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Stormie1126

Today's facepalms....

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Apparently Matchmaker RNGesus hates me again after 3 days of giving me REALLY good teams...seen a lotta cruisers literally just FLEEING at the first sight of an enemy today-I mean just full on turning tail and running for map edges/the start point without firing a shot.:Smile_facepalm:

But two instances unrelated to Cruiser terror were just so absurd I had to laugh, and share.

First one, as soon as match starts, one of our T5 DD skippers says it's his first time in a DD. Mmkay, fair enough, we all gotta start somewhere...though maybe not jump in at T5. But shortly into the match, none of the 3 DDs are capping, and when the rest of the team starts griping, that captain I mentioned repeats it's his first time in that type, and doesn't know what to do with them. I politely tell him (while facepalming to myself, of course) that DDs are spotters and cappers, and torp throwers at any BB silly enough to get close. And then suggest maybe he do some research before jumping into a new ship type in the future. No toxicity in the exchange, I just wonder how someone could be playing long enough to free XP to a T5 DD hasn't picked up what their job is by observation.

Second one, I'm on a team with a Nagato. Team starts trying to coordinate tactics, someone says there's only one DD, and I chime in there's no CV's either, which makes me, a BB captain, very happy. Nagato ends up going "What does CV mean?" and I tell him 'carrier'. "Ok, and what does V stand for?" "...no, that's what CV means. Like BB is battleship and DD is destroyer, CV=carrier." Guy says thank you, and it takes a second to sink in I'm in an upper tier match: "....how did you make it to T7 without learning that?" No response, but the exchange made me worry for the captains abilities...and rightly so, for he promptly gets himself surrounded and sunk.

Methinks WG needs to put a limiter of some kind on buying/Free XPing to upper tiers...I know it'll never happen, but a guy can dream, right? :Smile-_tongue:

Edited by Stormie1126
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Proof that it is eminently possible to fail upwards!

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2 hours ago, Stormie1126 said:

Apparently Matchmaker RNGesus hates me again after 3 days of giving me REALLY good teams...seen a lotta cruisers literally just FLEEING at the first sight of an enemy today-I mean just full on turning tail and running for map edges/the start point without firing a shot.:Smile_facepalm:

But two instances unrelated to Cruiser terror were just so absurd I had to laugh, and share.

First one, as soon as match starts, one of our T5 DD skippers says it's his first time in a DD. Mmkay, fair enough, we all gotta start somewhere...though maybe not jump in at T5. But shortly into the match, none of the 3 DDs are capping, and when the rest of the team starts griping, that captain I mentioned repeats it's his first time in that type, and doesn't know what to do with them. I politely tell him (while facepalming to myself, of course) that DDs are spotters and cappers, and torp throwers at any BB silly enough to get close. And then suggest maybe he do some research before jumping into a new ship type in the future. No toxicity in the exchange, I just wonder how someone could be playing long enough to free XP to a T5 DD hasn't picked up what their job is by observation.

Second one, I'm on a team with a Nagato. Team starts trying to coordinate tactics, someone says there's only one DD, and I chime in there's no CV's either, which makes me, a BB captain, very happy. Nagato ends up going "What does CV mean?" and I tell him 'carrier'. "Ok, and what does V stand for?" "...no, that's what CV means. Like BB is battleship and DD is destroyer, CV=carrier." Guy says thank you, and it takes a second to sink in I'm in an upper tier match: "....how did you make it to T7 without learning that?" No response, but the exchange made me worry for the captains abilities...and rightly so, for he promptly gets himself surrounded and sunk.

Methinks WG needs to put a limiter of some kind on buying/Free XPing to upper tiers...I know it'll never happen, but a guy can dream, right? :Smile-_tongue:

As a some what newish player, I did not know DDs were supposed to be the primary cappers. Just starting to understand the targeting methods of torpedoes and can say that 99 percent of the time I will not hit team mates. Of course if a team mate decides to turn back to 'reengage' is another matter altogether. Sorry my Derzki shot 12 or so torpedoes at the enemy and you decide to get back into the face of the cruiser/battleship that has already stripped you of a good portion of your health. Have not gotten into pvp at all really. So I know I have a lot to learn. Have played WoT and WoT Blitz more than this but have been starting to play more here. Finally, who would be a good person to learn from more about destroyers? I enjoy them insofar and would love to be able to really start to learn the ins and outs of this class of ship. :fish_book:

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i get what you're saying...

 

but just to nitpick.  the V in CV is generally believed to actually mean something.  it means heavier-than-air, or craft that use fixed-wings to generate lift.  i suspect there's also a related reason helo carriers don't have a CV designation and are LPH's or LHD's instead (helo's not being fixed-wing craft and all).  http://www.navweaps.com/index_tech/index_ships_list.php

 

The following is taken from "United States Naval Aviation 1910-1995, Appendix 16: US Navy and Marine Corps Squadron Designations and Abbreviations":

On 17 July 1920, the Secretary of the Navy prescribed a standard nomenclature for types and classes of NAVAL VESSELs, including aircraft, in which lighter-than air craft were identified by the type "Z" and heavier-than air craft by the letter "V". The reference also speculates that: "The use of the "V" designation has been a question since the 1920s. However, no conclusive evidence has been found to identify why the letter "V" was chosen. It is generally believed the "V" was in reference to the French word volplane. As a verb, the word means to glide or soar. As a noun, it described an aeronautical device sustained in the air by lifting devices (wings), as opposed to the bag of gas that the airships (denoted by "Z") used. The same case may be regarding the use of "Z". It is generally believed the "Z" was used in deference to Count Ferdinand von Zeppelin. However, documentation has not been located to verify this assumption."

 

Edited by Shadeylark

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20 minutes ago, kapri25 said:

As a some what newish player, I did not know DDs were supposed to be the primary cappers. Just starting to understand the targeting methods of torpedoes and can say that 99 percent of the time I will not hit team mates. Of course if a team mate decides to turn back to 'reengage' is another matter altogether. Sorry my Derzki shot 12 or so torpedoes at the enemy and you decide to get back into the face of the cruiser/battleship that has already stripped you of a good portion of your health. Have not gotten into pvp at all really. So I know I have a lot to learn. Have played WoT and WoT Blitz more than this but have been starting to play more here. Finally, who would be a good person to learn from more about destroyers? I enjoy them insofar and would love to be able to really start to learn the ins and outs of this class of ship. :fish_book:

so, couple pointers.

 

1) dd's are the primary cappers because stealth becomes more and more important the higher you go.  guns get more and more accurate and hit harder and harder; being able to move around the map and grab objectives without being seen becomes paramount because being seen pretty much guarantees taking massive damage if you can't position correctly... and capping often necessitates positioning oneself badly.  so... the dd's are the primary cappers because they can often afford to be badly angled in a cap circle because they can often be in a cap circle undetected (and therefore not be shot at).  radar proliferation tends to make this more of a risky proposition starting at t7, but imo and contrary to the whiners and dd-mafia on the forum, its not as big a problem as its made out to be; it just delays capping for good players and ruins bad player's days (which i don't find to be anything but a good thing)

2) you're always gonna have to watch your torps.  its generally accepted that your torps are your responsibility from the moment you launch them till they hit something or run out of steam.  doesn't matter what the other guy does, those remain your torps.  you need to develop the situational awareness to ensure that your torps go into reds, not greens, because where your torps go is always your responsibility.

3) russian dd's aren't known for their torps anyways.  the derpski is a fun little boat, but its an anomaly in the line.  russian dd's also don't play like typical dd's... so the bit above about being a primary capper becomes less and less relevant to russian dd's (for example, by t10 you will have worse concealment than some cruisers).  up till round t6 russian dd's are fine in the primary capper role, but after that there's a pretty big shift in how a russian dd should be played to maximum effect.

4) going to the above point 4... there are currently 5 main dd lines in the game right now, soon to be 6 with the release of brit dd's.  among those there are 2 line splits, with the russian and ijn dd's having divergent dd branches starting in the mid-upper tiers.  each line of dd plays very differently than the others.  ijn are torpedo snipers who rely on stealth even more than any other line.  usn are jack-of-all-trade boats tending towards gunboats but having a couple outstanding torpedo boats.  german boats are less stealthy than others but have excellent guns and hydro at higher tiers, which allows them to outright bully other dd's when contesting caps without supporting gunfire from cruisers.  russian boats tend to be gunboats, but the line branch offers a more usn style of play instead if you prefer.  the ijn branch stops at t8 but there are rumours it will be expanded to t10 soon and it tends to play as more of a stealthier gunboat line than a torpedo line.

 

you're gonna want to get advice specific to the line of dd's you're playing.  after you've got experience in the game (im talking a few thousand battles at least), if you're not like most of the sea sponges in this game, you should be able to determine from observation how various lines and types of ships play, or at least should be played, even if you haven't touched them yourself yet.

Edited by Shadeylark
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31 minutes ago, Shadeylark said:

i get what you're saying...

 

but just to nitpick.  the V in CV is generally believed to actually mean something.  it means heavier-than-air, or craft that use fixed-wings to generate lift.  i suspect there's also a related reason helo carriers don't have a CV designation and are LPH's or LHD's instead (helo's not being fixed-wing craft and all).  http://www.navweaps.com/index_tech/index_ships_list.php

 

The following is taken from "United States Naval Aviation 1910-1995, Appendix 16: US Navy and Marine Corps Squadron Designations and Abbreviations":

On 17 July 1920, the Secretary of the Navy prescribed a standard nomenclature for types and classes of NAVAL VESSELs, including aircraft, in which lighter-than air craft were identified by the type "Z" and heavier-than air craft by the letter "V". The reference also speculates that: "The use of the "V" designation has been a question since the 1920s. However, no conclusive evidence has been found to identify why the letter "V" was chosen. It is generally believed the "V" was in reference to the French word volplane. As a verb, the word means to glide or soar. As a noun, it described an aeronautical device sustained in the air by lifting devices (wings), as opposed to the bag of gas that the airships (denoted by "Z") used. The same case may be regarding the use of "Z". It is generally believed the "Z" was used in deference to Count Ferdinand von Zeppelin. However, documentation has not been located to verify this assumption."

 

Oh of course, I knew that (in reference to V meaning volplane/voler). But was irrelevant in the context of the in game conversation XP

 

13 minutes ago, Shadeylark said:

so, couple pointers.

 

1) dd's are the primary cappers because stealth becomes more and more important the higher you go.  guns get more and more accurate and hit harder and harder; being able to move around the map and grab objectives without being seen becomes paramount because being seen pretty much guarantees taking massive damage if you can't position correctly... and capping often necessitates positioning oneself badly.  so... the dd's are the primary cappers because they can often afford to be badly angled in a cap circle because they can often be in a cap circle undetected (and therefore not be shot at)

2) you're always gonna have to watch your torps.  its generally accepted that your torps are your responsibility from the moment you launch them till they hit something or run out of steam.  doesn't matter what the other guy does, those remain your torps.  you need to develop the situational awareness to ensure that your torps go into reds, not greens, because where your torps go is always your responsibility.

3) russian dd's aren't known for their torps anyways.  the derpski is a fun little boat, but its an anomaly in the line.  russian dd's also don't play like typical dd's... so the bit above about being a primary capper becomes less and less relevant to russian dd's (for example, by t10 you will have worse concealment than some cruisers).  up till round t6 russian dd's are fine in the primary capper role, but after that there's a pretty big shift in how a russian dd should be played to maximum effect.

4) going to the above point 4... there are currently 5 main dd lines in the game right now, soon to be 6 with the release of brit dd's.  among those there are 2 line splits, with the russian and ijn dd's having divergent dd branches starting in the mid-upper tiers.  each line of dd plays very differently than the others.  ijn are torpedo snipers who rely on stealth even more than any other line.  usn are jack-of-all-trade boats tending towards gunboats but having a couple outstanding torpedo boats.  german boats are less stealthy than others but have excellent guns and hydro at higher tiers, which allows them to outright bully other dd's when contesting caps without supporting gunfire from cruisers.  russian boats tend to be gunboats, but the line branch offers a more usn style of play instead if you prefer.  the ijn branch stops at t8 but there are rumours it will be expanded to t10 soon and it tends to play as more of a stealthier gunboat line than a torpedo line.

 

you're gonna want to get advice specific to the line of dd's you're playing.  after you've got experience in the game (im talking a few thousand battles at least), if you're not like most of the sea sponges in this game, you should be able to determine from observation how various lines and types of ships play, or at least should be played, even if you haven't touched them yourself yet.

Erm....you do realize I'm not the one who was in the DD and didn't know what to do, yes? I was sharing a story about someone else who had no idea how to DD at T5, who I had to explain to him what his general role was. Not trying to be rude, just don't know why you're seemingly trying to give me advice on a story I shared about another captain in hopes people would get a chuckle >_>

Edited by Stormie1126

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21 minutes ago, Stormie1126 said:

Erm....you do realize I'm not the one who was in the DD and didn't know what to do, yes? I was sharing a story about someone else who had no idea how to DD at T5, who I had to explain to him what his role was. Not trying to be rude, just don't know why you're seemingly trying to give me advice on a story I shared about another captain in hopes people would get a chuckle >_>

Player @kapri25 asked about how to play DDs. 

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54 minutes ago, kapri25 said:

As a some what newish player, I did not know DDs were supposed to be the primary cappers. Just starting to understand the targeting methods of torpedoes and can say that 99 percent of the time I will not hit team mates. Of course if a team mate decides to turn back to 'reengage' is another matter altogether. Sorry my Derzki shot 12 or so torpedoes at the enemy and you decide to get back into the face of the cruiser/battleship that has already stripped you of a good portion of your health. Have not gotten into pvp at all really. So I know I have a lot to learn. Have played WoT and WoT Blitz more than this but have been starting to play more here. Finally, who would be a good person to learn from more about destroyers? I enjoy them insofar and would love to be able to really start to learn the ins and outs of this class of ship. :fish_book:


Yes, but you started properly and are indeed VERY new with only 250ish battles under your belt; that's totally fine and understandable, the issue was the guy I was referring to Free XP'd his way up to T5 (where things start getting more serious) to jump in to DDs for the first time.

As far as learning, even in the same ship type, different specific ships have different roles; eg. some BBs are sniper ships, like most of the IJN line, and some are up close brawlers, like most of the KM line. Your best bet is to just go to google, type in the specific ship, followed by the word tips-so if you want to know how to play the Minekaze, type in "Minekaze tips", you'll get 3-5 results right at the top usually leading to posts on this very forum that'll give you exactly what you're looking for.

I'd also recommend getting into PVP, that's where you'll find a higher chance of 'smart' players (though there's plenty of dumb ones there too)-EXCEPT when you get a new ship. The first few battles in a new ship, it's a good idea to go back to bot battles for for a brief period to get a feel for it.

Also, once you move to PVP, remember-YOU are always responsible for your own torpedoes-map/situational awareness is key. If you're firing and think there's the slightest chance a friendly might wander into your torp's path, give out a warning. Rare is the time when it's truly someone else's fault for friendly fire via torpedoes.

6 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

Player @kapri25 asked about how to play DDs. 

Yeah, I hadn't noticed that post till just now. Apologies, didn't notice you'd quoted him (I'm tired and when I clicked the new post notification, the page loaded far enough down it cut off your quote) and now that I'm aware, good advice, in supplement to what I just provided.

Edited by Stormie1126

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Stormie1126,  while I sympathize with you , you have to understand that many, if not most, players of this game have no interest in naval history at all.   WoWs to them is just another shooter game and is interchangeable with every other generic FPS out there.  You can see it in their tactics, or lack thereof, their demeanor in chat, and their slavish devotion to stats.

Just play your own ship, do the best you can, and move along.

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4 minutes ago, ElAurens said:

Stormie1126,  while I sympathize with you , you have to understand that many, if not most, players of this game have no interest in naval history at all.   WoWs to them is just another shooter game and is interchangeable with every other generic FPS out there.  You can see it in their tactics, or lack thereof, their demeanor in chat, and their slavish devotion to stats.

Just play your own ship, do the best you can, and move along.

Naval history didn't really have anything to do with it lol. I don't begrudge someone not knowing why CV stands for carrier IRL, I know not everyone is a military nut like I am; it's the fact the guy was in a T7 non-premium ship-which means he's been playing a good while whether he free XP'd his way there or not-and hadn't figured out that in game, the abbreviations mean what they mean despite literally EVERYONE using abbreviations for ship types. :P

Edited by Stormie1126

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3 hours ago, Stormie1126 said:

Apparently Matchmaker RNGesus hates me again after 3 days of giving me REALLY good teams...seen a lotta cruisers literally just FLEEING at the first sight of an enemy today-I mean just full on turning tail and running for map edges/the start point without firing a shot.:Smile_facepalm:

But two instances unrelated to Cruiser terror were just so absurd I had to laugh, and share.

First one, as soon as match starts, one of our T5 DD skippers says it's his first time in a DD. Mmkay, fair enough, we all gotta start somewhere...though maybe not jump in at T5. But shortly into the match, none of the 3 DDs are capping, and when the rest of the team starts griping, that captain I mentioned repeats it's his first time in that type, and doesn't know what to do with them. I politely tell him (while facepalming to myself, of course) that DDs are spotters and cappers, and torp throwers at any BB silly enough to get close. And then suggest maybe he do some research before jumping into a new ship type in the future. No toxicity in the exchange, I just wonder how someone could be playing long enough to free XP to a T5 DD hasn't picked up what their job is by observation.

Second one, I'm on a team with a Nagato. Team starts trying to coordinate tactics, someone says there's only one DD, and I chime in there's no CV's either, which makes me, a BB captain, very happy. Nagato ends up going "What does CV mean?" and I tell him 'carrier'. "Ok, and what does V stand for?" "...no, that's what CV means. Like BB is battleship and DD is destroyer, CV=carrier." Guy says thank you, and it takes a second to sink in I'm in an upper tier match: "....how did you make it to T7 without learning that?" No response, but the exchange made me worry for the captains abilities...and rightly so, for he promptly gets himself surrounded and sunk.

Methinks WG needs to put a limiter of some kind on buying/Free XPing to upper tiers...I know it'll never happen, but a guy can dream, right? :Smile-_tongue:

I seriously find this hard to believe if they are in a 'tree' ship.

Now if the DD was an Okhotnik..  I could believe it...  AND STAY VERY FAR FROM IT TOO.

If the BB was a Texas..  Again..  quite understandable.

But a person needs to play a huge number of games to get that far... to be able to convert the Free XP to get these... especially the Nagato.

...

Like the guy in a Ranger who claimed they never played a CV battle before... 

I'm thinking..  'Some new owner is starting out on an existing account', or recently purchased, or they used some 'levelling' service.

Either that, or it's an alt 'Double-Agent' cheat.

...

Some say to stick to Co-Op to learn a ship before taking it into Random.

But if you go into random and are beaten down by obvious bullies and cheats..  co-op is fine.

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1 minute ago, AVR_Project said:

I seriously find this hard to believe if they are in a 'tree' ship.

Now if the DD was an Okhotnik..  I could believe it...  AND STAY VERY FAR FROM IT TOO.

If the BB was a Texas..  Again..  quite understandable.

But a person needs to play a huge number of games to get that far... to be able to convert the Free XP to get these... especially the Nagato.

 

I know, that's why I was so amazed as well XD

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There are many resources to learn how to properly play ships in this game; tons of videos, excellent players that will take their time to walk a newer player through the ropes, etc.  There are clans that actually run training streams and have question/answer and mentorship programs for players seeking greater skills.  Probably least effective are players in-game with sub-marginal stats of their own giving unsolicited advice, which will invariably be received as criticism.  

jw

 

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1 hour ago, kapri25 said:

As a some what newish player, I did not know DDs were supposed to be the primary cappers. Just starting to understand the targeting methods of torpedoes and can say that 99 percent of the time I will not hit team mates. Of course if a team mate decides to turn back to 'reengage' is another matter altogether. Sorry my Derzki shot 12 or so torpedoes at the enemy and you decide to get back into the face of the cruiser/battleship that has already stripped you of a good portion of your health. Have not gotten into pvp at all really. So I know I have a lot to learn. Have played WoT and WoT Blitz more than this but have been starting to play more here. Finally, who would be a good person to learn from more about destroyers? I enjoy them insofar and would love to be able to really start to learn the ins and outs of this class of ship. :fish_book:

Conceptually, the ship types - in a very general sense, with exceptions - into the following roles:

  • Destroyers (DDs): Stealthy ninjas - they use their speed and concealment to set up ambush attacks on enemy capital ships with their torpedos, and they use their fast firing but low damage guns against other destroyers. 
    • Note: some DDs are better at killing enemy dds (like American DDs), and others are better at killing enemy capital ships with torpedos (like Japanese DDs) - this national flavour is common to this game, and you'll have to learn this as you go. 

For new players, I recommend the following as easy to learn and to play: 

  • Destroyers: American destroyers are the easiest to play - their fast firing guns, and torpedoes on both sides (at low tier) means that its a fast, fun run-and-gun style, with great smoke screens.  They are very forgiving - rush in, gun enemy destroyers, and if you win and live, then rush up to a battleship and shove him up with torps... once you get more experience, you can do all of those things better, faster, longer etc. 

If you have any specific questions, please ask away!

Otherwise, good luck!

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Thank you all for your advice. A lot to keep in mind. For now, will (que the cheers from veteran players) stay in co op and lower tiers to get more of a sense of the ships. Yes, my time in Blitz and PC WoT has taught me that being new does not mean I should buy a premium vehicle (ship) and blindly believe that because I have a premium I am invincible and rush the enemy. And then call the team a bunch of idiots. Again, thank you for all the info! Fair seas and smooth sailing to you all!

Edited by kapri25

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1 hour ago, kapri25 said:

Thank you all for your advice. A lot to keep in mind. For now, will (que the cheers from veteran players) stay in co op and lower tiers to get more of a sense of the ships. Yes, my time in Blitz and PC WoT has taught me that being new does not mean I should buy a premium vehicle (ship) and blindly believe that because I have a premium I am invincible and rush the enemy. And then call the team a bunch of idiots. Again, thank you for all the info! Fair seas and smooth sailing to you all!

 

Laudable attitude,  but a word of caution about Co-op (PVE).

PVE will teach you a lot of bad habits.  The three that come to mind (there are many others)...

1)  The bots always rush in, so it teaches you to rush in too before your team scores all the kills. 

2) Bots are always programmed to focus on a particular ship so, if you are not that ship at that moment, you can sail right up and torp them with complete impunity.

3) PVE rewards you for ignoring capping and going only for kills/damage.

Doing these in PVP will get you killed fast or, at the very least, cause a string of losses for your team.  About the only thing Co-op (PVE) is good for is to familiarise  yourself with a ships handling and how the guns and torps work.  Other than that it is a really bad place to learn the game.   It took me a very long time to shake off the lessons that were drummed into me by PVE play style.

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CV in this game was explained to me a while back to generally stand for "Carrier Vehicle"

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22 minutes ago, JCC45 said:

 

Laudable attitude,  but a word of caution about Co-op (PVE).

PVE will teach you a lot of bad habits.  The three that come to mind (there are many others)...

1)  The bots always rush in, so it teaches you to rush in too before your team scores all the kills. 

2) Bots are always programmed to focus on a particular ship so, if you are not that ship at that moment, you can sail right up and torp them with complete impunity.

3) PVE rewards you for ignoring capping and going only for kills/damage.

Doing these in PVP will get you killed fast or, at the very least, cause a string of losses for your team.  About the only thing Co-op (PVE) is good for is to familiarise  yourself with a ships handling and how the guns and torps work.  Other than that it is a really bad place to learn the game.   It took me a very long time to shake off the lessons that were drummed into me by PVE play style.

Yeah I kind of figure that. But I have to start somewhere for now. PVE will, like you said, familiarize me with the ships, types of class, and each nation's up and downs. Here's to learning! Cheers!

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3 hours ago, Stormie1126 said:

Naval history didn't really have anything to do with it lol. I don't begrudge someone not knowing why CV stands for carrier IRL, I know not everyone is a military nut like I am; it's the fact the guy was in a T7 non-premium ship-which means he's been playing a good while whether he free XP'd his way there or not-and hadn't figured out that in game, the abbreviations mean what they mean despite literally EVERYONE using abbreviations for ship types. :P


The 2-letter abbreviations we generally use (CV, BB, DD, etc.) are American ship designations. The rest of the world uses a Pennant number system. Given the number of non-Americans on the NA server, it's not surprising someone wasn't knowledgeable about the US system. Heck, with all the different languages flying around in chat it's easy to see the difficulties ABDA Flot had.

 

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Co-op is good for testing out ships.  Bots are pretty predictable, so you can test your aiming and ship maneuvering without too much penalty.  I usually play randoms, but have quite a few co-op games too, just for said testing.  That said, you can see some pretty interesting play, not always good, in co-op.  Randoms is where you should be playing once you figure out the ship.  It is the real learning ground.  Play in the tier that is comfortable for you until you master it.  Then move up.  Don't be obsessed with moving up the tier just to get the bigger badder ship.  A lot of people make that mistake thinking the tougher ship will solve the issues of being killed by a bigger ship.  There is always a bigger ship, until you reach T10.  Then, they are all big ships, and they can all punish you if you make a mistake.  As OP mentioned, you will often see mid or higher tier players playing bigger ships, yet they don't fully understand the game.  This is a complex game with lots of nuances that need to be learned.  It is not a "Sunday Sailor" sight seeing expedition, but I think a few players think that it is.

I didn't think I would see a higher tier loss in co-op, but was reminded last night that it was entirely possible.  I took a T7 Minsk DD into the game to test out Aslains mods that are listed as ok by WG.  I haven't used them in over a year, but was looking at some of the camera and HUD features.  I ended up in a match with mostly T9 ships where I was the only DD.  I headed towards the closest cap knowing the bulk or the enemy ships would go there, and they did.  However, my team all went to the edge of the map.  I should have avoided the cap when I realized what was happening.  That was my fault.  Well, I died a horrible death once spotted.  I usually survive, but the difference in the cameras and HUD threw off my game maneuvers just enough, which is why I test in co-op rather than randoms.  My team stayed at the map edge and the enemy bots all sailed over and broadside shot all the ships that were lined up in a shooting line like ducks at a carnival.  I couldn't believe that players with high tier T9 ships would play that way, but they did.  It just goes to show that you can fail your way up to high tier ships.

 

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23 minutes ago, Murcc said:

CV in this game was explained to me a while back to generally stand for "Carrier Vehicle"

While I believe the the "V" s from the French verb "voler" meaning "to fly" the reason a V was used instead of CC as BB or DD for battleships & destroyers. Which ever is correct this was to designate the ship carried fixed wing aircraft instead of what we called blimps or airships. Now I haven't done any research but I don't recall hearing about sea going tenders for rigid frame airships.

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7 hours ago, Stormie1126 said:

I just wonder how someone could be playing long enough to free XP to a T5 DD hasn't picked up what their job is by observation.

Unless they were playing someone else's account for the first time, like a kid or sibling or friend trying something out?

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To be fair, you can easily blast through DDs up to T5 without bothering to cap, just because newer players in slow ships can give you an inflated sense of how effective torps are, and make you think that slinging torps is all you need to do.

As far as nomenclature, a lot of players aren't hardcore naval types, and I'm not sure if the game itself uses that lettering convention. (especially since they are an American thing) I wonder how many people playing modern-setting FPS games know what a STANAG mag is, or the difference between a battle rifle, an assault rifle, and an automatic rifle.

Edited by Skpstr

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1 hour ago, JCC45 said:

 

Laudable attitude,  but a word of caution about Co-op (PVE).

PVE will teach you a lot of bad habits.  The three that come to mind (there are many others)...

1)  The bots always rush in, so it teaches you to rush in too before your team scores all the kills. 

2) Bots are always programmed to focus on a particular ship so, if you are not that ship at that moment, you can sail right up and torp them with complete impunity.

3) PVE rewards you for ignoring capping and going only for kills/damage.

Doing these in PVP will get you killed fast or, at the very least, cause a string of losses for your team.  About the only thing Co-op (PVE) is good for is to familiarise  yourself with a ships handling and how the guns and torps work.  Other than that it is a really bad place to learn the game.   It took me a very long time to shake off the lessons that were drummed into me by PVE play style.

I play a bit of both, and know how to switch back and forth.

High tier PvE is getting much tougher.  I'm beginning to look up my team-mates for failing teams and seeing a 60% win rate ... IN PVE !!!!

CV battles are incredibly different.  First of all, bots can do a RiverDance around your dropped torpedoes.  They are much more difficult to erase than they are in Random.  If you can do well in Co-Op as a CV operator, you will be a serious clubber in PvP.

Destroyers don't live long in PvE.  If you can survive the battle while being even mildly engaged, you will have no difficulty in Random.  In Co-Op, you learn not to cap right away...  or you will be the first to die.  On bad missions, you will have the entire bot team following you around relentlessly.  If you open fire and light yourself up in open water...   dead.

Cruisers and battleships...  PvE is not so bad.  Pretty much an easy life.  The fewer ships help out with those two groups.  Except..  If you are in a German BB, do not chase the bot CV with AP bombs...  just don't.  cap, repair, play cards..  whatever..  Just leave the CV alone.

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what gets me isn't when someone doesn't know the designation of a ship type, but when they manage to reach t8 or higher and still have to ask in game chat things like "if i select a target for my secondaries, do they only shoot at that target?"  i honestly don't know if its worse when its a wallet warrior who bought a Massachusetts with only 200 battles under his belt asking such things, or when its someone with 4000 battles asking.  

 

on the one hand, the wallet warrior's ignorance is excusable since he's so new, but its inexcusable for him to be playing at t8 when so new and so clueless.  but on the other hand its just as frustrating to deal with someone who has fought a requisite number of battles to deserve to be at t8, but obviously hasn't learned anything in those battles.

 

i guess in the end it just comes down to i hate almost every player in this game, not least because they make it so hard for me to decide which ones to hate more. :Smile_sceptic:

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