This.

[_ENO_]

(Enter your rant here)

 

/rant.

[Ensign_Cthulhu]

It means nothing in isolation. There's no way to tell on the basis of the information provided here that the player with less than 10 battles isn't a unicum with a 90% win rate in carriers overall, who's going to roll the 75% unicum into the dust and spit on their grave.

[Ace_04]

And? 

[Gerbertz]

5 minutes ago, _ENO_ said:

(Enter your rant here)

 

/rant.

you have a way with words mister. +1

[_ENO_]

15 minutes ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

It means nothing in isolation. There's no way to tell on the basis of the information provided here that the player with less than 10 battles isn't a unicum with a 90% win rate in carriers overall, who's going to roll the 75% unicum into the dust and spit on their grave.

True. Didn't play out that way.

Turns out he was a reroll. 

[Kevs02Accord]

Despite the common misconception that a high WR CV vs a lower WR CV means the match is forfeit we pulled a win, quite easily, in just such a case. Our CV did his best, didn't give up, the team played well and together, thats what is actually important.

[RagingxMarmoset]

24 minutes ago, _ENO_ said:

True. Didn't play out that way.

Turns out he was a reroll. 

So what? 

[ausanimal]

49 minutes ago, _ENO_ said:

(Enter your rant here)

 

/rant.

I think CV players need to start doing this for every other ship class if it's good enough to bring it up for CVs and post it on the forum i swear there is one each day that someone post it's good enough to do it for every other ship. _ENO_ you made this post you have the first honours to do one for BB? 

[Crucis]

25 minutes ago, Kevs02Accord said:

Despite the common misconception that a high WR CV vs a lower WR CV means the match is forfeit we pulled a win, quite easily, in just such a case. Our CV did his best, didn't give up, the team played well and together, thats what is actually important.

I don't completely agree with you on this, Kev.  I think that they're both important.

The weaker CV player "doing his best" isn't good enough.  If you're a pure garbage CV player, your "best" is still going to be pretty pathetic.  OTOH, if you're a lowish WR CV player but, let's say, still in the 40's% range and you play above expectations, you might be playing well enough to hold your own.  Maybe not enough to outplay the unicums CV player, but well enough to help your own team and not get face rolled by the enemy CV player.  And in that case, then your team will have the ability to overcome their CV disadvantage and win.  

I am very hard pressed to see a team with a garbage CV player defeating a team with a unicum CV player, unless the rest of the unicum CV player's team is so bad that no matter how hard he carries, it's not enough.  It just seems unlikely to me that if the unicum CV player's team is in any way moderately competent, that garbage CV's team will be able to play so well that they can overcome those odds.

Note that I agree that never giving up always matters.  

[Crucis]

22 minutes ago, ausanimal said:

I think CV players need to start doing this for every other ship class if it's good enough to bring it up for CVs and post it on the forum i swear there is one each day that someone post it's good enough to do it for every other ship. _ENO_ you made this post you have the first honours to do one for BB? 

A.  Ship TYPE, not ship class.

B. It's just not the same thing.  When you're talking about high tier carriers, it's absolutely a 1v1 thing, due to MM constraints.  When you're talking about BBs, you can have up to 5 BBs per team under normal MM circumstances, or more with an MM dump.  And having 1 bad apple BB can be bearable because the others can take up the slack.  Heck, because cruisers are doing the same thing as BBs (i.e. surface combat), they can also take up some of the slack for a bad BB.  You see this whenever there's an AFK BB and yet the team still wins.

 

[megadeux]

1 minute ago, Crucis said:

A.  Ship TYPE, not ship class.

B. It's just not the same thing.  When you're talking about high tier carriers, it's absolutely a 1v1 thing, due to MM constraints.  When you're talking about BBs, you can have up to 5 BBs per team under normal MM circumstances, or more with an MM dump.  And having 1 bad apple BB can be bearable because the others can take up the slack.  Heck, because cruisers are doing the same thing as BBs (i.e. surface combat), they can also take up some of the slack for a bad BB.  You see this whenever there's an AFK BB and yet the team still wins.

 

I don't think so, because they obviously have the same influence. A 70% WR BB has, by nature of statistics, just as much influence on the match as a 70% WR CV. Both can be overcome, and, in the case of CVs, I'd say it's easier to overcome. You can't blow a BB's salvo out of the air, but you absolutely can with a CV. I have seen highly. Incompetent teams with a trash CV making themselves immune to my strikes with just one or two well positioned AA cruisers. 

It's absolutely possible, in fact, quite easy to deter CV strikes. It's much harder to do the same to torpedoes or shells.

[ausanimal]

14 minutes ago, Crucis said:

B. It's just not the same thing.  When you're talking about high tier carriers, it's absolutely a 1v1 thing, due to MM constraints.  When you're talking about BBs, you can have up to 5 BBs per team under normal MM circumstances, or more with an MM dump.  And having 1 bad apple BB can be bearable because the others can take up the slack.  Heck, because cruisers are doing the same thing as BBs (i.e. surface combat), they can also take up some of the slack for a bad BB.  You see this whenever there's an AFK BB and yet the team still wins.

It is the same are you telling me someone that's had less then 10 battles in a Yamato will do as well as someone that has had 300 battles in one i would put my money one the one that has had 300 battles in it to play better, that's all the OP showed was that it was someone new to Midway even though they found out later it was a reroll. So if people are happy to post every time they come across a CV with less then 10 battles lets make it fair ground and do it to all ship TYPES, if you get it to a match and you find out that person is new to that tier and they just got a brand new shiny ship and have less then 10 battles in that ship screen shot it and post it lets see how many people will do it or do they just want to hide and only post when it's a CV?

[Sweetsie]

1 hour ago, _ENO_ said:

(Enter your rant here)

 

/rant.

heck ya I'll enter my rant... 20-4 yesterday... here is today...I think I have taken crazy pills....there is absolutely no rigging of MM whatsoever!

 

 

[Sweetsie]

1 hour ago, Kevs02Accord said:

Despite the common misconception that a high WR CV vs a lower WR CV means the match is forfeit we pulled a win, quite easily, in just such a case. Our CV did his best, didn't give up, the team played well and together, thats what is actually important.

Said Croatia.

[Canadatron]

1 hour ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

It means nothing in isolation. There's no way to tell on the basis of the information provided here that the player with less than 10 battles isn't a unicum with a 90% win rate in carriers overall, who's going to roll the 75% unicum into the dust and spit on their grave.

Yeah, cause that's usually how it plays out.

[Helstrem]

1 hour ago, _ENO_ said:

True. Didn't play out that way.

Turns out he was a reroll. 

Rerolls are one reason matchmaker using games played, or games played in ship type, as a metric is not going to work.  Unicums wanting to squish newbies will simply create new accounts periodically to get back into the low games played group.

[Sweetsie]

9 minutes ago, ausanimal said:

It is the same are you telling me someone that's had less then 10 battles in a Yamato will do as well as someone that has had 300 battles in one i would put my money one the one that has had 300 battles in it to play better, that's all the OP showed was that it was someone new to Midway even though they found out later it was a reroll. So if people are happy to post every time they come across a CV with less then 10 battles lets make it fair ground and do it to all ship TYPES, if you get it to a match and you find out that person is new to that tier and they just got a brand new shiny ship and have less then 10 battles in that ship screen shot it and post it lets see how many people will do it or do they just want to hide and only post when it's a CV?

I think the point here is that this matchup shouldn't simply happen. Its why so many of us don't play cv, the more I think about this example the more of a perfect example it becomes.

I am not good at CV's but I like them, co-op is so short when you bring a cv its very hard to get real game strategy experience. You bring a new CV to a game like this, you get waxed, every hates, you lose and you question whether to play cv any more....

It's why good CV players have a ridiculously higher wr in CV's than they do in regular ships and bad cv players wr's are lower than their regular ships. This matchup cannot happen.

[megadeux]

2 minutes ago, Sweetsie said:

I think the point here is that this matchup shouldn't simply happen. Its why so many of us don't play cv, the more I think about this example the more of a perfect example it becomes.

I am not good at CV's but I like them, co-op is so short when you bring a cv its very hard to get real game strategy experience. You bring a new CV to a game like this, you get waxed, every hates, you lose and you question whether to play cv any more....

It's why good CV players have a ridiculously higher wr in CV's than they do in regular ships and bad cv players wr's are lower than their regular ships. This matchup cannot happen.

When I learned CVs I did it by trial and error at tier IV and V. Those tiers were perfect because of low AA load and only one fighter squad. Now those options are gone, and people have to learn at the exponentially harder tier VI and VII. If you have co-op experience though, you should be able to do well at tier VI, because of the single fighter squad and (relatively) low AA load. 

I club EU with my ryujo (I have mates over there who play low tiers, I prefer high tiers, so it's not for the sake of clubbing) And because of the fact that there's only one fighter squad to get around, it's much harder to shut down the enemy CV. If I were you I'd grab indepence, or ryujo if you want a challenge, and learn there. You don't really have to learn fighter v fighter because it's so easy to get around, but you can definitely learn without the stress.

[ausanimal]

12 minutes ago, Sweetsie said:

I think the point here is that this matchup shouldn't simply happen. Its why so many of us don't play cv, the more I think about this example the more of a perfect example it becomes.

I am not good at CV's but I like them, co-op is so short when you bring a cv its very hard to get real game strategy experience. You bring a new CV to a game like this, you get waxed, every hates, you lose and you question whether to play cv any more....

It's why good CV players have a ridiculously higher wr in CV's than they do in regular ships and bad cv players wr's are lower than their regular ships. This matchup cannot happen.

And what you want that CV player to sit there in queue for hours till someone else comes along with a CV with less then 10 battles to make it a fair match for the CV players yep that sounds like a great idea i think i'll have a sleep while i wait and when i wake up i'll still be in the queue. Every player, ship type, tier has the same problem someone will bring a new ship they just got with no battles in it or a few let's make them wait till they have someone with the same amount off battles to make it a even match for those two ships.

It's part of moving up the line you learn how to use the ship type you picked be it DD, BB or CV. By tier 10 CV players should have a good understanding on how to play CV from strafe, manual drops, positioning of your CV, targets to strike or avoid, where to send your planes and how to compete with the other CV you might lose to the other CV  and 1 CV will always lose in a match. With all the experience you gained as you worked up the line to get to tier 10 it should be enough to be able to handle yourself and help the team as much as you can from damage, AA cover and spotting.

[Sweetsie]

28 minutes ago, megadeux said:

When I learned CVs I did it by trial and error at tier IV and V. Those tiers were perfect because of low AA load and only one fighter squad. Now those options are gone, and people have to learn at the exponentially harder tier VI and VII. If you have co-op experience though, you should be able to do well at tier VI, because of the single fighter squad and (relatively) low AA load. 

I club EU with my ryujo (I have mates over there who play low tiers, I prefer high tiers, so it's not for the sake of clubbing) And because of the fact that there's only one fighter squad to get around, it's much harder to shut down the enemy CV. If I were you I'd grab indepence, or ryujo if you want a challenge, and learn there. You don't really have to learn fighter v fighter because it's so easy to get around, but you can definitely learn without the stress.

I went from the protection of t4-5 and played 3 games at tier 6. My first two games I was bottom tier playing against tier 8 ships getting waxed, the third game was against a full blown 19pt captain playing as AS.. he waxed me and gloated in chat. I know what I want my planes to do, just as you do, but I lack the decision making ability or click skills to time my strafes and manual drops effectively, many times by messing up, my planes circle around and get shot down. No, I am not a quitter after such few games...… but I also hate the idea of screwing my team over by being so bad.

[_Lord_Scott_]

I'm going to Sync Drop with myself and screw around with everyones WR.

That's what I see in the OP

[Sweetsie]

3 minutes ago, ausanimal said:

And what you want that CV player to sit there in queue for hours till someone else comes along with a CV with less then 10 battles to make it a fair match for the CV players yep that sounds like a great idea i think i'll have a sleep while i wait and when i wake up i'll still be in the queue. Every player, ship type, tier has the same problem someone will bring a new ship they just got with no battles in it or a few let's make them wait till they have someone with the same amount off battles to make it a even match for those two ships.

It's part of moving up the line you learn how to use the ship type you picked be it DD, BB or CV. By tier 10 CV players should have a good understanding on how to play CV from strafe, manual drops, positioning of your CV, targets to strike or avoid, where to send your planes and how to compete with the other CV you might lose to the other CV  and 1 CV will always lose in a match. With all the experience you gained as you worked up the line to get to tier 10 it should be enough to be able to handle yourself and help the team as much as you can from damage, AA cover and spotting.

Perfect, thank you. I only read your opening ten words.... If their is a skill based MM system their will be tenfold the CV players. Learning against other crappers is fun...and even. Learning against 75% players is the reason there are so few CV players....

 

[TwoLate51]

[Sweetsie]

6 minutes ago, ausanimal said:

And what you want that CV player to sit there in queue for hours till someone else comes along with a CV with less then 10 battles to make it a fair match for the CV players yep that sounds like a great idea i think i'll have a sleep while i wait and when i wake up i'll still be in the queue. Every player, ship type, tier has the same problem someone will bring a new ship they just got with no battles in it or a few let's make them wait till they have someone with the same amount off battles to make it a even match for those two ships.

It's part of moving up the line you learn how to use the ship type you picked be it DD, BB or CV. By tier 10 CV players should have a good understanding on how to play CV from strafe, manual drops, positioning of your CV, targets to strike or avoid, where to send your planes and how to compete with the other CV you might lose to the other CV  and 1 CV will always lose in a match. With all the experience you gained as you worked up the line to get to tier 10 it should be enough to be able to handle yourself and help the team as much as you can from damage, AA cover and spotting.

I read the remainder of your post...I understand your point but I will explain why it isn't the same... we all know two things concerning ships.... don't show broadside and when to use AP or HE....sure there is more to it, but in theory all ships use those functions. A CV is totally unique and different game style.  the game is very much like chess, occupy territory, move pieces.....Having a queen that is overpowered vs one that doesn't how to play their queen...

 

Look, if it was as "easy" as grinding there would be no 75% cv players and not 1000's of 35% cv players. Good players feast on scrubs. that doesn't happen (to such a degree) with a any ships. find a great cv player look at hiw WR and then his other ships wr….why such a big difference?

[ausanimal]

1 minute ago, Sweetsie said:

Perfect, thank you. I only read your opening ten words.... If their is a skill based MM system their will be tenfold the CV players. Learning against other crappers is fun...and even. Learning against 75% players is the reason there are so few CV players....

you left out the part that it go's for all other ships to if your BB is fresh of the line you will be waiting till another BB of the same tier with no matches comes along before you join a match, i think it will be a long wait for a lot of people and put them off them game if they have to wait hours to take there ship into battle. But if your happy to wait that long so the ship your playing is matched even go for it, i can see it now all the players getting their first tier 10 ship just to sit in queue for ages because people wanted even matchmaking and they can't take their BB, cruiser or DD into battle because there is no one else with a new tier 10 ship at that time.

So thank you for wanting to make players wait ages to get into a battle because you want a even and easy match and no competition from more experienced players.