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IOWADragon

The upcoming EULA

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Did Stephen Hawking's or Albert Einstein's genuis come from any degree or were they born to be smart. If I understand this correctly, and it dosen't require a degree form Yale or Harvard to be intellengent.  Wargaming NA can review all content, such as Facebook, You Tube, Twitch, Patreon posts and ban whomever they feel, brusied their egos or a player who dared to be human. I've watched some of the top CC in Wargaming and I see this freedom of speech suppression a matter of grave concern to all. Some of the CC are very outspoken on what they like and don't like about Wargaming.

Hell lets just turn out the lights, lock the doors and go play other games while the head office sorts this mess out.

Or not

I like Wargamings products.They give people a chance to play great games for free. And yes a person could become the best player of all time and never spend a penny. Just might take them longer. If only I was that good, oh well.

I play any game, as gaming is my hobby and entertainment, I'll spend money when and where I can. I mean why not, right. 

I'm a human, as such I say and do human type things. I take peoples inventory, tell em how they could play better,(in some cases it might help) and get pissed off some.

If ya want a life like battle game with flowers and pansies, maybe you should go other places to work and play. Maybe.

 

Edited by IOWADragon
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Well, I haven't read the new EULA but this doesn't seem so far fetched.  Not defending a limitations on speech, just guessing maybe WG encountered conditions in which they want a tool in their arsenal to ban certain really abusive players who don't add to the community.  So, as always, take it with the idea that most likely, WG is not going to ban you because you made a YouTube video over ship "X" you didn't care for.

On another interesting legal snippet, many folks don't read their employment contracts.  Many big companies add a clause stating that anything you come up with on your own time and with your money is theirs, as long as you are employed by them.  I have seen a court case where this was thrown out but many employers still add it in and will not hire you unless you sign the agreement. 

Got to love all the lawyers

 

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This would be truly worthy of an outrage... if this hadn't been the case since... forever?

Spoiler

13.1 If you violate any provision of these Terms of Service or the EULA,, then we may, at our sole discretion depending on the seriousness of the breach and without any notice to you, take some or all of the following actions:

  1. suspend your Account for a short period of time;
  2. suspend your Account for a longer period of time; and
  3. may close your Account, and

in each case the level of seriousness of the breach shall be determined exclusively by Wargaming and you agree not to appeal against such Wargaming decisions.

http://legal.na.wargaming.net/en/terms-of-service/

That is in the Terms of Service. So basically, if WG decided that my waifu was trash (which btw it isn't) they could look for a small, irrelevant post that I made some time ago which might scratch the rules slightly, then nuke my account without warning and that would be it. Perfectly legal.

Spoiler

3. Limited License

3.1 Subject to your compliance with the terms and conditions set forth in this EULA and the Terms (including without limitation payment of any applicable fees), Wargaming grants you:

  • (a) a limited, non-exclusive, non-transferable, non-sublicensable, revocable license to use one copy of the Software as downloaded directly from Wargaming or made available by an authorized Wargaming distributor, solely in object code format and solely for your personal, non-commercial use for lawful purposes; and
  • (b) non-exclusive permission to access and use the Service for your personal, non-commercial use for lawful purposes, solely through the use of a licensed copy of the Software.

http://legal.na.wargaming.net/en/end-user-licence-agreement/

Important part highlighted. This is from the old EULA. Again, WG reserves itself the right to take away my "right" (no, it's actually not a right) to play this game at any time.

 

TL;DR: This stuff is not new, and it's not unique. And it's certainly not worth it to cry wolf about it now.

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Why bring the CCs into this? What they say as a player is pointless, they rarely have great playing ability or knowledge of what WG is trying to do with the game. All they have is the ability to create media like news channels and try to stay in the spotlight while they can by saying questionable things.

 

The administrators of this site aren't on our side, they're afraid of being yelled at for what's let on here. So they remove nearly all content that rightfully challenges them out of fear it might lead to something else.

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24 minutes ago, IOWADragon said:

Did Stephen Hawking's or Albert Einstein's genuis come from any degree or were they born to be smart. If I understand this correctly, and it dosen't require a degree form Yale or Harvard to be intellengent.  Wargaming NA can review all content, such as Facebook, You Tube, Twitch, Patreon posts and ban whomever they feel, brusied their egos or a player who dared to be human. I've watched some of the top CC in Wargaming and I see this freedom of speech suppression a matter of grave concern to all. Some of the CC are very outspoken on what they like and don't like about Wargaming. Hell lets just turn out the lights, lock the doors and go play other games while the head office sorts this mess out. 

Pls explain what right you have to play this game?

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Freedom was always an illusion.

but still,the weird part is that new EULA is coming only on NA from what i heard.

the world of tanks forum are a little mad because now they have the ammo to end pref MM aka nerf tanks.

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This doesn't really change much to be honest, we never owned anything in this game.  Wargaming holds full rights over their product.

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7 minutes ago, ValkyrWarframe said:

This doesn't really change much to be honest, we never owned anything in this game.  Wargaming holds full rights over their product.

This, so much this.

Legally speaking we are asking WG's permission to play their game, to which they will answer "yes" in basically any case, but with the remark that we are priviledged to play their game, and not entitled.

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18 minutes ago, HowitzerBlitzer said:

Why bring the CCs into this? What they say as a player is pointless, they rarely have great playing ability or knowledge of what WG is trying to do with the game. All they have is the ability to create media like news channels and try to stay in the spotlight while they can by saying questionable things.

 

The administrators of this site aren't on our side, they're afraid of being yelled at for what's let on here. So they remove nearly all content that rightfully challenges them out of fear it might lead to something else.

Wasn't the SirFoch thing evidence enough. Jingles leaving CC for a while. So if things happen at that level, what chance does a lesser known person stand. As to their playing, I like that they have bad days as do the rest of us. Some of them have good memories for the stats though and how the game mechnics work.

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16 minutes ago, Bronk said:

Pls explain what right you have to play this game?

As long as I have legal right per WG, a good enough pc with internet service what more do I or anyone else need. If I don't like the EULA I know full well that I don't have to play, But that in and of itself does not make it morally right, Just legal

 

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4 minutes ago, IOWADragon said:

As long as I have legal right per WG, a good enough pc with internet service what more do I or anyone else need. If I don't like the EULA I know full well that I don't have to play, But that in and of itself does not make it morally right, Just legal

Please name an online gaming company that does not reserve itself the right to kick you out on their own discretion.

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25 minutes ago, SireneRacker said:

This would be truly worthy of an outrage... if this hadn't been the case since... forever?

  Reveal hidden contents

13.1 If you violate any provision of these Terms of Service or the EULA,, then we may, at our sole discretion depending on the seriousness of the breach and without any notice to you, take some or all of the following actions:

  1. suspend your Account for a short period of time;
  2. suspend your Account for a longer period of time; and
  3. may close your Account, and

in each case the level of seriousness of the breach shall be determined exclusively by Wargaming and you agree not to appeal against such Wargaming decisions.

http://legal.na.wargaming.net/en/terms-of-service/

That is in the Terms of Service. So basically, if WG decided that my waifu was trash (which btw it isn't) they could look for a small, irrelevant post that I made some time ago which might scratch the rules slightly, then nuke my account without warning and that would be it. Perfectly legal.

  Reveal hidden contents

3. Limited License

3.1 Subject to your compliance with the terms and conditions set forth in this EULA and the Terms (including without limitation payment of any applicable fees), Wargaming grants you:

  • (a) a limited, non-exclusive, non-transferable, non-sublicensable, revocable license to use one copy of the Software as downloaded directly from Wargaming or made available by an authorized Wargaming distributor, solely in object code format and solely for your personal, non-commercial use for lawful purposes; and
  • (b) non-exclusive permission to access and use the Service for your personal, non-commercial use for lawful purposes, solely through the use of a licensed copy of the Software.

http://legal.na.wargaming.net/en/end-user-licence-agreement/

Important part highlighted. This is from the old EULA. Again, WG reserves itself the right to take away my "right" (no, it's actually not a right) to play this game at any time.

 

TL;DR: This stuff is not new, and it's not unique. And it's certainly not worth it to cry wolf about it now.

Depends on how the power is used.  Wasn't that long ago that we had the Sir Foch incident.  Using the DMCA against someone because they used foul language on youtube was like solving an ant infestation with a nuclear bomb.  And what he was complaining about was the crappy version of the Grapf Z.  That crap ship deserved the criticism it got.

I will reserve judgment, but if a credible complaint is made and it gets a CC member banned, I will certainly reconsider future purchases.

I rely on the likes of Flamu, Mouse, Notser, iChase, and others to give their honest opinions on new ships before deciding if I want them in my collection.  Should their content start getting manipulated by WG NA because their negative feedback might affect sales, I will start to consider alternate games to patronize.  Wargaming may not realize it, but many of my purchases wouldn't happen if I didn't get to see honest commentary on how the ship works and plays before buying it. I've spent a significant sum on this game, and they have honest community contributors to thank for that.

Don't interfere with the free flow of information and I will continue to be a happy customer.  I like this game, it would be a shame if it was ruined by corporate stupidity.

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9 minutes ago, SireneRacker said:

Please name an online gaming company that does not reserve itself the right to kick you out on their own discretion.

As I said, dosen't make it right, just legal. How would you feel if it happened to you, is all I can say. How carefull can a person be, all the time. Hell I know people may not like me because I'm American, white, have long hair, am outspoken. What does that have to do with right or wrong.

Yes, legally, people do many things, still not all legal issues are good for all.

Edited by IOWADragon

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I think this is more put in to stop people putting things on reddit and youtube advertising things like illegal stuff which can be fake, an account scam, a way to hack someones account___ etc. 

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The EULA seems to me the same but with a different wording.

As for the CCs well they also reworked that program you know?

Edit: Also the CC program has additional conditions (such as NDAs) that by nature have to be more restrictive. Anyway, the CC program is different to the EULA.

Edited by CO_Valle

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It is nothing burger.  Every game, not just online games, has a EULA that says essentially the same things.  They are all just [edited]covering things the company's lawyers say need to be in there.  How much is even enforceable is highly debatable.

Basically, if you want to play any computer game you basically need to agree to the same kinds of terms.

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Mingles with Jingles addressed this today......the eula is fine in the other areas, it seems it's just the NA office up to it's old tricks again, similar to the crap-storm they caused last year.

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31 minutes ago, Psicopro said:

Depends on how the power is used.  Wasn't that long ago that we had the Sir Foch incident.  Using the DMCA against someone because they used foul language on youtube was like solving an ant infestation with a nuclear bomb.  And what he was complaining about was the crappy version of the Grapf Z.  That crap ship deserved the criticism it got.

SirFoch was not about Graf Zep, he was talking about an overpowered Premium Tank which was announced/released/whatever. It was iChase who got booted for the Graf Zep disaster.

And what should be noted here, until WG NA started spewing what is nonsense at best, SirFoch was officially banned for his extremely vulgar and offensive language. Considering that half his video consisted of him directly insulting (yes, insults, that half had nothing to do with constructive criticism) WG, a fair point they made. And iChase said himself that he may have worded a few things inappropriately, if what he said would warrant a kick from the CC program itself is a different story, but in neither of the two cases was someone banned for critizising WG. It was about how they did it.

For example Mouse made a post where she brutally critizised Graf Zep, nothing happened to her. So...

30 minutes ago, IOWADragon said:

As I said, dosen't make it right, just legal. How would you feel if it happened to you, is all I can say. How carefull can a person be, all the time. Hell I know people may not like me because I'm American, white, have long hair, am outspoken. What does that have to do with right or wrong.

Yes, legally, people do many things, still not all legal issues are good for all.

I have yet to see someone being banned for making constructive criticism which was not reflecting WG‘s dreamworld.

And just so you know, you have this right yourself. And there are certainly cases where you might want that.

For example if your neighbor enters your store, and you absolutely hate that guy because he always stares at your wife‘s cleavage or whatever. You can tell him to leave your store immediately, and he would have to leave it. He didn‘t break any laws, but you were permitted to exercise your right over your house.

And this game is no different. This is WG‘s house, and we are just guests here. If WG tells someone to leave, we have to leave. It‘s their right to do so, for whatever reason they may have.

Where would we be if we were not even allowed to throw people off our own property?

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It's their game please understand that.  If you don't like it don't play.

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11 minutes ago, SireneRacker said:

SirFoch was not about Graf Zep, he was talking about an overpowered Premium Tank which was announced/released/whatever. It was iChase who got booted for the Graf Zep disaster.

And what should be noted here, until WG NA started spewing what is nonsense at best, SirFoch was officially banned for his extremely vulgar and offensive language. Considering that half his video consisted of him directly insulting (yes, insults, that half had nothing to do with constructive criticism) WG, a fair point they made. And iChase said himself that he may have worded a few things inappropriately, if what he said would warrant a kick from the CC program itself is a different story, but in neither of the two cases was someone banned for critizising WG. It was about how they did it.

For example Mouse made a post where she brutally critizised Graf Zep, nothing happened to her. So...

I have yet to see someone being banned for making constructive criticism which was not reflecting WG‘s dreamworld.

And just so you know, you have this right yourself. And there are certainly cases where you might want that.

For example if your neighbor enters your store, and you absolutely hate that guy because he always stares at your wife‘s cleavage or whatever. You can tell him to leave your store immediately, and he would have to leave it. He didn‘t break any laws, but you were permitted to exercise your right over your house.

And this game is no different. This is WG‘s house, and we are just guests here. If WG tells someone to leave, we have to leave. It‘s their right to do so, for whatever reason they may have.

Where would we be if we were not even allowed to throw people off our own property?

Or you could tell your wife that the cleavage showing clothes are inticing the lust of men and she could wear something more modest. 

 

.....Incoming ban for me? Inb4 thread closure. 

Edited by Megrim3

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16 minutes ago, Megrim3 said:

Or you could tell your wife that the cleavage showing clothes are inticing the lust of men and she could wear something more modest. 

 

.....Incoming ban for me? Inb4 thread closure. 

I am not the type of person to tell anyone else how to dress, provided that the current outfit is not breaking any social norm within my culture.

If it makes you happy, then we can also just swap it for the neighbor staring at your wife at the beach while she was wearing a swimsuit, also works.

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11 minutes ago, SireneRacker said:

I am not the type of person to tell anyone else how to dress, provided that the current outfit is not breaking any social norm within my culture.

If it makes you happy, then we can also just swap it for the neighbor staring at your wife at the beach while she was wearing a swimsuit, also works.

Uh oh. The thought police have arrived. That's going to be a minority report. 

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This whole business with trash EULAs (which have been debated as to their legality in the U.S.), as well as what Twitter and Facebook have been getting up to, just serves to highlight the need for a broad and comprehensive Internet Bill of Rights. I, for one, am tired of the capriciousness of game publishers (and it's usually the publishers, and keep in mind that WG are both), that take their audiences and playerbases for granted to the extent that they can decide for whatever reason that they can take away what you have worked hard to achieve, especially if you have indeed paid for what you have.

Of course, I'm also in favor of actual ownership of our own copies of games, whether physical or digital, rather than simply renting the license to play it. This is how EA can justify their live service bollocks.

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1 hour ago, IOWADragon said:

As long as I have legal right per WG, a good enough pc with internet service what more do I or anyone else need. If I don't like the EULA I know full well that I don't have to play, But that in and of itself does not make it morally right, Just legal

 

So.... None. Just as I thought. 

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The way I see it this is a normal EULA. WG is stating World of Warships is their intellectual property and they reserve all rights to this property. 

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