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dimzzy

Massachusetts vs Alabama

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What I hear is that Massachusetts is a brawler while Alabama is a "normal" BB. If I already have Alabama why would I want to get Massachusetts? And if I would want to play a brawler Tirpitz looks more attractive, no?

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7 minutes ago, dimzzy said:

What I hear is that Massachusetts is a brawler while Alabama is a "normal" BB. If I already have Alabama why would I want to get Massachusetts? And if I would want to play a brawler Tirpitz looks more attractive, no?

Well, you answered your own question, really.

 

For many, just having the ship is what they want. For others, like myself, I like brawling in a BB, and I don't like playing the exact same ship over and over, it's something I rarely do.

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17 minutes ago, dimzzy said:

What I hear is that Massachusetts is a brawler while Alabama is a "normal" BB. If I already have Alabama why would I want to get Massachusetts? And if I would want to play a brawler Tirpitz looks more attractive, no?

The version of Massachusetts that is being tested now isn't real good.  For a ship that is to be leaning towards a Secondary Build, it is using USN BB Secondaries, and in WoWS, USN BB Secondaries are ALL GARBAGE.

 

As it stands right now, NC & Alabama are far superior to Mass.  But Mass is still in testing.

 

I also want to point this out.  When Alabama was in testing there was a lot of drama because of her having skyscraper citadels.  We had enough of that sh*t with Iowa, Missouri, Montana already, who still had tall citadels at the time.  Then Alabama was altered to have waterline citadel and she released like that.  And that is the current version we have and love.

Alabama's old citadel from iChase.

MQUYbcO.jpg

 

Kronshtadt also had tremendous problems.  Her earlier version in testing was horrible, the new one is much more doable.

 

So, Mass is still in testing.  Give it time and let's see what the devs do with it.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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Having watched Flamu play it a bit today, the secondaries seem underwhelming.  Even though the repair cooldown is nice and short, it seems that it doesn't really have the armor to fill a true brawler role.  As it is now, it isn't really comparable to the Tirpitz in my opinion.

Edited by Deviathan

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Tirpitz is better. The secondaries are better, the citadel is harder to hit, and those torpedoes really help you during brawls.

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Massachusetts cannot go live as she is, because she won't sell. I mean, I guess maybe they don't care about releasing a clunker because it's a hull clone? But that seems like an enormous missed opportunity for a vessel which is as-popular regionally as Alabama is in the deep south.

I'm a New Englander born and raised, and I will not be buying her in her present incarnation. A brawling U.S. BB with no torps and bad secondaries makes no sense from either a gameplay perspective, or as a captain trainer. This is one time when WG needs to put the "flavor" back in the spice cabinet and just design a ship that works.

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1 hour ago, Deviathan said:

Having watched Flamu play it a bit today, the secondaries seem underwhelming.  Even though the repair cooldown is nice and short, it seems that it doesn't really have the armor to fill a true brawler role.  As it is now, it isn't really comparable to the Tirpitz in my opinion.

I brawl in Alabama today. . . and out-brawl Tirpitz with regularity.  In fact, I'm generally confident of my ability to take down a Tirpitz 1-1 in a brawl even when I'm more damaged than he is, unless he has help.

I expect for those of us who really specialize in brawling, Massachusetts will be just fine.  It may not be a mass-market ship though.  Not everyone digs the excitement of the brawl.

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WG needs to un-screw the 5"/38 secondaries if they're going to make a "Brawler".  Even the buffed Mass has a gimped ROF and the shells seem to be an amalgamation of the worst qualities of the AP and AA Common rounds - IE fire chance based of the AP's bursting charge and penetration qualities of the AAC.  

The trade-off for being a brawler is KM levels of main battery 'accuracy' on ship that was famous for extremely long range kills.

:cap_hmm:

Edited by SCygnus

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I think MA will be fine as a brawler BUT they need to buff that main gun sigma. 1.7 with mediocre secondary guns is just not viable. The French have decent secondary guns, not KM good but pretty good, and decent main gun accuracy. MA could be like that. Good brawler who can also hit from range. Keeps excellent AA as it's US flavor.

Edited by AdmiralThunder

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I thought the Massachusetts was on track to have accuracy over maneuverability, which would make it more like the other American BBs at higher tier.  Alabama is the ship you want if you like to get up and look them in the whites of their eyes.

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Tirpitz guns reload faster, turrets turn faster, the ship is faster, the secundaries are better, has torps and the armor is better.

 

Massachusetts has one more gun, guns hit harder, better turning circle and concealment and better heal.

 

Tirpitz is the better brawler between the two. Tbh, IMO, Massachusetts seems a meh ship so far. 

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1 hour ago, Big_Tidday_Goth_GF said:

I thought the Massachusetts was on track to have accuracy over maneuverability, which would make it more like the other American BBs at higher tier.  Alabama is the ship you want if you like to get up and look them in the whites of their eyes.

They changed it to be a brawler. Improved secondary stats and hammered the sigma from 1.9 down to 1.7 (which is worse than the KM T8 BB's btw WG).

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3 hours ago, Battlecruiser_Goeben said:

Massachusetts cannot go live as she is, because she won't sell. I mean, I guess maybe they don't care about releasing a clunker because it's a hull clone? But that seems like an enormous missed opportunity for a vessel which is as-popular regionally as Alabama is in the deep south.

I'm a New Englander born and raised, and I will not be buying her in her present incarnation. A brawling U.S. BB with no torps and bad secondaries makes no sense from either a gameplay perspective, or as a captain trainer. This is one time when WG needs to put the "flavor" back in the spice cabinet and just design a ship that works.

Mutsu, Ashitaka, Krispy Kreme, Huang Meh went on sale.  Ashitaka in particular was an abysmal failure.  Even in Asia Server where there is a heavy leaning towards Japanese ships, Ashitaka sold poorly.  The Battles played by the ship has been abysmal.

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i don't see the MA being a scary brawling/secondary ship in its current form.  Even with the buffed RoF(why did WG make US secondaries so bad?), you still lack the pen to do reliable damage to things outside of DDs and maybe some cruisers. The germans get a HE pen bonus, making them more viable.   After all that, i think you only end up with 5% or so fire chance.   If you were to take IFHE to boost your secondaries pen damage, your fire chance is now 4%.  So you would have to take the flags and maybe DE to get a decent fire chance.  Of course, all of this is only good if you can get into a brawl otherwise the points are useless.  You would need to consistently get enough fires/secondary damage to make the build worth it. 

 

Coming from someone who likes brawling, this ship seems meh.  I would probably take some hybrid survival and secondary build, where i can maximize living, while still making the secondaries a little better.(if i ever got the ship)

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4 hours ago, TitanicMan2 said:

Tirpitz is better. The secondaries are better, the citadel is harder to hit, and those torpedoes really help you during brawls.

the tirpitz secondaries dont work bow on. and being bow protects from citadels.

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28 minutes ago, Hanger_18 said:

the tirpitz secondaries dont work bow on. and being bow protects from citadels.

 

Silly rabbit, the Derpitz does not have a citadel.

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So it could be brawling BB that has very strong AA. If you suffer from carriers in Tirpitz you can switch to Massachusetts and worry only about DDs. That could sell it I guess.

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3 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Mutsu, Ashitaka, Krispy Kreme, Huang Meh went on sale.  Ashitaka in particular was an abysmal failure.  Even in Asia Server where there is a heavy leaning towards Japanese ships, Ashitaka sold poorly.  The Battles played by the ship has been abysmal.

I've done OK with my Ashitaka, but she's too soft.  If I am going to play a capital ship, I prefer battlecruisers.  Ashitaka though, I dont enjoy it.

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3 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Mutsu, Ashitaka, Krispy Kreme, Huang Meh went on sale.  Ashitaka in particular was an abysmal failure.  Even in Asia Server where there is a heavy leaning towards Japanese ships, Ashitaka sold poorly.  The Battles played by the ship has been abysmal.

There is nothing wrong with Mutsu-shipfu.  I love mine, and keep her snuggled up next to my Warspite.

Besides, it's looking like the Masshole is less a brawler or sniper, and more of a general purpose mid range fighter.  Typically solid USN AA, improved secondaries, still very capable main battery.  Mobile, well armored, and packing extremely good torpeedus protection.  If anything, I'd say she's looking like a Battleship that will reward aggressive play while still punishing fools that play stupid.  I wouldn't even give manual secondaries or AA but mount the secondary module, then take BFT and AFT.

Solid armor and a shotgun, play her like a tier 8 New Mexico.  Slap some Radar or Hydro in the thing (I'd favor the latter) and rock some faces.

Edited by Highlord

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2 hours ago, Highlord said:

There is nothing wrong with Mutsu-shipfu.  I love mine, and keep her snuggled up next to my Warspite.

Besides, it's looking like the Masshole is less a brawler or sniper, and more of a general purpose mid range fighter.  Typically solid USN AA, improved secondaries, still very capable main battery.  Mobile, well armored, and packing extremely good torpeedus protection.  If anything, I'd say she's looking like a Battleship that will reward aggressive play while still punishing fools that play stupid.  I wouldn't even give manual secondaries or AA but mount the secondary module, then take BFT and AFT.

Solid armor and a shotgun, play her like a tier 8 New Mexico.  Slap some Radar or Hydro in the thing (I'd favor the latter) and rock some faces.

I'm kind of feeling the same. MA = Alabama with free AFT at the cost of some sigma.

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3 hours ago, Highlord said:

There is nothing wrong with Mutsu-shipfu.  I love mine, and keep her snuggled up next to my Warspite.

Besides, it's looking like the Masshole is less a brawler or sniper, and more of a general purpose mid range fighter.  Typically solid USN AA, improved secondaries, still very capable main battery.  Mobile, well armored, and packing extremely good torpeedus protection.  If anything, I'd say she's looking like a Battleship that will reward aggressive play while still punishing fools that play stupid.  I wouldn't even give manual secondaries or AA but mount the secondary module, then take BFT and AFT.

Solid armor and a shotgun, play her like a tier 8 New Mexico.  Slap some Radar or Hydro in the thing (I'd favor the latter) and rock some faces.

I was making Mutsu work also, but you have to admit, her sales has been abysmal.  You rarely if ever see Mutsu in action and to me, of all the Premium BBs that haven't been perma-yanked, she was the rarest.  That was until Ashitaka was released.  That bombed hard.

 

I still remember Old Stock Amagi and I sure as hell was not going to pay for that experience.

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If they could only fix the sigma (back to 1.9 ideally) and beef up the secondaries they will sell a ton of these.

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7 minutes ago, nagasakee said:

If they could only fix the sigma (back to 1.9 ideally) and beef up the secondaries they will sell a ton of these.

 

It needs to have some balancing downside or it's just a straight-up better Alabama.  German levels of sigma will be OK as long as the secondaries have enough bite and the ship has enough durability.  If you're using your secondaries then you're at 10 KM or less, so your main battery will still hit.

Edited by SCygnus

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