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iDuckman

Wargaming, are you going to ruin Co-op too?

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Friday on the 0.7.8 PT server.  Mostly solo, plowed through the T1 bots as usual to satisfy the "5 Wins in Co-op" Mission.   Here's a couple of game results:

Spoiler

Screenshot_29.thumb.png.7b0fb91c95913c8ef16b4219e6186c2c.png

Screenshot_30.thumb.png.77a0c85ec3632c4ba8de177648fe2906.png

 

 

Saturday on a different account, playing Tier 1 mostly with Black Swan, full workup (stock captain), I got my head handed to me four games in a row.  Three times killed early leaving the red bots outnumbering the green 5 to 2 so I bailed to save time.  (Technically, a Draw.)  One game I survived to be the last man against 4 reds in a badly damaged ship.

This is worse than anything WG has done to the Scenarios.  The red bots are accurate and deadly.  They dance like Barishnikov yet still out-hit humans.  They play as a group and focus fire.  The green bots didn't seem to play much differently than usual.  They just died quicker.  (The green spawns, btw, were terrible.)

 

WG, you want to turn away new players, you're going about it the right way.

 

Edited by iDuckman
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And sometimes, we retire to Co-Op on bad days when we are hurting our Random teams, yet still want to shoot stuff with our floaty-botes.

My rules for co-op:

When on Two Brothers..  ALWAYS go up the middle. (did that today with a Lexington - got top spot with 2 ramming kills.)

Full throttle at start.

If you aren't laughing at the end...  You did it wrong.

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If you were playing in the higher tiers (T8+), the AI bots are much deadlier. T10 AI bots pretty much insta-react to a player's attack, and the only way to reduce it is either predict well (ripple fire, adjusting the aim a bit each sht) or not-lock onto them (usually when torping).

Otherwise, I'd just say you had extremely potato casuals on your teams.

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So, they've dialed up the bots on PTS? Not the first time they've tried jacking them up to "beserker" mode, if memory serves. If they've truly went overboard with how far they've dialed them up, I'd be willing to bet they'll turn them back down slightly once they get enough blowback, same as last time.

 

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5 minutes ago, YamatoA150 said:

If you were playing in the higher tiers (T8+), the AI bots are much deadlier.

Did you even bother to read the post?   I WAS PLAYING AT TIER 1.  I WAS PLAYING SOLO.  No human potatoes.

As far as I can recall, I have never lost a match at Tier 1.  Recent record on my Steam (Co-op only) account Tiers I-IV (haven't gotten any higher) is, IIRC, 245-4-1 with no loss at Tier 1. 

No, there have been radical changes to low-tier Co-op on the PTS today.

 

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Yep, co-op is a nice relaxing change from randoms, or a good place to test out a new/stock ship without completely embarrassing yourself.  I've noticed other players in battle commenting on how the player-to-bot ratio was on our team, and try to group up as soon as possible.

The friendly bots do like to ram though, more and more it seems. I sometimes try to knock out the enemy ship and save them, then the bot just plods along to the next BB salvo or wave of torps it can find.

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1 minute ago, Retnav54 said:

So, they've dialed up the bots on PTS? Not the first time they've tried jacking them up to "beserker" mode, if memory serves. If they've truly went overboard with how far they've dialed them up, I'd be willing to bet they'll turn them back down slightly once they get enough blowback, same as last time.

"turn them back down slightly"??  This is Tier ONE, where new players go to die.  A new player bounces off anything like this, he won't be back.

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35 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

Today with a different account, playing Tier 1 mostly with Black Swan, full workup, I got my head handed to me four games in a row.

No one, under ANY circumstance, should have a bad experience in a Black Swan.  That ship just brings instant happiness no matter how the battle turns out.  I don't think I've ever used it in Co-Op though...

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Just now, iDuckman said:

Did you even bother to read the post?   I WAS PLAYING AT TIER 1.  I WAS PLAYING SOLO.  No human potatoes.

As far as I can recall, I have never lost a match at Tier 1.  Recent record on my Steam (Co-op only) account Tiers I-IV (haven't gotten any higher) is, IIRC, 245-4-1 with no loss at Tier 1. 

No, there have been radical changes to low-tier Co-op on the PTS today.

Not well enough; I speed-read and slowed down at the bolded segment. My fault.

Must be a minor bug then. It's not the first time WG turned on Skynet mode that ended up making the T1 AI as deadly as T10s (to say nothing of the T10 AI basically god-haxxing).

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1 minute ago, DouglasMacAwful said:

It's basically Angry Birds, warships edition.  Who cares?  You're still going to approach 99% WR in them. 

You don't read worth a dam either.  With normal bots, I approach 100%.  With THESE bot I am now 0-4.  Tell me how easy it is.  :etc_swear:

 

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2 minutes ago, DouglasMacAwful said:

I also did the PTS missions in co-op.  Didn't lose any games.  Didn't notice a difference.  Maybe a string of bad luck?

[Reading again.]  I did that last night.  Try it right now and tell us how you do.

Edited by iDuckman

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Well, thankfully it's on PTS, and they are trying out 7.8 - I'd agree with the above assessment, probably a glitch or something else they're testing having unintended consequences. OTOH, if once 7.8 goes live, we end up with the Skynet death squads once again in co-op on the regular server, then it's time to give WG what for.

 

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WG will stick with their decision no matter what we say once it's live.  Witness the recent stonewalling on the WGC.

The time to deal with this is NOW, while it is still in PT.

 

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15 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

"turn them back down slightly"??  This is Tier ONE, where new players go to die.  A new player bounces off anything like this, he won't be back.

Bot AI should be phased difficulty in Co-Op.

Otherwise we need a pre-scripted training rooms for all players with less than 50 matches, that is fish in a barrel easy for a vetran, so new players are not scared off.

@iDuckman has a valid point of alarm that 0.7.8 indicates AI that are too strong for T1 new players.

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I'm thinking that every other person who's replied here is basing their assumptions off of current build and not PTS.

I look forward to getting my head handed to me in PTS T1 Co-op so OP and I can commiserate properly.

Edited by cavscout1739
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14 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

Did you even bother to read the post?   I WAS PLAYING AT TIER 1.  I WAS PLAYING SOLO.  No human potatoes.

As far as I can recall, I have never lost a match at Tier 1.  Recent record on my Steam (Co-op only) account Tiers I-IV (haven't gotten any higher) is, IIRC, 245-4-1 with no loss at Tier 1. 

No, there have been radical changes to low-tier Co-op on the PTS today.

Although I can not ever remember losing a tier 1 match against the bots, I never played with a team of them either. Sometimes friendly bots are decent, sometimes they are potatoes of an especially stupid variety. Tier 1 can actually be tough though because it is always Standard battle so the bots always rush the base and if your team isn't ready to meet them and goes out of the base to meet them, you can lose easily to them. I imagine your friendly bots rushed out to fight, they usually do stupid crap like that. When playing on a bot heavy team in Standard Battle, I always just sit at the base and wait for them. Sometimes the humans I am with will slaughter the bots, sometimes not so I am there to defend the base and can get quite an impressive score/kill count when done correctly. 

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1 minute ago, KSN said:

Otherwise we need a pre-scripted training rooms for all players with less than 50 matches,

There is one.  If you're a veteran you've never seen it anywhere but PTS.  Not a bad intro, but not nearly enough to offset this.

 

1 minute ago, cavscout1739 said:

I look forward to getting my head handed to me in T1 Co-op so OP and I can commiserate properly.

:Smile_great:  Go try it.  Play a game and see.

 

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8 minutes ago, Taylor3006 said:

Tier 1 can actually be tough though because it is always Standard battle so the bots always rush the base and if your team isn't ready to meet them and goes out of the base to meet them, you can lose easily to them.

They don't do that.  They don't yolo.  They really don't seem to care about the green base at all.  (They do defend their own.)  Instead they appear to be ship hunting.

Please go try it.  You're a much more experienced Co-op player than I.  Please give us your impressions.

 

Edited by iDuckman

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Did you try any other tiers besides Tier 1? If say, tiers 2, 3, and 4, you're seeing the same results, which could indicate this affects ALL tiers in co-op, then I agree, something sounds major fubar.

 

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5 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

They don't do that.  They don't yolo.  They really don't seem to care about the green base at all.  (They do defend their own.)  Instead they appear to be ship hunting.

Please go try it.  You're a much more experienced Co-op player than I.  Please give us your impressions.

I wish I could, can't use the PTS because I am Mac afflicted. What you are describing then is odd, and something new. Maybe they have buffed the AI a bit, I mean it really does suck. Very curious now. 

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