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Avrova1904

A recurrent nightmare with japanese destroyers

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It happens to me several times but now that I get Fubuki is even worse, obviously is my fault. When I go to cap I am spotted by another destroyer and I last seconds alive because everybody is firing at me. I could overcome this with Mutsuki, Minekaze and Kamikaze because my captains have concealment skill and I can spot other destroyers before they spot me but with Fubuki my detection range is 7.0 km and I feel unable to cap anything. What can I do?

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The way you play is dictated by your ship's abilities. With larger concealment you need to be more cautious and avoid putting yourself in risky situations.

Fubuki is slow and the guns while decent cannot turn fast enough to engage in a gun fight 1v1 over a cap. So initially you want to sit further away from the cap and closer to your cruisers. That way if you do get focused you will have back up readily available.  In that position you can still spot for them, and take an undefended cap.   Look to cap mid game as you will have a far better idea of where the enemy ships are. Don't feel goaded into fighting over a cap, you are at a disadvantage so leave it and come back later on.

The single biggest thing you can do to improve your play is to Use your mini map to get as much information as possible about the disposition of the enemy forces. 

There are lots of good youtube vids about destroyer play so take some time to see how others go about it. I've picked up quite a lot from watching them.           Notser, Flamu & Destroyer Kuroshiokai  is a good place to start.

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Thank you, this is a great advice. The only problem is those players complaining that you are not able even to cap anything, you are a terrible player, etc... but what can I do if nobody is pushing? suicide myself? I would like to push if I am with other destroyers and cruisers. I am feed up stupid people (because I can't put insults here).

Edited: And I think that this game if plenty of haters.

Edited by Avrova1904

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Just ignore people who tell you what to do when it is bad advice. There is nothing you can do if you are sunk.

Knowing when to push requires experience, the basis for this is good intel which is why using the mini map is so critical. You can take risks but they need to be calculated risks. The stealth ships/radar cruisers wont always be on the minimap but by looking at who has been spotted and where they are you can judge what the risks are for any given action.

You will also get a good idea where radar cruisers are likely to go on each map and can use that to your advantage. For example if there is a large island close to cap on their side they are likely to sit behind it and use their radar when the cap starts to be captured. Knowing this you can approach the cap from an angle that prevents them being able to directly fire on you eliminating one of your threats. 

There are lots of little tricks you can use the only downside to this is it takes time/experience to learn them.

One point I would make is to think about moving a 10 point commander from one of your other ships as CE is huge advantage. A couple of dollars worth of doubloons to retrain him may be a wise investment towards your enjoyment of the ship.  

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You best train up your captain for concealment. I personally don't play any of my ships with-out having the concealment now it's even harder with all those radar ships floating around 

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3 hours ago, Avrova1904 said:

Thank you, this is a great advice. The only problem is those players complaining that you are not able even to cap anything, you are a terrible player, etc... but what can I do if nobody is pushing? suicide myself? I would like to push if I am with other destroyers and cruisers. I am feed up stupid people (because I can't put insults here).

Edited: And I think that this game if plenty of haters.

Ignore them, they don't have the guts to play DD and they should apologize after your team wins the game. If you know your ranges, you can still spot and cap btw even if it takes 2-3 passes.

 

58 minutes ago, KURT_WOLFF said:

You best train up your captain for concealment. I personally don't play any of my ships with-out having the concealment now it's even harder with all those radar ships floating around 

Any DD should have concealment as soon as you reach 10 pts, then maybe you can cap more effectively :)

 

Edited by Commander_367

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To hear DD players whine about radar is pretty funny. Why not demand top speed for BBs be dropped to 5 knots with a 30 km turn radius ? 

 

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Along with getting concealment expert part of becoming proficient with IJN DDs is knowing your opponents.  Learn what the concealment of opposing DDs is, watch the minimap like others have said so you can predict what you might run into and proceed accordingly. (you know you can out-spot a Russian DD, but a hidden Haida can be deadly)

Secondly, know how to use your stealth.  Don't go nose first into caps unless you know for absolute certain you will be the only DD there because if you get spotted making a full 180 degree turn is a long time during which you can take damage; come in at an angle and skim the edge of it so if you are lit you simply have to make a hard 90º turn and you're already on your way out and can go dark that much faster.  If necessary you can do this and overshoot the cap, and reverse in so you're already facing out; it takes slightly more time but leaves you in a position where you're present a smaller profile if you do get lit.  Once you have CE you should be able to out-spot a good deal of other DDs which will give you precious seconds to react.  Also, generally speaking IJN guns aren't great (at least close in) and firing them causes your detection to bloom out to their max range for 20 seconds, so sometimes it's better to simply run away rather than try and get a few licks of damage in.  You can even use this fact to your advantage if you can bait an enemy DD to shoot at you, slip back into stealth and let your team pound on them for that 20 seconds when their detection is maxed out. (taking a hit or two in trade for killing or rendering an enemy DD combat ineffective is a decent trade in my book)

As you get higher you'll also start to see more radar (some tier7 USN cruisers and all tier8+ USN and Russians).  Learn how large a radius and how long these ships' radar lasts, and and unless you know for sure generally assume their radar is ready to go at the worst possible time for you.  Also take note that radar works thru islands so a cruiser camping next to an objective can light you even if you have no way of seeing them, so try to remember common positions radar cruisers camp and where they were last seen on the minimap and plan accordingly. (people love parking behind an island adjacent to a cap then radaring as soon as the cap becomes contested)

Lastly Radio Position Finding is a viable (some would say necessary) skill for IJN DDs when you reach 14 points.  Instead of using it to hunt down hidden DDs you can use it to try and determine where potential predators are lurking and either work around them or try and set them up for your team to kill if possible.

That's all I can think of at the moment.  Some of this other have said, and a lot will come from experience.  Overall IJN DDs can be rough but always remember a live DD is worth a lot at the end of the game so try to maximize your survival.  People might rage in chat on what they think you should be doing, but a majority of pubbies as dumb as crapand don't even know how to play their own ships properly so do what you gotta do to stay afloat so you can have an impact on the game when it's most important.

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7 hours ago, Louiebuck said:

To hear DD players whine about radar is pretty funny. Why not demand top speed for BBs be dropped to 5 knots with a 30 km turn radius ? 

 

There is no whining about radar in this thread, perhaps read the posts before you try trolling clown

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There are a great great many players with vapor for brains who think it's a funny thing to tell the DD player "oh yea, I got your back" while having no intention other then to leave you unsupported.  I have learned the hard way to look at the mini map and see what my team mates are and are not doing, and adjusting my actions accordingly.   From this point forward your going to have to get much much more cagey about getting stuck in.  There's more Radar ships about, and CV's have made a bit of a come back recently.  DO NOT let team mates pressure you EVER.  Your in the most fragile class of ship, and some out there will happily toss you to the sea wolves so they don't have to compete with you..  Because to too many of them team mates are the competition, not the opposing team.

Peep that chase stat kudo's instead of victory...  You learn to really hate playing with 'em

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On ‎7‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 4:55 PM, TL_Warlord_Roff said:

 I have learned the hard way to look at the mini map and see what my team mates are and are not doing, and adjusting my actions accordingly. 

This. This is very important. I used to go try to cap a flag, only to be lit up, and sunk, without any support. Now, I will only cap on my own when I know there are no enemy DDs nearby. What DedPan said is very good, also. I try to use my smoke on the way out of a cap, not on the way in. That way, it covers my escape, while still giving cover to my friendlies in the area.

I play Akatsuki almost exclusively. I think it's the best DD in the game, for me.

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On 7/15/2018 at 1:50 PM, DedPan said:

Lastly Radio Position Finding is a viable (some would say necessary) skill for IJN DDs when you reach 14 points. 

While I agree, it can be a loooooong grind to that 14pt captain to have BOTH CE and RPF. If you keep your ships, then you start the grind all over with the Akatsuki, then Kagero, then ...

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Just a lil hint to those working the commander grind..  The most difficult 19 point commander to get is the first one.

One you get 'em put them in a ship, preferably premium if you have one (for you IJN skippers any tier 4 to 8 IJN premium will do!) And then just go play that commander exclusively.  His job is to earn elite commander XP... Any other ship either premium or standard with premium cammo that also add to commander XP  are your "Trainers"

A couple things to keep in mind.. it only take 190,000 ECXP to respec a 19 point commander... for a commander your going to  reassign to a non premium ship  save the 500 doubloons.  100,000k in silver to accelerate training + what ever needed combo of ECXP and FeXP to finish it up and you'll be golden.  

 

I counted my CO's up yesterday.   I have 4, 19 point commanders and very close to having 3 more (on at 18, one at 17, and one at 16).  I almost don't pay attention to them that much anymore.   My most played ships Harakaze, Kagero, Akizuki, and Yugumo all have a 19 pointer assigned so first thing I do each day is go play the ships I love to play the most anyway and knock out anywhere from 8k to whatever I can cap out with, w/signals which with a little skill and a little luck can be a very very great amount. On a related note,  I had a day last month I pulled nearly an 80% W/L for the day and banged our well over 140k ECXP..also ran my [edited]dry of signals!  Oh well, that's what they're for!  If a such a fancy smancy spud as I can bang it out, so can you!

I also know to many players who have totally lost track of how many maxed out CO's they have.  They got the warships bug baaaaaaaad!

For those working to that first 19 pointer, all I can say is play it smart, work the one in the ship your best at, and keep working them..  Switching commander about between ships all the time is often NOT as needed as folks think, and it can chew up resources fast.  The commander just augments what you can do, so keep your focus on building your skills.. and it's ok to specialize, but do have a basic understanding of what other ship around you can do, and how they operate. Every thing you know and put to use will speed up the grind.

 

Warlord sends

Edited by TL_Warlord_Roff

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On 7/15/2018 at 3:42 AM, Avrova1904 said:

It happens to me several times but now that I get Fubuki is even worse, obviously is my fault. When I go to cap I am spotted by another destroyer and I last seconds alive because everybody is firing at me. I could overcome this with Mutsuki, Minekaze and Kamikaze because my captains have concealment skill and I can spot other destroyers before they spot me but with Fubuki my detection range is 7.0 km and I feel unable to cap anything. What can I do?

First off, I hate being spotted, that's why I like the Kamikaze (5.4 km detection) and the Shimakaze (5.6 km detection).

When your spotted, you give up options.

That being said, this is what I would do.

Make sure your running camo and the most effective one at that.

Head to the cap and sail just inside the broader at 1/4 or 1/2 speed. Do not go to the center and have an escape route in mind. 

If your spotted without seeing anyone, pop smoke, fling random torpedos and speed boost the hell out of there. If you have RLF even better, you have a rough idea where to fling torpedos.

Expect torpedos coming through your smoke cloud.

If you get illuminated by radar, well that suck, but you can escape by dodging incoming fire by wiggling just right.

If you see a radar ship coming your way within 9 km, bail and come back later.

Good luck.

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On 7/15/2018 at 6:42 AM, Avrova1904 said:

It happens to me several times but now that I get Fubuki is even worse, obviously is my fault. When I go to cap I am spotted by another destroyer and I last seconds alive because everybody is firing at me. I could overcome this with Mutsuki, Minekaze and Kamikaze because my captains have concealment skill and I can spot other destroyers before they spot me but with Fubuki my detection range is 7.0 km and I feel unable to cap anything. What can I do?

When I was grinding that line, I had two ARP captains that had come with 10 skill points. Until I was able to get them to 19, I limited myself to two active ships that I played. They are now at 19 on my Yugumo and my Shimakaze. I have used the Elite Cmdr xp to get some other IJN captains to 10 (with help from an HSF captain and a certain cat) so I will have some additional  what I consider usable IJN DD's.

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Thank you for your advice. When do you use HE in japanese destroyers? Usually if I want to help someone versus another destroyer and I use HE it ends bad or I end severely damaged, seriously, japanese destroyers are shells magnets, everybody are shooting at me.

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On 7/15/2018 at 10:12 AM, KURT_WOLFF said:

You best train up your captain for concealment. I personally don't play any of my ships with-out having the concealment now it's even harder with all those radar ships floating around 

While I take this advice and regularly print 14-16 point captains for ships, new players cant do this.

For those players I recomend this:

1.  Stack up as many XP and commander XP flags, camos etc as possible to lessen your grind to 10 points.

2.  Get your dailies on the ships you are grinding.  Not doing so leaves XP on the table.

3.  Tactics wise try to use a DD that is more sneaky than you and back them up.  If that is not possible try to use terrain to mask your approach to caps etc. 

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On 7/15/2018 at 4:55 PM, TL_Warlord_Roff said:

There are a great great many players with vapor for brains who think it's a funny thing to tell the DD player "oh yea, I got your back" while having no intention other then to leave you unsupported.  I have learned the hard way to look at the mini map and see what my team mates are and are not doing, and adjusting my actions accordingly.   From this point forward your going to have to get much much more cagey about getting stuck in.  There's more Radar ships about, and CV's have made a bit of a come back recently.  DO NOT let team mates pressure you EVER.  Your in the most fragile class of ship, and some out there will happily toss you to the sea wolves so they don't have to compete with you..  Because to too many of them team mates are the competition, not the opposing team.

Peep that chase stat kudo's instead of victory...  You learn to really hate playing with 'em

That is a sad fact of the game isnt it? So revealing...... I have been too innocent to realize such a thing. Some people really don't care about the rest of the team do they? I have been known to sacrifice myself for the benefit of others, such as smoking and escorting troubled carriers, push with dds in my cruisers to keep them safe, and even loiter to provide AA to the fleet. When called to help out I should realize that those people may not have my best interest in their hearts.

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It is a sad fact and I've seen so often over the last three years.  I don't even think about it anymore.   And I am deeply grateful when I do see ships behind me not hiding behind rocks but out where they can shoot what I spot for them.  

You can't win if you don't fight, and the sooner you start with the fighting the sooner you can generate an advantage for your team and win.   

As an old surfer friend of mine once said.."There's no substitute for intensity"

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