Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
You need to play a total of 10 battles to post in this section.
Zarroc1

Improving Ibuki - Zao Guns

11 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

15
[-K-]
[-K-]
Members
71 posts
4,418 battles

Ibuki is a terrible ship. Everyone knows it and accepts it as the paywall of the line, like the Izumo in the IJN BB line. But I think it could use a buff. 

 

Why not have a gun upgrade that gives it Zao guns? Keep the dual gun turrets but give it the 203/50 18th year type guns on Zao which would branch off the B-Hull upgrade. This allows you to adjust to Zao gun ballistics, which are a completely different than anything else in the line before, and (I think) would make Ibuki much more enjoyable. Because the three main reasons Ibuki stinks is her terrible armor, coupled with slow reloading guns that have very floaty shells at 13km+ that makes it difficult to play at the ranges required. 

 

Just my thoughts. 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
449
[-AA-]
Members
1,729 posts
6,657 battles

Are you using the Range module on Ibuki? 

I think Ibuki is pretty okay. The only thing I don't understand is that the Mogami & Ibuki reload slower than the Myoko….

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,130
[SYN]
[SYN]
Members
6,986 posts
7,530 battles

My issue with Ibuki was it was boring. I didn't find it to be a bad ship, it's just not a flashy souped up sports car.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,819
[SALVO]
Members
17,112 posts
17,794 battles

I admit that it's been a long time since I played the Ibuki, but I don't remember it as a bad ship.

Now, the Zao...  As nice as the buff it got from the 12 km torpedoes, IMO, the Zao needs some more buffing.  IMO, the Zao is a prime example of power creep.  It could absolutely use a serious buff to its HP total.  The nerf down to about 40k may have been justifiable at the time, but now, the Zao seems grossly weak on HP compared to all other tier 10 CA's.  (I'll ignore the CL's in this comparison.)  Heck, the damned Moskva has 65k hp!!!  And all other tier 10 Heavy Cruisers have over 50k HP, while the Zao is stuck with only 40.8k HP.  And it's no longer the tier 10 beast CA it used to be either.  It's time for the devs to bump the Zao up to around 50k or more HP so that it can be "HP-competitive" with the other tier 10 heavy cruisers.

 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27
[BIER]
Members
126 posts
1,878 battles

The Ibuki suffers from a problem that is endemic to the IJN line, not just cruisers, but ALL IJN ships.

They're one trick ponies. That is, they pretty much have a single playstyle that they can function at, and nothing else.

In the Ibuki's case, it's extreme-range HE spam. That's what it excels at.  Try to do much else with it, and you're erased almost instantly.

I don't really see how any buffs are needed - it does what it does quite well, and I cant' see how any minor changes would allow it to do anything else successfully.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20
[NETSI]
Members
72 posts
7,772 battles

I don’t understand why posts here aren’t really discussing the actual suggestion made by OP, which actually seems to be a very reasonable upgrade. 

Ibuki’s floaty guns are in fact an issue in why it feels so underwhelming at range. Having the option to take on Zao’s gun ballistics is a very logical progression and gives more purpose to taking on the range mod in Ibuki. This allows it to be effective against faster targets like DDs and have more time to kite from high tier BB shells by staying at range while still being useful.

Right now, a range mod Ibuki ends up having 19km range, more than what Zao can reach, and in most cases it can’t actually hit anything not a battleship beyond 16km with its arcs. It seems rather counterintuitive that the tier 9 has better range than tier 10, but it’s all purely for show in practice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15
[-K-]
[-K-]
Members
71 posts
4,418 battles
16 hours ago, Crucis said:

I admit that it's been a long time since I played the Ibuki, but I don't remember it as a bad ship.

Now, the Zao...  As nice as the buff it got from the 12 km torpedoes, IMO, the Zao needs some more buffing.  IMO, the Zao is a prime example of power creep.  It could absolutely use a serious buff to its HP total.  The nerf down to about 40k may have been justifiable at the time, but now, the Zao seems grossly weak on HP compared to all other tier 10 CA's.  (I'll ignore the CL's in this comparison.)  Heck, the damned Moskva has 65k hp!!!  And all other tier 10 Heavy Cruisers have over 50k HP, while the Zao is stuck with only 40.8k HP.  And it's no longer the tier 10 beast CA it used to be either.  It's time for the devs to bump the Zao up to around 50k or more HP so that it can be "HP-competitive" with the other tier 10 heavy cruisers.

 

Lol. People who say Zao isn't good anymore don't know how to play her. The 12km torp buff was awesome but not really needed. If you think Zao isn't good, you're just not playing her right or she's just not the ship for you. 

10 hours ago, LAnybody said:

The Ibuki suffers from a problem that is endemic to the IJN line, not just cruisers, but ALL IJN ships.

They're one trick ponies. That is, they pretty much have a single playstyle that they can function at, and nothing else.

In the Ibuki's case, it's extreme-range HE spam. That's what it excels at.  Try to do much else with it, and you're erased almost instantly.

I don't really see how any buffs are needed - it does what it does quite well, and I cant' see how any minor changes would allow it to do anything else successfully.

 

 

That's not all Zao can do and if you think it is, please see above. 

 

2 hours ago, hyuuu said:

I don’t understand why posts here aren’t really discussing the actual suggestion made by OP, which actually seems to be a very reasonable upgrade. 

Ibuki’s floaty guns are in fact an issue in why it feels so underwhelming at range. Having the option to take on Zao’s gun ballistics is a very logical progression and gives more purpose to taking on the range mod in Ibuki. This allows it to be effective against faster targets like DDs and have more time to kite from high tier BB shells by staying at range while still being useful.

Right now, a range mod Ibuki ends up having 19km range, more than what Zao can reach, and in most cases it can’t actually hit anything not a battleship beyond 16km with its arcs. It seems rather counterintuitive that the tier 9 has better range than tier 10, but it’s all purely for show in practice.

This. With Ibuki's armor, you HAVE to stay long range for most of the match. With your terrible shells, hitting anything at the ranges required is ridiculously hard, which ends up making the ship just a BB damage farmer. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,819
[SALVO]
Members
17,112 posts
17,794 battles
1 hour ago, Zarroc1 said:

Lol. People who say Zao isn't good anymore don't know how to play her. The 12km torp buff was awesome but not really needed. If you think Zao isn't good, you're just not playing her right or she's just not the ship for you. 

I didn't say anything about it not being good or whatever.  But there is an undeniable and OBVIOUS imbalances in the Zao compared to other tier 10 heavy cruisers, the Zao's low HP pool.  Also, I disagree on the torpedoes.  The original torpedoes, while great for their speed, required the Zao to be played in an exceptionally risky way that wasn't true for other IJN CA's (IIRC).  Adding the 12 km torps only allowed the Zao to be played like other heavy cruisers in her line.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15
[-K-]
[-K-]
Members
71 posts
4,418 battles
On 7/20/2018 at 8:57 AM, Crucis said:

I didn't say anything about it not being good or whatever.  But there is an undeniable and OBVIOUS imbalances in the Zao compared to other tier 10 heavy cruisers, the Zao's low HP pool.  Also, I disagree on the torpedoes.  The original torpedoes, while great for their speed, required the Zao to be played in an exceptionally risky way that wasn't true for other IJN CA's (IIRC).  Adding the 12 km torps only allowed the Zao to be played like other heavy cruisers in her line.

There might be a difference in HP but that doesn't mean Zao is underpowered compared to th rest of the T10 cruisers. Again,  Zao is balanced just fine IMO even with the low HP. It's armor is troll and it's incredibly stealth which compensates. Also, there isn't a ship in IJN CA line that can use torps safely like the Zao can now. It is always risky to try and use the IJN CA torps with their bad angles and small margin between torp range and detectability. 

Edited by Zarroc1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Testers
1,143 posts
3,273 battles

Ibuki's only hardship is that she's trapped between the gems of the IJN Cruiser Line.

Mogami is a fun ship, the original 15x gun HE broadside. And has the variability of choosing 203s. Helena maybe another option for 15x gun broadsides "now" but Mogami's still has Torpedoes and variability on top of her. The primary differences between Ibuki and 203 Mogami is the DP mounts, T9 Module, and MB Range; The latter most can be attributed to Tier.

And Zao is Zao... prior to the 12km Torps, Torpedoes were the only thing Ibuki had over Zao. 

Although the one thing Ibuki has over her T8 and 10 sisters is she is very unassuming. Nobody that sees a Ibuki next to a Mogami or Zao will shoot at the Ibuki first (unless 'buki is full broadside). Her apparent threat level isn't high enough. A buff to Ibuki making her more dangerous would make those grinding her have a more enjoyable time. But the consequences are an increase in threat potential VS target of opportunity. 

---

Anyways if you want to know how I grinded through Ibuki this was my build:

Modules: MAM1 - SBM2* - DCM1 - SGM2 - CSM1 - MBM3 

*occasionally I used AAM2 

Consumables: DFA - Spotter 

CMDR: PT - AR - DE - CE - AFT* - SI - CatCON - PM*

*AFT and PM could easily be 5pts spent wherever, but I went with a Secondary / AA loadout for the grind. 

If you're wondering "why not Hydro?" It's because DFA vs CatFTR, DFA is hands down better. Likewise since I'm took the RoF mod Spotter is better than FTR since I'm losing out on Range. Also Planes haven't the ability to spot Torpedoes, might not be as good as Hydro, but with CatCON you have a decent sweep area. 

If you're fearless of CVs then run Hydro. If you're fearful of them swap out Spotter. If you're not bothering with AFT on an IJN GunBote, since their AA and SB are sub-par that's another 4pts to play with. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
272 posts
3,540 battles

I have Ibuki running the gun range mod and I don't have too much trouble landing hits at max range, but I have a good amount of practice with it. I wouldn't be against giving her Zao guns, but I personally don't need them. Zao on the other hand, I love the ship, I can do great things with that ship, but I really think she needs an increase to her rate of fire. Everything she faces can either match her reload or beat it by quite a lot. I don't get why Moskva with it's 9 inch guns or Henri IV with it's 10 inch guns should reload faster than Zao's 8 inch guns. I'm not asking for a Des Moines reload, but at least let me reload faster than these (battle)cruisers with 9 and 10 inch guns.  I can't exactly stealth fire over open water anymore, so I've got to have some sort of way to effectively match the ships that are meant to rival me. I don't even care about the health pool difference, I can make that work as is, but I really could use a reload that doesn't leave me as the slowest cruiser at tier 10. It's also a bit insulting that Henri IV is likely to get a reload booster sometime soon on top of already beating my reload.

Edited by CaptHarlock_222

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×