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RagingxMarmoset

I have a question about the Scharnhorst.

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Here is the scenario:

 

I was engaging a King George V from about 12-13 kilometers. He was kiting away and firing HE, having varied success. I stuck with AP because he would occasionally soften the angle to near full broadside. RNG was trolling me hard, but I was chipping away fairly well. In the end, a combination of the fires he set and some air dropped torpedoes finished me. 

 

We won, but it came down to a last second miracle play. Had I taken care of the KGV, it would have been a rout for us. Should I have switched to HE for that engagement? I keep hearing about how poorly German HE performs, but I wonder if I could have sunk the Brit if I had switched.

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If you are chasing KGV prepare to burn until you are dead. Unless he shows a perfect broadside to you. That 11 inch guns is just not good enough.

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Yeah, he kited you hard. You could have switched to HE, and/or find some way of disengaging from him. This way, your are getting out of the situation that KGV wanted you in.

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7 minutes ago, BearlyHereBear said:

yes

 

 

6 minutes ago, BearlyHereBear said:

But I would have done it like you....

I’m with Bear on this one!

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The more I think about this, the more I think I should have broken off and found a new angle or target. Damn.

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I almost always use HE against bbs in sharny but I also tend to run from them until late game where I can close and brawl. I’ll use ap for brawling. 

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20 minutes ago, RagingxMarmoset said:

Here is the scenario:

 

I was engaging a King George V from about 12-13 kilometers. He was kiting away and firing HE, having varied success. I stuck with AP because he would occasionally soften the angle to near full broadside. RNG was trolling me hard, but I was chipping away fairly well. In the end, a combination of the fires he set and some air dropped torpedoes finished me. 

 

We won, but it came down to a last second miracle play. Had I taken care of the KGV, it would have been a rout for us. Should I have switched to HE for that engagement? I keep hearing about how poorly German HE performs, but I wonder if I could have sunk the Brit if I had switched.

Scharn HE not so good.  Could you have gotten closer to KGV? IMO you were too far away because Scharn is a BB killer if you can get within 5km or closer. Main guns, secondaries kick in, and THEN you unleash fast torps at a range where it is hard to miss. Of course I don't know all the circumstances that confronted you. IMO generally not wise to trade main gun shots with BBs at range.  Your main guns are only 11 inch.Just my 2 cents. I do have her and love that ship. Fits my style. Carry on and good luck.

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In that situation you are playing to the KGV's strengths and not your own. The Scharn is not meant to take on BBs at range unless they are being dumb and showing broadside for long periods of time.

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10 minutes ago, wstugamd said:

I almost always use HE against bbs in sharny but I also tend to run from them until late game where I can close and brawl. I’ll use ap for brawling. 

She a brawling monster if ya do it right!  For sure.

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The better weapon of the Scharnhorst is the speed. That saved him in Norway against the Renown or later in convoy attacks after discovering a BB with the escort. The speed saved him by the war to the last battle. Then, with the speed lost in the Cape Nord battle, he was doomed.  

Edited by Komarov60

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11 minutes ago, Komarov60 said:

The better weapon of the Scharnhorst is the speed. That saved him in Norway against the Renown or later in convoy attacks after discovering a BB with the escort. The speed saved him by the war to the last battle. Then, with the speed lost in the Cape Nord battle, he was doomed.  

I use her speed early game to hunt down cl and punish. Only seek bbs late game when it’s brawling time

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Its often better to change target. Dont try to 1v1 unless you have a big advantage. In that situation it was better to desingage and go after other ship.

 

If for some reason you cant disangage and its forced in a 1v1. If he keeps angled change to HE. And try to get closer and brawl. You have better chance there. 

 

Scharnhorst HE is pretty meh, its your last resource. Only use when your AP is useless and you dont have other target to shoot at.

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Start turning your turrets in preparation, turn hard across his stern so the only way his guns can still hit you is to turn himself as you will max out his turret angle, you keep turning forcing him to come around, you should end up with a broadside , or you will be able to disengage, need to rotate your own guns first though and give up a round of shooting 

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Even scharn gets the 1/4 pen HE and can start fires on a moving target. Angled target and sometimes long ranges, better to just use he HE.

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Love my Scharn and having been in these situations where I can't close the distance and brawl I fire HE and disengage. It's not great HE but it gets the job done. 

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Scharn is a anti-cruiser BB. The only time your AP should come into play during a BB engagement is if that BB is close (10km's give or take) and showing a full broadside. <Some BB's you might can citadel at longer ranges if their armor is weak enough though. No angling what so ever. If the BB is showing an angle and refusing to give you a full broadside target, switch to HE and use that instead. You will do more damage over time as long as you are hitting the superstructure; via regular damage to said superstructure and fires, you will likely do much better than if you were using AP.

Since that BB was running away from you, you could not use your preferred tool of choice (torpedoes) to deal with it. If you started to notice the battle turning against you, or that you believe you cannot win, do not be afraid to break away from the engagement and retreat (BUT NEVER show your broadside if the enemy can fire at you.) German Turtleback armor may be good, but it can still be penetrated and you can still take a hit to your citadel.

Edited by Levits

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1 hour ago, RagingxMarmoset said:

The more I think about this, the more I think I should have broken off and found a new angle or target.

Yeah ... now you have the winning tactic; play to YOUR strong points, not his.

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@RagingxMarmoset play against the team, dont play against a ship. Did the KGV have to die? Was his position vital to his team or prevent your team from accomplsihing some immediate objective?  People get too fixated on fighting what’s infront of them so they try to win a fight where they don’t have an advantage and never stop to ask if the fight was worth fighting for in the first place.

 

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31 minutes ago, NCC81701 said:

@RagingxMarmoset play against the team, dont play against a ship. Did the KGV have to die? Was his position vital to his team or prevent your team from accomplsihing some immediate objective?  People get too fixated on fighting what’s infront of them so they try to win a fight where they don’t have an advantage and never stop to ask if the fight was worth fighting for in the first place.

 

I felt his demise was at least somewhat critical. He had a direct line to our carrier and posed a serious threat to our cap. However, upon reflection, I should have disengaged and regrouped with our remaining cruiser, probably saving my ship and giving us an overmatch if the KGV pressed the attack. So, I think the answer to may question is not what ammunition type was correct, but what tactic was correct? Practice, practice, practice.

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Should have disengaged rather than press an engagement on unfavorable terms.

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