Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
You need to play a total of 10 battles to post in this section.
ddoubletapp1

Groz Skipper Skills?

19 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

182
[WOLF4]
Members
846 posts
11,146 battles

Groz seems like she would be strongest with a dedicated Commander, as I think we can all agree that SI should be the first third level skill he takes - but where from there (for 100% random play)?

I'm approaching the 19th point, and am a little torn as to how to spend the remainder.  This is where I'm at so far - the Commander has 18 total points, with 14 spent, four in hand and one left to earn.

http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/1000000000000001000001000000100119

I'm torn between running her as a full AA build with MFAA just for the laughs (with the last point going towards PM) - or balancing her a bit with SE and AR.

So - for those already running a 19 point skipper on Groz - what are you finding works for you?

TIA!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
473
[A-D-F]
Members
1,434 posts
19,607 battles

For a general random battle gunboat captain, I would take this: http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/1000000000000011010001000000100119

For an AA captain, I would prefer this: http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/1000000000000011000011000000100119

Unless you want to go full AA, but you would have to choose between BFT or SI, as you can only have one: http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/1100000000000001000001000000110119

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
397
[ICBM]
Members
679 posts
7,963 battles
4 hours ago, Lightninger said:

For a general random battle gunboat captain, I would take this: http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/1000000000000011010001000000100119

 

These are the exact skills I am using.  I'm at 16pts and took SE first, so I don't have SI yet, but plan to get it. So far I am having good luck. I wish I could fit DE in there somewhere because those guns would be flamethrowers, but I think the survivability that SI affords is more important, plus that extra speed boost really helps when you find yourself kiting from distance. Its a very fun boat and very strong against enemy destroyers.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
182
[WOLF4]
Members
846 posts
11,146 battles
21 hours ago, Lightninger said:

For a general random battle gunboat captain, I would take this: http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/1000000000000011010001000000100119

For an AA captain, I would prefer this: http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/1000000000000011000011000000100119

Unless you want to go full AA, but you would have to choose between BFT or SI, as you can only have one: http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/1100000000000001000001000000110119

Good call.   I think I'll go with the first set - maybe after the CV re-work it'll be worth changing up to MFAA, but currently taking the AA module and AFT takes care of any spotting planes in range very quickly.  The balanced build is probably the strongest option, at the moment.

17 hours ago, mrieder79 said:

These are the exact skills I am using.  I'm at 16pts and took SE first, so I don't have SI yet, but plan to get it. So far I am having good luck. I wish I could fit DE in there somewhere because those guns would be flamethrowers, but I think the survivability that SI affords is more important, plus that extra speed boost really helps when you find yourself kiting from distance. Its a very fun boat and very strong against enemy destroyers.

Agreed - 3500 more HP is nothing to sneeze at.  I'm actually not doing all that well in Groz, over-all.  Purchased her the day before the first set of US CLs dropped - and have been playing her a little too aggressively.  I need to remember not to turn away while fighting other DDs - just keep her bow on with her forward guns in action while dueling - I blame too many matches in Fletcher, and my bad habit of turning  to get all her guns into the duel - Groz just doesn't handle quick enough to make that viable, and once she shows her side to the reds while spotted, her HP depletes a little too quickly! 

Edited by ddoubletapp1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
397
[ICBM]
Members
679 posts
7,963 battles

Does choosing AA mod over the Dispersion mod hurt gunnery much? I currently have the gunnery mod but am considering switching to the AA mod. If CVs come back, I'll def. switch.

 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
397
[ICBM]
Members
679 posts
7,963 battles
42 minutes ago, ddoubletapp1 said:

 

Agreed - 3500 more HP is nothing to sneeze at.  I'm actually not doing all that well in Groz, over-all.  Purchased her the day before the first set of US CLs dropped - and have been playing her a little too aggressively.  I need to remember not to turn away while fighting other DDs - just keep her bow on with her forward guns in action while dueling - I blame too many matches in Fletcher, and my bad habit of turning  to get all her guns into the duel - Groz just doesn't handle quick enough to make that viable, and once she shows her side to the reds while spotted, her HP depletes a little too quickly! 

I do best when I play Groz like udaloi. with all the radar, you just get hosed if you push too far into caps. I stay at the very edge of the cap or just outside of it to shoot enemy dds when my cruisers radar. I don't go into caps until it is safe.  I have struggled with the change from khab and udaloi to grozzo, but it is better when I'm careful. Radar is usually what gets me. I'm hoping things even out soon, but who know. 

With DD duels, I have been doing very well in Groz. I always hold my speed boost in reserve, then pop it right at the beginning of the duel, then angle away or toward depending on how close the red team is. Grozzo is very strong vs enemy dds. Between the speed boost and rudder shift (4.6 secs isn't terrible) the red DDs don't hit me much. Usually it is their team that I have to worry about. Once those laser rounds start hitting every 3.5 seconds, most DDs bug out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
182
[WOLF4]
Members
846 posts
11,146 battles
On 7/4/2018 at 7:32 AM, mrieder79 said:

Does choosing AA mod over the Dispersion mod hurt gunnery much? I currently have the gunnery mod but am considering switching to the AA mod. If CVs come back, I'll def. switch.

 

I haven't found it to be a hindrance - I guess if you stick with the numbers, I'm 7% less effective with gunnery - but I can live with that.

Even Midways will avoid you (unless its a unicum that decides cross dropping your smoke in early game is the right move - which it is!) - and if you get a T8 CV in the match - well, you can single-handedly make him regret his choice of ships when he pushed the Battle button - ha ha!

Just remember to keep your AA off, when his strike package detects you - pop smoke and defensive AA and laugh maniacally!  I like the special module for AA on this ship for added LOLs.

On 7/13/2018 at 9:31 PM, beliy_demon said:

This is what I run:  http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/1100000000000011010011000000000119

I don't find AFT much useful after recent range buff, 12.3km is sufficient for flanking.    This build shreds enemy DDs.

Good call - I'm finishing up the 19th point to get AR, otherwise our skipper build is identical.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
258
[AAA]
Members
1,111 posts
12,329 battles
On 7/14/2018 at 12:31 AM, beliy_demon said:

This is what I run:  http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/1100000000000011010011000000000119

I don't find AFT much useful after recent range buff, 12.3km is sufficient for flanking.    This build shreds enemy DDs.

I haven’t gotten to the Groz yet but would DE be of more use than bft? 

I like my guns to pew pew as fast as they can but at 4 sec reload is bft better than de? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
182
[WOLF4]
Members
846 posts
11,146 battles
14 hours ago, wstugamd said:

I haven’t gotten to the Groz yet but would DE be of more use than bft? 

I like my guns to pew pew as fast as they can but at 4 sec reload is bft better than de? 

I mis-spoke in my last post - my chosen Skipper skills and beliy_demon's are actually a little different.

I'll work my choice justifications from the top down.

CE is a no-brainer - the Groz is a useful boat in traditional DD roles (capping and stealth torping), and CE, camo and the concealment module get her detectability down to 6km even.

I took AFT as a second four point skill - as it offers a two-fold advantage - extending the Groz's insanely easy to use, flat shooting gun range to 14.8km.  Secondly - it extends the AA range to 7.5km.  I don't run into carriers very often, at this tier - but the Groz knocks down vessel launched spotters and fighters as quickly as she looks at them, which is awesome when one wants to stay undetected on the other side of a land mass.

SE and SI were the three point skills I took.  You want SI - it gives you a third smoke, speed boost and heal consumable, and a fourth DFAA (with premium consumables).  Otherwise you would have two of each of the important ones. 

I like SE as it boosts Groz's HP pool to 24.4K - which is pretty healthy, and with the heal can extend you into the late match - even when you have taken a lot of fire in early cap fights.  I had a match yesterday, in which I took two torp hits - one early match, one mid match - and still survived to the end.

You could definitely make an argument for either DE or BFT - but by selecting the main gun module, reload is already down to 3.5 seconds - and the fire chance is already pretty good at 8.5%. 

Neither were strong enough benefits to dissuade me from the two three point skills I decided on.

Everything below this is pretty obvious - LS because its mandatory on gunboat/hybred DDs, PT for the same reason (imho) - and AR because I needed to spend those last two points and Groz's turret traverse is already pretty darn quick.

Anyway - just an explanation of my choices - hope you find it somewhat useful.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
397
[ICBM]
Members
679 posts
7,963 battles

SI is better than BFT or DE. You really want that survivability boost since your job is to get in there and mix it up in caps and hunt enemy dds. Grozzo is such a good DD hunter without BFT or DE that you may as well make yourself that much harder to kill. Nice to be able to heal up after knife fights.

Edited by mrieder79
  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
258
[AAA]
Members
1,111 posts
12,329 battles
10 hours ago, ddoubletapp1 said:

I mis-spoke in my last post - my chosen Skipper skills and beliy_demon's are actually a little different.

I'll work my choice justifications from the top down.

CE is a no-brainer - the Groz is a useful boat in traditional DD roles (capping and stealth torping), and CE, camo and the concealment module get her detectability down to 6km even.

I took AFT as a second four point skill - as it offers a two-fold advantage - extending the Groz's insanely easy to use, flat shooting gun range to 14.8km.  Secondly - it extends the AA range to 7.5km.  I don't run into carriers very often, at this tier - but the Groz knocks down vessel launched spotters and fighters as quickly as she looks at them, which is awesome when one wants to stay undetected on the other side of a land mass.

SE and SI were the three point skills I took.  You want SI - it gives you a third smoke, speed boost and heal consumable, and a fourth DFAA (with premium consumables).  Otherwise you would have two of each of the important ones. 

I like SE as it boosts Groz's HP pool to 24.4K - which is pretty healthy, and with the heal can extend you into the late match - even when you have taken a lot of fire in early cap fights.  I had a match yesterday, in which I took two torp hits - one early match, one mid match - and still survived to the end.

You could definitely make an argument for either DE or BFT - but by selecting the main gun module, reload is already down to 3.5 seconds - and the fire chance is already pretty good at 8.5%. 

Neither were strong enough benefits to dissuade me from the two three point skills I decided on.

Everything below this is pretty obvious - LS because its mandatory on gunboat/hybred DDs, PT for the same reason (imho) - and AR because I needed to spend those last two points and Groz's turret traverse is already pretty darn quick.

Anyway - just an explanation of my choices - hope you find it somewhat useful.

 

2 hours ago, mrieder79 said:

SI is better than BFT or DE. You really want that survivability boost since your job is to get in there and mix it up in caps and hunt enemy dds. Grozzo is such a good DD hunter without BFT or DE that you may as well make yourself that much harder to kill. Nice to be able to heal up after knife fights.

Thank both of you. Very helpful!

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8,769
[SALVO]
Members
24,197 posts
24,546 battles

This is an interesting thread because I'm respeccing my Groz captain.  I've been seriously considering whether to dump AFT in favor of RL.  In Clan Battles, Radio Location is a very powerful skill for pretty much any DD, so I'm sorely tempted to take RL.  At the same time, I'm not sure if RL's worth using over AFT in Randoms.  It's a tough decision.

 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
182
[WOLF4]
Members
846 posts
11,146 battles
10 hours ago, Crucis said:

This is an interesting thread because I'm respeccing my Groz captain.  I've been seriously considering whether to dump AFT in favor of RL.  In Clan Battles, Radio Location is a very powerful skill for pretty much any DD, so I'm sorely tempted to take RL.  At the same time, I'm not sure if RL's worth using over AFT in Randoms.  It's a tough decision.

 

Agreed - I took advantage of the sale on commander re-spec, this weekend, and tried some new Skipper builds that I have been pondering.

Its interesting - for a very long time after RDF was added to the Commander skills, I was pretty sure it  was a skill I wasn't interested in adding.

Some months went by, and I decided to re-spec Yamamoto (Commander of my Shima, Fujin and Shino) and added RDF just to try it out.  It took a stretch of matches to get used to it, and understand how to maximise the information it was giving me - but I wouldn't switch back now.  Its a very strong skill on a DD, for sure.

I also added it to Henri and Hindy, this weekend - as I find it very useful in hunting DDs in those ships - as well as adding it to my Z-52 Commander.

I gave some thought to adding it to my Groz Skipper, as well - but in the end decided that AFT offered a little more advantage - I was mostly giving up BFT and PM to get it on the Commanders I re-spec'ed this weekend.

I don't play CW - but I can see how it would be an even stronger skill under those conditions (fewer ships in a match) - same would hold for ranked meta.  I believe if I was using Groz under those circumstances, I would indeed give up AFT for RDF.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8,769
[SALVO]
Members
24,197 posts
24,546 battles
1 hour ago, ddoubletapp1 said:

Agreed - I took advantage of the sale on commander re-spec, this weekend, and tried some new Skipper builds that I have been pondering.

Its interesting - for a very long time after RDF was added to the Commander skills, I was pretty sure it  was a skill I wasn't interested in adding.

Some months went by, and I decided to re-spec Yamamoto (Commander of my Shima, Fujin and Shino) and added RDF just to try it out.  It took a stretch of matches to get used to it, and understand how to maximise the information it was giving me - but I wouldn't switch back now.  Its a very strong skill on a DD, for sure.

I also added it to Henri and Hindy, this weekend - as I find it very useful in hunting DDs in those ships - as well as adding it to my Z-52 Commander.

I gave some thought to adding it to my Groz Skipper, as well - but in the end decided that AFT offered a little more advantage - I was mostly giving up BFT and PM to get it on the Commanders I re-spec'ed this weekend.

I don't play CW - but I can see how it would be an even stronger skill under those conditions (fewer ships in a match) - same would hold for ranked meta.  I believe if I was using Groz under those circumstances, I would indeed give up AFT for RDF.

ddoubletapp1, short of running a Khab, DDs in CBs tend to exist for the sake of spotting (both enemy ships and torps), capping, counter DD work, and occasionally making torpedo attacks on the enemy.  Oh, occasionally, you'll use your guns on larger ships, if the situation is right.  But generally, you won't see DDs constantly firing their guns at larger units.  They're more valuable doing their primary tasks than just doing a small amount of chip damage while exposing themselves to return fire (as well as giving up their concealment and the mystery of their location).

I suppose this could be a case where if one could develop 2 different captains for the Groz, one for randoms and one for clan battles, one could get the best of both worlds.

 

EDIT:  Upon rereading this post, it occurs to me that one could say that the reasons I live for DDs in CBs could also be said to be the role of DDs in randoms too.  I think that the difference is that in randoms, you're often trying to rack up some good damage, particularly if you're in a DD that's capable of doing so.  OTOH, in CBs, producing big damage really isn't a DDs role.  Oh, that's not so say that if you can land a bunch of torps and pile up the damage that anyone on your team is going to complain.   But given the uncertainty of landing lots of torp hits, even in CBs, damage production is a very secondary role for DDs in CBs behind the other tasks I listed earlier.

Edited by Crucis
  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
182
[WOLF4]
Members
846 posts
11,146 battles
25 minutes ago, Crucis said:

ddoubletapp1, short of running a Khab, DDs in CBs tend to exist for the sake of spotting (both enemy ships and torps), capping, counter DD work, and occasionally making torpedo attacks on the enemy.  Oh, occasionally, you'll use your guns on larger ships, if the situation is right.  But generally, you won't see DDs constantly firing their guns at larger units.  They're more valuable doing their primary tasks than just doing a small amount of chip damage while exposing themselves to return fire (as well as giving up their concealment and the mystery of their location).

I suppose this could be a case where if one could develop 2 different captains for the Groz, one for randoms and one for clan battles, one could get the best of both worlds.

Sounds like the strongest of strategies to me - especially if you have a spare high skilled VMF Commander, or a healthy bank of elite Skipper XP to spend.

I've watched a number of vids of CWs - and can fully understand how strong RDF would be in that meta.  I would absolutely give up AFT for RDF, if I were to be playing Groz in CW - or ranked, for that matter.

Groz actually holds my current record for spotting damage (@ 196K) - her relative concealment and speed, make her a pretty strong spotting boat, for sure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8,769
[SALVO]
Members
24,197 posts
24,546 battles
1 minute ago, ddoubletapp1 said:

Sounds like the strongest of strategies to me - especially if you have a spare high skilled VMF Commander, or a healthy bank of elite Skipper XP to spend.

I've watched a number of vids of CWs - and can fully understand how strong RDF would be in that meta.  I would absolutely give up AFT for RDF, if I were to be playing Groz in CW - or ranked, for that matter.

Groz actually holds my current record for spotting damage (@ 196K) - her relative concealment and speed, make her a pretty strong spotting boat, for sure.

I have all of the tier 10 DDs and I find the Groz to be one of the most difficult ones for which to spec the captain.  Why?  Because there are just so many different ways to build the captain.  Does one take SE, SI, BFT, DE, or TAE at level 3?  And what about other level 4 skills after CE?  There are just so many viable ways to build a Grozzy captain, depending on how you want to focus him.  Hardcore gunboat CO (who might even given up CE)?  Hybrid CO with a mild focus on guns?  Hybrid CO with some focus on torps?  Hardcore generalist?

 

Oh, and another thought on AFT.  A big reason for taking AFT is how it increases AA range.  Great for randoms, but currently, that's not a concern in CBs.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
182
[WOLF4]
Members
846 posts
11,146 battles
23 minutes ago, Crucis said:

I have all of the tier 10 DDs and I find the Groz to be one of the most difficult ones for which to spec the captain.  Why?  Because there are just so many different ways to build the captain.  Does one take SE, SI, BFT, DE, or TAE at level 3?  And what about other level 4 skills after CE?  There are just so many viable ways to build a Grozzy captain, depending on how you want to focus him.  Hardcore gunboat CO (who might even given up CE)?  Hybrid CO with a mild focus on guns?  Hybrid CO with some focus on torps?  Hardcore generalist?

 

Oh, and another thought on AFT.  A big reason for taking AFT is how it increases AA range.  Great for randoms, but currently, that's not a concern in CBs.  

It does have options, for sure.

CE and SI are skills I wouldn't give up on a Groz Skipper - but I recently watched a vid of someone playing a torp focused Groz (TAE and the torp module) - and it was very strong indeed.  Two banks of five, fairly hard hitting torps is nothing to sneeze at.

Agreed on AFT - if it extended only one of Groz's strengths, I would seriously consider giving it up for RDF in randoms - but the two fold extension of main gun range and AA (out to 7.5km with the AA module, which I also run) is too much to turn from. 

Not that its a match-breaker against a T10 CV - but being able to knock down ship launched spotters and fighters so effectively is one of Groz's greatest strengths, imho.

If there is an influx of high tier CVs after the rework - I may just invest the dubloons and swap AFT for MFAA, just for the laughs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8,769
[SALVO]
Members
24,197 posts
24,546 battles
1 hour ago, ddoubletapp1 said:

It does have options, for sure.

CE and SI are skills I wouldn't give up on a Groz Skipper - but I recently watched a vid of someone playing a torp focused Groz (TAE and the torp module) - and it was very strong indeed.  Two banks of five, fairly hard hitting torps is nothing to sneeze at.

Agreed on AFT - if it extended only one of Groz's strengths, I would seriously consider giving it up for RDF in randoms - but the two fold extension of main gun range and AA (out to 7.5km with the AA module, which I also run) is too much to turn from. 

Not that its a match-breaker against a T10 CV - but being able to knock down ship launched spotters and fighters so effectively is one of Groz's greatest strengths, imho.

If there is an influx of high tier CVs after the rework - I may just invest the dubloons and swap AFT for MFAA, just for the laughs.

I've always considered the choice between AFT and MFAA a difficult one.   Greater AA range or greater AA firepower (but at the expense of having to manually direct your AA).  I usually opt for AFT, because trying to manually select aircraft squadrons, particularly at high tiers when the planes can be so fast, can be rather difficult.  I've usually found it to be easier to just stick with AFT and not have to  bother with selecting squadrons.  Or rather I'd try to select squadrons, but wouldn't stress too much about it, which I would with MFAA since without manual selection, you have no AA at all.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×