Jump to content
You need to play a total of 5 battles to post in this section.
beliy_demon

DD XP distribution... feels bad man...

65 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

401
[SIDE]
Members
1,440 posts

DD get no love. Take 4,123.

Be nice if spotting and area denials got massive XP boosts.

Edited by thebigblue
  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
315
[DIEBL]
Members
1,413 posts
14,647 battles
22 minutes ago, thebigblue said:

DD get no love. Take 4,123.

Be nice if spotting and area denials got massive XP boosts.

Why so DD become more irrelevant and boring??

  • Cool 1
  • Boring 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
508
[LOU1]
Members
3,063 posts
8,155 battles

i usually get a lot from capping and defense.  It looks like most of the damage was from small percentages of BB HP, which doesn't earn very much XP.  And over half the damage was done to lower tier ships.  Takes a bunch of capping/defense to to really earn the big numbers.  What ship(s) got the other 2/3 of the capping points?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
508
[LOU1]
Members
3,063 posts
8,155 battles
28 minutes ago, thebigblue said:

DD get no love. Take 4,123.

Be nice if spotting and area denials got massive XP boosts.

It can be frustrating to successfully drive ships away from caps through an entire battle, making it difficult to actually complete a cap yourself and then get hardly any XP on the win.

Edited by ExploratorOne
  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
855
[SBS]
Members
2,485 posts
2,253 battles

The middle graph shows the average XP for T10 by ship type.

On 6/12/2018 at 10:07 PM, saber1979 said:

Here are some average battle stats for tier 10 per class. As expected dds are on the bottom and have been for a long time.

AverageDamagePerBattlePerClass.thumb.png.ffd2672b1568ecdcc7b947bb32486734.png

AverageXpPerBattlePerClass.thumb.png.0210d40c02c14fbc247486859145e730.png

AverageKillsPerBattlePerClass.thumb.png.d306e4ae2c908d291e55ba9c27557584.png

  • Cool 1
  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,325
[CUTE]
Members
5,202 posts
3,461 battles
21 minutes ago, Slimeball91 said:

The middle graph shows the average XP for T10 by ship type.

 

You can see where Wargaming did their XP reshuffle in the Fall of 2016 pretty darn clear in those graphs. That's always amazed me, what a dropoff. You would think average XP would be a lot closer between the classes considering that it would be easier to balance ships through rewards than combat efficiency.

Edited by Canadatron

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
787
[DUDE_]
Members
2,604 posts
12,503 battles
9 hours ago, beliy_demon said:

Screenshots say it all...

 

2018-07-13.thumb.png.de24d54c42d6d45cfef59860455d33cd.png5b4970c226ff9_2018-07-13(1).thumb.png.25605d3a0e245d0514d299e25c7c1fa5.png

what are you complaining about? your only good damage was on the gearing, the rest was farming big ships which pays less and there wasn't that much damage done. You got 1700 base xp… Did you cap did you get any defender badges?

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
372
[P2W]
[P2W]
Members
1,240 posts

Capping and spotting don't pay crap. If you want XP you MUST do craploads of damage, and the most reward from that comes from killing other DDs. Their reward models are [edited]broken.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,521
[-K-]
[-K-]
Members
3,112 posts
12,671 battles
21 minutes ago, Sweetsie said:

what are you complaining about? your only good damage was on the gearing, the rest was farming big ships which pays less and there wasn't that much damage done. You got 1700 base xp… Did you cap did you get any defender badges?

He's complaining that the 217k spotting damage he got wasn't worth jack, which is a pretty common -- and IMO legitimate -- complaint. Likewise the tanking >1m potential damage, though it sort of depends what that came from.

Edited by Edgecase
  • Cool 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
787
[DUDE_]
Members
2,604 posts
12,503 battles
13 minutes ago, Edgecase said:

He's complaining that the 217k spotting damage he got wasn't worth jack, which is a pretty common -- and IMO legitimate -- complaint. Likewise the tanking >1m potential damage, though it sort of depends what that came from.

1700 base xp isn't bad. many a tier ten game goes by and the top place finisher may not even hit that threshold and or surpass it by much. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,592
[PSP]
Members
6,325 posts
8,942 battles
2 hours ago, w4spl3g said:

Capping and spotting don't pay crap. If you want XP you MUST do craploads of damage, and the most reward from that comes from killing other DDs. Their reward models are [edited]broken.

Actually, capping (especially solo capping) gives large amounts of XP. I can cap two caps and do a minor amount of damage and come in near the top of my team in the Gearing, with positive credits too. Conversely, last match, I did  65k of damage without capping and lost 11,000 credits.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
50
[BOATC]
Members
185 posts
3,247 battles
2 hours ago, Sweetsie said:

1700 base xp isn't bad. many a tier ten game goes by and the top place finisher may not even hit that threshold and or surpass it by much. 

217k spotting damage is incredible. That's over 2 tier 10 BBs worth of damage done solely because of where he put his ship. As far as I can tell spotting damage isn't rewarded in any way which is awful. He absolutely should have been top of his team. They wouldn't have gotten the kills without the spotting.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
787
[DUDE_]
Members
2,604 posts
12,503 battles
2 minutes ago, tenfingerstentoes said:

217k spotting damage is incredible. That's over 2 tier 10 BBs worth of damage done solely because of where he put his ship. As far as I can tell spotting damage isn't rewarded in any way which is awful. He absolutely should have been top of his team. They wouldn't have gotten the kills without the spotting.

got me curious, so I checked my stats, one game I had 260k spotting in my shima.

Keep in mind afks can shoot down planes, hit with secondary's and spot bad guys.... 217k and 1700 base xp with minimal damage.... he prob shouldn't have got as much xp as he did.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
414
[2CUTE]
Beta Testers, In AlfaTesters
2,265 posts
3,852 battles
12 hours ago, GuntherPrein said:

Why so DD become more irrelevant and boring??

in an age where radar cruisers are taking over vision control, having a good DD spotting for your team is a godsend. I'll happily provide spotting damage if I'm on a flank with a team that uses that information. 

  • Cool 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
593
[WOLF6]
Members
1,874 posts
4,935 battles
16 minutes ago, Sledgehammer427 said:

in an age where radar cruisers are taking over vision control, having a good DD spotting for your team is a godsend. I'll happily provide spotting damage if I'm on a flank with a team that uses that information. 

This ^

radar is fekkerd. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
855
[SBS]
Members
2,485 posts
2,253 battles
19 minutes ago, Sweetsie said:

217k and 1700 base xp with minimal damage.... he prob shouldn't have got as much xp as he did.

You're sort of proving his point.  He did over 67K in damage, that's well above the average.  He also got 83/239 of the capping points, and 217K spotting.  How much more can you expect a DD to do?  Your post shows you don't have any realistic understanding of situation of DD play for the average player. 

  • Cool 4
  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
787
[DUDE_]
Members
2,604 posts
12,503 battles
10 minutes ago, Slimeball91 said:

You're sort of proving his point.  He did over 67K in damage, that's well above the average.  He also got 83/239 of the capping points, and 217K spotting.  How much more can you expect a DD to do?  Your post shows you don't have any realistic understanding of situation of DD play for the average player. 

you are probably right. I hate to think that my 4000 games of dd alone have been a waste of time. Thank you for the education, I feel I am a better player now because of you.

  • Funny 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,241
[WOLF3]
Members
6,478 posts
2,422 battles
4 hours ago, Edgecase said:

He's complaining that the 217k spotting damage he got wasn't worth jack, which is a pretty common -- and IMO legitimate -- complaint.

While most DD whining is just that, I have to agree here.  If there are spotting rewards they are minuscule.  They should be better.

As for the graphs, no surprises.  They show that DD XP rewards track damage done. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
787
[DUDE_]
Members
2,604 posts
12,503 battles
20 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

While most DD whining is just that, I have to agree here.  If there are spotting rewards they are minuscule.  They should be better.

As for the graphs, no surprises.  They show that DD XP rewards track damage done. 

been thinking about this....A dd could simply do no damage and spot the entire game.... just know the limits of the radars and enemy ships detections..... never put yourself in harms way. what is that worth.... granted it can easily win a game...but...other ships take risks by firing their guns with worse detections... still cant justify crediting a player with more xp than this one received. But it is interesting.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
436
[CAST]
Members
1,428 posts
5,978 battles
1 minute ago, Sweetsie said:

been thinking about this....A dd could simply do no damage and spot the entire game.... just know the limits of the radars and enemy ships detections..... never put yourself in harms way. what is that worth.... granted it can easily win a game...but...other ships take risks by firing their guns with worse detections... still cant justify crediting a player with more xp than this one received. But it is interesting.

It is literally impossible for a high tier destroyer to both spot and "never put [itself] in harms way."  Maybe in a battle on Ocean where that DD enjoys a significant spotting advantage over all enemy DDs, but even then it's going to take a good deal of skill in terms of keeping track of where all enemy ships are, particularly those with radar.  Plus the only way it's really going to happen is if the opposing team only has a Kiev/Tashkent/Khabarovsk as its DD and does not have any Russian radar cruisers...a lot of required factors combined with a map that very rarely comes up anyway.

2 hours ago, Snargfargle said:

Actually, capping (especially solo capping) gives large amounts of XP. I can cap two caps and do a minor amount of damage and come in near the top of my team in the Gearing, with positive credits too. Conversely, last match, I did  65k of damage without capping and lost 11,000 credits.

 

5b1c608672bd6_Screenshot(394).thumb.png.2dbebe921cc15d4cc48bf1d66d503dd1.png

I didn't cap the XP screen as it wasn't part of the point I was trying to make after this battle, but I lost 10k credits and it was a win; without premium time I would've lost 91k.  That's 169 of my team's 180 capping points, i.e., 3 "solo" caps, to go along with very respectable damage totals (both personal and spotting).  By my calculations I had 1598 base XP in the match, which is a solid total but probably not an accurate indicator on how much my play influenced the win.

I saw another viewer make the point during a Twitch stream last night that this might be intentional on WarGaming's part--by throwing so many consumables on high tier ships now, which of course "have" to be premium, they are making it a near requirement to run premium time and/or pay for premium camouflage on tier 10 ships in order to come out ahead on credits even after fairly good battles.  Which is their prerogative to do, but it also somewhat spoils all of the other efforts they've made to keep Warships a truly "free to play" title.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,241
[WOLF3]
Members
6,478 posts
2,422 battles
12 minutes ago, Sweetsie said:

been thinking about this...

It's an issue worth discussing.

Concealment management is a definite skill (one I am trying to learn) and spotting has very real value to the team.  Historically it's one of the DDs primary roles with the fleet.  Should a pure spotting game be rewarded as much as a high-damage game?  No.  In the latter case the ship is acting directly to defeat the enemy, while in the former it is supporting those that do. 

Capt. Hughes' maxim in Fleet Tactics (paraphrased a bit):  "Find the enemy (i.e. the point of decision) through scouting, then concentrate sufficient firepower at the point of decision."

While we're not doing coordinated "fleet actions", the need for intel doesn't change.  If I can get a good picture of the enemy's deployment, I as an individual ship can spot the points of opportunity and the traps.  In some cases, a spotting DD may be more valuable than a torping DD.  (The two aren't mutually exclusive.)

In any case, the spotting DD should be rewarded enough and explicitly so as to promote the spotting function.

 

DDs also have a defensive role.  I wonder how that could be rewarded?

 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
787
[DUDE_]
Members
2,604 posts
12,503 battles
3 minutes ago, Harv72b said:

It is literally impossible for a high tier destroyer to both spot and "never put [itself] in harms way."  Maybe in a battle on Ocean where that DD enjoys a significant spotting advantage over all enemy DDs, but even then it's going to take a good deal of skill in terms of keeping track of where all enemy ships are, particularly those with radar.  Plus the only way it's really going to happen is if the opposing team only has a Kiev/Tashkent/Khabarovsk as its DD and does not have any Russian radar cruisers...a lot of required factors combined with a map that very rarely comes up anyway.

5b1c608672bd6_Screenshot(394).thumb.png.2dbebe921cc15d4cc48bf1d66d503dd1.png

I didn't cap the XP screen as it wasn't part of the point I was trying to make after this battle, but I lost 10k credits and it was a win; without premium time I would've lost 91k.  That's 169 of my team's 180 capping points, i.e., 3 "solo" caps, to go along with very respectable damage totals (both personal and spotting).  By my calculations I had 1598 base XP in the match, which is a solid total but probably not an accurate indicator on how much my play influenced the win.

I saw another viewer make the point during a Twitch stream last night that this might be intentional on WarGaming's part--by throwing so many consumables on high tier ships now, which of course "have" to be premium, they are making it a near requirement to run premium time and/or pay for premium camouflage on tier 10 ships in order to come out ahead on credits even after fairly good battles.  Which is their prerogative to do, but it also somewhat spoils all of the other efforts they've made to keep Warships a truly "free to play" title.

Interesting points you make, as to the dd spotting only...its could actually be pretty easy to do, just know the number of dds and use smoke to escape, don't get close enough to islands to get radared.... but it could be done.

the second point is clear cut, WG does an excellent job of creating a scenario for one to crack his wallet...and once that happens, the floodgates open. Every "free" offer in the world is designed to get you to come back and spend money at some point. Even those that never spend a dime contribute to this game, every football team needs tackling dummies to fill the practice field.....without live bodies to fill the ranks,,,,I doubt the game survives.... their time is WG's money.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,241
[WOLF3]
Members
6,478 posts
2,422 battles
1 minute ago, Sweetsie said:

.without live bodies to fill the ranks,,,,I doubt the game survives.... their time is WG's money.

A win-win situation.  :cap_win:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
436
[CAST]
Members
1,428 posts
5,978 battles
1 minute ago, Sweetsie said:

Interesting points you make, as to the dd spotting only...its could actually be pretty easy to do, just know the number of dds and use smoke to escape, don't get close enough to islands to get radared.... but it could be done.

Both of the things you mention negate the ability to spot effectively. :Smile-_tongue:

I main destroyers and I've played a good deal of T10 battles of late, after the radar boom.  I'm not one of those people who think radar "ruins the game"--it's very much possible to be effective as a DD even in radar-heavy battles, it just requires some different skill sets vs. the old fashioned ninja method.  But for all but the most skilled DD players (a category I do not fall under :Smile_teethhappy:), it truly is all but impossible to consistently spot for their team without risking (and often losing) their ship, at least at these tiers--any time you approach closely enough to spot a radar cruiser (for example), you run the risk of being counter-spotted by another unknown enemy ship or aircraft.  And in the case of a ship like Chapayev or Yueyang, any time you spot them at all you are by definition inside their radar range.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×