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FrodoFraggin

Thoughts on Tier 8

Tier 8  

110 members have voted

  1. 1. With incoming legendary upgrades to Tier 10 and several ships being buffed, should the Tier 8s facing them receive any attention?

    • Buff Tier 8s to keep up with T10 improvements (aware that Tier 6 would have it rougher)
      1
    • Protect Tier 8 matchmaking so they see at most Tier 9
      55
    • Tier 8s: grin and bear it
      54

38 comments in this topic

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Legendary upgrades (some admittedly not too good) and some Tier 10s receiving buffs (yes, one getting nerf), life for Tier 8s could get rougher.  Discuss!

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Ran into a div of testers a couple of nights ago.

Montana, Stalingrad and Rebublique. 

Their accuracy was unbelievable.  3 salvos and my Republique was dead.

I do not like those midules.

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7 minutes ago, dEsTurbed1 said:

Ran into a div of testers a couple of nights ago.

Montana, Stalingrad and Rebublique. 

Their accuracy was unbelievable.  3 salvos and my Republique was dead.

I do not like those midules.

I thought none of those get accuracy upgrade with the legendary upgrades. Only Zao and Yamato’s legendary upgrade contain a accuracy upgrade.

 

On topic; No, I don’t think so. Perhaps something similar should be unlocked when your ship becomes Elite status, for all tiers from 6 to 9?

Edited by LemonadeWarrior

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9 minutes ago, dEsTurbed1 said:

Ran into a div of testers a couple of nights ago.

Montana, Stalingrad and Rebublique. 

Their accuracy was unbelievable.  3 salvos and my Republique was dead.

I do not like those midules.

That's just pure skill you ran into.  Nothing to do with modules at all.

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It doesn't seem to be balanced from a logical standpoint to buff the most powerful ships in the game, and still have them face off against lower tiered ships.  I understand its not about logical balance.

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Still unclear how they are to be obtained...

...and as always Midway gets the shaft...:Smile_sceptic:

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I could see boosting credits and xp given to tier 8 who do damage / sink tier 10 ships with these legendary upgrades. 

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The legendary mods are still in testing so I think it's still to early to tell.   A good deal of them are honestly pretty useless and a bunch of others are more sidegrades than straight upgrades.  From what I'm seeing there are only a few of them that are straight buffs.  

 

17 minutes ago, LemonadeWarrior said:

Only Zao and Yamato’s legendary upgrade contain a accuracy upgrade.

Moskva's does as well

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2 hours ago, Ace_04 said:

That's just pure skill you ran into.  Nothing to do with modules at all.

That and the result of focus fire effectiveness.

Stalingrad and a Zao burned me...then Montana switched to HE....

Game over when Republique Citadeled me from 20 km on my flank....

I lasted 2 minutes once spotted....

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I don't think they're supposed to be actual upgrades, more sidegrades. It's like a cheap way of creating a new T10, without having to make a whole new line.

Also, the idea of buffing T8s in response is really problematic. You'd screw over T6, T7, and T9 in the process. Basically, it's an ugly cascade that I don't think this change warrants.

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I will def grin and bear it because even if it makes it harder to compete in a tier 8.

I am one of those who welcomes more of a challenge and I know that even when a ship gets a buff or a legendary upgrade.

Sadly that does not make the player any better so unless it comes down to Gunstar against EdgeCase :Smile_great:

Most players will not be able to utilize anything given to them like that to gain the advantage in a fight.

Edited by GUNSTAR_THE_LEGEND

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I'm going to hold off until the changes are made and we see what effect the modules have when Tier 8 ships are involved. If I can still do damage and sink Tier 10s with a decent amount of frequency, I won't be as concerned.

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Whether or not they implement these upgrades, I think protected matchmaking for Tier 8s isn't a bad idea.  There's just a huge power gap between 8 and 10.  Probably bigger than any other tier gap in the game.

Ideally, I think they should move Tier 10s into their own queue and make it a Clan Wars/Tier 10 League only thing.  Most of them are fake anyway.

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Just now, TugboatCommander said:

I'm going to hold off until the changes are made and we see what effect the modules have when Tier 8 ships are involved. If I can still do damage and sink Tier 10s with a decent amount of frequency, I won't be as concerned.

I'm going to speak up now because an ounce of prevention is worth (more than) a pound of future corrections that will likely never come. 

Just now, TheDreadnought said:

Ideally, I think they should move Tier 10s into their own queue and make it a Clan Wars/Tier 10 League only thing.  Most of them are fake anyway.

Keep T10's in the game as is, move the upgrades to Clan Wars and other T10 only venues.

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Honestly, I find tier 8 fine and generally competitive even in a tier 10 match. I mean, you're bottom tier and will never do especially well, but that applies to all tiers. Tier 8 BBs all have 32mm plating. Tier 8 DD and Cruisers all have top concealment because of the concealment module. Tier 8 carriers ... will get a rework soon, so let's not talk about them, lol.

I'd say the only ships that really struggle at tier 10 are the cruisers due to the lack of heal when facing 12 gun battleships. I'm still of the opinion that ALL tier 8 cruisers should get Repair Party standard.

As for the legendary modules ... give Wargaming time to test and balance them. I have no problems with them having a strong upgrade as long as the drawback is equally strong. In some cases, the buff is way stronger than the drawback (hello, Hindy, I think your R key is feeling lonely), whereas in other cases, it either is the opposite (hello, Montana ... aren't you glad your Steering Gears won't get knocked out  for too long that once in a blue moon time you take a torpedo hit there?) or just makes no sense at all given how the ship is best played (hello, Des Moines ... how's that open water thing treating you ... wait, you're back to port already?).

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16 minutes ago, KaptainKaybe said:

I'm still of the opinion that ALL tier 8 cruisers should get Repair Party standard.

This is the only kind of buff T8 cruisers need. T8 BBs and DDs uptier pretty well, but boy, does a lack of durability/endurance really hurt some of the T8 cruisers.

It doesn't even have to be the full T9/Atago/PE heal. It only has to be one charge standard so it doesn't cause huge imbalance when matched against lower tiers.

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There wasn't an option for "try to ensure that T8 ships aren't the only one in a T9/10-heavy game." If not protected MM, then at least some sort of MM weighted to putting more T8's in wherever possible.

Unfortunately you can't reliably try these things in Public Test because the population is so much lower that it doesn't reflect live-server reality.

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1 hour ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

There wasn't an option for "try to ensure that T8 ships aren't the only one in a T9/10-heavy game." If not protected MM, then at least some sort of MM weighted to putting more T8's in wherever possible.

Unfortunately you can't reliably try these things in Public Test because the population is so much lower that it doesn't reflect live-server reality.

From your post to God's eyes.....  I have been the "only" or next to only T8 ship for weeks now....  I retired my Tier 9 and 10's when the radar meta started: they are NVA and lose money.

Tier 7 and 8's are the population Tier 9 and 10's farm each and everyday: we are free point for them....  That's why any poll have little or no value: because we are free "stuff" to a lot of WoWs veterans.  If those veterans had to fight their own tiers, they'd hurt their W/L and ePeen bragging rights.......  So, WG will never change this paradigm.   The problem is, new players like me are abandoning Tier 9 and 10 play completely.  I've ground up to Tier 10 and now have retired those ships !  There are hundreds of new players that have figured out that Tier 8 is now at risk and we are actually starting to play down, OUT OF RADAR RANGE, and abandoning ranked, clan and any matches above Tier 7.

I play tier 8 and there are times it is just no fun....  I've stopped in-game spending and in the fall, when several other new games launch, I'm going to only drop in part time.  There are thousands of newer players that are going to vote with our keyboards and hit the "install" button in the very near future.... 

I like this game, I really do; and, I have a lot of friends on-line playing it.  Even teams from "other FPS's" and we all agree:  the paradigm is changing towards.............the 1960's.  The operative question is: do you want to be there because the WoWs  "value proposition" is Iron and Steel ship era naval combat? 

Server reality?  Screen shot after screen shot of being one of 1 or 2 T8 ships in matches....

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Although I clicked "Grin and Bear it", I didn't like the quote.  It's more like "There is nothing wrong with T8".  Seriously.  I play a lot of T8 ships.  From DDs, to CAs, to BBs.  I notice when I'm bottom tier, and the MM line up.  As that is all part of strategic planning.  But I don't think "Ah, crap...I gotta grin and bear it".  No...I think..."Where can I go...what can I do...to be most effective".  I especially look for T9 or  T10 shps that I can complement, either with main fire support or AA support or screening in general.  

Granted, I can't lead an early cap crash in my T8 BB like I can in my T10 BB...a T8 just can't do that in most T10 games.  But I can sure as hell push a cap in support of a T10 group doing the same.  Or if they play a mid game, I can play mid too.  Add weight to the fire of the T10s.  Help focus DDs.  yada yada.

If you think you're dead meat...well....you've already lost half the battle.

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The upgrades aren't the issue, its the MM. I played some many T8 games where I was in T10 MM the last couple of days I just stopped playing them. I even had to run solo because my mates refused to play T8 after a few games. 

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58 minutes ago, Asym_KS said:

Tier 7 and 8's are the population Tier 9 and 10's farm each and everyday: we are free point for them....  That's why any poll have little or no value: because we are free "stuff" to a lot of WoWs veterans.  If those veterans had to fight their own tiers, they'd hurt their W/L and ePeen bragging rights.......  So, WG will never change this paradigm.  

Conspiratorial victim thinking, and sailing very close to libel.

 

47 minutes ago, Soshi_Sone said:

Granted, I can't lead an early cap crash in my T8 BB like I can in my T10 BB...a T8 just can't do that in most T10 games.  But I can sure as hell push a cap in support of a T10 group doing the same.  Or if they play a mid game, I can play mid too.  Add weight to the fire of the T10s.  Help focus DDs.  yada yada.

As someone who came into the game (and to these forums) at a time when people who hung back were getting bashed rather heavily, it got seared into my soul to get well forward and fight. In a Tier 8 ship in Tier 10 games, this gets me killed more often than not - in a radar Edinburgh, I'm too busy finding places to hide to do much, while with smoke I use my concealment to get forward... and then get detected by T10 destroyers and erased almost instantly by higher-tier battleships and heavy cruisers.

Yes, the people being complained about were mostly battleship drivers, but it didn't stop me taking a lot of this criticism to heart and I'm still trying to wean it out of my system. Marty McFly syndrome, LOL. Progress will come with practice, I suppose, but I need to get away from goal-directed missions for a bit.

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4 minutes ago, Canadatron said:

Just play Kutuzov, problem solved.

The problem is getting one for those players who don't already have it.

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