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Driftwood1844

Paper Ships anyone? A-150s

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https://www.yahoo.com/news/japan-had-plans-build-battleships-164700677.html

 

I have been finding all kinds of news articles today on warships. This one is rather awesome because it talks about the Super-Yamatos. Japan Had Plans to Build Battleships with 20-Inch Guns. The A-150s would theoretically have carried six 510-millimeter (twenty-inch) guns in three twin turrets, Can anyone say yes please? How about reward whales that spend a'lot with A-150s.

  • Cool 2

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I  fail to see why the Japanese would have thought 6x 20" guns are better than 9x 18". In practice you won't be able to take advantage of the extra range.

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10 minutes ago, _Lord_Scott_ said:

WG has already stated the Yamato and her guns will be the Biggest guns in "Their Game"

A super-yamato is still a yamato :)

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3 minutes ago, GrandAdmiral_2016 said:

Get Conqueror. Eight 18-inchers with a 63% fire chance firing HE work wonders, and the AP does massive hurt.

The 18" guns on the Conqueror are junk. They can't even overmatch the same amount of armor as the Yamato's guns which is [edited]. The 12x 16.5" gun option is better.

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Just now, Lampshade_M1A2 said:

The 18" guns on the Conqueror are junk. They can't even overmatch the same amount of armor as the Yamato's guns which is [edited]. The 12x 16.5" gun option is better.

It all depends on what happens in the game. I kept my 419s and swap them out with the 18s.  The 419s have the weight of broadside advantage. the 18s have damage. Dispersion is identical for both. Yamato's guns are better because ''Balance, Comerade'', which anyone in possession of the ballistics info can tell you is pure B_S. All Allied ships except those of the USSR have been mistreated mightily by WG. Its' a game, after all....LOL..

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20 minutes ago, Lampshade_M1A2 said:

I  fail to see why the Japanese would have thought 6x 20" guns are better than 9x 18". In practice you won't be able to take advantage of the extra range.

It isn't about range but about the damage a hit causes. There were other routes to harder hitting shells though such as the US super heavy shells. The 18 & 20 inch shells were a better hammer

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2 minutes ago, BrushWolf said:

It isn't about range but about the damage a hit causes. There were other routes to harder hitting shells though such as the US super heavy shells. The 18 & 20 inch shells were a better hammer

A well designed 18" shell has more than enough penetration for the job. Besides having 3 fewer barrels the 20" guns would have a lower rate of fire individually.

I suppose it's the same debate when comparing other battleship calibers (number of guns versus caliber) but when you're down to 6 guns on a 70,000 ton battleship it ought to make you reconsider some things.

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45 minutes ago, Slumlord_Cheeto said:

A super-yamato is still a yamato :)

doesnt matter, no guns over 18.1 inches will be in this game as stated by WG, and 20 inch guns would be pretty much impossible to balance in this game

Edited by tcbaker777

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10 minutes ago, Lampshade_M1A2 said:

A well designed 18" shell has more than enough penetration for the job. Besides having 3 fewer barrels the 20" guns would have a lower rate of fire individually.

I suppose it's the same debate when comparing other battleship calibers (number of guns versus caliber) but when you're down to 6 guns on a 70,000 ton battleship it ought to make you reconsider some things.

The Japanese logic on more than a few things military was questionable at best. I didn't finish what I was saying in that post. The 18 & 20 shells were a better hammer while the US super heavy shells were a better rapier. Even with the Yamato's the Japanese would have been better served by developing the best 15/16" gun BB they could instead of wasting resources on them.

2 minutes ago, tcbaker777 said:

doesnt matter, no guns over 18.1 inches will be in this game said by WG themselves, and 20 inch guns would be pretty much impossible to balance in this game

Really long reload times would go a long way towards that.

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So Tier 11?... I’m sure that thing can whitstand a couple missile hits.

Edited by CO_Valle

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It has to be the 8x2 variant or bust.

Though speaking from an in-game perspective, both would be broken OP; the 6x2 version moreso given the levels of balancing required.

Common to both plans:

  • 127mm secondaries would have been upgraded to fully enclosed 100mm secondaries.
    • As per the plans for BB Shinano and subsequent Yamato-class hulls.
    • Would be a straight buff to AA and secondary punch in-game, as well as improved survivability due to all being closed mounts.
  • 155mm secondaries would have either been replaced with 2x Twin 100mm secondaries per mount or upgraded.
    • A further buff to AA and secondary punch in-game.
  • 25mm AA guns were to be upgraded to 40mm Japanese Bofors variants.
    • Yet another further buff to AA.
  • 510mm primaries would have had a 45s reload (at best; 60s at worst).
    • Would end up being more accurate than Yamato in both vertical and horizontal dispersion to compensate, though to what degree depends on the 6x2 or 8x2 setup.
    • AP would end up overpenning most DDs and CLs, but absolutely nuke every CA+ ship.
    • HE pierces up to 84mm of armor just by itself, with the regular 1/6 Pen. Pretty much can citadel most CLs and probably Detonate DDs.
  • Turrets motors were to be strengthened to support the new armament.
    • Odds are likely they may have been electric instead of hydraulic, leading to a straight traverse buff in-game.
  • Armor was to be upgraded; redistributing some excess armor to improve the citadel and provide increased resistance.
    • This was intended to be done with Shinano and the subsequent hulls, giving them more survivability and slightly faster main turret traverse due to lightening some of the turret facings to increase citadel/ammo protection.
    • Another net buff to traverse speed, and a net buff to armoring.

6x2 Variant Issues:

  • Would need secondary ranges exceeding Republique to compensate for the lack of primary weapon DPM.
    • Short of WG giving an A-150 a fictional Cold War reloading system upgrade to 30~35s, the only way 6x2 A-150 would be able to deal any sort of consistent damage is with long-range secondaries.
    • Given that it's uniform or near-uniform 100mm secondaries, while they tend to be rather floaty past 10km, they benefit from built-in 1/4 HE pen, high-firestarting chance, and if one decides, IFHE to murder everything.
      • The steep drop-off allows allows the 100mm secondaries to arc over islands. Enjoy the rain of fire.
  • Would need Yamato's historical maneuverability to survive long enough between shots and to get in close enough for the secondary DPM.
    • Due to the lack of actual DPM and needing to get in closer vs plenty of strong T10 rivals, playing more like Massachusetts on 'roids.
  • Traverse would still be slow; around 55~60s, but faster than the original 72s in-game.
    • It was even slower in real-life, but the planned turret armor reductions and motor upgrades would have brought it closer to that of other IJN BBs, around 45s or so.

8x2 Variant Issues:

  • Still would need secondary ranges rivaling Republique, but not necessarily exceeding.
    • Again, short of WG giving a fictional reloading system upgrade, 8x2 A-150 would be reliant on her secondaries for the bulk of her damage. But with 2 extra 510mm cannons, the 45s reload isn't as punishing and the accuracy can be downgraded a bit as well. In exchange, the secondary range would only have to match Republique, and 8x2 A-150 would just have to work on getting close enough.
  • Still would need improved maneuverability, but worse than the 6x2 design.
    • More due to being a Yamato hull, just extended. So rather than a 640m turning, more like 780m or so. Better than most T10s still, and rivaling some T9s and T8s.
  • Would need Yamato's old Super Heal to compensate for being longer and easier to hit even with improved maneuverability.
    • Because we know for a fact that an 8x2 A-150 would somehow be given worse concealment than Yamato, and would almost be visible from the start of the match.
  • Traverse would still be slow; around 55~60s, but faster than the original 72s in-game.
    • It was even slower in real-life, but the planned turret armor reductions and motor upgrades would have brought it closer to that of other IJN BBs, around 45s or so.

In both cases, A-150 with the planned upgrades (not including fictional reload buffs to the main guns) is enough to make even Stalingrad cry, and render any DD that isn't attempting to stealth torp her swiss cheese in a matter of seconds. 6x2 would be Massachusetts on steroids. 8x2 would be what 8x2 Conqueror wished she could be.

Simply put, A-150 in either form is too good for the game outside of being a boss ship, or an Operations/Co-Op only ship (for that God mode feel, even on Hard Mode Operations). WG just substituting Yamato's 9x 460mm for 6x 510mm isn't doing proper justice to the design, which was supposed to be a refined and upgraded Yamato-class (and as far as secondary/AA/Armor upgrades go, was in the plans anyway starting from Shinano onwards).

  • Cool 3

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2 hours ago, Slumlord_Cheeto said:

The A-150s would theoretically have carried six 510-millimeter (twenty-inch) guns in three twin turrets

Quickly crunches some numbers 

35mm of over match....:Smile_sceptic:.....not enough to cross any thresholds 

 

Edited by yashma

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Ain't happening bro...

2 hours ago, _Lord_Scott_ said:

WG has already stated the Yamato and her guns will be the Biggest guns in "Their Game"

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5 minutes ago, yashma said:

Quickly crunches some numbers 

35mm of over match....:Smile_sceptic:.....not enough to cross any thresholds 

 

So... Yamato levels of overmatch. Much improvement.

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Anyone up for Tillman IV-2. I'd love to see 15 18" guns running around at tier 10. Possibly as the crown to a USN Standard BB line, while Iowa and Montana lead a battle cruiser/fast battleship line (if/when WG ever does a USN BB line split).

Spoiler

Cast thine eyes upon the glory of this work of theoretical naval architecture, and be amazed.

keAnalp.png

 

Edited by sulghunter331

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1 hour ago, yashma said:

Quickly crunches some numbers 

35mm of over match....:Smile_sceptic:.....not enough to cross any thresholds 

 

wouldnt it round up to 36? which iirc is here and there?

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"Super-Montana" with 12x 18" guns and 20x 6" DP secondaries please.

Oh and give all 18" and 18.1" guns the same overmatch capability.

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6 hours ago, Hanger_18 said:

wouldnt it round up to 36? which iirc is here and there?

Until HE pen, overmatch does not round.

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13 hours ago, Hanger_18 said:

wouldnt it round up to 36? which iirc is here and there?

Overmatch doesn't round, hence the reason the Conqueror's 457s can't overmatch 32mm of armor.

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