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crazyferret23777

? about Manual AA

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I am considering putting Manual AA on some of my BB captains and want to know which BB's would be best for that? Should that just be something for USN BB's? Would a ship like the Kii be a troll ship if you added it to it's already great AA? What about other IJN BB's like the Amagi? TIA

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It's mostly effective on US BBs (from tier 8-10) or you can give it to Hood...
but I doubt it when you try it out on Amagi... Probably Kii would need it but I haven't had the ship so I had a little doubt on her...

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AA is good for all Ships but manual AA on a BB is wasted so many other choices that are better.

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USN BB: All T8, T9, and T10

German BB T5,T6,Gnei*. *a must take skill on this ship

Brits BB: T6

IJN BB: Kii only

French BB: T7, T9, T10

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6 minutes ago, Plaatduutsch said:

USN BB: All T8, T9, and T10

German BB T5,T6,Gnei*. *a must take skill on this ship

Brits BB: T6

IJN BB: Kii only

French BB: T7, T9, T10

Tier 6 and 7 USN BB make good use of it also, BUT only should be taken if you truly hate CVs

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6 minutes ago, Psycodiver said:

Tier 6 and 7 USN BB make good use of it also, BUT only should be taken if you truly hate CVs

There are much better BBs for AA at T6 and T7.

The AA skill shows how desperate players are trying to survive in a CV battle rather than a hatred to a class. 

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1 minute ago, Plaatduutsch said:

The AA skill shows how desperate players are trying to survive in a CV battle rather than a hatred to a class. 

Part of the problem is very little of the player base even knows how to concentrate their AA on incoming planes. When you "control" +"left mouse click" on incoming planes it concentrates your AA on those planes even without the manual AA skill. I learned this from the Dunkirk mission a while back and I consistently had the top plane kills for that mission in my little destroyer. I think my record for plane kills in PvP (non carrier) is in my Alabama and killed like 45 planes in one match. The manual skill is nice, it will slaughter planes like there is no tomorrow, but I find there are much better skills to focus on especially since carriers are not in every match.

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The Gneis with AFT, Manual AA for the captain and modules gets it to a rating of 96.

Nothing beats swatting planes out of the air than that!

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I run it on my Scharn, but you have to know what you are doing if you are going to give up 4 points for it.  Typically play it on Sunday afternoons when CVs are out in larger numbers on NA server.  They see easy German BB kill...they soon regret it.

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From Konig all the way to tier X is a good choice,

Konig as an example gives you 158,4 dps in the long AA. Yes in a tier 5 BB. And i will add the fact at tier 5 you will face a lot carriers. Now when you reach at the Gneisenau, Bismarck ....

you will not see many carriers and your AA is already very good and your secondaries are great. So usually the players use AFT and manual secondaries on this ships. But for the Konig and the Bayern it is really a good choice.

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For BBs, Manual AA's returns are best on the BBs that have a solid, big gun, long range AA suite.  The trait buffs 85mm or larger AA guns.

 

Some examples of Manual AA BB candidates that have good long range AA guns.

Spoiler

 

Tier VII+ USN BBs, especially the VIII-X ones.

Tier VIII IJN Premium BB KiiYou know your AA is RIDICULOUS when it makes the AA of North Carolina and Alabama look weak in comparison.  She is a serious Manual AA candidate as her 100mm AA guns are super-nasty and are the core of what makes her AA so dangerous.

Tier X Yamato - Probably not for PVP as AA Yamato is an extremely niche choice, but if you are a Co-op guy, AA Yamato is an extremely valid choice because unlike PVP, in Co-op, you actually see a lot of CVs.

Tier VII Gneisenau - She will eat aircraft, even higher tier aircraft, with ease and ask for more.  Saipan's Tier IX planes?  Taiho's Tier IX planes?  LOL, keep sending them baby!

Tier VII+ Tech Tree German BBs - They actually have pretty good long range AA DPS and range with an AA Build.  But this is typically never realized because German BBs are slanted to anything but AA Build recommendations.

Tier VI Queen Elizabeth - The Best BB AA of Tier VI.  She has a base 89 DPS for her long range guns, and that makes her a deadly candidate for Manual AA.  A key thing to consider is that at Tier VI, she is literally in the middle of the game where there's actual CV activity.  She will see Tier V-VIII CVs and in that MM group, there are many dangerous CVs that see frequent action.  Arizona, Fuso for example will get devoured even by Tier V CVs, but QE will sweep aside planes as if they were lowly peasants.

Tier VII RN Premium BB Duke of York - The returns aren't as big but she can still make use of the trait.  The main thing is DOY's AA DPS is really towards medium and short range, but if you REALLY hate CVs then DOY can still milk it some.  It's just the return on it will not be anything like Gneisenau, who's long range AA is monstrous.

Tier VIII+ RN BBs - They can have great AA but like German BBs, typical builds of these ships tend to never focus on AA.  Conqueror is an excellent example.  I think in reviews, it's been shown that Conqueror, on paper, could have AA that could match or even surpass Montana.  However, doing that means not taking ASM1, which RN BBs kind of need to make their shelling what it is.

Tier VII+ Tech Tree French BBs - From Lyon on in the tech tree, French BBs have very solid AA suites.  Lyon in an AA Build trolls CVs.  Richelieu, Alsace, Republique have the foundations of fantastic AA.  Tier VII-IX, the AA DPS is centered at mid and short ranges, but like DOY, having Manual AA makes the long range AA cut into planes much more from further out.  By the time planes get to the mid-range aura, they're in serious trouble.

 

 

Of all of these however, IMO, USN BBs are still the best candidates above other BB Lines for a true, dedicated AA Build.  The reason is due to the Upgrade System and how unique USN BBs are compared to all other ship lines.  All Non-CV ship lines access ASM1 to improve dispersion in Slot 3 Upgrade Slot.  Except USN BBs, they cannot access ASM1 at all.  Only at Tier IX-X do they access anything to improve dispersion... Artillery Plotting Room Mod 2 (APRM2), and that sits in Slot 6 with the likes of MBM3, AAGM3, etc.  If a Non CV, Non-USN BB wants to get AAGM2 to help bring AA to max range, that means upgrades like ASM1, SBM2 cannot be used.  Same thing vice versa.  Examples.

Spoiler

 

For Conqueror to have an AA Build, that means slotting AAGM2 and not ASM1, and her guns suddenly become more unreliable.  This applies to Lyon, Richelieu, Gneisenau, etc.

 

For Colorado, NC, Alabama, they adopt AAGM2 and focus on AA because that's all they can realistically do.  There's no ASM1 nor APRM2 for them to access, and their secondaries are garbage, so yeah... They take AAGM2 and AA Build because there's nothing else that's really good for them.

 

For Iowa, Missouri, Montana, it's just like CO, NC, 'Bama... Except that not only can they slot AAGM2 and help max out their AA, they can at the same time slot APRM2 to improve gun dispersion, because AAGM2 and APRM2 are in different slots.  Their secondaries are STILL garbage.

 

 

No other Non-CV ship line works like that, not even USN Cruisers and Destroyers, only USN BBs at IX-X can do this.  This is further reinforced since USN BB secondaries as a whole are garbage, so it's nothing at all like French & German BBs which often are seen with Secondary Builds.

 

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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6 hours ago, Plaatduutsch said:

There are much better BBs for AA at T6 and T7.

The AA skill shows how desperate players are trying to survive in a CV battle rather than a hatred to a class. 

True, my point is that it is still viable use of the skill points unlike the Texas where she doesn't have any AA gun bigger than 76mm

 

2 sides of a coin, I won't lie the newer player base really are poor at handling a semi competent CV captain unlike players that were around in the beginning when we had game where it was a T7 and 8 CV vs a single T5 CV. That said good AA helps, when I was nearly done my Nagato grind I changed from AA build to concealment/tank build and I had a match where a T6 CV wouldn't get off me and I couldn't stop him except to maneuver to mitigate damage 

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Manual AA is best on Texas.. since its more of a floating AA platform rather than a BB.

If talking about high tier them probably Fredrich/Kurfurst or Alsace/Republique would be the best ships for it.. Missouri might have been good as well but shes gone now unless you have it in your port

Edited by KAGA_kaini
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20 minutes ago, KAGA_kaini said:

Manual AA is best on Texas.. since its more of a floating AA platform rather than a BB.

If talking about high tier them probably Fredrich/Kurfurst or Alsace/Republique would be the best ships for it.. Missouri might have been good as well but shes gone now unless you have it in your port

Bad. Manual AA skill doesn't affect the AA guns on the Texas because they're below the skill threshold.

 

Manual Fire Control for AA Armament: +100% to average damage per second of AA guns with a caliber exceeding 85mm against a designated target.

Texas AA: 20mm / 40mm / 76,2mm, none which benefit from the skill, meaning there's zero gain on that ship.

Edited by Woofship
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9 hours ago, crazyferret23777 said:

I am considering putting Manual AA on some of my BB captains and want to know which BB's would be best for that? Should that just be something for USN BB's? Would a ship like the Kii be a troll ship if you added it to it's already great AA? What about other IJN BB's like the Amagi? TIA

 

1 hour ago, Woofship said:

Bad. Manual AA skill doesn't affect the AA guns on the Texas because they're below the skill threshold.

 

Manual Fire Control for AA Armament: +100% to average damage per second of AA guns with a caliber exceeding 85mm against a designated target.

Texas AA: 20mm / 40mm / 76,2mm, none which benefit from the skill, meaning there's zero gain on that ship.

What no one talked about until Woofship, is that MFCAA only works on AA guns 86mm and bigger. So check your high tier BBs for big AA guns before using this skill on a dedicated BB captain.


Personally, I find Fire Prevention to be a better choice over MFCAA on BBs as it reduces the two superstructure locations for fire to one. AFT extends the AA range for all AA guns and extends the range for all secondary guns. CE lets you go dark easier, to heal for example. BoS reduces fire times. SI gives more heal. I think that there are many better choices for a dedicated BB captain than MFCAA. MFCAA works best on CL/CAs with big gun AA and DFAA.

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10 hours ago, crazyferret23777 said:

I am considering putting Manual AA on some of my BB captains and want to know which BB's would be best for that? Should that just be something for USN BB's? Would a ship like the Kii be a troll ship if you added it to it's already great AA? What about other IJN BB's like the Amagi? TIA

Tier for tier the BEST troll AA BB in the game is the Queen Elizabeth.  Run the specs.  Look at the DPS.  Then take it into battle and shred 'em left and right.  But be warned, there are two things you need to know.  One, you must have good mini-map awareness.  If the CV is coming for you, being in the right position to wreck them is very important (Hint:  A bow position usually isn't the best).  T8 CVs need a bit more respect, but can be dealt with in general.  I've been known to troll T8s on occasion. 

Another dark horse is the Lyon.  Not as good as the QE (tier for tier), as it's a T7 and will see T9 CVs.  But it too has a very powerful AA suite when full spec'd.

 

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Meh, never saw much use for it. With the incredibly low CV pop (not counting the current increase from Halsey campaign), how often would you make use of it. Sure, if you want to spend your dubs / fxp / elite exp on a troll build go for it. Seems like a wasted skill to me, but if that's what floats your boat, others have suggested excellent ships to use it on.

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7 hours ago, Woofship said:

Bad. Manual AA skill doesn't affect the AA guns on the Texas because they're below the skill threshold.

 

Manual Fire Control for AA Armament: +100% to average damage per second of AA guns with a caliber exceeding 85mm against a designated target.

Texas AA: 20mm / 40mm / 76,2mm, none which benefit from the skill, meaning there's zero gain on that ship.

You can't wake up a person who pretends to sleep.

He is very likely to intentionally misinform the  new players who have questions on AA.

YES, MANUAL AA DOES NOT WORK ON TEXAS.

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