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Hey guys and Wargaming staff,

Are there any upcoming updates for the Conqueror in planning or the development phase? I just had a few battles against it in my t9 and t10 Missouri, and the thing is still stupidly OP. Had a few Conquerors sit completely broadside, while I was shooting back in my Missouri/Iowa, Fredrich de Grobe, and Yamato, and they take less than 10k dmg, no no history of citadels whatsoever. Range varied from 8-18km, but it feels like they are even tankier than the German Battleships. 

This tankiness is fine, but the Conqueror can just return fire with only two of his 4 turrents for +10k dmg in HE, not to mention the numerous fires. And I can't reduce that by angling. I would really like to ask players thoughts on this, as well as suggest to Wargaming to rework the Conqueror, and balance it in light of the new ship lines and reworks that are coming out. Because this is a ship that is still stupidly hard to fight against, unless somehow you got off the perfect torpedo volley...

 

 

 

 

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HE and fire damage can be healed back entirely. I'd rather eat 60k fire damage than 15k citadel damage.

As for citadeling Conq, yeah that's tough to do since the cit sits below the water line.

O5zCupN.jpg

But, 'stupidly OP'? I strongly disagree with that. Conq farms a lot of damage, yes, but doesn't convert that into wins. The vast majority of the damage it farms from the ship type that can best tank that sort of damage and recover it entirely. If Conq was 'stupidly OP' like you claim, it would show in its winrate. Of all T10 battleships, Conq is the one I fear the least.

Montana has broadside weight and accuracy

Kurfuerst has broadside weight and tankiness

Republique has stupid AP penetration and ROF

Yamato has lolpen guns

Conq does meaningless, low value damage and is squishy; were it not for its superheal it would be the most easily killed T10 BB in the game by far.

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Im in for balancing the Conqr or at least the rework on its no skill HE shells.

If it was up to me I would just remove HE shells from it all together and steepen the angles that its AP shells can penetrate.

Or 

Give HE normal pen values because that's a german thing and nerf fire chance because that's a french thing.

 

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Conqueror is like a toned down Asashio, being a very dangerous opponent for any Battleship but against other ship types she struggles.

Against Destroyers she is lacking the HP to take a few Torpedoes, or a way to spot Torpedoes like for example a plane or Hydro.

Cruisers don‘t risk instant deletion from her guns, unlike what a Montana or a Yamato can do against Cruisers. Conqueror and Kurfürst are the two T10 BBs I fear the least when playing a T10 Cruiser myself.

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While the Conqueror is the literal epitome of everything that enrages in the RN BB line, it's but the epitome, the entire line needs to be looked at to make the game more fun. Battleships focused on their HE shells is a joke in and of itself, and these ships, while possibly balanced, make the game unfun and the environment... Unhealthy. I may be (partially) convinced that it's balanced, but that doesn't mean it doesn't need a good looking at and a good balancing. 

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It’s a great ship but not over powered, and misunderstood imo.

Its AP is quite good but under used, definitely accurate and can blap cruisers just fine,  At less than 12 k or so AP can wreck other B.B.

Its HE is best used at long range or angled B.B., sure it can be healed, but it’s wearing the fleet down,

A benefit of fires is people will often use their damage control which can make them more vulnerable to flooding and more fire.  If you can get a sense of what your dd are upto you can create that permaflood situation by leading with fire.

This ship also acts like a sheep dog, herding the enemy as many will turn away from the area this ship is headed 

 

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1 hour ago, Rolkatsuki said:

Im in for balancing the Conqr or at least the rework on its no skill HE shells.

If it was up to me I would just remove HE shells from it all together and steepen the angles that its AP shells can penetrate.

Or 

Give HE normal pen values because that's a german thing and nerf fire chance because that's a french thing.

 

Just get rid of her 420s and call it a day.

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Thanks for your inight guys. We appreciate you sharing your concerns and experiences with us about her. What areas do you feel need particular work to make her balanced? 

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13 hours ago, WolfofWarship said:

What areas do you feel need particular work to make her balanced? 

Reduce to OP-ness of the HE. Its stupid when a conq can shoot the starboard side of my Prinz and knock out one of the torp tubes on the port side, as well as both on the starboard, set 2 fires and knock AA at the same time. The fire chance so broken, so like @Rolkatsuki said, either remove HE altogether(Nothing new since Brit CL's have no HE) or nerf it's blast radius and fire chance.

Edited by Prinz_Eugen_Kai_Ni
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Fighting Conquerors is an exercise in frustration and wholly unfun, but I have to agree, I have yet to see one directly impact a game when all he fires is HE. The HE is absolutely broken, as is the stealth and underwater citadel....but they just don't have that threat. All they really do is just annoy people....
I see a lot of this particularly in the KGV. By all means it's OP as shet with the stealth and HE power and firepower and accuracy and reload, but yet....I can't impact games well. I can't chunk battleships as well as even a Gneisenau. I have matches with 14-20 fires and still lose horribly because I failed to provide impact. All those fires and burned off health is low impact and passive damage, like a Kutuzov or Chapayev. You have to really be able to focus down people and keep those fires lit, which you just can't do as well to battleships that heal it off and cruisers that stealth away and dodge. 
I have more confidence in Scharnhorst AP than the KGV's, and more confidence in the Scharn's armor than KGV, and more confidence in the AA, more confidence in brawls, better speed, better turret traverse, better firing angles, list goes on.....KGV is a mini Conqueror really. But as a Battleship? No. 
Montana, GK, and Yamato are true brutes and real threats. All three of them will easily dump 20k damage per salvo into broadside ships or outright delete them. Konq? Nope. Too busy flinging HE, hiding in stealth, and being even more passive than them. 
I don't fear Conqs even in my Iowa. Fustrating? Yes. But I have stealth Iowa with fireprevention, so I can completely control his output. 

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14 hours ago, WolfofWarship said:

What areas do you feel need particular work to make her balanced? 

IF you ask me, the Conqueror's ability to deal 3 to 4 fire per salvo is the sticking point. I don;t think cruisers in tier 10 can dish out 3 to 4 fires in a single salvo like the Conqueror can. Its the only BB that acts not like a BB, as it performs like an over armored cruiser with weak AP shells ( its weak because no one has faith in using them to save there lives). I don't think WOWS will change that since the 2 Phil's have stated in the KOTS pod cast 

  • Its not nerfing the HE shells anytime soon.
  • Tier X is a fair and balance for which WOWS dedicated 6months of this yrs (starting in Dec of 2017). Just in Tier X events alone

The only good side to this situation is, the Conqueror is  the only BB with very strong HE shells in the tier. You know you see a Conqueror your going to see fire. Now, if there's a lot of Conqueror HE type shells in ever class, every nation in tier X, ( like the problem with Radar being everywhere, every class ship, every nation) then yes I would say address the issue.

Other then that, In summery, yes the HE shells on the Conqueror are annoying/very strong/stronger then any ship in the tier. My recommendation is limit 1 or 2 Conqueror limit in Match making. As for me, I am more concerned about the Radar stew of every ship class, of every nation, starting from tier 8 on-wards. Send my concerns to the necessary WOWS department :). Thank you 

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I don't understand how they thought a 48% fire chance would add to Tier X games. It's a meme, it makes high tier gameplay brainless. I keep saying it in my head. 48%.. it's just ridiculous.

Every conq I've played against plays it like an Atlanta. Then when one stumbles into cap, they're still too silly to let the HE go and swap to AP at 8km distance. You're capable of huge AP damage and have an OP heal but the HE chance pushes people to play passively.

I like playing the RN lines for their AP, but seeing how the higher tiers are played my interest goes more toward french and german lines.

 

A Tier X Warspite.. with speed, good turret rotation, sigma. A man can dream.

Edited by VanillaPepsi

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Just remove the smaller caliber guns and nerf the spread when using HE, that would be all I'd ask for. It might need a bit of a concealment nerf too, it's offensive it can have a smaller spotting range than some cruisers.

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must be doing it all wrong, i've been running the 457s alot with AP and she does ok with them. i ditched the 419s out of principal.  i too feel the fire crap in this game is out of control in general. i would like to see the 457s reload buffed as others stated to a base of 25-27 second range. give the guns the monster boom sound affect like the yammy. i like the super heal, the ship itself is squishy. i wish it could at least get hydros as it has no scout plane. thats my wish list!

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Keep loading AP into Conqueror.  She is coated in 32mm plate, as with other French and RN BBs.  She eats penetrations easily, but too many dumb scrubs in this game won't take advantage of that.  Oh well.

 

Cruiser spam is deadly effective against her as it is with RN & French BBs.  It's very easy even for them to get penetrating hits all over the place.  Now, I wouldn't take my Cruiser 1-on-1 with Conqueror and trade shots, but if you see it busy with a firefight, feel free to rack up hits and reliable damage on her.

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Oh no, a fire.

That thing that BBs have two consumables to utterly negate unless you've overextended or done something wrong.

As opposed to taking 16k of penetration damage from an OK AP salvo?

Still much more afraid of Montanas than this.

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Conqueror is extremely vulnerable to cruiser HE spam, has a low health pool, and while it's heal is very strong, the cooldown is very long. Keep it spotted and it melts.

It's nowhere near as OP as most people claim.

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On 6/10/2018 at 8:26 AM, Lert said:

HE and fire damage can be healed back entirely. I'd rather eat 60k fire damage than 15k citadel damage.

As for citadeling Conq, yeah that's tough to do since the cit sits below the water line.

O5zCupN.jpg

But, 'stupidly OP'? I strongly disagree with that. Conq farms a lot of damage, yes, but doesn't convert that into wins. The vast majority of the damage it farms from the ship type that can best tank that sort of damage and recover it entirely. If Conq was 'stupidly OP' like you claim, it would show in its winrate. Of all T10 battleships, Conq is the one I fear the least.

Montana has broadside weight and accuracy

Kurfuerst has broadside weight and tankiness

Republique has stupid AP penetration and ROF

Yamato has lolpen guns

Conq does meaningless, low value damage and is squishy; were it not for its superheal it would be the most easily killed T10 BB in the game by far.

I wouldn't call Conq 'stupidly OP'. But this comment is very misinformed.

You can heal only 50% of both HE and AP penetration. There is no fundamental difference between the two. It is also quite hard to citadel BBs these days. The good thing about Conq is that her HE does very consistent damage at range while AP tend to richochet, shatter, overpen in those situations.

Fire damage can be healed back but it is still lethal against aggressive BBs. You can't just out-heal fire damage all the time since heal amount is limited and it has a CD. Fire damage is less effective against BBs that can disengage. However, I would argue that pushing enemy BBs away is beneficial to your team as well.

You can still be quite effective if you mainly use AP. Straight-up calling Conq damage meaningless is just wrong on so many levels.

Conq has just as much broadside weight as Montana or GK. Her forward firing angle is also really good.

And you are also downplaying her sustain from super heal. I have Montana and Yamato as well. But my Conq has the highest potential damage among the three. If you know how to make use of her concealment, you can be a very good meat shield for your team.

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On 6/16/2018 at 5:11 PM, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Keep loading AP into Conqueror.  She is coated in 32mm plate, as with other French and RN BBs.  She eats penetrations easily, but too many dumb scrubs in this game won't take advantage of that.  Oh well.

 

Cruiser spam is deadly effective against her as it is with RN & French BBs.  It's very easy even for them to get penetrating hits all over the place.  Now, I wouldn't take my Cruiser 1-on-1 with Conqueror and trade shots, but if you see it busy with a firefight, feel free to rack up hits and reliable damage on her.

Thanks for the tips man, but if Im in a bb against a conqueror, should I just load HE too?

PS: WG: Yes, I definitely agree with decreasing the HE alpha/ fire chance (nerfing her guns). It's just such a brainless tactic, and there is no counterplay against in from a BB's viewpoint.

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Honestly, I can live with the HE damage and other current characteristics of the Conq, save one (and it's problematic up and down the RN BB line):

The absolute certainty that being hit by Conq HE will [edited] your modules.

The splash radius for damage is ludicrous for RN HE.  One shell can knock out a half-dozen AA or Secondary modules on a BB, and cripple a DD simply though module damage alone.  Near misses knock out one virtually every time on a CA/DD, and DDs still take splash damage from near misses most of the time.

I've lost both torp tubes, my engine, rudder, all my AA, and a gun turret, PLUS started a fire, PLUS 2500 in damage, all from a single shell hit.  While that's a bit extreme, virtually every hit from Conq HE guaranties at least 3 modules/fires started.

That's far too much. For BBs, you can effectively remove most of their AA with a single volley that connects (i.e. 4-5 hits).  Two volleys, even with a mediocre hit rate, will make a BB unable to defend itself against ANY plane strike.  Single shell Conq HE hits on DDs can easily destroy HALF of their total armament.

 

That's far too powerful. HE (of all kinds, but especially RN HE) needs to be toned down in the NUMBER of modules it can damage. No more than 2 per hit for BB-sized HE, and CA/DD HE should never be able to cause more than one module damage per hit.

 

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On 6/30/2018 at 11:21 AM, ShinaMashiro said:

Thanks for the tips man, but if Im in a bb against a conqueror, should I just load HE too?

PS: WG: Yes, I definitely agree with decreasing the HE alpha/ fire chance (nerfing her guns). It's just such a brainless tactic, and there is no counterplay against in from a BB's viewpoint.

No, keep AP loaded.  Keep going for AP penetrations.  Conqueror has the smallest HP pool of Tier X BBs, and if you're using your weakest shell, HE, then you're not really providing pressure against her.  If the range is short enough, you can also aim for the turrets.  The 419mm turret have vertical faces with thin armor and are susceptible to getting KO'd.

 

Also, getting into an HE DPM race as a BB against Conqueror is a losing move because Conqueror's HE are stronger than yours in terms of Damage value.  Keep using AP, get the Penetrations.

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