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Nergy

The trouble with BBs

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I always hear "BBs go in and tank". Let me make clear that Battleships are not the MMORPG equivalence of Tanks. They are the equivalence of a nearsighted Mage with shaking hands. They are glass cannons that are not equipped dealing with the amount of incoming damage. Why? Battleships are so big that cruisers and destroyers can't miss them even if they wanted to. BBs have to eat anything that is shot at them and in a close combat situation when you are hit by 5 shells every second, I not even talk about torpedoes, flooding and fire, your HP pool drops as fast as your checking account on a Friday night (or NVIDIA and Intel release something new). On top of that on many BBs the turret movement is so slow that very often they have to run a straight line or they can't hold a lock on a target, so if you evade you can't shoot and if you shoot you can't evade. And unlike smaller ships, BBs are way too visible and not fast enough to get out of trouble if they take a "wrong" turn, and very often you won't know that until 5 minutes later, so pardon us if we scan the water for dog poop.

What is with this one salvo deleting a cruiser? It takes luck and mostly a CA that is so stupid or so arrogant that he runs in a straight line. So if you get deleted in one then this is a sign of your own incompetence and not that BBs are big, mean, overpowered cruiser deleting machines. If you position and maneuver a small ship correctly then it is next to impossible for a BB to hit you! I watched a DD burn down a Yamato and a Friedrich der Große from full health, and there was nothing we could do. You aim at a spot where you think the DD will be 8 seconds later and hope it will be there. If it turns a little you miss, unless the dispersion luck sends a shell so far of course that you actually score a small hit and even if it is there you still depend on RNG luck.

Many BB driver play in a way the game design, knowledge and experience dictates. Are there cowards? Of course there are fearful guys that hide behind the BBs HP pool and any mountain range on the map, hell they would hide on the other side of the map borders if they could and sometimes, just sometimes, I suspect it is those straightline cruiser guys that got burned too often and now give real BB drivers a bad name.

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Err, if bbs are not tanks, who is?
Remember, even in an MMORPG, you don't throw tanks dead centre into the swarm of enemies alone.
If you have trouble hitting things in high tier bbs you have trouble with gunnery or positioning, or both. Use concealment and awareness!
If you see dds burn down bbs, either both bbs are bots that they can't hit anything, or the team is so spread out and oblivious that they can't deal with a khabarovsk.

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29 minutes ago, Nergy said:

I always hear "BBs go in and tank". Let me make clear that Battleships are not the MMORPG equivalence of Tanks. They are the equivalence of a nearsighted Mage with shaking hands. They are glass cannons that are not equipped dealing with the amount of incoming damage. Why? Battleships are so big that cruisers and destroyers can't miss them even if they wanted to. BBs have to eat anything that is shot at them and in a close combat situation when you are hit by 5 shells every second, I not even talk about torpedoes, flooding and fire, your HP pool drops as fast as your checking account on a Friday night (or NVIDIA and Intel release something new). On top of that on many BBs the turret movement is so slow that very often they have to run a straight line or they can't hold a lock on a target, so if you evade you can't shoot and if you shoot you can't evade. And unlike smaller ships, BBs are way too visible and not fast enough to get out of trouble if they take a "wrong" turn, and very often you won't know that until 5 minutes later, so pardon us if we scan the water for dog poop.

What is with this one salvo deleting a cruiser? It takes luck and mostly a CA that is so stupid or so arrogant that he runs in a straight line. So if you get deleted in one then this is a sign of your own incompetence and not that BBs are big, mean, overpowered cruiser deleting machines. If you position and maneuver a small ship correctly then it is next to impossible for a BB to hit you! I watched a DD burn down a Yamato and a Friedrich der Große from full health, and there was nothing we could do. You aim at a spot where you think the DD will be 8 seconds later and hope it will be there. If it turns a little you miss, unless the dispersion luck sends a shell so far of course that you actually score a small hit and even if it is there you still depend on RNG luck.

Many BB driver play in a way the game design, knowledge and experience dictates. Are there cowards? Of course there are fearful guys that hide behind the BBs HP pool and any mountain range on the map, hell they would hide on the other side of the map borders if they could and sometimes, just sometimes, I suspect it is those straightline cruiser guys that got burned too often and now give real BB drivers a bad name.

Clutch Move In Before The Lock GIF - ClutchMove InBeforeTheLock GIFs
 
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26 minutes ago, Nergy said:

What is with this one salvo deleting a cruiser? It takes luck and mostly a CA that is so stupid or so arrogant that he runs in a straight line. So if you get deleted in one then this is a sign of your own incompetence and not that BBs are big, mean, overpowered cruiser deleting machines. 

 

This is such horse pucky.  All it takes is for a cruiser to get detected for a few seconds and happen to be broadside to a BB that isn't.  I know, cuz I've done it to cruisers.  The reason is because every BB is loaded and ready to go to get that big hit on one.  Some of those cruisers can be hit through the citadel from any angle.

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30 minutes ago, Nergy said:

I always hear "BBs go in and tank". Let me make clear that Battleships are not the MMORPG equivalence of Tanks. They are the equivalence of a nearsighted Mage with shaking hands. They are glass cannons that are not equipped dealing with the amount of incoming damage. Why? Battleships are so big that cruisers and destroyers can't miss them even if they wanted to. BBs have to eat anything that is shot at them and in a close combat situation when you are hit by 5 shells every second, I not even talk about torpedoes, flooding and fire, your HP pool drops as fast as your checking account on a Friday night (or NVIDIA and Intel release something new). On top of that on many BBs the turret movement is so slow that very often they have to run a straight line or they can't hold a lock on a target, so if you evade you can't shoot and if you shoot you can't evade. And unlike smaller ships, BBs are way too visible and not fast enough to get out of trouble if they take a "wrong" turn, and very often you won't know that until 5 minutes later, so pardon us if we scan the water for dog poop.

What is with this one salvo deleting a cruiser? It takes luck and mostly a CA that is so stupid or so arrogant that he runs in a straight line. So if you get deleted in one then this is a sign of your own incompetence and not that BBs are big, mean, overpowered cruiser deleting machines. If you position and maneuver a small ship correctly then it is next to impossible for a BB to hit you! I watched a DD burn down a Yamato and a Friedrich der Große from full health, and there was nothing we could do. You aim at a spot where you think the DD will be 8 seconds later and hope it will be there. If it turns a little you miss, unless the dispersion luck sends a shell so far of course that you actually score a small hit and even if it is there you still depend on RNG luck.

Many BB driver play in a way the game design, knowledge and experience dictates. Are there cowards? Of course there are fearful guys that hide behind the BBs HP pool and any mountain range on the map, hell they would hide on the other side of the map borders if they could and sometimes, just sometimes, I suspect it is those straightline cruiser guys that got burned too often and now give real BB drivers a bad name.

He's right you know. 

 

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27 minutes ago, Nergy said:

They are glass cannons that are not equipped dealing with the amount of incoming damage.

This is a ridiculous statement.  Battleships have, by far, the most hitpoints, best armor schemes and best repair capabilities.  They are vastly more capable of weathering enemy fire than any other ship type.  This does not mean you can always survive extended focus fire from multiple enemies or get away with sloppy positioning, but you absolutely can survive beatings no other ship type would even come close to enduring.

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@Nergy Then play BBs and show us all how it should be done!

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8 minutes ago, torpsRus said:
Clutch Move In Before The Lock GIF - ClutchMove InBeforeTheLock GIFs
 

LOL, I dont know why,  but its comforting knowing your going to post this in every thread,  the more times i see it the harder i laugh. :cap_haloween:

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2 minutes ago, DarkStormy said:

He's right you know. 

 

The biggest problem BBs have IMO, overall, is a very sloooooow reload and slow speed. But, that is what they are!  That is how clever cruisers kill them. I am not able to play BBs cept for Scharnhorst.  Don't have the patience.  No fun. Slow. Potent ships..... but I have not gots the time nor the brain that is wired for them. Many players are like this. Blam, then 30 secs later you get to do that again. Yawn. But you like em, play em.

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2 minutes ago, dmckay said:

The biggest problem BBs have IMO, overall, is a very sloooooow reload and slow speed. But, that is what they are!  That is how clever cruisers kill them. I am not able to play BBs cept for Scharnhorst.  Don't have the patience.  No fun. Slow. Potent ships..... but I have not gots the time nor the brain that is wired for them. Many players are like this. Blam, then 30 secs later you get to do that again. Yawn. But you like em, play em.

I play every class of ship even the dreaded CV. Just bought the scharnhorst,  wow is that a fun ship.

The biggest problem with all of WOWS is that to do well (in any class) you need team play from 12 random people on the internet.

thats it in a nut shell.

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Just now, DarkStormy said:

I play every class of ship even the dreaded CV. Just bought the scharnhorst,  wow is that a fun ship.

The biggest problem with all of WOWS is that to do well (in any class) you need team play from 12 random people on the internet.

thats it in a nut shell.

No kidding. 

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The problem is not the BB itself, its the player.  When you see a game where all your BB players have a lower average damage than a DD you know they are worthless, time and time again you get on a team and the 5 BB players are either red or yellow damage figures ( less than 50k ) and for yammy or monty players, you know, yeh sure they hit stuff but they don't influence anything

The Op is completely wrong, what you have is poor players who have no clue, and are to scared top push when its needed or shoot the radar CA instead of the easy shot of just shooting another BB.

BB players who do good damage and know how to position themselves in the game know when they need to push and they make shots that influence the game for the other classes, what the Op calls luck deleting a CA is what others call experience on where to aim.

 

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51 minutes ago, Nergy said:

I always hear "BBs go in and tank". Let me make clear that Battleships are not the MMORPG equivalence of Tanks. They are the equivalence of a nearsighted Mage with shaking hands. They are glass cannons that are not equipped dealing with the amount of incoming damage. Why? Battleships are so big that cruisers and destroyers can't miss them even if they wanted to. BBs have to eat anything that is shot at them and in a close combat situation when you are hit by 5 shells every second, I not even talk about torpedoes, flooding and fire, your HP pool drops as fast as your checking account on a Friday night (or NVIDIA and Intel release something new). On top of that on many BBs the turret movement is so slow that very often they have to run a straight line or they can't hold a lock on a target, so if you evade you can't shoot and if you shoot you can't evade. And unlike smaller ships, BBs are way too visible and not fast enough to get out of trouble if they take a "wrong" turn, and very often you won't know that until 5 minutes later, so pardon us if we scan the water for dog poop.

What is with this one salvo deleting a cruiser? It takes luck and mostly a CA that is so stupid or so arrogant that he runs in a straight line. So if you get deleted in one then this is a sign of your own incompetence and not that BBs are big, mean, overpowered cruiser deleting machines. If you position and maneuver a small ship correctly then it is next to impossible for a BB to hit you! I watched a DD burn down a Yamato and a Friedrich der Große from full health, and there was nothing we could do. You aim at a spot where you think the DD will be 8 seconds later and hope it will be there. If it turns a little you miss, unless the dispersion luck sends a shell so far of course that you actually score a small hit and even if it is there you still depend on RNG luck.

Many BB driver play in a way the game design, knowledge and experience dictates. Are there cowards? Of course there are fearful guys that hide behind the BBs HP pool and any mountain range on the map, hell they would hide on the other side of the map borders if they could and sometimes, just sometimes, I suspect it is those straightline cruiser guys that got burned too often and now give real BB drivers a bad name.

Are you on drugs? The minute most Tier VI BBs can't auto-bounce Tier VIII 406 mm AP no matter how steeply angled they are, is the minute I actually consider a single word in your post. For the moment though:

 

N.C. and Tirpitz(15 inch gunned yes, but still capable of overmatching a Bayern's bow) shooting AP at the super-steeply angled side of a Bayern:

 

"That one bounced!"

 

30 seconds later:

 

"Ricochet!"

 

30 seconds later:

 

"We didn't penetrate their armor!"

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4 minutes ago, CriMiNaL__ said:

The problem is not the BB itself, its the player.  When you see a game where all your BB players have a lower average damage than a DD you know they are worthless, time and time again you get on a team and the 5 BB players are either red or yellow damage figures ( less than 50k ) and for yammy or monty players, you know, yeh sure they hit stuff but they don't influence anything

The Op is completely wrong, what you have is poor players who have no clue, and are to scared top push when its needed or shoot the radar CA instead of the easy shot of just shooting another BB.

BB players who do good damage and know how to position themselves in the game know when they need to push and they make shots that influence the game for the other classes, what the Op calls luck deleting a CA is what others call experience on where to aim.

 

Get a load of this admiral halsey wannabe.

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Just now, Highlord said:

Get a load of this admiral halsey wannabe.

Where have I not stated the truth to the matter, its easy for you to add nothing as you do on so many occasions, but can you actually scrounge up anything to dispute what I have said.

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1 hour ago, Nergy said:

What is with this one salvo deleting a cruiser? It takes luck and mostly a CA that is so stupid or so arrogant that he runs in a straight line. So if you get deleted in one then this is a sign of your own incompetence and not that BBs are big, mean, overpowered cruiser deleting machines

Well lets take this argument. We have American/British CL, VS a BB (of any nation) that has double the caliber of guns, repair party, the highest HP pool in a match in any tier compared to the CL,  BBs can over match any CL armor while all the CL can do is  set BBs  fires.  It takes a very long time to sink a BB with fire However, 4 salvos of BB anywhere   and its over for the cruisers. BBs are immune to citadels from cruisers.

1 hour ago, Nergy said:

Many BB driver play in a way the game design, knowledge and experience dictates. Are there cowards?

I don;t think BB drivers are cowards, what I do think and makes perfect sense to me is, BBs damage farm. When they do, they failed at there only job they have in the game which is sink cruisers or/and high value targets. That is it. BBs are the laziest class ships in the game work load wise. When BBs fail at there primary job that means other classes have to pick up the slack.

1 hour ago, Nergy said:

I always hear "BBs go in and tank". Let me make clear that Battleships are not the MMORPG equivalence of Tanks. They are the equivalence of a nearsighted Mage with shaking hands.

^^^ Disagree re evaluate. Mages do all the workload, they have a a lot thing to do. BBs don;t hve that workload. Sorry I disagree with your observation

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I disagree that BB's are like the mages in MMORPG's.

Unless OP means some kind of a mage wearing heavy armor that slooows him/her down so much that he/she can't move fast. But those aren't the norm even in most MMO's.

I don't think the traditional style of classes from MMORPG can be compared to the ships in this game. It's not even similar.

BB's may not be tanks, but they still have most health, most armor, and most access to Repair Party. I think the user needs to leverage such durability to achieve... goals and victories, I guess.

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2 minutes ago, CriMiNaL__ said:

You should read an entire thread rather than come in at the end and appear like an idiot

why? I could read the entire thread thru several times, and STILL appear like an idiot. you know, sort of like you....

besides, it's really pretty boring.

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9 minutes ago, Spud_butt said:

why? I could read the entire thread thru several times, and STILL appear like an idiot. you know, sort of like you....

besides, it's really pretty boring.

i can't be half the idiot you are, because as far as the game goes i took time to learn how its played, your still wandering around in the dark.

if people calls things boring, more often than not it is because they are boring.

Edited by CriMiNaL__

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Battleships have a health pool on par with equaling multiple ships. They draw the attention away from the mages and rogues with their "Taunt" skill and once they show up, every enemy around feels compelled to focus on it. They have a healing ability that can recover the full HP amount of a whole other class. They have a damage potential on par with swinging a great axe at the enemy with the enemy having the same chance to dodge said attack; they are also the least likely to be killed off with a single salvo. They are in fact the perfect example of what a tank should be.

With that said, there are these little stealthy "rogue" bastards running around that can KO the "Tank" in one hit if the Tank isn't Intelligent enough to maneuver and dodge the attack and if/when he does not have any support from our "Mystical" friends the Cruiser class.

Cruisers of which often times are loaded out with enough "Spells" (aka consumables) and/or a debuff attack (fires) that can "poison" BB's with a lucky shot if that BB fails a save (RNG be damned).

In comparison, a Cruiser is a mage that can be taken out in 1 shot from the Tank but has the ability to unmask the rogues and other half-rogue/half-mage cruisers (British cruisers). A DD is still a rogue and a BB is still a tank for all intents and purposes being able to sustain more damage than the Rogue class and Mage class combined.

Now enough of the D&D stuff.

Battleships can tank damage and should tank damage for the other ships since this is a team game and ultimately any BB left alone against even a single DD is usually at a severe disadvantage without that cruiser/DD support. BB's have great alpha damage, but cruisers have the best DPM you will ever find in the game. DD's are in fact the best at 1 hit kills (regarding torp salvos) but are typically too fragile to deal with the cruisers. So a BB that can keep their Cruisers alive to the end (or at least until the enemy DD's are dead) is better off tanking that damage rather than letting it's cruisers fall before it.

The only thing that differs from this is the particular BB in question and something that both those shouting "Go Tank" and the OP himself seem to neglect. Some are designed to sit further back and not engage in CQB against other BB's due to armor limitations (Japanese, British). Some are brawlers and are specifically designed to get up close and personal with the enemy Cruisers and BB's (German specifically). And some are able to do a bit of both (US, French). Know the ships intended positions and playstyle and position yourself accordingly. In the same sense that a cruiser shouldn't expect a Kongo to run up and tank damage for it, a Bismarck should not be attempting to snipe from the back of the map.

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BBs are laughably easy to play and do well in. If you aren't doing well then you need to examine what you're doing and what the good players do by comparison. Then figure out why they do it.

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