rate when they go from one extreme to another, killing bots with impunity to getting massacred by 19 point seal clubbers in T-1-4 ships.

 

Put hard caps of three captain points at tier one, four captain points at tier two, five captain points at tier three and six captain points at tier four. Make tier five the new release point into the deep end where the sharks are waiting in the shallows for the baby seals. Having guys running around at tier 1-4 with 19 point captains smashing your new players over and over is pretty ridiculous and should be stopped. It won't stop seal clubbing as experienced players will snack on newer players every time. They just shouldn't be doing it with concealment expert, BFT, AFT, skills that allow them to attack new players with 3 point captains with impunity.  

The real question I ask is why are Experienced Captains playing down? 

A conversation last night was revealing"  "I'm playing at this tier because I've had it with radar....  They can kiss my ****"    Another was:  "Everybody left Tier 9 and 10 and we are all playing Tier 7 cruisers as low as we can....."

Farming.  Simply farming cause game play at the top two levels is a mess.....

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3 minutes ago, Lert said:

So, you're personally volunteering to buy everyone a mid / high tier captain trainer? People are limited to what they can afford, not to what someone else thinks they should be running instead.

No I'm saying if you're training a captain why would you willingly cut your experience gains in half by using a low tier boat.  You're making your grind a lot longer.  You should be able to draw even on credits up a few tiers higher on tech tree boats where you can get better experience.

Edited by RedRushian

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2 minutes ago, RedRushian said:

No I'm saying if you're training a captain why would you willingly cut your experience gains in half by using a low tier boat.  You're making your grind a lot longer.

No, you're making a blanket statement and adding a (very mild) insults to anyone who does something you don't agree with.

As for why, +50% camo XP bonus plus an additional +50% for the first win in a day adds up, despite the tier difference.

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Seal clubbing is a bit of a myth anyway. There is a mix of noobs and veterans in all tiers. You might feel more special playing only high tiers, but from a simple enjoying-the-game perspective 4-7 are superior. 

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1 minute ago, NashW8 said:

Seal clubbing is a bit of a myth anyway.

It's a lottery anyways. Sometimes they are baby seals. Sometimes they are Navy SEALs.

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As others have mentioned, the giant sticking point is premium ships.  Not even taking account those who use low tier premiums to eke out some extra XP for a captain, should somebody who enjoys playing a tier 2 premium be forced to recruit a new captain every 20 or so battles?

WarGaming wouldn't make a change to the way premium ships work, anyhow, not even tier 2 & 3 ships.  People paid money to get those ships (in many cases, anyway), and if you take away a major benefit to owning them you create a lot of anger amongst the paying customer base along with a fair amount of mistrust toward purchasing premiums in the future.

Also, 30 battles in the Black Swan on an admitted re-roll account...you are part of the problem. :Smile-_tongue:

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1 minute ago, w4spl3g said:

Newbies get protected matchmaking. "Seal Clubbing" is much more difficult than popular opinion makes it seem. I would rather see them stop people from taking useless skills to combat craplike fake troll builds on shipcomrade (maybe not an issue soon).

Yea but that protected matchmaking means they fight bots, not real players. That does not prepare them for randoms. They also don't have captains or commander skills to deal with until they reach a certain level in their service record. So they are stepping out into the real world with a one or two point captain.

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