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icuOklaCity

What am I missing about detection

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I've got to be missing something about how the detection / smoke system works... There are 4 detection symbols, Radar Detection(radar screen), Hydro Detection (Head phones), Air detection (Air Plane), and Sight Detection (!)

I'm in my Gearing, about 5 mins into match.  A Buffalo is 13Km out from me.   I duck behind a island with him closing the gap he turns on radar and I'm detected but he can get a shot on me.  He close to about 5-6 km to clear island to get a shot. I pulled out and popped smoke just as his radar ran out. .While in my smoke  I send a salvo of torps his way to make him duck behind a island so I can escape out the back side of smoke screen ... Just as I do,  I'm detected again (!), and stay detected and get deleted by the Buffalo that was 4.7k away and I was in my smoke screen not firing...

So what am I missing here.... I don't see how he regain a sight detection on my Gearing while I was in my smoke screen not firing, and moving at 1/4 throttle  and he was 4.7 km away. There was no other ships within 12 km so it could not have been aa team mate detected me for him...

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Hydro and radar have the same detection icon. Considering the Buffalo was 4.7km away from you, you'd be in his hydro ship detect range, which, coincidentally, is about 4.7km.

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You may be right about his Hydro range, but I got the Sight Detection Symbol (!) not Radar/Hydro symbol... But glad you told me radar and hydro was the same symbol cause I thought Hydro you got a Head Phone symbol...

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Just now, icuOklaCity said:

You may be right about his Hydro range, but I got the Sight Detection Symbol (!) not Radar/Hydro symbol... But glad you told me radar and hydro was the same symbol cause I thought Hydro you got a Head Phone symbol...

There’s always a shimmy just in front of ca when dd hunting. You got troll detected. If you’ve ever played donsky this is shimmy drivers’ national sport since your radar range is less than your detection range.

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There is also Radio Positioning Finder (that commander skill that pings the direction of the nearest target.)  

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Also beware that your ship can be detected within a certain radius when firing from smoke, and even when not firing (the minimum detection range is 2 km).

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Most confusion from people being detected comes from lack of information about all the possibilities within it. Without a replay, nobody is going to be able to tell you how it happened. Based on your extremely small pool of given info, I can only think of two possibilities.

1. Buffalo incapacitated your engine, making you slide out of smoke enough for him or something else to see you. 

2. There was a third party ship spotting you in the smoke with target acquisition mod, giving him 3km assured acquisition over your 2km.

 

its entirely possible neither of these are true, but that is all that works in your given information which can be wrong/incomplete. 

Edited by Pulicat

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Could have just been blind fire, too. I dumpstered a gearing sitting in smoke today at 12k out, in my Montana.

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1 hour ago, Avenge_December_7 said:

Also beware that your ship can be detected within a certain radius when firing from smoke, and even when not firing (the minimum detection range is 2 km).

Very much this.  DDs have more leeway in camping smoke and firing their guns as the detection when firing from smoke is the smallest with such small sized guns.  Cruisers trying the same have to actually be concerned about this.

 

But in the DD game, especially if you're camping smoke, that means another DD could be nearby that you don't know about, and he's in your smoke gunfire detection radius.

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I dont know if it is the "radar explosion" that happened recently or what but DD playing is getting difficult and not fun at all.

I dont understand totally the concealment/detection in this game because I have been in a little Izyaslav being shot by invisible ships 4km away and I was not shooting and detected.

I thought when a ship (specially the big ones) shoots its main battery it becomes instatly visible but I waas seeing the shots coming from nowhere (there was no smoke) but no crapto aim at.

Thats depressing.

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51 minutes ago, Patosentado said:

I dont know if it is the "radar explosion" that happened recently or what but DD playing is getting difficult and not fun at all.

I dont understand totally the concealment/detection in this game because I have been in a little Izyaslav being shot by invisible ships 4km away and I was not shooting and detected.

I thought when a ship (specially the big ones) shoots its main battery it becomes instatly visible but I waas seeing the shots coming from nowhere (there was no smoke) but no crapto aim at.

Thats depressing.

This is an excellent example of why ridiculous mechanics like radar are inherently bad for the game.

They took the long-establishment concealment/detection system which was the very foundation of Warships, and one of the major reasons why it was successful, and they perverted it with the addition of inexplicably rule-breaking mechanics.

There used to be 3 cases when you were spotted: Another ship had LOS on you. A plane was within your detection radius. You were revealed due to close proximity to a ship (2k) or hydro, which is just an extended version of proximity detection.

They added a mechanic which essentially throws that long-establish convention out the window, in favor of magical "reveal all" ability that takes nothing, not terrain, not weather, not LOS, not smoke, not detection rating, nothing at all into account and reveals everything.

You see this happen very often in successful games after launch. The team that created the game moves onto the next thing, and the live team that takes over the operations of the game, doesn't truly understand how the game work or the ingredients of the secret sauce and makes well-intended changes that end up ruining the secret sauce. This is why so many MMOs have "legacy" servers.

RPF was(is) fine. Nerfing torp damage/speed/concealment, fine. Nerfing DD guns, smoke firing, DD detection, DD armor, all fine. Adding radar was a foolish mistake as it messes with one of the core fundamental design conventions of the game.

Edited by Lensar
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19 hours ago, Patosentado said:

I dont know if it is the "radar explosion" that happened recently or what but DD playing is getting difficult and not fun at all.

I dont understand totally the concealment/detection in this game because I have been in a little Izyaslav being shot by invisible ships 4km away and I was not shooting and detected.

 

To answer your question, this is unlikely to have been the result of radar. You'd see an icon on your screen if you're detected by radar/hydro.

 

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Well seeing how it looks like some who reply with what they think could be the reason for me being / staying detected, fail to read my complete post and not just the header before replying. I'm not sure if I reply would help me figure out what I'm missing about detection.. I did learn that Radar and Hydro have the same symbol ( I thought they where different) so thats a plus..

On 15/06/2018 at 12:53 AM, ThemasterTanker1 said:

Hydro and radar have the same detection icon. Considering the Buffalo was 4.7km away from you, you'd be in his hydro ship detect range, which, coincidentally, is about 4.7km.

This may be how I stayed detected.. Even though I was moving away from the Buffalo I was only at 1/4 power so he may have been able to just keep me in his hydro range... But that still don't explain the (!) LOS detection symbol I got.. My smoke screen was still between me and him.

On 15/06/2018 at 1:01 AM, monpetitloup said:

There’s always a shimmy just in front of ca when dd hunting. You got troll detected. If you’ve ever played donsky this is shimmy drivers’ national sport since your radar range is less than your detection range.

As I said in my OP the Buffalo was the only enemy ship with in 12 k  There was no Shanny or any other DD close by. They where accounted for on the other side of mini map.

On 15/06/2018 at 1:21 AM, HamptonRoads said:

There is also Radio Positioning Finder (that commander skill that pings the direction of the nearest target.)  

Was not RPF detected. and PDF don't give the owner of it  detectability of enemy ships. Just gives them a general direction of the closes enemy ship. At least that's how I understand it seeing how I've never ran it on any of my boats/

On 15/06/2018 at 1:43 AM, Avenge_December_7 said:

Also beware that your ship can be detected within a certain radius when firing from smoke, and even when not firing (the minimum detection range is 2 km).

Again as stated in my OP ... I was not firing as I was trying to sneak away  from Buffalo. That was the reason behind the torp salvo... (Hoping I might get lucky with one or 2 torps ) but actually just wanting to get him to reveres back behind island  so I could pop smoke and slide out the back door...

On 15/06/2018 at 1:57 AM, Pulicat said:

Most confusion from people being detected comes from lack of information about all the possibilities within it. Without a replay, nobody is going to be able to tell you how it happened. Based on your extremely small pool of given info, I can only think of two possibilities.

1. Buffalo incapacitated your engine, making you slide out of smoke enough for him or something else to see you. 

2. There was a third party ship spotting you in the smoke with target acquisition mod, giving him 3km assured acquisition over your 2km.

 

its entirely possible neither of these are true, but that is all that works in your given information which can be wrong/incomplete. 

At some point the Buffalo did knock out my engine along with every other system before he made me go for a swim. But the only time I slipped out of my smoke was when I when out the backside  of smoke screen leaving it between me and him.... And again there was no other ships within 12 k of us. I was aware of most of the red team general positions before this engagement started. and the 2 I didn't know their where about ended up across the map from us as reveled by mini map shortly after I went for a swim.....

 

Not trying to sound like a Donkey, with my reply, but still would like to understand how it happen...... If it was anything other then LOS detection I should have seen the symbol for that type of detection and not the LOS (!)...

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I think in this case, unless you give us a replay, it is going to be close to impossible to figure out why you were detected.

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