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SeigeTank2010

6 bombs drop. 5 hit. 4 over-penetrate ?!

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So how is it a bomb that's set to explode on contact when dropped from above the ship (let alone perfectly parallel with the ship's current course) over-penetrate, cause almost no damage and do not even cause flooding?   For one to do it?  Ok, whatever.   But 4 of them to do it when you dropped 6 and 5 hit?   LOL

 

Edited by SeigeTank2010

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8 minutes ago, SeigeTank2010 said:

So how is it a bomb that's set to explode on contact when dropped from above the ship (let alone perfectly parallel with the ship's current course) over-penetrate, cause almost no damage and do not even cause flooding?   For one to do it?  Ok, whatever.   But 4 of them to do it when you dropped 6 and 5 hit?   LOL

 

Use HE bombs instead of AP bombs?

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AP bombs need a certain amount of deck armor to arm.

Enterprise's AP bombs, for instance, need 70mm of deck armor to arm and penetrate to about 184 mm. Any less and the bomb will overpen, any more and the bomb will shatter.

For this reason, pretty much all destroyers are immune to AP bombs, most USN bbs don't care at all, and German BBs suffer greatly.

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Too big; armor too thin...

Thus, the smaller GZ AP bombs are OP, while US 1000lb AP bombs can't do anything worth noting to ships not named Bismarck or Tirpitz...

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Got 3 citadels from AP bombs on the Scharn, and 1 citadel on the kuma just for HE bomb, different CV of course.

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Welcome to USN AP bombers!  Highly specialized and capable of decimating...a small number of ships.  And scratching everyone else.

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1 hour ago, SeigeTank2010 said:

So how is it a bomb that's set to explode on contact when dropped from above the ship (let alone perfectly parallel with the ship's current course) over-penetrate, cause almost no damage and do not even cause flooding?   For one to do it?  Ok, whatever.   But 4 of them to do it when you dropped 6 and 5 hit?   LOL

 

Because that’s how AP bombs are designed to work on game. Certain ships you will almost always overpen and never get a full pen. You need to know the deck armor of each ship you’re planning to bomb to know whether or not you will pen them or overpen them. As others have said, they need a certain amount of deck armor to arm.

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4 hours ago, Avenge_December_7 said:

For this reason, pretty much all destroyers are immune to AP bombs, most USN bbs don't care at all, and German BBs suffer greatly.

You rite
 

Spoiler

Thank god this isn't the current/final build on GZ
Shot-17.09.19 20.33.19-0522 by PH-PennySnowFlyer

 

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3 minutes ago, Amatsukaze_KaiNi said:

You rite
 

 

Thank god GZ is finalized.

Edited by renegadestatuz

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2 minutes ago, Amatsukaze_KaiNi said:

You rite
 

  Hide contents

Thank god this isn't the current/final build on GZ
Shot-17.09.19 20.33.19-0522 by PH-PennySnowFlyer

 

Jesus christ, how in the [edited] did WG think that was a good idea?

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Just now, renegadestatuz said:

Thank god GZ is finalized.

Too bad it's incredibly OP and made for unskilled play.

  • hydro on a CV: lol what?
  • turtleback armor that apparently can sometimes shatter BB shells and definitely makes cruiser and dd guns suffer
  • secondaries that make closing with her a risky business (since when could carriers confidently duel destroyers at close range and win?)
  • dive bombers that just don't give a [edited] about anything short of actually dying
    • circle reticle = no aiming required: just click and get massive damage
    • ap bombs that are better than USN AP bombs (despite Graf Zeppelin historically having never held a candle to the other tier 8 CVs)
  • torpedo bombers with an excellent drop pattern (hard to avoid) and the option for deep water torpedoes
  • bloody 10-plane fighter squadron that can simply wreck havoc on anything that gets caught in its strafe; a good GZ player can basically make enemy fighters scramble to get out of its path while its bombers nuke everything with a force that makes Kaga jealous

The list goes on and on.

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1 hour ago, renegadestatuz said:

Because that’s how AP bombs are designed to work on game. Certain ships you will almost always overpen and never get a full pen. You need to know the deck armor of each ship you’re planning to bomb to know whether or not you will pen them or overpen them. As others have said, they need a certain amount of deck armor to arm.

AP bombs are similar to AP shells.  The contact detonator has a delay so that they do NOT explode on contact.  You want shells and bombs to penetrate the armor, not explode outside of it and scratch the paint.

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If it's an "over-penetrate", how is it it did not create a hole in the hull and hence flooding, since it's coming from almost straight up?  Granted they can repair it but it should at least create flooding when coming down from 90 degrees.

Second "switch to HE" is useless advice when you can't switch in a battle and furthermore have no way of knowing which types or tiers of ships you're about to face to pick the "right" bomb type.

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48 minutes ago, SeigeTank2010 said:

If it's an "over-penetrate", how is it it did not create a hole in the hull and hence flooding, since it's coming from almost straight up?  Granted they can repair it but it should at least create flooding when coming down from 90 degrees.

Second "switch to HE" is useless advice when you can't switch in a battle and furthermore have no way of knowing which types or tiers of ships you're about to face to pick the "right" bomb type.

Because it doesn’t work like that in game. Flooding only comes from torps or ramming.

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2 hours ago, Amatsukaze_KaiNi said:

You rite
 

  Hide contents

Thank god this isn't the current/final build on GZ
Shot-17.09.19 20.33.19-0522 by PH-PennySnowFlyer

 

That's what happens when you build Battleships for a prior war instead of accounting for new developments :Smile_teethhappy:  Every real navy in the world got that memo already, some much earlier like the US Navy (which incidentally handles AP bombs very well in the game), but everyone else got the memo.  The British climbed on board Post-WWI and even the Japanese saw the trend.  Except of course, Ze Germans :Smile_teethhappy:

 

As for AP Bombs, buddy of mine who loves Lexington and is actually very good with her, refuses to switch to AP bombs.  His reason is obvious.  It makes his CV too specialized for BBs German Battleships.  He keeps traditional TB + HE Dive Bombers with Sexi Lexi.  The HE DBs are good against all target types, especially DDs and Cruisers.  There are no HE DB "overpens."

"But Haze, that means he can't nuke the sh*t out of those German BBs!"

He doesn't care.  He just DOT Stacks Battleships and that is as fatal to a BB as anything else out there.  He's extremely disciplined on his timing to nail a BB after it has used its Damage Control Party against Flood effect.  Once that DCP is on cooldown, the HE DBs are coming and it's game over.

 

I've watched him troll the sh*t out of BBs.  He nails them with the TBs, lands a Flood, forces the DCP use, and waits.  He even keeps the DBs flying just outside the AA range, just to let the BB player know what's coming when that DCP active timer goes away.

 

Even better, this technique is super reliable against ALL BB types.  Not just German BBs.  A USN BB is just as prone to being killed by DOT Stacking as a German BB is by AP Dive Bombers.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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55 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

That's what happens when you build Battleships for a prior war instead of accounting for new developments :Smile_teethhappy:  Every real navy in the world got that memo already, some much earlier like the US Navy (which incidentally handles AP bombs very well in the game), but everyone else got the memo.  The British climbed on board Post-WWI and even the Japanese saw the trend.  Except of course, Ze Germans :Smile_teethhappy:

 

As for AP Bombs, buddy of mine who loves Lexington and is actually very good with her, refuses to switch to AP bombs.  His reason is obvious.  It makes his CV too specialized for BBs German Battleships.  He keeps traditional TB + HE Dive Bombers with Sexi Lexi.  The HE DBs are good against all target types, especially DDs and Cruisers.  There are no HE DB "overpens."

"But Haze, that means he can't nuke the sh*t out of those German BBs!"

He doesn't care.  He just DOT Stacks Battleships and that is as fatal to a BB as anything else out there.  He's extremely disciplined on his timing to nail a BB after it has used its Damage Control Party against Flood effect.  Once that DCP is on cooldown, the HE DBs are coming and it's game over.

 

I've watched him troll the sh*t out of BBs.  He nails them with the TBs, lands a Flood, forces the DCP use, and waits.  He even keeps the DBs flying just outside the AA range, just to let the BB player know what's coming when that DCP active timer goes away.

 

Even better, this technique is super reliable against ALL BB types.  Not just German BBs.  A USN BB is just as prone to being killed by DOT Stacking as a German BB is by AP Dive Bombers.

Isn’t this normal carrier play?

also, the waiting DBs are risking enemy fighters deleting them - but increase aggravation for the B.B. driver if the fighters don’t come (in time)... 

Firey salt generators: active

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18 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

Isn’t this normal carrier play?

also, the waiting DBs are risking enemy fighters deleting them - but increase aggravation for the B.B. driver if the fighters don’t come (in time)... 

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It's not normal, at least these days.  Lots of Carriers today don't DOT Stack anymore.

 

He'd wait the DBs when the situation was fine.  He's very proficient in deplaning other CVs even with Lexington's single fighter unit regardless of the CV he faced.  Only Enterprise with its endless fighter reserves made him work harder, but I had faith that he'd always win the air war.  Once the air war was won, that's when it was time to troll the BBs for him.

 

I keep telling him he should get Enterprise or just say, "F-ck it and get Midway," but he likes Lexington too much.  He's the only one I personally know that likes her, and is actually good with her.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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2 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

It's not normal, at least these days.  Lots of Carriers today don't DOT Stack anymore.

Why not? Because direct strikes are now more effective, so you can cycle your planes faster??

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3 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

Why not? Because direct strikes are now more effective, so you can cycle your planes faster??

I don't know man!  Why do I see BBs & Cruisers sail right into the middle of an open water cap in the middle of the map to start a game?  Why am I watching Clevelands trying to trade shots with a Yamato in open water at 12km?  The answer lies in there! :Smile_teethhappy:

 

Also, the days of losing your planes to reload a new squadron more quickly went away a long, long time ago.  I think back in late 2015 still.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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3 hours ago, SeigeTank2010 said:

If it's an "over-penetrate", how is it it did not create a hole in the hull and hence flooding, since it's coming from almost straight up?  Granted they can repair it but it should at least create flooding when coming down from 90 degrees.

Second "switch to HE" is useless advice when you can't switch in a battle and furthermore have no way of knowing which types or tiers of ships you're about to face to pick the "right" bomb type.

weve been through this idea, and it was very quickly scrapped.

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15 hours ago, renegadestatuz said:

Because it doesn’t work like that in game. Flooding only comes from torps or ramming.

Oh so the game is designed so that bombs go completely through a ship through the hull that's below water, but no flooding.   Makes sense.   O.o

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13 hours ago, Hanger_18 said:

weve been through this idea, and it was very quickly scrapped.

What logic was used to supposedly scrap this?

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what ship you was using and what ship you was targer?

Btw, yep, its weird bombs get overpens but not floods. Bombs are... or too good, or totaly useless, too much rng on this sh*t.

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27 minutes ago, SeigeTank2010 said:

Oh so the game is designed so that bombs go completely through a ship through the hull that's below water, but no flooding.   Makes sense.   O.o

Never said it makes sense. Just the way it is.

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