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TangoCayman

Nerf that Khab already

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NERF THE KHAB IT IS TOO DAMN POWERFUL.

 

NERF HE PEN

NERF ROF

NERF RANGE

ALL OF IT and yes im holding down the shift key.... i am sick of this.

Nerf it or im done.

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Did you just get killed by one per chance. Never chase a Khaby not even once or twice. The Khaby doesn't like it and dying isn't nice.

The rhyme is a play on "Never Tease A Weasel". My mom read this book to my siblings and I when I was 3 or 4.

5b3004fbd5cc2_51Okw1qx19L._SX365_BO1204203200_.jpg.6f655d34740986ca9a815efe9601f01a.jpg

Never tease a Weasel not even once or twice a Weasel doesn't like it and teasing isn't nice. I must have liked it I remember the saying.

Edited by Sovereigndawg
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10 minutes ago, TangoCayman said:

Nerf it or im done.

Dang, you have WG over the barrel, now!  That'll show 'em!

Edited by desmo_2
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16 minutes ago, TangoCayman said:

NERF HE PEN

NERF ROF

NERF RANGE

Nah, tbh HE pen is where I feel like my khaba struggles.

RoF is fine.

Range is fine, and actually nerfed compared to what it used to be, and is being buffed with lengendary modules.

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15 minutes ago, desmo_2 said:

Dang, you have WG over the barrel, now!  That'll show 'em!

Nah, he forgot to say that he spends money and therefore his opinion counts more than F2P players. :Smile_teethhappy:

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Nerf it? There's people on these forums that want the ships manueverability restored. They want it buffed! And so do I! 

If you're in a DD against Khab, youre dead. Plain and simple. No... A Gearing can't Solo it. The Shima melts. The YueYang fares better. The Groz is... MIA. The Z52 can hurt it badly with AP but will still lose.

Cruisers? Good luck. Only a Hindi and Moskva pose any threat. But they don't die to it either. Kind of a stalemate. Unless they go crazy and decide to go broadside. Which alot of dummies do. Then they get citadelled. The minotaur is the biggest offender.

And BBs fear the Khab... It can BBQ battleships nonstop.  But their AP is very accurate and can hurt the DD badly and reliably with the current broken AP mechanics. Unless that was fixed...

Nerf it you say?

I'm going to hazard a guess and say this thread is over some salt, a very sore and stretched wide open  rear end, or you don't know your ships very well in WoWs.

Edited by ElectroVeeDub

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Personally, the only problem I have with Khaba is how it somehow manages to retain its speed while still sporting the 50 mm armor since...well...let's just say physics and historical tests disagree.

Otherwise, I have no issues with Khaba. It is quite typical of the Russian gunboat line, and thrives on the likes of overextended battleships and anything that can't deal with it at long range. Chasing it is usually a horrible idea, since it can be quite evasive and it certainly won't have any issues burning a single ship down. However, it sacrifices detection and torpedoes for this (and AA), and that 50 mm armor plating means that BB AP can still deal a horrendous amount of damage if you aim well.

Overall, the only peeve I have with it is its physical contradictions. Otherwise, it's quite well-balanced in this state, IMO.

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I hate to break it to ya buddy, but they are gonna buff it's range.

To let you know it's history.

They nerfed torpedo range.

They nerfed gun range.

They nerfed it's detection range.

They nerfed it's rudder so bad that you have to use both rudder modules...

This ship has had the nerf bat swung at it so much that an average potato struggles....

.....

If YOU think it is too OP, please play 100 battles in It, then tell us what you think.

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My Yamato killed 2 Khabs and took the cap from them.  Does that mean Yamato needs double the nerfs Khab needs?

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1 hour ago, ElectroVeeDub said:

Nerf it? There's people on these forums that want the ships manueverability restored. They want it buffed! And so do I! 

If you're in a DD against Khab, youre dead. Plain and simple. No... A Gearing can't Solo it. The Shima melts. The YueYang fares better. The Groz is... MIA. The Z52 can hurt it badly with AP but will still lose.

Cruisers? Good luck. Only a Hindi and Moskva pose any threat. But they don't die to it either. Kind of a stalemate. Unless they go crazy and decide to go broadside. Which alot of dummies do. Then they get citadelled. The minotaur is the biggest offender.

And BBs fear the Khab... It can BBQ battleships nonstop.  But their AP is very accurate and can hurt the DD badly and reliably with the current broken AP mechanics. Unless that was fixed...

Nerf it you say?

I'm going to hazard a guess and say this thread is over some salt, a very sore and stretched wide open  rear end, or you don't know your ships very well in WoWs.

I personally think that they should buff the Khab's concealment... considerably.  I described why in the IJN DD thread, but I'll say it again.  I think that a number of RU DDs need to have their concealment reduced.  They're set so high because they were meant to prevent RU DDs from open water stealth firing at too short a range.  But now that OWSF is no longer a thing, they should reduce those concealment values.  They should do this to encourage those RU DDs to move in closer and contend for caps. 

Right now, if you're in a Khab with a dual rudder build (no conceal module) and no CE skill (because it's just not worth taking right now, IMO, with so many other more useful skills), your minimum conceal is 9.7 km (including camo paint).  You can't be a good cap contender when the enemy can outspot you by over 3 km.  They can just run away, launch torps on you, and just keep you spotted for their team mates.  IMO, RU DDs like the Khab need to have much lower concealments so that they can get close enough to caps to be competitive.  Not outspot the enemy.  Just low enough to be competitive with other same tier non-IJN DDs.  Also note even with such greatly improved concealments, it can be a big risk for a DD like the Khab to get so close to DDs with good torps, because the Khab is in my experience, terrible at avoiding ship launched torps, because even with a double rudder setup, her great speed and low agility makes avoiding torps nearly impossible.  (If Khabs were going to get serious about cap contending, they probably should take the Vigilance skill to enhance their torp beats ability.)

But so long as concealments for RU DDs like the Khab and Kiev are so terrible, it will be hard to get a lot of their players to want to get in a lot closer to caps while they're so badly outspotted by similar tier DDs.

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2 hours ago, ElectroVeeDub said:

Nerf it? There's people on these forums that want the ships manueverability restored. They want it buffed! And so do I! 

If you're in a DD against Khab, youre dead. Plain and simple. No... A Gearing can't Solo it. The Shima melts. The YueYang fares better. The Groz is... MIA. The Z52 can hurt it badly with AP but will still lose.

Cruisers? Good luck. Only a Hindi and Moskva pose any threat. But they don't die to it either. Kind of a stalemate. Unless they go crazy and decide to go broadside. Which alot of dummies do. Then they get citadelled. The minotaur is the biggest offender.

And BBs fear the Khab... It can BBQ battleships nonstop.  But their AP is very accurate and can hurt the DD badly and reliably with the current broken AP mechanics. Unless that was fixed...

Nerf it you say?

I'm going to hazard a guess and say this thread is over some salt, a very sore and stretched wide open  rear end, or you don't know your ships very well in WoWs.

A second reply.

I wish that the Khab's maneuverability was restored, in addition to a big concealment boost.  Having said that, I do wish that it was nerfed in some way so that it wasn't quite so devastatingly effective in 1v1 DD duels.  Maybe greatly reduced armor?

The problem I see with the Khab is that it's so brutally optimized for being a long range gunboat that it really does perform a lot more like a super-fast light cruiser than a destroyer.  But the thing is that it *IS* classified as a destroyer and is often expected to do things that other DDs take for granted, like contending caps.  But right now, it's just too easy to spot to get close enough to be a good cap contender.  And it's too unmaneueverable to want to get too close to torp using DDs because it will have a difficult time  avoiding said torps.  At the same time, because of its strong armor, it's hard for any other good gunboat to hurt it.

I'm not sure why you say that the YY fares better against the Khab, except perhaps because it has more speed than the Gearing.  The YY's big downside is its DW torps.  A Khab has no reason to fear torps in a duel against a YY (or any other PA DD or the Asashio) and can bore right in on one, whereas against all non-PA DDs, the Khab has to at least respect the threat of regular torpedoes in a DDvDD close range duel.

 

I guess what it comes down to is this.  How does WG want the Khab and similar RU DDs to be used and seen?  As long range gunboats that many will fear to bring close to a cap that's contended, or as a DD that can perform most, if not all, normal DD tasks, even if a little differently.  Right now, the Khab seems to be the former, when it might be better for the game if it was closer to the latter.

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45 minutes ago, dEsTurbed1 said:

I hate to break it to ya buddy, but they are gonna buff it's range.

To let you know it's history.

They nerfed torpedo range.

They nerfed gun range.

They nerfed it's detection range.

They nerfed it's rudder so bad that you have to use both rudder modules...

This ship has had the nerf bat swung at it so much that an average potato struggles....

.....

If YOU think it is too OP, please play 100 battles in It, then tell us what you think.

I don't think that it's quite as bad as you make it out to be.  But you're not entirely wrong either.  It's not so OP that it's a guaranteed win to play kind of ship.

But as I've outlined in earlier posts, I do kind of wish that the devs would make some tweaks to the Khab (and similar RU DDs) to make them play a bit closer to traditional DDs, and be capable of being cap contenders.  Sure, some Khab players are so good (or so crazy) that they'll take their Khabs in and brawl.  But most won't.  I think that it'd be nice if they were tweaked in such a way that people were more comfortable with the idea of bringing their Khabs in closer to caps and contend for those caps.

 

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1 hour ago, Crucis said:

I'm not sure why you say that the YY fares better against the Khab, except perhaps because it has more speed than the Gearing.  The YY's big downside is its DW torps.  A Khab has no reason to fear torps in a duel against a YY (or any other PA DD or the Asashio) and can bore right in on one, whereas against all non-PA DDs, the Khab has to at least respect the threat of regular torpedoes in a DDvDD close range duel.

I made it to rank #1 in a Khab, and had it probably 6 weeks after release years ago. It was my first T10 ever. So I've played it a fair amount.

Yes, the YueYangs torps are useless against a Khab. However the YueYangs guns are VICIOUS at a 10km range or so. I've damn near been killed by skilled YY players in a 1vs1 gunfight. Don't kid yourself... They hurt. If the YY has more health... It can kill a Khab. With great difficulty...

The Z52 poses a threat as well in smoke with hydro and AP.

But the Minotaur and Khab can annihilate eachother depending on range and angles. Its surprising...

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Khab appears OP in random battles because it is matched with T8 and T9 ships so often. When matched against T10 ships, it does not shine nearly as brightly. I ranked out in Khab this season and it was very difficult. Some of that is my skill level, but it is also very easy for average players in T10 cruisers and BBs to nail a khab. It is strong when played properly (and when you can avoid getting jumped by a mino, or getting within 13.5k or a zao or hindenburg, or eating full pen from any BB that manages to land a round, or eating a full-spread shimi volley, or getting smoke-hydroed broadside to a Z-52 and eating it....) 

Also, (and I'm guessing here) khab players tend to be specialists. They really focus on the ship and learn how to make it work. When you play khab right, it is very strong, but you really have to get it right or blat. 

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Most dangerous ships to a Khab in descending order, most to least dangerous T10:

IMO...

 

Montana

Republique

Conqueror

Moskva

Hindenburg

DesMoines

Henri

YueYang

Z52

Gearing

Grozovoi (because nobody plays it)

Shimkaze

 

 

The Minotaur is barely a threat at 10kms or higher. Its terrible arcs and the Khabs good armor allows it to bounce most shells. Under 10kms and broadside the Minotaur can curb stomp a Khab if broadside. The Khab can also citadel that cruiser nearly as quickly. So I'm not sure how to rank it... Its the strongest and weakest...

Kurfurst? Meh... If in secondary range. Yamato? It doesn't tend to hit it. Zao? It can be deadly in skilled hands but tends to stealth up and it's succeptable to the Khabs AP. Less of an issue... Yet the HE can be devestating.

 

Mind you I say this assuming you're in high ranked games or clan battles. Not randoms.

 

 

Edited by ElectroVeeDub

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6 hours ago, Crucis said:

I don't think that it's quite as bad as you make it out to be.  But you're not entirely wrong either.  It's not so OP that it's a guaranteed win to play kind of ship.

But as I've outlined in earlier posts, I do kind of wish that the devs would make some tweaks to the Khab (and similar RU DDs) to make them play a bit closer to traditional DDs, and be capable of being cap contenders.  Sure, some Khab players are so good (or so crazy) that they'll take their Khabs in and brawl.  But most won't.  I think that it'd be nice if they were tweaked in such a way that people were more comfortable with the idea of bringing their Khabs in closer to caps and contend for those caps.

 

Only a buff to detection would do that. 

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I could casually defeat a Minotaur and Cleveland at the same time in Buffalo in a sudden encounter, unless I misjudge the torpedoes badly.

1v1 Khabarovsk magic Russki Master Race smacks Buffalo around casually every time and has magical Russian Hidden Fire Chance Bonus that lets it set 2 superstructure fires within 3 salvos every time. Not to mention the accuracy that lets you actually score said 2 fires continuously.

I spit upon this abomination of balancing and am contemplating simply never playing above Tier 7 because of this grotesque heap of Stalinium lies.

 

Nerf the damned speed down from "cheaty speed trials" AND significantly nerf the rate of fire in exchange for the laser accuracy, velocity and it might be balanced.

Alternatively, just remove the Hidden Russki Fire Chance Bonus.

Edited by Guardian54

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When you are as slow to grind things as I am you pay...only my second of two tier X ships, I got Khab after the nerf bat. I don’t sail her much (or didn’t when I was playing regularly). Bottom line: simply not a fun ship to sail. Taking a ship that is powerful and can win matches for you and making it spectacularly unrewarding to sail is the real nerf.  Obviously, YMMV.

Hindy is my other Tier X...and possibly a better cap contender, heh. 

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On 6/24/2018 at 1:38 PM, TangoCayman said:

NERF THE KHAB IT IS TOO DAMN POWERFUL.

 

NERF HE PEN

NERF ROF

NERF RANGE

ALL OF IT and yes im holding down the shift key.... i am sick of this.

Nerf it or im done.

Meh - the Khab is a good boat, of that there is no doubt - but after the gun range, torp range and rudder speed nerfs, I think she is somewhat balanced.

There are lots of players in Khabs that don't play her to her strengths - which is killing every red DD it can, as quickly as it can.  Plenty are content to sail it around, setting fires on BBs - but given the likelihood of domination matches at T10, where securing caps is more important than damage totals against BBs, its a ship that isn't used all that effectively by many (maybe even most?).

I frankly - find her pretty boring - if I want that playstyle, I'm more likely to sail Hindy instead - a ship that is far more capable of influencing match outcomes than the Khab.

The Groz, however - now thats a DD thats fun to play.  Effective in traditional DD roles, has a heal while not giving up smoke, can wreck planes, and can bring the AP pain at least as effectively as the Z52 - whats not to love?

Edited by ddoubletapp1

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On 6/24/2018 at 1:38 PM, TangoCayman said:

NERF THE KHAB IT IS TOO DAMN POWERFUL.

 

NERF HE PEN

NERF ROF

NERF RANGE

ALL OF IT and yes im holding down the shift key.... i am sick of this.

Nerf it or im done.

This is his first post and he wants the Khaba to be nerfed lol.  Wheres down voting when you need it.

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On 6/24/2018 at 4:38 PM, TangoCayman said:

NERF THE KHAB IT IS TOO DAMN POWERFUL.

 

NERF HE PEN

NERF ROF

NERF RANGE

ALL OF IT and yes im holding down the shift key.... i am sick of this.

Nerf it or im done.

BuhBye:Smile_great::Smile_honoring:

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