Jump to content
You need to play a total of 5 battles to post in this section.
ecirmo

Sudden jump in tier 1 difficulty?

63 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

Members
10 posts
175 battles

Hey everyone,

Brand spankin' new player here, loving the game. I will preface everything that follows with this: I completely understand that I am green as grass, have learned very little on the strategy of gameplay, and have essentially everything to learn. HOWEVER, I have recently experienced an unexplained jump in difficulty dramatic enough to render me utterly useless, and not in a fun "I'm learning, this is great!" way.

Allow me to explain:

Tier 1, playing the Orlan, Black Swan, and Hashidate. My first week of play I dipped my toes in cautiously, lost several matches in a row, got one or two kills. Cool! After that first week, my next four days I was absolutely monstering every opponent in random play, for hours on end. I would finish games with 7 kills. Sometimes I would be the last ship standing on my team with 4 remaining on the other team, and I'd still sink them all and win. I got the hang of aiming quickly, possibly from other gaming experience, and found no issue landing nearly all my shots even from a great distance. 

It was to the point where I was leveling up (player level) nearly every match and raking in a lot of xp (what seemed to me, given my tier). As of two days ago, I reached level 13, got a Tier 2 ship, then a Tier 4 ship, and tried my luck at those tiers. Gameplay became way more difficult, as I expected, and staying alive was pretty unattainable. So I said to myself, "Right, this is frustrating. Clearly I went too far too fast, I'd better go back to tier 1, settle in, gain some xp and and improve my skills. Cool! This'll be fun."

...except that when I went back to Tier 1, suddenly the opponents were just as difficult as Tier 4. Now, playing the same way I did before (which led me to great success), and at Tier 1 like before,  I somehow can't even stay alive for more than a minute, not to mention actually kill anybody and gain much needed xp.

I have absolutely no delusion that I am actually  good at the game yet; I'm not. But can anyone explain this sudden and, frankly, not-fun jump in difficulty, even in Tier 1?!

Going from very successful to utterly useless, with nothing in between, isn't particularly enjoyable, BUT I could live with it if I knew why. Anybody have any ideas?

  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24
[WOLF1]
Members
107 posts
4,765 battles

I believe there is protected match making up to a certain threshold of number of battles. This keeps you from meeting more experienced players. My guess is you ve crossed that threshold (maybe 300 battles?) and now you’ve jumped to a much larger and more difficult pool of people. Step back, don’t charge in and continue the learning. 

  • Cool 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
307
[SUCIT]
Members
916 posts
3,863 battles
2 minutes ago, ecirmo said:

-snip

It has been theorized before that there is a pool of brand new players that you will get thrown into for your first few battles.  This means you'll only be going up against people who are as brand new as you are.  You might have passed the battle threshold, and may have been thrown into the normal matchmaking pool with people who have thousands of battles

It's either that or confirmation bias.  

On a side note, welcome to the game, and welcome to the forums.  If you have any questions about gameplay, mechanics or anything pertaining to wows at all, you can shoot me a DM on the forums.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
149
[-TKS-]
[-TKS-]
Members
356 posts
4,839 battles

I recently discovered, from inviting a friend to join wows, that WG protects new players in random battles with low level accounts from seal clubbers. you were mostly playing against bots In the random games you played prior to level 13. you exceeded the protection and now your games are filled with real players. takes a little getting use to because the boats do not sail straight anymore.  but I am confident you will get the hang of it. Plenty of videos from the community to learn from including the WIKI. 

good luck!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
2,348 posts
1,062 battles
1 minute ago, skillztowin said:

I recently discovered, from inviting a friend to join wows, that WG protects new players in random battles with low level accounts from seal clubbers. you were mostly playing against bots In the random games you played prior to level 13. you exceeded the protection and now your games are filled with real players. takes a little getting use to because the boats do not sail straight anymore.  but I am confident you will get the hang of it. Plenty of videos from the community to learn from including the WIKI. 

good luck!

If you are playing tier 1 random in non-protected mode, know that there are players that have played thousands of games at tier 1.  They know the map like a favorite book, and have highly trained captains.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
285
[NNC]
Members
2,059 posts
7,854 battles

Wows has a tendency of putting a game in with bots for new people.

first maybe 20 game can include people that have names like :fletcher: , :hipper:  etc. 

 if its ppl with a : before and after their name that means they are a bot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
90
[DENY]
Members
249 posts
6,961 battles

There are many players who have thousands and thousands of matches in Tier I ships. I've seen 9,994 in the same ship at Tier II, and over 5,000 in a Black Swan, seal clubbers choice of tier I ship.

There's a very large amount of luck in the match making. Get many seal clubbers and it's hard to win when you don't have aim down pat, and remember, they have 19 point captains, while you have very low captain skills.

You can be very aggressive against new players, but not such much against players that have thousands of matches. Seal clubbers usually know how to hit citadels. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
573 posts
1 minute ago, JessieTheKitty said:

Wows has a tendency of putting a game in with bots for new people.

first maybe 20 game can include people that have names like :fletcher: , :hipper:  etc. 

 if its ppl with a : before and after their name that means they are a bot.

I remember when I first started playing I typed in chat" Good Play :Hipper" after he Drilled holes in my ship.

I didn't realize it was a AI Bot.

I still send Compliments to the Bots.( better than wasting them on the living)

  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
8 posts
401 battles

Its was probably the time of day you played. Check the player stats in Tier 1. There are some players that have literally played thousands of tier 1 games....it's all they play. And they are very good at them.

In tier 1 games with top players, you absolutely cannot solo. You'll be vaporized instantly. Your team either needs to be a very slow group push. Or sit back and let them come to you. All games are standard map mode. There will never be Domination or Epicenter. There is arguably never a reason to push. So staying back is the most effective tactic. Always remember stay in a group. Never solo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,364
[WOLF3]
Members
6,923 posts
2,724 battles
20 minutes ago, ecirmo said:

...except that when I went back to Tier 1, suddenly the opponents were just as difficult as Tier 4. Now, playing the same way I did before (which led me to great success), and at Tier 1 like before,  I somehow can't even stay alive for more than a minute, not to mention actually kill anybody and gain much needed xp.

There are several issues here, including WG diddling with the bots.  But let's be clear first.  What battle mode were you playing?  Random or Co-op?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
149
[-TKS-]
[-TKS-]
Members
356 posts
4,839 battles
1 minute ago, Sovereigndawg said:

Or, the easy way, you can right click on a player during the post game summary and check their profile.  

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
473
[QNA]
[QNA]
Members
1,838 posts
5,922 battles

No matter what, Random should not have any bots no matter how new the player is. Given that he is a brand new player, he was mostly playing Coo for awhile since new players can't play Random. He might've or the game might've changed his game mode to Random, hence more difficult ships. If anything, trial by fire. This is how you learn to play the game. You will get frustrated but if you don't now, you will be more afterwards.

 

:Player: = Bot

:Fishtail: = Bot

vangm94 = Player

[-TKS-]skillztowin = Player

Edited by Vangm94
  • Cool 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
10 posts
175 battles
8 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

There are several issues here, including WG diddling with the bots.  But let's be clear first.  What battle mode were you playing?  Random or Co-op?

 

I am playing random battles exclusively ever since it was an option, and I saw those huge wins and kill numbers while in random, Tier 1.

The explanations above make sense to me if it's either brand new players or bots---curses for building me up only to tear me down, WOWS! If it's not that, then I'm not sure what's going on.

Regardless, it would appear that a drastic change in gameplay is in order, as well as no longer going solo shoot-'em-up...alas. And getting more matches under my belt.

Edited by ecirmo
  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
1,247 posts
10 battles
24 minutes ago, ecirmo said:

Hey everyone,

Brand spankin' new player here, loving the game. I will preface everything that follows with this: I completely understand that I am green as grass, have learned very little on the strategy of gameplay, and have essentially everything to learn. HOWEVER, I have recently experienced an unexplained jump in difficulty dramatic enough to render me utterly useless, and not in a fun "I'm learning, this is great!" way.

Allow me to explain:

Tier 1, playing the Orlan, Black Swan, and Hashidate. My first week of play I dipped my toes in cautiously, lost several matches in a row, got one or two kills. Cool! After that first week, my next four days I was absolutely monstering every opponent in random play, for hours on end. I would finish games with 7 kills. Sometimes I would be the last ship standing on my team with 4 remaining on the other team, and I'd still sink them all and win. I got the hang of aiming quickly, possibly from other gaming experience, and found no issue landing nearly all my shots even from a great distance. 

It was to the point where I was leveling up (player level) nearly every match and raking in a lot of xp (what seemed to me, given my tier). As of two days ago, I reached level 13, got a Tier 2 ship, then a Tier 4 ship, and tried my luck at those tiers. Gameplay became way more difficult, as I expected, and staying alive was pretty unattainable. So I said to myself, "Right, this is frustrating. Clearly I went too far too fast, I'd better go back to tier 1, settle in, gain some xp and and improve my skills. Cool! This'll be fun."

...except that when I went back to Tier 1, suddenly the opponents were just as difficult as Tier 4. Now, playing the same way I did before (which led me to great success), and at Tier 1 like before,  I somehow can't even stay alive for more than a minute, not to mention actually kill anybody and gain much needed xp.

I have absolutely no delusion that I am actually  good at the game yet; I'm not. But can anyone explain this sudden and, frankly, not-fun jump in difficulty, even in Tier 1?!

Going from very successful to utterly useless, with nothing in between, isn't particularly enjoyable, BUT I could live with it if I knew why. Anybody have any ideas?

There is protected matchmaking. Remember when looking at your team lineup, all the players with a : in front of their name were bots. On another account I would generally see 1 live person per battle the rest were bots. In the black Stan I put up the best numbers the server has ever seen, In my first 30 "Random" battles I has 26 Krackens. The moment you leave protected matchmaking you are thrown against all live players and there are ALWAYS seal clubbers padding their stats playing low tier. It is nearly impossible to play well with a 3 point captain when you are facing experienced players in low tier ships with 19 point captains. Get out of the really low tiers as quickly as possible, that is where a lot of sharks are hiding. Get into the deeper water T5 and up where the captain points are not as overwhelming as they are T1 - T4.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,992
[WOLF7]
Members
10,359 posts

Protected mode was extended to Level 11 and tier 4. If you pass level 11, you are no longer protected from the seal clubbers....:Smile_teethhappy:

Just checked, you're 13 now so....the clubbers are hungry.

Edited by awiggin

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
1,247 posts
10 battles
2 minutes ago, Vangm94 said:

No matter what, Random should not have any bots no matter how new the player is. Given that he is a brand new player, he was mostly playing Coo for awhile since new players can't play Random. He might've or the game might've changed his game mode to Random, hence more difficult ships. If anything, trial by fire. This is how you learn to play the game. You will get frustrated but if you don't now, you will be more afterwards.

I played on a new account and due to protected matchmaking often I was the only live player on my team against one other live player, the other 11 ships were bots. The most I ever saw during the protected phase was two live players at a time. The rest were always bots.

 

Sue paints a grim picture of the numbers of new players coming into the game...as in it is almost non existent.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
10 posts
175 battles
14 minutes ago, Chelsea2003 said:

Its was probably the time of day you played. Check the player stats in Tier 1. There are some players that have literally played thousands of tier 1 games....it's all they play. And they are very good at them.

In tier 1 games with top players, you absolutely cannot solo. You'll be vaporized instantly. Your team either needs to be a very slow group push. Or sit back and let them come to you. All games are standard map mode. There will never be Domination or Epicenter. There is arguably never a reason to push. So staying back is the most effective tactic. Always remember stay in a group. Never solo.

I was playing exclusively in the evenings at first, and was when things suddenly got way harder.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,992
[WOLF7]
Members
10,359 posts
Just now, UssIowaSailor said:

I played on a new account and due to protected matchmaking often I was the only live player on my team against one other live player, the other 11 ships were bots. The most I ever saw during the protected phase was two live players at a time. The rest were always bots.

 

Sue paints a grim picture of the numbers of new players coming into the game...as in it is almost non existent.

That's correct, protected mode random is filled with bots, due to the low number of new players. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
10 posts
175 battles
3 minutes ago, awiggin said:

Protected mode was extended to Level 11 and tier 4. If you pass level 11, you are no longer protected from the seal clubbers....:Smile_teethhappy:

Just checked, you're 13 now so....the clubbers are hungry.

Well who can blame them, seal is probably delicious.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,992
[WOLF7]
Members
10,359 posts
3 minutes ago, awiggin said:

Protected mode was extended to Level 11 and tier 4. If you pass level 11, you are no longer protected from the seal clubbers....:Smile_teethhappy:

Just checked, you're 13 now so....the clubbers are hungry.

This^

Just now, ecirmo said:

I was playing exclusively in the evenings at first, and was when things suddenly got way harder.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
1,247 posts
10 battles
2 minutes ago, awiggin said:

Protected mode was extended to Level 11 and tier 4. If you pass level 11, you are no longer protected from the seal clubbers....:Smile_teethhappy:

Just checked, you're 13 now so....the clubbers are hungry.

lol I created a new account on Steam, I ran the Black Swan exclusively and had insane numbers killing bots in supposed randoms. I had 26 Krackens but as soon as I hit lvl 11 and was in my FIRST real random there were tons of Black Swans with 19 point captains. The moment the battle started and I was detected by RDF I knew I was in trouble lol. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
10 posts
175 battles
Just now, awiggin said:

That's correct, protected mode random is filled with bots, due to the low number of new players. 

Historically I have never done well against human opponents in games, which is why I usually avoid those games. In this case, I thought maybe I had had either a breakthrough, or finally found a game I kick [edited]at. Lol. Life is never so simple.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
473
[QNA]
[QNA]
Members
1,838 posts
5,922 battles
3 minutes ago, ecirmo said:

I am playing random battles exclusively ever since it was an option, and I saw those huge wins and kill numbers while in random, Tier 1.

The explanations above make sense to me if it's either brand new players or bots---curses for building me up only to tear me down, WOWS! If it's not that, then I'm not sure what's going on.

Regardless, it would appear that a drastic change in gameplay is in order, as well as no longer going solo shoot-'em-up...alas. And getting more matches under my belt.

There was a player awhile back in Port Chat who wanted WG to give the game auto-torpedoes or auto-aiming main guns because he was ever so good at close-quarters-combat. We kept telling him why they would not do it and why we don't like it but he kept saying, he is good. Then we managed to figure out that he was playing Coop because with the way he was describing it, those battles would not happen in Random.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
149
[-TKS-]
[-TKS-]
Members
356 posts
4,839 battles
1 minute ago, UssIowaSailor said:

I played on a new account and due to protected matchmaking often I was the only live player on my team against one other live player, the other 11 ships were bots. The most I ever saw during the protected phase was two live players at a time. The rest were always bots.

 

Sue paints a grim picture of the numbers of new players coming into the game...as in it is almost non existent.

yeah. agreed on the grim. I also think attrition is a problem.  I see, from owning a clan, players with less than 1500 battles are at high risk to get frustrated and quit/move on. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×