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KalishniKat

Tired of the OP Ship Thing

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Seeing Kamikazes and other OP premiums consistently get 4 to 5 kills per game is getting old. How do you expect to have game balance when you have an elite class of ships and individuals who have much better ships constantly dominating games, and yet you then make it so that no one else can possibly acquire these ships. If you made a mistake and introduced and OP ship, the answer is not to make it so no one else can have them, thus ensuring a small elite class of clubbers, the answer maybe is to buff other ships to meet them on a more even field. WG won't nerf these ships so why not buff others to match? These ships take an already crappy MM with T5 andT6 and make it worse. And then WG wonders about player retention issues. 

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I think you're missing the point. 

 

There are no "OP" ships only "OP" captains.

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1 minute ago, CorradoG60 said:

I think you're missing the point. 

 

There are no "OP" ships only "OP" captains.

I know you're being sarcastic, but some people won't get it, most likely the ones with 4,000 kamikaze games.

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In the case of Kamikaze and her sisters, anyone using them nowadays will likely be veteran players who have been around a while, and know the ship inside out. I think it's less about the ship and all about the people sailing her.

It's funny looking back, that when Fujin was introduced it was received poorly, being seen as a slightly worse copypaste of Minekaze. How the game has changed.

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I don't have a Kamikaze, so I can't say too much about it aside from I can only recall being killed by one once and it was because I was caught off guard by the quick reload.  To be honest, I'm struggling to think of a single ship that worries me when I see it.  There are definitely players that make me worry, but not ships.

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Please repeat after me: It's not the ship, it's the driver.

 

Belfast, for instance, is supposed to be OP a/f. I, however, suck sweaty donkey you know whats in it. Again, driver, not ship. Driver.

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I think what's OP really depends on your playstyle. What's OP to one person may not be OP to another.

E.G. when I think of OP ships, Kamikaze is nowhere even on that list.

I think that alone is enough to give credence to the, "it's not the ship, it's the captain," posts above.

And I don't even have a Kamikaze variant, so it's not me just defending my own slice of OP either.  

Edited by Poharan

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T10 is a wonderful place. 

Untainted by premiums.

Most balanced tier. 

Always top tier. 

Edited by Kombat_W0MBAT
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My favorite tech-tree ship for a long time was the Minekaze. I was told the Kamikaze clones would likely never be sold again. But the Kamikaze was sold for three days or so just ahead of the IJN DD line split and the nerfs to Isokaze and Minekaze, so I bought it as a way to keep playing what was essentially a pre-nerf Minekaze. I was decent in the Minekaze, and have improved since buying the Kamikaze. But I think that has been more a case of my becoming a better player, really. 

I agree that the ship is very good. But it is a lot better in the hands of someone familiar with how to play it and who may have a 17-19 point captain to put in it. And I think that is the case for a handful of other ships, too. Giulio, Belfast, Kutuzov, Nicolai, Gremy, etc. So much so that in the hands of a player who knows how to get the most out of these ships they can be monsters. But so can the Clemson and some other tech-tree ships.

Respects,

Am

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2 minutes ago, Kombat_W0MBAT said:

T10 is a wonderful place. 

Untainted by premiums.

Most balanced tier. 

I think you accidentally put a zero after the one there....

PPevp0H.png

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14 minutes ago, Th3KrimzonD3mon said:

Please repeat after me: It's not the ship, it's the driver.

Yes the driver is the biggest difference. Some can do well in really bad ships. However, if captains are nearly equal, then ship quality takes over.  Put me in an Indy car and an Indy driver in a '74 Pinto and the Indy driver is probably going to win 'cuz I don't know what I'm doing and will probably crash (who put such a tiny steering wheel in this thing??). Put an Indy driver in each, which is going to win?

 

So you have good ships being played by good players, double whammy.

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25 minutes ago, Th3KrimzonD3mon said:

Please repeat after me: It's not the ship, it's the driver.

 

Belfast, for instance, is supposed to be OP a/f. I, however, suck sweaty donkey you know whats in it. Again, driver, not ship. Driver.

It IS the ship, mate.

Many issue and wg/wows fail to see many issue and seem to never fix the big ones. (or so it seems)

I have well over 200 ships in port. Most all people on the planet (except Russia I'll assume) expect a warranty of use, usability and durability (among others). You refuse to offer anything to your customer.

A 7 day return policy should be started. Digital items have no inherent value to begin and with wordy salesmanship tactics and vague promises of fun and proportionate use, you sell items that many people will not or can't enjoy.

Of course I've checked in your own forums, YouTube and other sources and find a return policy is really needed. Of course, I see if offering a steam of mediocre ships might kill the business. So it might be better for all to limit the mediocre and offer 'fun' and 'entertaining' ships.  One ship or type of ship will never please everyone, but 'game' makers need to appear to be trying on this gamesmanship  front.

I'm very offended to read 'your' new ship reports and find, that the ship is actually quite awful. Then find some reviewer saying what you know about the offending ship. My money is gone and I've learned to hate and mistrust Wargaming/World of War Ships. When customer pays 'YOU' $40/50/60/70/80/90 or a $100 dollars for single digital ship...it can become a real hate.

A 7 day return policy...is that reasonable?

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4 minutes ago, Super_Dreadnought said:

In the case of Kamikaze and her sisters, anyone using them nowadays will likely be veteran players who have been around a while, and know the ship inside out. I think it's less about the ship and all about the people sailing her.

I'm a pathetic DD player.  I just don't have the patience and don't mind being seen in a CL or BB.

The only DD I really have fun in is the Kami R.  Though I kinda like the Longjiang at tier 2 with 4.7 km concealment and 8.5 km torps - YIKES!

And I have the Walkitalkie cause I got the Halloween camo.

 

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Quote

Seeing Kamikazes and other OP premiums consistently get 4 to 5 kills per game is getting old. How do you expect to have game balance when you have an elite class of ships and individuals who have much better ships constantly dominating games, and yet you then make it so that no one else can possibly acquire these ships. If you made a mistake and introduced and OP ship, the answer is not to make it so no one else can have them, thus ensuring a small elite class of clubbers, the answer maybe is to buff other ships to meet them on a more even field. WG won't nerf these ships so why not buff others to match? These ships take an already crappy MM with T5 andT6 and make it worse. And then WG wonders about player retention issues. 

The better the driver, the more powerful the ship.

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7 minutes ago, Kombat_W0MBAT said:

T10 is a wonderful place. 

Untainted by premiums.

Most balanced tier. 

Always top tier. 

Kalishnicat, what K. Wombat is so politely saying is;  You need to get out of the Kiddie Pool ( tier 4-6 ) and get into the deep end ( tier 10 ) where skill is the meta and OP ships are available to ANYONE who wants to grind it out.  I'm sure you feel more comfortable there at tier 5, but WG is going to make sure that tier 10 is the most properly balanced since that is where the "end game" competitive content takes place.  Tier 5 is fun zone, not serious business zone, so if the performance of several of the ships annoys you - climb above it and swim in the unbiased tier 10 waters, where your skill is exposed for all to see.

I find it difficult to match my lower and mid tier performance ( 4-8 ) in tier 9 and 10, but that's because I don't play enough matches there.  Yet nothing feels better than a tier 10 carry, because you know it was earned.

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8 minutes ago, tincan_SC said:

It IS the ship, mate.

Many issue and wg/wows fail to see many issue and seem to never fix the big ones. (or so it seems)

I have well over 200 ships in port. Most all people on the planet (except Russia I'll assume) expect a warranty of use, usability and durability (among others). You refuse to offer anything to your customer.

A 7 day return policy should be started. Digital items have no inherent value to begin and with wordy salesmanship tactics and vague promises of fun and proportionate use, you sell items that many people will not or can't enjoy.

Of course I've checked in your own forums, YouTube and other sources and find a return policy is really needed. Of course, I see if offering a steam of mediocre ships might kill the business. So it might be better for all to limit the mediocre and offer 'fun' and 'entertaining' ships.  One ship or type of ship will never please everyone, but 'game' makers need to appear to be trying on this gamesmanship  front.

I'm very offended to read 'your' new ship reports and find, that the ship is actually quite awful. Then find some reviewer saying what you know about the offending ship. My money is gone and I've learned to hate and mistrust Wargaming/World of War Ships. When customer pays 'YOU' $40/50/60/70/80/90 or a $100 dollars for single digital ship...it can become a real hate.

A 7 day return policy...is that reasonable?

Single issue voter for sure ......

Why the heck are you hijacking a thread about OP ships with your complaint/rant?  Have the decency to start your own thread or take it to support please.

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45 minutes ago, CorradoG60 said:

I think you're missing the point. 

 

There are no "OP" ships only "OP" captains.

that's total bull

then why don't you drive a crap ship? why do you want spend $50 to buy a premium ship instead? just for looks? got too much money to throw away? LOL

Edited by Happy668
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34 minutes ago, KalishniKat said:

Seeing Kamikazes and other OP premiums consistently get 4 to 5 kills per game is getting old. How do you expect to have game balance when you have an elite class of ships and individuals who have much better ships constantly dominating games, and yet you then make it so that no one else can possibly acquire these ships. If you made a mistake and introduced and OP ship, the answer is not to make it so no one else can have them, thus ensuring a small elite class of clubbers, the answer maybe is to buff other ships to meet them on a more even field. WG won't nerf these ships so why not buff others to match? These ships take an already crappy MM with T5 andT6 and make it worse. And then WG wonders about player retention issues. 

 

Funny how a ship that started off as a tech-tree ship with nerfed guns is now classified as a seal clubber, innit? That's what the Fujin was.

Kamikaze R was a clone of it, but given away to people who overperformed in a challenge some years back. For a while, the running joke was "we have more Kamikazes than they do, obviously we're going to win." There was more than a little truth to it, too, because the ship had been earned by people who had worked their way through some fairly difficult challenges to get it, and were therefore probably at a slightly higher skill level than the people who didn't have it.

The people who still play it today? Years later? We're generally not exactly the bottom 5% of the player base. I'm not spectacular by any means, but I've got enough battles to know what I'm doing, and enough battles in Kamikaze-R that I can frequently have a good impact on the outcome of the battle.

Yeah, a good player can do some good stuff with it, but seriously: it's not nearly as OP as people think.

And yeah, I get Krakens with it here and there. But the thing is, it's not because I'm overpowered... it's because somebody, somewhere, did something dumb and let me kill them. Or rather, 5 somebodies.

In this battle, I spent half the fight spotted, but people just weren't trying to kill me for some reason! I think 2 ships actually put in any effort on that front. The Omaha (who was so low health that I was able to gun him) and the Bogue at the end (who didn't have enough planes left to make it happen).  I didn't do anything in this battle that couldn't have been done in almost any destroyer from T3 up in the same game.  (*almost. Asashio couldn't have torped that one cruiser at the beginning.)

This isn't because I'm a super-skilled player or because Kamikaze-R is OP. It's about lack of determined attempts to kill me from the other team. When that happens? I get shut out. I've had probably 3 games in the last week where I didn't break 10,000, because the other team's destroyers and cruisers made sure that I died. 2 of them, I didn't even break 5,000!

 

 

 

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Asashio, Kutuzov, Belfast, and in that order.  Asashio hasn't been fully realized yet but it will surpass Kutuzov.  OP has a point but this, after all, is a business in a very niche market of ship gaming.

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8 minutes ago, BullHalsey said:

Asashio, Kutuzov, Belfast, and in that order.  Asashio hasn't been fully realized yet but it will surpass Kutuzov.  OP has a point but this, after all, is a business in a very niche market of ship gaming.

 

Lol, no. Asashio isn't OP. It's a gimmicky ship that excels at one thing. Killing BBs. That's it.

The only blatantly OP ships in the game are the Nikolai, Gremy, Kamikaze, and Belfast. Gulio, Konig, and GZ get honorable mentions. 

People often misconstrue "overperforming" as "overpowered".

Edited by Kombat_W0MBAT
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4 minutes ago, Kombat_W0MBAT said:

 

Lol, no. Asashio isn't OP. It's a gimmicky ship that excels at one thing. Killing BBs. That's it.

The only blatantly OP ships in the game are the Nikolai, Gremy, and Belfast. 

People often misconstrue "overperforming" as "overpowered".

We just have a minor difference of opinion here; also it is bordering on semantics to call overperforming different from overpowered.  You left out the Kutuzov.  One well played Kutu, or god help you, two moderately well played Kutuzovs can easily spell disaster for an opposing team.

Perhaps you could state the difference between overperforming and overpowered for us.

Edited by BullHalsey

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I remember when the Kamikaze as thought of as a worse Minekaze. Some people even jokingly sold theirs since the Minekaze was "better in every way".

Then the Minekaze got nerfed into the floor.

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56 minutes ago, Super_Dreadnought said:

It's funny looking back, that when Fujin was introduced it was received poorly, being seen as a slightly worse copypaste of Minekaze. How the game has changed.

3 minutes ago, Cruiser_StLouis said:

I remember when the Kamikaze as thought of as a worse Minekaze. Some people even jokingly sold theirs since the Minekaze was "better in every way".

Then the Minekaze got nerfed into the floor.

Yup, I remember this too. Kamikaze R was considered mediocre compared to Minekaze, at the time.

 

OP, the only reason the Kamikaze sisters are considered "over-powered" at this stage in the game is because they're the remnants of what the IJN DD line used to be. The Kamikaze's retained the super fast T5 IJN torps of old, and due to how the split turned out, their gun handling is middle of the road now, aka passable. This combined with 5.4km concealment and skilled captains driving them, you get what you often see now.

 

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5 minutes ago, GhostSwordsman said:

their gun handling is middle of the road now, aka passable. 

Passable?

9 second reloads, dude.

9

second

reloads

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Oh how things have changed in a few years.  Kam and sisters used to be laughable premiums till the entire IJN DD line got nuked with the nerf hammer.  They are no where near OP.  Good players in good ships make them feel that way.  Just another BB whine thread.  Carry on.

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