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DJC_499

Captain Skills for Massachusetts and IFHE

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With the Massachusetts reportedly set to be released SoonTM and seeing and reading the associated videos and reviews I am wondering about the apparent requirement for IFHE and the proposed "full secondary" Captain build consisting of, say, PM, AR, BFT, AFT, MFCSB, and IFHE. First this demands a 19-point Captains and limits the ability for this ship as a "trainer". Further I also get worried about the absence of any "protective skills" like BOS, FP, etc.

Given the skill, intellect, and experience of the Commanders reading this posting I look forward to your thoughts as the optimal build for this ship and the specific need for IFHE to make this effective.

Thanks.....

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3 minutes ago, DJC_499 said:

With the Massachusetts reportedly set to be released SoonTM and seeing and reading the associated videos and reviews I am wondering about the apparent requirement for IFHE and the proposed "full secondary" Captain build consisting of, say, PM, AR, BFT, AFT, MFCSB, and IFHE. First this demands a 19-point Captains and limits the ability for this ship as a "trainer". Further I also get worried about the absence of any "protective skills" like BOS, FP, etc.

Given the skill, intellect, and experience of the Commanders reading this posting I look forward to your thoughts as the optimal build for this ship and the specific need for IFHE to make this effective.

Thanks.....

I’m pretty sure Notser (?) made a video on using a non one off captain. Pretty much just AFT, BFT, and AR. It’s really up to you what you use but the main reason I wouldn’t bother with IFHE is the accuracy of the secondaries. All secondaries aim mid ship which means belt armor but most aren’t accurate enough to hit it and you’ll get all over the ship. I’m assuming most hits on battleships won’t really do a lot especially up close even with IFHE so I personally wouldn’t run it. Depends on how many 19 pointers you have.

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BFT/AFT/MS are what you'll want. The rest is up to the player imo.

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I will just run my regular 19pt US BB Capt setup for AA with BFT/AFT and then equip the ship with SBM2. Done.

Edited by AdmiralThunder
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I think an argument made against IFHE, cant remember by who, is that the USN arcs at distances end up mostly on superstructures.

Of course IFHE  in the Mass could synergize with the USN CLs in conjuction with CE.

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19 minutes ago, AdmiralThunder said:

I will just run my regular 19pt US BB Capt setup for AA with BFT/AFT and then equip the ship with SBM2. Done.

This is what I am thinking too. Thanks

Arguably, for a "full secondary build" I would think that DE might actually be better than IFHE as you save a point allowing EM to be added as well as incrementally increasing your fire chance by 40% (from 5% (I think) to 7%).

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IFHE Secondaries only really make a big shift for French 100mm and German 128mm Secondaries.

 

So if you want a Secondaries MASS it's going to be pretty traditional with the core abilities of BFT / AFT / Manual Secondaries, as with other Secondary Builds.  Some drop BFT for BOS.

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Do you have a 19pt captain you use for USN Light Cruisers? He may already be set up for Massachusetts. I never imagined my Atlanta captain was the perfect fit for a 35,000 ton battlewagon, but here we are. :Smile_coin:

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I'm going for the meme build, and will do full secondaries including manual and IFHE.  I'll be funding the Premium heal since a 19 pt captain won't have enough to do superintendent.  This is the build MAN-oTaur and @LittleWhiteMouse suggested in the review. I've already edited my Alabama captain this way and can just move him over once Big Mamie is out.

If I do not think that my play style works with this build. (Although I actually think it will be a perfect match!) I'll try eliminating IFHE and go with an EM/Superintendent build.  But frankly I expect the Massachusetts to be awesome in Co-op.   The enemy charges right in...to my secondaries. 

 

Edited by nagasakee

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AR, BFT, and AFT are no-brainers, but everything else is captain preference.

  • IFHE is probably the one skill most useful for this type of build since it substantially improves the consistency of secondary battery damage.
  • Concealment Expert is also useful for captains wishing to have more control over when and where they want to engage in a brawl.
  • The benefit of Manual Secondaries may be a little bit more limited since the base accuracy along with SBM2 is already very good on this ship.  I was watching this review below and he was playing the ship more traditionally, and it still performed very well. 
  • Given the incredible presence of fire breathers lately, I don't think taking Basics of Survivability would do too much since it just gets refreshed faster than the timer anyways.
  • Expert Marksman not very necessary since the turret traverse speed on the Massachusetts is already very fast (36s base).  EM would reduce it to 31.5s

Gotta say though, you need a lot of captain skills to make this ship work.

 

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I've been thinking about this a lot as well. I think i'm going to try the manual secondaries first and see how that nets out and swap out for IFHE if needed. I'm going to be picking this one up entirely for brawling. I'll be running some side by side comparisons with a few captains to see if the increased damage from IFHE offsets the increased hit and fire chances of the manual secondary build. It's likely going to take a while to get enough data. I just want the darn ship :) 

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I see secondarys up to 11.3 mine only go to 10.8..am I missing something have ihfe,superintendant,aft,bft pre maint  should I fire he?

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Do you have have the flag equipped? 

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29 minutes ago, BlazerSS said:

which flag?

http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Flags#Available_Signals

Mike Yankee Soxisix

+5% to secondary battery maximum firing range.
-5% to maximum dispersion of secondary battery shells.
-5% to secondary battery loading time.

When people talk of Secondary Build ranges, this signal flag is assumed to be equipped.  Just an FYI for the future.  The longer the range, the bigger the gains.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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On 6/25/2018 at 8:35 AM, AdmiralThunder said:

I will just run my regular 19pt US BB Capt setup for AA with BFT/AFT and then equip the ship with SBM2. Done.

This. Except I'll be running Vigi instead of BFT because torpedobeats > planeswatting. Not speccing into secondaries in this current meta. But it'll be funny to watch them blaze away and scare off DDs even if they don't actually do that much damage.

--Helms

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Was testing it out in co-op with Secondaries Build.

 

BFT+AFT+Manual Secondaries, with SBM2 installed.  The secondaries are fierce, spammy.  But personally, it took me some getting used to on seeing Tier VI-VII CV aircraft go through my AA.  Yes, I know it's a Secondaries Build and it's a concession Bismarck makes doing the same thing.  But personally, my High Tier USN BBs are AA Builds by tradition.  If planes come near, they die, simple as that.  Seeing Ranger drop a few bombs on me was real annoying but yes... It's a build concession.

 

The sad part of this acceptance?  This was only co-op.  Nevermind what a good CV player using Kaga, Enterprise, Graf Zeppelin, Shokaku, Taiho, Hakuryu, Midway will do to you.

 

An idea to toss around for fun in co-op and future Tier VIII operations, is dropping CE, still do the Secondaries Build, but take Manual AA.

PT

AR

BFT

Manual Sec & AFT & Manual AA

SBM2 installed.

Definitely wouldn't do PVP with this :Smile_teethhappy:

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I have a dedicated 19pt captain on my Mass right now with a full secondary build:

  1. PT, PM
  2. EM
  3. BFT
  4. MFCSA, IFHE, AFT

I have also used my Cleveland 19pt captain on it and still did 30k damage in a T10 match with my secondaries, and has a build:

  1. PT, PM
  2. AR
  3. DE
  4. IFHE, AFT, CE

So the dispersion even without manual secondaries still seemed pretty good. 

 

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What are thoughts so far on Manual Secondaries?  I went AFT, IFHE, and FP.  No regrets on the first two, but wondering if the Manual Secs are better overall than FP.  Anyone playing with these have an opinion?

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I've found ifhe to be better in dmg.

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7 hours ago, Croda said:

What are thoughts so far on Manual Secondaries?  I went AFT, IFHE, and FP.  No regrets on the first two, but wondering if the Manual Secs are better overall than FP.  Anyone playing with these have an opinion?

IFHE is unnecessary on Massachusetts' secondaries because 127mm already penetrates the superstructure of whatever she encounters.

If we were talking specific German BBs or Secondaries of 100mm gun size, then there are good reasons, but for the cost of 4 pts, it doesn't do anything meaningful to USN 127mm because it already penetrates all possible threats where they need it most... Superstructure.

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Full secondaries build with IFHE , with context in what it was hitting. It is a very very good brawler.

shot-18_06.29_13_13.33-0898.thumb.jpg.e36d08986df8ac4892cfb91070a8abbb.jpg

shot-18.06.29_13.16.19-0772.jpg

Edited by Dave_1974

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IFHE is a waste of points, in the case. You really should be putting those points into either concealment or fire prevention, instead. I'm going fire prevention myself, since you are getting close to other people's secondaries when you're in brawling range. When I'm going to be as close as I usually am to the enemy, the concealment means nothing anyways.

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