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l1nv5

Possible CV fix?

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There are many CV players regard their planes as their weapons and their lives. Without Planes, CVs are useless. So maybe planes HP should be counted towards CV total HP? For e.g. if a CV is deplaned, his HP should be lower compared to a CV that is full of planes and each plane kill is also counted towards the DMG number one received when shooting down the planes. There are too many matches where one side lost just because they can't kill the CV in time. This fix will both rewards more for shooting down planes, plus, make CV survivablity more on-par with other ships in the game.

Thought?

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12 minutes ago, l1nv5 said:

There are many CV players regard their planes as their weapons and their lives. Without Planes, CVs are useless. So maybe planes HP should be counted towards CV total HP? For e.g. if a CV is deplaned, his HP should be lower compared to a CV that is full of planes and each plane kill is also counted towards the DMG number one received when shooting down the planes. There are too many matches where one side lost just because they can't kill the CV in time. This fix will both rewards more for shooting down planes, plus, make CV survivablity more on-par with other ships in the game.

Thought?

no

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If a team can't kill a deplaned CV in time to win a match, they honestly don't deserve to win

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2 minutes ago, Cruiser_Noshiro said:

If a team can't kill a deplaned CV in time to win a match, they honestly don't deserve to win

For e.g. you have a DD left, shooting at a CV that's hiding 20km far corner of the map?

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22 minutes ago, l1nv5 said:

For e.g. you have a DD left, shooting at a CV that's hiding 20km far corner of the map?

Then the DD loses the game for the team due to not knowing how best to win

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52 minutes ago, l1nv5 said:

There are many CV players regard their planes as their weapons and their lives. Without Planes, CVs are useless. So maybe planes HP should be counted towards CV total HP? For e.g. if a CV is deplaned, his HP should be lower compared to a CV that is full of planes and each plane kill is also counted towards the DMG number one received when shooting down the planes. There are too many matches where one side lost just because they can't kill the CV in time. This fix will both rewards more for shooting down planes, plus, make CV survivablity more on-par with other ships in the game.

Thought?

If a ship loses a turret, should it lose a portion of its hp, on top of whatever damage it had received in the volley that destroyed that turret?

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17 minutes ago, Cruiser_Noshiro said:

Then the DD loses the game for the team due to not knowing how best to win

A CV can be effective sitting anywhere in the map. A DD just killed another DD in another corner of the map and head for the CV. Is that CV worthy of the win just because he is sitting far away from his teammates?

 

7 minutes ago, sulghunter331 said:

If a ship loses a turret, should it lose a portion of its hp, on top of whatever damage it had received in the volley that destroyed that turret?

Sure. But a ship doesn't have 100+ turrets as far as I know

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3 minutes ago, l1nv5 said:

Sure. But a ship doesn't have 100+ turrets as far as I know

I meant in proportion. If an Iowa lost a turret, for example, it would lose the same amount of health a CV would if it were to lose a third of its air wing.

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A CV can be effective sitting anywhere in the map. A DD just killed another DD in another corner of the map and head for the CV. Is that CV worthy of the win just because he is sitting far away from his teammates?

YES!!! Why would a BB, a DD or a cruiser in the same situation as you described be more entitled to seal the victory than a CV?

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1 minute ago, sulghunter331 said:

I meant in proportion. If an Iowa lost a turret, for example, it would lose the same amount of health a CV would if it were to lose a third of its air wing.

I don't believe that would be so much issue for surface ships as BBs and CAs rarely lost their turrets anyways. The issue with CV is that they can be deplaned, having absolutely 0 impact if the game goes on and still can win the game by hiding far enough. Plane survivability is low but CV survivability is way too high. Not as if CV survivability is the most important aspect of how good CV dominates the game but this should fix a (small) part of it.

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1 minute ago, kgh52 said:

YES!!! Why would a BB, a DD or a cruiser in the same situation as you described be more entitled to seal the victory than a CV?

Because surface ships has to "be" there to kill/make impact/carry the game. And it's too much to ask surface ships to then having to travel the whole map surface to seal the win for the team. Most ships don't travel 100kts you know. A deplaned CV is essentially a dead weight. It's just stupid to reward someone for just their presence.

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14 minutes ago, l1nv5 said:

A CV can be effective sitting anywhere in the map. A DD just killed another DD in another corner of the map and head for the CV. Is that CV worthy of the win just because he is sitting far away from his teammates?

Well, yes. The CV/DD duo played smartly. By sacrificing himself, the DD distracted the enemy DD and allowed the CV to survive long enough to run down the clock.

 

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2 minutes ago, sulghunter331 said:

Well, yes. The CV/DD duo played smartly. By sacrificing himself, the DD distracted the enemy DD and allowed the CV to survive long enough to run down the clock.

 

Most of the games I played are just CVs surviving by doing CV things, aka sitting essentially outside the map. Imagine playing chess and you take your King and put inside a pocket

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5 minutes ago, l1nv5 said:

Most of the games I played are just CVs surviving by doing CV things, aka sitting essentially outside the map. Imagine playing chess and you take your King and put inside a pocket

A CV sits so far back because it has to. It has no armor, no useful guns, can be spotted from ranges that make battleships look stealthy by comparison, and even one fire can either negate their strength entirely or seriously hamper it. 

Also, the CV is more akin to a queen in power. 

Have you ever once considered counter tactics against CVs instead of simply bemoaning them?

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Because surface ships has to "be" there to kill/make impact/carry the game. And it's too much to ask surface ships to then having to travel the whole map surface to seal the win for the team. Most ships don't travel 100kts you know. A deplaned CV is essentially a dead weight. It's just stupid to reward someone for just their presence.

The fact that a CV without planes can capture points invalidates you "dead weight" claim.

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Just now, kgh52 said:

The fact that a CV without planes can capture points invalidates you "dead weight" claim.

It also still has secondaries, Kaga's and GZ's secondaries are no joke.

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51 minutes ago, l1nv5 said:

Because surface ships has to "be" there to kill/make impact/carry the game. And it's too much to ask surface ships to then having to travel the whole map surface to seal the win for the team. Most ships don't travel 100kts you know. A deplaned CV is essentially a dead weight. It's just stupid to reward someone for just their presence.

Every map in game has caps. You can take those instead. And surface ships just have to be there to shoot down planes as well, there is no skill or effort involved.

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1 hour ago, sulghunter331 said:

A CV sits so far back because it has to. It has no armor, no useful guns, can be spotted from ranges that make battleships look stealthy by comparison, and even one fire can either negate their strength entirely or seriously hamper it. 

Also, the CV is more akin to a queen in power. 

Have you ever once considered counter tactics against CVs instead of simply bemoaning them?

What tactics to chase down and kill a full HP CV at the end of the game, hiding in 1 corner of the map? Looking for and spot it by itself a hard enough feat on its won, yet still have to drain its useless HP to secure a win? When you have already killed all surface ships, take all the caps, shoot down all the planes, the game should be an auto win imo. A CV already has the ultimate ability to carry a team by being the best at dealing damage and spotting DDs, that's good enough, we don't need a CV that can carry the team even more by just surviving.

 

1 hour ago, kgh52 said:

The fact that a CV without planes can capture points invalidates you "dead weight" claim.

Sure, but a 1000 hp CV also can cap, but it's just unfair for teams, who has killed everything in their path to lost a game due to 1 CV hiding AFK in 1 corner.

35 minutes ago, cometguy said:

And surface ships just have to be there to shoot down planes as well, there is no skill or effort involved.

CV is the ONLY ship in game not having to risk its life to deal damage to other ships. It has to change. And btw, secondary damage are no skill involved, yet the damage is still counted in XP calculation.

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55 minutes ago, l1nv5 said:

What tactics to chase down and kill a full HP CV at the end of the game, hiding in 1 corner of the map? Looking for and spot it by itself a hard enough feat on its won, yet still have to drain its useless HP to secure a win? When you have already killed all surface ships, take all the caps, shoot down all the planes, the game should be an auto win imo. A CV already has the ultimate ability to carry a team by being the best at dealing damage and spotting DDs, that's good enough, we don't need a CV that can carry the team even more by just surviving.

 

Sure, but a 1000 hp CV also can cap, but it's just unfair for teams, who has killed everything in their path to lost a game due to 1 CV hiding AFK in 1 corner.

CV is the ONLY ship in game not having to risk its life to deal damage to other ships. It has to change. And btw, secondary damage are no skill involved, yet the damage is still counted in XP calculation.

As hard as a team may fight, if the other team hoards enough points such that the last surviving member just has to hide and run down the clock to win, than that other team had earned that win. It may seem unfair to the first team, but think about the second team, and what it had to do to put itself into the position that running down the clock is the winning move.

Another thing that you've failed to consider is that if one team has one CV, then the other team has a CV. Your CV would've been key in finding/spotting the last surviving enemy ship, although, if you left your CV hanging in the wind as destroyers ambushed him or let the enemy CV snipe him, then the loss that you suffered is your own fault.

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Except no,  it does not have to change.  And if your team has 'killed everything in its way' except the CV then you lost on caps,  not because you had one ship left hanging out in a corner.  

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1 hour ago, l1nv5 said:

CV is the ONLY ship in game not having to risk its life to deal damage to other ships. It has to change. And btw, secondary damage are no skill involved, yet the damage is still counted in XP calculation.

Make it to where CVs don't run out of planes, can't be stopped from launching or shot down, and can effectively be attacking a target every 30 seconds, and you have a deal. Otherwise CVs will continue to be subjected to mechanics impeding their ability to attack that no one else subjected to, and so shouldn't be subjected to the same threats of survival.

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Rarely have I seen the survivability of a deplaned CV factor into the outcome of a match. But if we're going to run with this idea, let's take a look at one unintended consequence.

 

Example using Ranger or Hiryuu, the most common T7 CVs and assuming the AS skill is active:

I, in my  CV, try to snipe the enemy CV and fail, only cutting his health down to half and losing all of my planes in the process (I'll assume the enemy lost no planes in the engagement, which is generous). I lose 25 or 26 planes out of 72, so I also lose 35-36% of my HP.

However, my trade was a net positive. I took 14-15% more health off the enemy CV, and any advantage in remaining planes is now lost because the enemy can't make use of it before dying to plane bleed (assuming we trade planes equally for the rest of the match). With 25/26 planes, I effectively killed 36.

Those numbers get better or worse depending on how successful the strike is, barring a full kill which is just as effective as always.

Edited by Flashtirade

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