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DouglasMacAwful

Co-op mains, especially DDs, do you realize you have to adjust your playstyle in randoms?

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First, I'm no unicom.  I'm way more a clubee than a clubber. Having said that, today has been a little frustrating.  I've seen some very bad play, andafter looking  at some of the worst offenders post-game, it seems we have an invasion of co-op mains - probably for the Indianapolis marathon.  Just this last game we had no CVs and one DD per side in a 6-7 domination game.  Our DD, a Nicholas, sat there in the spawn at 1/4 speed for 2 mins. I told him he's our only spotter and to move up. He moved up like 1 km and sat there for the rest of the game until he got deleted. After the game i saw he had 27 battles in random and over 1200 in coop. Similar incident with a cruiser who had like 40 randoms and 1500 coops - sailed near a cap, stopped without much cover, and got blasted early. 

Do you guys who rarely plan random know that ships won't suicide charge, and you need to adjust your playstyle?  DDs especially. It's a serious question - capping and spotting isn't a big thing in coop, but it's your job in random, not to hang back and wait for targets to snipe at.  

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4 minutes ago, DouglasMacAwful said:

First, I'm no unicom.  I'm way more a clubee than a clubber. Having said that, today has been a little frustrating.  I've seen some very bad play, andafter looking  at some of the worst offenders post-game, it seems we have an invasion of co-op mains - probably for the Indianapolis marathon.  Just this last game we had no CVs and one DD per side in a 6-7 domination game.  Our DD, a Nicholas, sat there in the spawn at 1/4 speed for 2 mins. I told him he's our only spotter and to move up. He moved up like 1 km and sat there for the rest of the game until he got deleted. After the game i saw he had 27 battles in random and over 1200 in coop. Similar incident with a cruiser who had like 40 randoms and 1500 coops - sailed near a cap, stopped without much cover, and got blasted early. 

Do you guys who rarely plan random know that ships won't suicide charge, and you need to adjust your playstyle?  DDs especially. It's a serious question - capping and spotting isn't a big thing in coop, but it's your job in random, not to hang back and wait for targets to snipe at.  

 

Spotting and capping in PvE is important. Most PvE players in my experience move forward towards the bots, because if you don't, the other players will get the XP first. Now there are a few campers in PvE, but they are a minority. I know I have to cut back on the aggressiveness in PvP, but I know you can't just camp either.

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Pretty sure I've never once done a coop mission.

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16 hours ago, DouglasMacAwful said:

First, I'm no unicom.  I'm way more a clubee than a clubber. Having said that, today has been a little frustrating.  I've seen some very bad play, andafter looking  at some of the worst offenders post-game, it seems we have an invasion of co-op mains - probably for the Indianapolis marathon.  Just this last game we had no CVs and one DD per side in a 6-7 domination game.  Our DD, a Nicholas, sat there in the spawn at 1/4 speed for 2 mins. I told him he's our only spotter and to move up. He moved up like 1 km and sat there for the rest of the game until he got deleted. After the game i saw he had 27 battles in random and over 1200 in coop. Similar incident with a cruiser who had like 40 randoms and 1500 coops - sailed near a cap, stopped without much cover, and got blasted early. 

Do you guys who rarely plan random know that ships won't suicide charge, and you need to adjust your playstyle?  DDs especially. It's a serious question - capping and spotting isn't a big thing in coop, but it's your job in random, not to hang back and wait for targets to snipe at.  

Perhaps he accidentally had the BATTLE button set to RANDOM. I've done that, intended to go to Coop and arrived in Random with no camos, no premium consummables, and no signals. If you look at my stats, you'll find lots of ships played once in Randoms because of that. LOL. 

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1 minute ago, Taichunger said:

Perhaps he accidentally had the BATTLE button set to RANDOM. I've done that, intended to go to Coop and arrived in Random with no camos, no premium consummables, and no signals. If you look at my stats, you'll find lots of ships played once in Randoms because of that. LOL. 

You get people in PvE saying, "dang it, I wanted to go into Randoms". I've done both. :Smile_teethhappy:

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23 minutes ago, DouglasMacAwful said:

First, I'm no unicom.  I'm way more a clubee than a clubber. Having said that, today has been a little frustrating.  I've seen some very bad play, and after looking  at some of the worst offenders post-game, it seems we have an invasion of co-op mains - probably for the Indianapolis marathon.  Just this last game we had no CVs and one DD per side in a 6-7 domination game.  Our DD, a Nicholas, sat there in the spawn at 1/4 speed for 2 mins. I told him he's our only spotter and to move up. He moved up like 1 km and sat there for the rest of the game until he got deleted. After the game i saw he had 27 battles in random and over 1200 in coop. Similar incident with a cruiser who had like 40 randoms and 1500 coops - sailed near a cap, stopped without much cover, and got blasted early. 

The marathon requires Tier 6+ in order for it to count. I doubt he is working on it in the Tier V Nicholas unless he is one of those that misreads the news, or selected the wrong battle mode as some have pointed out. :Smile_teethhappy:

But yeah, it's not really a surprise they perform very poorly. If you only play thousands of battles in Coop and avoid Random, than you're not going to develop any experience in dealing with actual players in the ships. The bots are fine if you want to test new ships and get use to how it handles, or just chill for the day killing targets. But it's never going to increase your experience beyond that level since the A.I. is limited based on a program code; human players are not.

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Those that just PVE won’t know any better when they enter PvP in my experience. This is just going to be one of those ride it out weekends like always. 

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17 minutes ago, Kizarvexis said:

You get people in PvE saying, "dang it, I wanted to go into Randoms". I've done both. :Smile_teethhappy:

Last time for me was in Bogue, wanted to bash bots at the und of the day, but loaded into PvP.

Said so and apologized, then piled in and scored pretty good, (still a loss, unfortunately.)

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51 minutes ago, DouglasMacAwful said:

First, I'm no unicom.  I'm way more a clubee than a clubber. Having said that, today has been a little frustrating.  I've seen some very bad play, andafter looking  at some of the worst offenders post-game, it seems we have an invasion of co-op mains - probably for the Indianapolis marathon.  Just this last game we had no CVs and one DD per side in a 6-7 domination game.  Our DD, a Nicholas, sat there in the spawn at 1/4 speed for 2 mins. I told him he's our only spotter and to move up. He moved up like 1 km and sat there for the rest of the game until he got deleted. After the game i saw he had 27 battles in random and over 1200 in coop. Similar incident with a cruiser who had like 40 randoms and 1500 coops - sailed near a cap, stopped without much cover, and got blasted early. 

Do you guys who rarely plan random know that ships won't suicide charge, and you need to adjust your playstyle?  DDs especially. It's a serious question - capping and spotting isn't a big thing in coop, but it's your job in random, not to hang back and wait for targets to snipe at.  

I'm glad that I rarely play coop 

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3 minutes ago, KURT_WOLFF said:

I'm glad that I rarely play coop 

 

It can be fun in its own way. If you want to brawl, PvE is the way to go as the bots don't have an S key. :Smile_teethhappy:

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23 minutes ago, gil5461 said:

Its a Game,get over it

Classy. Op is just frustrated about all the PVE people doing things that they're not supposed to be doing in PvP. You must be great at parties.

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Sigh.... In PvE the play style for destroyers is totally different. No need for spotting so what you do is stay behind a battleship, smoke up, and kill the enemy DDs and CAs as they rush you. Once they are dealt with you do your torpedo attacks on the bot BBs. I find PvP play in destroyers far easier. No one has a clue where you are unlike the bots who always head straight for you. Torp hits on humans are far easier than torp hits on bots. The hardest thing to overcome for PvE players is not shooting your guns. Remaining hidden is far more important and more a "thing" in PvP and something that every DD player in co-op has never run into. In PvP play you just slither around torping smoke, keeping stuff spotted and get caps. I don't bother contesting caps any more, just find one that is unoccupied and grab it. Easy enough and without the bots enhanced ability to know where you are, it is like a vacation. 

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I've seen plenty of Random mains in DDs doing the same thing.  So whats the difference?

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1 hour ago, DouglasMacAwful said:

First, I'm no unicom.  I'm way more a clubee than a clubber. Having said that, today has been a little frustrating.  I've seen some very bad play, andafter looking  at some of the worst offenders post-game, it seems we have an invasion of co-op mains - probably for the Indianapolis marathon.  Just this last game we had no CVs and one DD per side in a 6-7 domination game.  Our DD, a Nicholas, sat there in the spawn at 1/4 speed for 2 mins. I told him he's our only spotter and to move up. He moved up like 1 km and sat there for the rest of the game until he got deleted. After the game i saw he had 27 battles in random and over 1200 in coop. Similar incident with a cruiser who had like 40 randoms and 1500 coops - sailed near a cap, stopped without much cover, and got blasted early. 

Do you guys who rarely plan random know that ships won't suicide charge, and you need to adjust your playstyle?  DDs especially. It's a serious question - capping and spotting isn't a big thing in coop, but it's your job in random, not to hang back and wait for targets to snipe at.  

I would argue it is harder for a player to play a DD in Co-Op PvE because the bots are aggressive and will push said DD even when they smoke up. Bots can dodge torpedo spreads like a unicum on steroids, and human players tend to be passive when engaging DDs in Random battle mode, especially when they see smoke and there is no radar cruiser around. Bots are programmed to "damn the torpedos and full ramming speed ahead with guns blazing." Not saying Co-Op is harder than Random because human players are not predictable for the most part and the bots have specific behavior patterns, but there are some good players that choose to play PvE over PvP for various reasons. And you find bad players in all of the battle modes.

If a DD player, or any other type of player, is sitting in and around the base spawn for a couple of minutes at the start in Co-Op, that is just as bad as it is in Randoms. I rarely see a DD player do that in either battle mode unless they are AFK at the start or slow loading into the match. 

As far as the Indianapolis Marathon mission is concerned, that requires tier 6-10 ships. Since the Nicholas is tier 5, I doubt he was working on the Indianapolis Marathon mission

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1 hour ago, LiaoXanLan said:

Classy. Op is just frustrated about all the PVE people doing things that they're not supposed to be doing in PvP. You must be great at parties.

But it's ok for PVP players to come to Co-op and screw around at the expense of those who are there by choice and trying right? Hey I need a DD kill so I am going to yolo the middle, ram it, and back to port gl the rest of the game. Or I need secondary hits so I am going to yolo B, park, and not fire my guns and just sit there getting secondary hits until I die then do it again and again until I have enough. That's ok right?  Hey it's just Co-op so who cares? Oh I don't know maybe the others on the team care. 

Or the great (in their minds?) PVP players who come to Co-op and brag about how easy it is then get roflstomped inside of 3 minutes leaving the team short handed. And this isn't just the bad PVP players . I see players with Ranks up to and including Rank 1 get their butts handed to them by those oh so easy bots (but it can't be their fault right? they are PVP players so it has to be those lowly scrub PVE teammates that are to blame for them sucking and dying right off). But again it's just Co-op who cares. You don't owe it to your team to try and play smart that is just a thing you do if in PVP. :Smile_sceptic:

Co-op and PVP have different playstyles/metas. PVP is chess and Co-op is a playground brawl. The game itself is the exact same and if you can play one you can the other. Bad players in both modes and good players in both modes. Suck it up and get over yourselves guys. Co-op mains put up with horrible play from PVP players all the time for many reasons (working off pink, doing a mission, trying a new ship or build, div mates feel like screwing around vs actually playing, etc...) and we don't run to the forums crying about it. 

If some player who normally plays PVE wants to do a mission that is Random only and their way of playing doesn't fit with your desired playstyle, or they pull a PVP player in Co-op move of only showing up to complete the mission at the expense of the team, oh well it sucks to be you then. Been there and done that. All the time actually as that stuff is a regular occurrence in Co-op. PVE player's have the right to go to PVP and work on the mission and even more so if it is made PVP only. 

Some of you take this game and yourselves way too serious. And what about all these posts the last year+ about how we PVE mains need to put our big boy pants on and play PVP. So which is it? Stay out or put our big boy pants on and play PVP? Also, seems to me there is post after post after post about how everyone hates the passive meta of PVP and how everyone hides and camps and no one pushes or fights. Well, PVE payers  that are showing up and doing just that is what you have been asking for isn't it so what's the issue? Seems to me it is a no win situation for the PVE guys.

People on this forum make me laugh. :Smile_teethhappy:

 

Edited by AdmiralThunder
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1 hour ago, LiaoXanLan said:

Classy. Op is just frustrated about all the PVE people doing things that they're not supposed to be doing in PvP. You must be great at parties.

Hello mr hypocrite, OP isn't allowed to be frustrated unless he takes a stand on the PVP mains who decide to screw things up for the PVE mains (yes this is a thing, and yes it's about as common as PVE mains being complete scrubs more than PVP mains, grow up, it's a video game not actual life or death, get that through your thick skull)

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3 hours ago, DouglasMacAwful said:

Do you guys who rarely plan random know that ships won't suicide charge, and you need to adjust your playstyle? 

Some do, some don't.  I hear your frustration, but we've had this discussion on the forum many times.  As someone said in their comments above, PVP is a chess match and PVE is a brawl.  There are some nights that I come home and I want to just wail on some red guys because it's been a hard day.  I play PVE.  Other nights, I want that chess match, so I play PVP  

This is just me, but I tend to play in PVE when I have a new ship to help me get used to her guns, torps, etc. (as well as playing in Training if I can get some people to join me).  Once I feel comfortable, I move into Random.  My first games in Random tend to be rough as I retrain my brain to think less like the Hulk and more like the Ninja assassin (if I'm in a IJN dd) or the fleet dd of the USN line spotting in front of the heavies and taking out pesky red dds.  I tend to be the kind of player that my teammates get mad at until I've played a new ship about 10 games in Random when I start to see significant improvement.

I have 1300 battles played in Random and 1200 in Co-Op .  I enjoy both styles of play.  It all depends on my mental state when I start and where I am with my ship progression.

Give the PVE heavy players some slack.  They come over to the PVP side because they hear so much about "how much better" it is from this forum.  Once they join our "chess match", and ships aren't behaving the same way as they are used to, they have two very predictable reactions: 1) they get overly aggressive and push when they shouldn't or 2) they fight defensively and still die, just a bit slower.

Instead of complaining, have you ever tried to reach out to one of those players to help them become a better player?

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4 hours ago, DouglasMacAwful said:

First, I'm no unicom.  I'm way more a clubee than a clubber. Having said that, today has been a little frustrating.  I've seen some very bad play, andafter looking  at some of the worst offenders post-game, it seems we have an invasion of co-op mains - probably for the Indianapolis marathon.  Just this last game we had no CVs and one DD per side in a 6-7 domination game.  Our DD, a Nicholas, sat there in the spawn at 1/4 speed for 2 mins. I told him he's our only spotter and to move up. He moved up like 1 km and sat there for the rest of the game until he got deleted. After the game i saw he had 27 battles in random and over 1200 in coop. Similar incident with a cruiser who had like 40 randoms and 1500 coops - sailed near a cap, stopped without much cover, and got blasted early. 

Do you guys who rarely plan random know that ships won't suicide charge, and you need to adjust your playstyle?  DDs especially. It's a serious question - capping and spotting isn't a big thing in coop, but it's your job in random, not to hang back and wait for targets to snipe at.  

 

Why do people have such a hard time understanding who plays this game?

The game is full of casual players, who aren't interested in really learning the mechanics, and treat it like a phone game....

Sail ships, shoot stuff, watch the explosions. and move on, this is the majority of the player base, and most of them never even come to the forums....:Smile_teethhappy:

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4 hours ago, DouglasMacAwful said:

 I told him he's our only spotter and to move up. 

This is where you lost me. DDs are not spotters, they can just spot better due to thier lower concealment.

 

Any player in any ship can spot and the more successful team will attempt to reposition to oppose the other team, who will likey in turn attempt to reposition against the opposers.

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1 hour ago, AdmiralThunder said:

But it's ok for PVP players to come to Co-op and screw around at the expense of those who are there by choice and trying right? Hey I need a DD kill so I am going to yolo the middle, ram it, and back to port gl the rest of the game. Or I need secondary hits so I am going to yolo B, park, and not fire my guns and just sit there getting secondary hits until I die then do it again and again until I have enough. That's ok right?  Hey it's just Co-op so who cares? Oh I don't know maybe the others on the team care. 

Or the great (in their minds?) PVP players who come to Co-op and brag about how easy it is then get roflstomped inside of 3 minutes leaving the team short handed. And this isn't just the bad PVP players . I see players with Ranks up to and including Rank 1 get their butts handed to them by those oh so easy bots (but it can't be their fault right? they are PVP players so it has to be those lowly scrub PVE teammates that are to blame for them sucking and dying right off). But again it's just Co-op who cares. You don't owe it to your team to try and play smart that is just a thing you do if in PVP. :Smile_sceptic:

Co-op and PVP have different playstyles/metas. PVP is chess and Co-op is a playground brawl. The game itself is the exact same and if you can play one you can the other. Bad players in both modes and good players in both modes. Suck it up and get over yourselves guys. Co-op mains put up with horrible play from PVP players all the time for many reasons (working off pink, doing a mission, trying a new ship or build, div mates feel like screwing around vs actually playing, etc...) and we don't run to the forums crying about it. 

If some player who normally plays PVE wants to do a mission that is Random only and their way of playing doesn't fit with your desired playstyle, or they pull a PVP player in Co-op move of only showing up to complete the mission at the expense of the team, oh well it sucks to be you then. Been there and done that. All the time actually as that stuff is a regular occurrence in Co-op. PVE player's have the right to go to PVP and work on the mission and even more so if it is made PVP only. 

Some of you take this game and yourselves way too serious. And what about all these posts the last year+ about how we PVE mains need to put our big boy pants on and play PVP. So which is it? Stay out or put our big boy pants on and play PVP? Also, seems to me there is post after post after post about how everyone hates the passive meta of PVP and how everyone hides and camps and no one pushes or fights. Well, PVE payers  that are showing up and doing just that is what you have been asking for isn't it so what's the issue? Seems to me it is a no win situation for the PVE guys.

People on this forum make me laugh. :Smile_teethhappy:

 

 

1 hour ago, TheNargacuga said:

Hello mr hypocrite, OP isn't allowed to be frustrated unless he takes a stand on the PVP mains who decide to screw things up for the PVE mains (yes this is a thing, and yes it's about as common as PVE mains being complete scrubs more than PVP mains, grow up, it's a video game not actual life or death, get that through your thick skull)

You two are some of the biggest hypocrites I’ve seen so far. I was telling the other guy to relax and chill and y’all act like it’s the end of the world. Check your irony glands.

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9 hours ago, LiaoXanLan said:

 

You two are some of the biggest hypocrites I’ve seen so far. I was telling the other guy to relax and chill and y’all act like it’s the end of the world. Check your irony glands.

Yeah that is not what you said. Not even close. You defended the OP chastising PVE players for daring to enter the sacred grounds that are PVP and not playing to his desired levels or style.  

Typical of some of this forum. 

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I learned the hard way, that's for sure.  I, for one, do know the differences.  PvE brawling is more fun than PvP camping and poking around and whatever else you guys do in there.

 

Lots of brawling action in this thread, too!  :Smile_Default:

 

:cap_popcorn:

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1 hour ago, AdmiralThunder said:

Yeah that is not what you said. Not even close. You defended the OP chastising PVE players for daring to enter the sacred grounds that are PVP and not playing to his desired levels or style.  

Typical of some of this forum. 

And this is up to him to make such a post. I don't approve of posts like this personally but when one needs to rant somewhere its better to let them rant for a bit. You're the typical hypocrite that defends anyone that decides to be rude and disrespectful and God help anyone try to defend the op because its a rant. If you don't like it, no one said you had to respond or even read every post. Move on and ignore the thread. Also, I was also throwing in some criticism into the guy I was responding to. Guess that's a big problem with thick skulled idiots like you.

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31 minutes ago, LiaoXanLan said:

And this is up to him to make such a post. I don't approve of posts like this personally but when one needs to rant somewhere its better to let them rant for a bit. You're the typical hypocrite that defends anyone that decides to be rude and disrespectful and God help anyone try to defend the op because its a rant. If you don't like it, no one said you had to respond or even read every post. Move on and ignore the thread. Also, I was also throwing in some criticism into the guy I was responding to. Guess that's a big problem with thick skulled idiots like you.

Well I am a PVE main so I take offense at the general attitude of people like the OP who constantly run us down on these forums. IF he is going to post such comments it opens him up to people firing back. I will be darned if I sit back and let people run PVE players down without speaking up. More people, PVP and PVE players alike, need to speak up when these things happen and say ENOUGH; it doesn't matter where people play. PVE or PVP we all play this game and support it so show some respect for each other's choices.  Play where you want and allow others the same courtesy.

And, let me add, while I was sarcastic in my comments I refrained from personal insults as you have done. I actually rebutted the complaints the OP had about PVE players in PVP by pointing out we PVE players put up with this exact scenario (swap players around) all the time yet we don't whine about it on the foams. Your comment that I am a thick skulked idiot is not only wrong, as I am actually quite intelligent, well read, and educated, but it is also totally uncalled for. Any high ground you may think you occupied was lost when you reverted to name calling.

I am not a hypocrite in the least. You didn't say I don't approve of the OP's comments but I get it he is just venting frustration. I never would have said a word to you in that case. Your comments defended the OP, insulted another poster who was calling the OP out, and thus I responded.  You did a poor job of communicating what you wanted to say in your initial post. Maybe do a better job in the future to avoid confusion.

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