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StoptheViolins

Waterline 1.1 and the End of WASD Hacks?

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I finally took the time to watch Waterline 1.1 and found myself actually appalled by some of things that WG is changing.

1)  Generalization:  BB shells aren't supposed to hurt DDs.

When the two fellows described the mechanics of the AP shell and stated that the salt spewing from DD players was actually being considered as a real issue I was like "what??"  So the mechanics are working as designed but DD players and think getting hit for 1/3 health by a BB is bad.  Right now I feel lucky if I hit a DD with any shell fired from my BB at a DD.  DD's have the highest dispersion defensive bonus in game so when a BB lands a hit, the BB should be rewarded equally with how the BB shell is designed to damage.  Whether it be min or max.  I find the whole thing akin to BB players demanding torpedoes only do 10% damage if the DD is within 3km when the DD fires the torpedo because DDs deleting a BB at close range is unfair to BB players.

If a BB lands a shot on a DD and the shell does 1/3 damage to the DD that's unfortunate but that's just the nature of the game.  The DD gets plenty of defensive bonuses from large cammo values, lowest smoke firing penalties, and ships firing at them get a dispersion debuff.  To compensate DDs have a small HP pool and require good tactics to play but have a huge alpha damage potential.  DDs literally can delete BBs in one salvo.  BBs used to be able to delete cruisers butt that got taken away.  DDs don't need any more protectionism from WG.

2) Generalization: WASD hacks and good positioning shouldn't be rewarded.

Two mods, one I never heard of are being considered for integration into the game itself vs being outlawed.  One is called Traffic Light or something similar that allows players to see whether a ship is slowing down or speeding up.  Uhm... slowing down and speeding up is a potent long range WASD hack and even a short range one for use against torpedo boats.

The other mod they didn't name but I've heard of to oh so much salt is the mod that allows using the mini-map to aim long range shots.  Now granted, most warships had plotting rooms and this mod kind of puts it in line with the plotting room but WoWS isn't really that detailed of a battleship simulator. To be honest I haven't even seen video of the mini-map aiming mod but based on the threads it pretty much benefits the US or any other ship that has huge shell arches the most simply because it allows players to target ships behind islands (that the shells can clear to target) that the regular aiming system won't allow.  Normally ducking behind an island is good positioning since that keeps you out of target site of most ships.  But not so anymore.

Now strictly speaking the mini-map aiming tool once given to everyone might not be a game breaker for most, and it will definitely make US cruisers more viable (Atlanta's sending that fire rain over the mountain) so I am not sure whether it's really something to be overly concerned with... but any mods that allow ship prediction boons kind of dumbs down the game.  I mean WoT from 2013 required aiming and sighting in targets but WoT 2017 just requires putting a sight on the target and spamming away - no need for siting in your guns. Gold ammo is now credit ammo - no need to aim for weak spots as gold ammo for some tanks make all the enemy tank a weak spot. Totally dumbed down game play.  Adding prediction on ships to WoWS - exact same path.  WoWS needs to keep some thinking in the game.

3) I don't think WG gets what is wrong with carriers.  I might not either.

The issue I have with carriers is that (in PvE) I at most get 4-5 sorties off before the match is over.  Unless I am spot on, my team doesn't face hug reds, and DDs don't roll the map I don't get a lot of XP out of the battle.  I am not hindered by the interface unless I am distracted by.... SQUIRREL!  but I am hindered by a feeling that I can't contribute much to a match beyond killing the AI planes, spotting, and making the AI waste it's repair party.  CVs feel pretty MEH right now.  Not obscenely bad, just not middling engaging. 

Granted CVs are a fairly casual affair, stay in map mode, direct planes, repeat.  No heart pounding action of a BB duel or a action suspense story being played out by a DD to be had in a CV.  Just a lot of strategic thinking and planning for a handful of rewards - even for great CV play.

As a realist I do realize that in a crack CV player's hand a CV can be the red teams nightmare, but so can a good other type of ship player.  Even on ace games where I had good sinkings and equally good damage the CV payout was minuscule compared to what BB play pays.  Not sure why - payout is still based on the same numbers - oh wait.. flags.  Yup, I can run 4 more flags on every other ship type (usually all economic) thus making the rewards feel more significant so maybe adding 4 economic only flags to CVs would help "some".

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1 minute ago, StoptheViolins said:

(Atlanta's sending that fire rain over the mountain)

I suspect that once this mod becomes integrated into the game, it will  make Atlanta and St Louis (T3 American) so powerful that they will either have to remove the Atlanta from sale (as they did the Belfast) and nerf the St Louis' ROF or fire chance, or remove the mod and ban it.

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14 minutes ago, StoptheViolins said:

BBs used to be able to delete cruisers butt that got taken away

Good news, I can stop humping islands with a Des Moines then!

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19 minutes ago, StoptheViolins said:

 

1)  Generalization:  BB shells aren't supposed to hurt DDs.

When the two fellows described the mechanics of the AP shell and stated that the salt spewing from DD players was actually being considered as a real issue I was like "what??"  So the mechanics are working as designed but DD players and think getting hit for 1/3 health by a BB is bad.  Right now I feel lucky if I hit a DD with any shell fired from my BB at a DD.  DD's have the highest dispersion defensive bonus in game so when a BB lands a hit, the BB should be rewarded equally with how the BB shell is designed to damage.  Whether it be min or max.  I find the whole thing akin to BB players demanding torpedoes only do 10% damage if the DD is within 3km when the DD fires the torpedo because DDs deleting a BB at close range is unfair to BB players.

If a BB lands a shot on a DD and the shell does 1/3 damage to the DD that's unfortunate but that's just the nature of the game.  The DD gets plenty of defensive bonuses from large cammo values, lowest smoke firing penalties, and ships firing at them get a dispersion debuff.  To compensate DDs have a small HP pool and require good tactics to play but have a huge alpha damage potential.  DDs literally can delete BBs in one salvo.  BBs used to be able to delete cruisers butt that got taken away.  DDs don't need any more protectionism from WG.

The issue wasn’t that a BB could pen a DD. The issue was “double dip” shells. I think it is fixed now but a BB could get a pen and overpen with the same shell. So essentially doing 33% + 10% of the alpha. What they are talking about it’s supposed to do 33% or 10%. A NC hitting a DD should do 4,323 for a pen and 1,310 for an overpen. It would occasionally hit a DD for 5,633. 

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13 minutes ago, StoptheViolins said:

- BBs used to be able to delete cruisers butt that got taken away.  DDs don't need any more protectionism from WG.

- Two mods, one I never heard of are being considered for integration into the game itself vs being outlawed.  One is called Traffic Light or something similar that allows players to see whether a ship is slowing down or speeding up.  Uhm... slowing down and speeding up is a potent long range WASD hack and even a short range one for use against torpedo boats.

- The other mod they didn't name but I've heard of to oh so much salt is the mod that allows using the mini-map to aim long range shots. 

2

- Are we playing the same game re: cruisers?  Though I'd consider suggesting reversing the additional 5% dispersion debuff that affects battleships a few patches back if DD's are guaranteed to overpen.  Making a battleship have to consider switching ammo types would increase the skill floor of the platform which I don't think would impact most good players, but might make a newbie stop gravitating toward the platform.  But it's hard to hit a DD at 13km if they aren't a potato and at top tier that is the range you are threatened by most torpedo platforms.  Perhaps that is intentional by the designers, time will tell.

- If you are in a ship with torpedos now you have this ability without any single mod.  This is a favorite tactic of Hindenberg players to range their shots against BB's.  It doesn't predict the future, so if you are being predictable you are going to get hit regardless.  Again, the shells don't adjust course once they are fired.

- If you allow X marks the spot to exist, you need to give the information to everyone.  Else the mod has to be removed.  Oh, and in an Atlanta I can hit you from behind that island now.  You don't fire off a few million rounds of ammo without learning how to drop it on people's heads.  This gives the info to novice players and counters island camping in a stationary position.  An Atlanta sitting broadside behind an island is in as much danger as you are from him if he sits in the same spot after being spotted.

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32 minutes ago, StoptheViolins said:

I finally took the time to watch Waterline 1.1 and found myself actually appalled by some of things that WG is changing.

1)  Generalization:  BB shells aren't supposed to hurt DDs.

When the two fellows described the mechanics of the AP shell and stated that the salt spewing from DD players was actually being considered as a real issue I was like "what??"  So the mechanics are working as designed but DD players and think getting hit for 1/3 health by a BB is bad.  Right now I feel lucky if I hit a DD with any shell fired from my BB at a DD.  DD's have the highest dispersion defensive bonus in game so when a BB lands a hit, the BB should be rewarded equally with how the BB shell is designed to damage.  Whether it be min or max.  I find the whole thing akin to BB players demanding torpedoes only do 10% damage if the DD is within 3km when the DD fires the torpedo because DDs deleting a BB at close range is unfair to BB players.

If a BB lands a shot on a DD and the shell does 1/3 damage to the DD that's unfortunate but that's just the nature of the game.  The DD gets plenty of defensive bonuses from large cammo values, lowest smoke firing penalties, and ships firing at them get a dispersion debuff.  To compensate DDs have a small HP pool and require good tactics to play but have a huge alpha damage potential.  DDs literally can delete BBs in one salvo.  BBs used to be able to delete cruisers butt that got taken away.  DDs don't need any more protectionism from WG.

2) Generalization: WASD hacks and good positioning shouldn't be rewarded.

Two mods, one I never heard of are being considered for integration into the game itself vs being outlawed.  One is called Traffic Light or something similar that allows players to see whether a ship is slowing down or speeding up.  Uhm... slowing down and speeding up is a potent long range WASD hack and even a short range one for use against torpedo boats.

The other mod they didn't name but I've heard of to oh so much salt is the mod that allows using the mini-map to aim long range shots.  Now granted, most warships had plotting rooms and this mod kind of puts it in line with the plotting room but WoWS isn't really that detailed of a battleship simulator. To be honest I haven't even seen video of the mini-map aiming mod but based on the threads it pretty much benefits the US or any other ship that has huge shell arches the most simply because it allows players to target ships behind islands (that the shells can clear to target) that the regular aiming system won't allow.  Normally ducking behind an island is good positioning since that keeps you out of target site of most ships.  But not so anymore.

Now strictly speaking the mini-map aiming tool once given to everyone might not be a game breaker for most, and it will definitely make US cruisers more viable (Atlanta's sending that fire rain over the mountain) so I am not sure whether it's really something to be overly concerned with... but any mods that allow ship prediction boons kind of dumbs down the game.  I mean WoT from 2013 required aiming and sighting in targets but WoT 2017 just requires putting a sight on the target and spamming away - no need for siting in your guns. Gold ammo is now credit ammo - no need to aim for weak spots as gold ammo for some tanks make all the enemy tank a weak spot. Totally dumbed down game play.  Adding prediction on ships to WoWS - exact same path.  WoWS needs to keep some thinking in the game.

3) I don't think WG gets what is wrong with carriers.  I might not either.

The issue I have with carriers is that (in PvE) I at most get 4-5 sorties off before the match is over.  Unless I am spot on, my team doesn't face hug reds, and DDs don't roll the map I don't get a lot of XP out of the battle.  I am not hindered by the interface unless I am distracted by.... SQUIRREL!  but I am hindered by a feeling that I can't contribute much to a match beyond killing the AI planes, spotting, and making the AI waste it's repair party.  CVs feel pretty MEH right now.  Not obscenely bad, just not middling engaging. 

Granted CVs are a fairly casual affair, stay in map mode, direct planes, repeat.  No heart pounding action of a BB duel or a action suspense story being played out by a DD to be had in a CV.  Just a lot of strategic thinking and planning for a handful of rewards - even for great CV play.

As a realist I do realize that in a crack CV player's hand a CV can be the red teams nightmare, but so can a good other type of ship player.  Even on ace games where I had good sinkings and equally good damage the CV payout was minuscule compared to what BB play pays.  Not sure why - payout is still based on the same numbers - oh wait.. flags.  Yup, I can run 4 more flags on every other ship type (usually all economic) thus making the rewards feel more significant so maybe adding 4 economic only flags to CVs would help "some".

1. The problem with BB AP vs DDs is that for some reason, BBs that get regular pens for 1/3 base damage are also getting the 10% overpen damage as well.  That's the problem.

2a.  The traffic light mod.  Part of me doesn't like this.  OTOH, I also don't like how ships that have torpedo launchers have a built in version of this.  You can be wayyyyyy out of torp range of a target, but use your torp aiming guide to judge the speed of a spotted enemy.  This doesn't seem fair to me.

2b. Mini-map aiming.  I think that this actually seems like a good idea.  For me, it's less about some BB deciding to blind shot that spot on the map 25 km away where an enemy was last spotted than it is for ships like the Atlanta who when they lose target lock on an enemy (due to the enemy no longer being spotted) on the other side of an island can no longer lob shells over said island.

If some people think that this is OP, they should consider that ships that have such high shell trajectories have considerable difficulty hitting targets near their max ranges due to the long shell flight times that come with high shell trajectories.  It seems to me like this is a nice way to give those ships a little compensation for that negative.

3. "I don't think WG gets what is wrong with carriers.  I might not either."  I think that it's the latter.  Also, if you're playing CVs in co-op, yes, you will usually have limited chances to do damage when you're on a team that aren't total potatoes.  That's the way it is with CVs in Coop.  If you want the chance to do real damage, get in more strikes, etc., I suggest you play CVs in randoms.  The reality is that with only 8 ships per team in coop, there's only so much you can do, unless you're in a higher tier coop battle with a lot of BBs.  And then your damage potential may increase.

As for doing damage in coop with CVs, if you know that the enemy bots will instantly use a DC part after a single fire or flood, you can use this against them.  Don't send all your bombers at a single target all at once.  Send in one DB squadron to get the first fire.  Then after you get that fire and the bots puts it out, give the bot a little time for the DC party to get into cooldown, then strike him again with the rest of your planes.  Just like one can manage fire damage on your own BBs, you can manage fire/flood damage on enemy bots because you KNOW that they'll use a DC party on the first fire or flood.  And you can use that knowledge against them.

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58 minutes ago, Belyy_Klyk said:

The issue wasn’t that a BB could pen a DD. The issue was “double dip” shells.

 

32 minutes ago, Crucis said:

1. The problem with BB AP vs DDs is that for some reason, BBs that get regular pens for 1/3 base damage are also getting the 10% overpen damage as well.  That's the problem.

So let me get this straight, BBs should still be able to hit for pen damage against DDs after the "fix"?

I really hated the idea of them removing this, so im thankful if they are keeping this, seeing as I basically never got the double hits since a few patches ago anyway.

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1 hour ago, StoptheViolins said:

1)  Generalization:  BB shells aren't supposed to hurt DDs.

When the two fellows described the mechanics of the AP shell and stated that the salt spewing from DD players was actually being considered as a real issue I was like "what??"  So the mechanics are working as designed but DD players and think getting hit for 1/3 health by a BB is bad.  Right now I feel lucky if I hit a DD with any shell fired from my BB at a DD.  DD's have the highest dispersion defensive bonus in game so when a BB lands a hit, the BB should be rewarded equally with how the BB shell is designed to damage.  Whether it be min or max.  I find the whole thing akin to BB players demanding torpedoes only do 10% damage if the DD is within 3km when the DD fires the torpedo because DDs deleting a BB at close range is unfair to BB players.

If a BB lands a shot on a DD and the shell does 1/3 damage to the DD that's unfortunate but that's just the nature of the game.  The DD gets plenty of defensive bonuses from large cammo values, lowest smoke firing penalties, and ships firing at them get a dispersion debuff.  To compensate DDs have a small HP pool and require good tactics to play but have a huge alpha damage potential.  DDs literally can delete BBs in one salvo.  BBs used to be able to delete cruisers butt that got taken away.  DDs don't need any more protectionism from WG.

You should read some of the threads relating to this in more detail, then you might understand why its been brought up.

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1 minute ago, Akeno017 said:

So let me get this straight, BBs should still be able to hit for pen damage against DDs after the "fix"?

I really hated the idea of them removing this, so im thankful if they are keeping this, seeing as I basically never got the double hits since a few patches ago anyway.

Yeah you can still pen a DD if it is angled or straight on. You should get mostly pens against an angled or head on DD and mostly overpen a to a flat broadside DD. 

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42 minutes ago, Crucis said:

Also, if you're playing CVs in co-op, yes, you will usually have limited chances to do damage when you're on a team that aren't total potatoes.  That's the way it is with CVs in Coop.  If you want the chance to do real damage, get in more strikes, etc., I suggest you play CVs in randoms.  The reality is that with only 8 ships per team in coop, there's only so much you can do, unless you're in a higher tier coop battle with a lot of BBs.  And then your damage potential may increase.

Screw that.

I do more damage in Co-op because everyone I see in Randoms apparently has the WASD hax installed, and understands how to use AA and DF.

Dont know where these whiny potatoes who complain about being deleted by carriers are, but I sure don’t see them.

Damage in Co-op? Can only get it in high tiers?

Pretty much always get over 50k in low tier carriers, (tier 4 and 5,) occasionally over 100k, and on rare ‘good’ games where the Green bots or players totally spud out; 150k games fighting at Solo Warrior odds.

42 minutes ago, Crucis said:

As for doing damage in coop with CVs, if you know that the enemy bots will instantly use a DC part after a single fire or flood, you can use this against them.  Don't send all your bombers at a single target all at once.  Send in one DB squadron to get the first fire.  Then after you get that fire and the bots puts it out, give the bot a little time for the DC party to get into cooldown, then strike him again with the rest of your planes.  Just like one can manage fire damage on your own BBs, you can manage fire/flood damage on enemy bots because you KNOW that they'll use a DC party on the first fire or flood.  And you can use that knowledge against them.

Exactly.

This is how I do so much damage with carriers in Co-op.

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The traffic light mod I use doesn't tell me if a ship is speeding up or slowing down , it only indicates forward , stopped or reverse . Sometimes smoke from the stacks doesn't render at long range and WG knows this that's why it's allowed . The torpedo aiming indicator on some ships can give you much more info than the traffic light mod .

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3 minutes ago, CriMiNaL__ said:

You should read some of the threads relating to this in more detail, then you might understand why its been brought up.

I have usually they all start with "a BB hit me for X% of my health and shouldn't be able to do that".  My understanding its because the angle of the DD allows for the BB shell to fuse and detonate while still inside the DD (per Waterline) thus causing near max or near max single shell damage.  Which in any real world makes sense.  The gist of the thread seems that all BB shells should pass right through DDs for min damage per shell.  The DD's seem to think that that is unfair.  The DD player comes across sounding like since it takes two seconds to walk the width of a tunnel it should take two seconds to walk the length of the tunnel.

Technically the DD has presented armor thick enough for the AP shell to fuse and enough ship length to give the shell time to detonate before leaving the interior of the ship.  Since WG confirmed that the BB AP shell acts the same on all WoWS ships it's not a bug.

Not unless WG has the fusing of AP shells messed up I find it hard to believe it is anything but DD players wanting to just not take any real damage.  Next they'll holler about fused HE shells doing max damage.

As for "switching ammo types" the case for using AP on bow tanking DDs is to pick the shell that maxes damage on a single shell hit which quite honestly hitting a DD with a BB is hard enough as it is.  Given that the BB shell reload time is 30s some BBs just shoot what they have the first go and then set the reload to which ever shell is needed.

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I actually agree with having the mini map targeting mod. Not for shooting at ships I can see behind islands, but for those I can't. If you are trying to target gunfire behind an island, and the island obstructs your view, your guns are only going to shoot the island, nor the area behind it. This can be briefly overcome by using a spotter plane, but thats temporary and the cool down is insanely long. Plus ships that don't have the ability to launch planes are completely unable to do this. 

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3 minutes ago, Trowa03 said:

I actually agree with having the mini map targeting mod. Not for shooting at ships I can see behind islands, but for those I can't. If you are trying to target gunfire behind an island, and the island obstructs your view, your guns are only going to shoot the island, nor the area behind it. This can be briefly overcome by using a spotter plane, but thats temporary and the cool down is insanely long. Plus ships that don't have the ability to launch planes are completely unable to do this. 

Press “m” twice quickly. Voila.

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1 minute ago, StoptheViolins said:

I have usually they all start with "a BB hit me for X% of my health and shouldn't be able to do that".  My understanding its because the angle of the DD allows for the BB shell to fuse and detonate while still inside the DD (per Waterline) thus causing near max or near max single shell damage.  Which in any real world makes sense.  The gist of the thread seems that all BB shells should pass right through DDs for min damage per shell.  The DD's seem to think that that is unfair.  The DD player comes across sounding like since it takes two seconds to walk the width of a tunnel it should take two seconds to walk the length of the tunnel.

Technically the DD has presented armor thick enough for the AP shell to fuse and enough ship length to give the shell time to detonate before leaving the interior of the ship.  Since WG confirmed that the BB AP shell acts the same on all WoWS ships it's not a bug.

Not unless WG has the fusing of AP shells messed up I find it hard to believe it is anything but DD players wanting to just not take any real damage.  Next they'll holler about fused HE shells doing max damage.

As for "switching ammo types" the case for using AP on bow tanking DDs is to pick the shell that maxes damage on a single shell hit which quite honestly hitting a DD with a BB is hard enough as it is.  Given that the BB shell reload time is 30s some BBs just shoot what they have the first go and then set the reload to which ever shell is needed.

I have a funny feeling that all this stuff about AP and DD's more to do with that BB are not changing their ammo type to engage the DD, when He was used primarily on DD ages ago, now forgetting the British line as they were never around, you used to see people switch to HE all the time for a DD but now its just AP unless the DD is the last red.

I have learnt to not be hit running length ways from a BB as he can inflict more damage on me the if I'm angled or near broadside to him, I does depend on the nation of BB tho.

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17 minutes ago, retic1959 said:

The traffic light mod I use doesn't tell me if a ship is speeding up or slowing down , it only indicates forward , stopped or reverse . Sometimes smoke from the stacks doesn't render at long range and WG knows this that's why it's allowed . The torpedo aiming indicator on some ships can give you much more info than the traffic light mod .

There is a thing in Naval artillery called ranging shots. The traffic light mod is total crap......this game is easy enough but they seem to want to continually dumb down the game and make it easier and easier for people to play. 

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Premium ships will need to be immune to these changes in the very least otherwise Wargaming will have even more rage than such changes will already create. Because AP shells not hurting DDs will be major nerf to ships like Graf Spee that do well using AP, but still fair to DDs since Graf Spee has hard enough time hitting DDs with only 6 guns and faily long reload.

Also good thing that I have the RN BBs almost up to tier VIII so I will have a BB that Wargaming gave insane HE shells to.

But if the AP shells not hurting DDs thing goes into effect Wargaming  will have totally lost their minds. In real life AP shells could most certainly hurt DDs, I mean thing about the size of a BB shell and then think about that hitting a small ship... It is going to cause some damage if it hits. So idea of such shells causing 0 damage to DDs is crazy.

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3 minutes ago, Belthorian said:

There is a thing in Naval artillery called ranging shots. The traffic light mod is total crap......this game is easy enough but they seem to want to continually dumb down the game and make it easier and easier for people to play. 

Sad thing is the fact that Dev team even feels the need to dumb down the game. What ever happened to people wanting to be and act intelligent and being willing and able to figure things out? 

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2 hours ago, StoptheViolins said:

I finally took the time to watch Waterline 1.1 and found myself actually appalled by some of things that WG is changing.

1)  Generalization:  BB shells aren't supposed to hurt DDs.

When the two fellows described the mechanics of the AP shell and stated that the salt spewing from DD players was actually being considered as a real issue I was like "what??"  So the mechanics are working as designed but DD players and think getting hit for 1/3 health by a BB is bad.  Right now I feel lucky if I hit a DD with any shell fired from my BB at a DD.  DD's have the highest dispersion defensive bonus in game so when a BB lands a hit, the BB should be rewarded equally with how the BB shell is designed to damage.  Whether it be min or max.  I find the whole thing akin to BB players demanding torpedoes only do 10% damage if the DD is within 3km when the DD fires the torpedo because DDs deleting a BB at close range is unfair to BB players.

If a BB lands a shot on a DD and the shell does 1/3 damage to the DD that's unfortunate but that's just the nature of the game.  The DD gets plenty of defensive bonuses from large cammo values, lowest smoke firing penalties, and ships firing at them get a dispersion debuff.  To compensate DDs have a small HP pool and require good tactics to play but have a huge alpha damage potential.  DDs literally can delete BBs in one salvo.  BBs used to be able to delete cruisers butt that got taken away.  DDs don't need any more protectionism from WG.

You don't seem to understand what destroyer players have a problem with, RE: battleship shells, so I'll try to put it into perspective by changing the situation around so that it applies to something you can understand.

 

Hypothetical:

A torpedo with a damage rating of 10,000 hits your battleship. The explosion mechanic registers on the torpedo bulge, dealing damage reduced by your TDS rating of 30%-- 7000. The explosion then touches the inner hull and registers a second hit on a hull that has no torpedo bulge-- 10000. As a result, you have taken 17,000 damage from a 10k damage torpedo.

 

This kind of double-dipping is what battleship shells are doing to destroyers.

 

This kind of double-dipping is what destroyer players are raising a fuss about.

 

The idea that destroyer players are clamoring to be "invincible" is hyperbolic nonsense.

9 minutes ago, Belthorian said:

There is a thing in Naval artillery called ranging shots. The traffic light mod is total crap......this game is easy enough but they seem to want to continually dumb down the game and make it easier and easier for people to play. 

Running Lights is a HUD mod to compensate for when the game decides you don't need to see funnel smoke at medium to long range. A well known, well documented bug that's been in the game since CBT. Forgive people for coming up with a mod that provides them the same information the game is supposed to, but randomly decides not to.

 

Running Lights actually benefits battleships the most, since battleships are most likely to make long range shots. The claim that it would do anything for destroyers is ludicrous.

Edited by KiyoSenkan
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1 hour ago, Crucis said:

You can be wayyyyyy out of torp range of a target, but use your torp aiming guide to judge the speed of a spotted enemy.

You can also use it to see which way a spotted ship will exit from behind an island, literally predicting where he will appear. One of many broken mechanics in the game.

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Traffic light mod only says if the ship is moving forward, backward, or is stopped.

This wouldn't be a problem if the game didn't miss the boat on making something that should be easilu apparent plainly so.

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6 minutes ago, Admiral_Thrawn_1 said:

Sad thing is the fact that Dev team even feels the need to dumb down the game. What ever happened to people wanting to be and act intelligent and being willing and able to figure things out? 

Sadly that seems to be a thing of the past, especially with younger gamers. My nephew turned 21 recently but from when he was a little kid he always played games on rookie or easy level. It did not matter he was crushing the computer, he was never interested in raising the difficulty level. He did not even like complex games, he watched me play Age Of Conan for years, an MMO with the most complex combat system of any MMO. He tried it but having to spend all the time learning a class, and the combat system was too much. He preferred the kid friendly mmo World OF Warcraft. 

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10 minutes ago, KiyoSenkan said:

You don't seem to understand what destroyer players have a problem with, RE: battleship shells, so I'll try to put it into perspective by changing the situation around so that it applies to something you can understand.

 

Hypothetical:

A torpedo with a damage rating of 10,000 hits your battleship. The explosion mechanic registers on the torpedo bulge, dealing damage reduced by your TDS rating of 30%-- 7000. The explosion then touches the inner hull and registers a second hit on a hull that has no torpedo bulge-- 10000. As a result, you have taken 17,000 damage from a 10k damage torpedo.

 

This kind of double-dipping is what battleship shells are doing to destroyers.

 

This kind of double-dipping is what destroyer players are raising a fuss about.

 

The idea that destroyer players are clamoring to be "invincible" is hyperbolic nonsense.

Running Lights is a HUD mod to compensate for when the game decides you don't need to see funnel smoke at medium to long range. A well known, well documented bug that's been in the game since CBT. Forgive people for coming up with a mod that provides them the same information the game is supposed to, but randomly decides not to.

 

Running Lights actually benefits battleships the most, since battleships are most likely to make long range shots. The claim that it would do anything for destroyers is ludicrous.

I am a battleship main and I would NEVER use the traffic light mod, I consider it cheating. I never said it would do anything for destroyers......my comment was generalized.

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With regards to X Marks the spot mod.  This isn't a mod that makes it a artillery plotting room.  All it does is add an X to the minimap of where you are currently targeting.  Locked onto a target and your guns can elevate enough to lob the shells over and onto your target?  You'll hit and everything will be the same way it is currently.  Lose the target and the shell time will make those shells hit island without the lock?  X marks the spot won't change that. 

Where it will come in handy is for those enemies who drop off map due to a smoke cloud and don't move... at all.  Or the long range people behind the island where the trajectory of your shells will be able to clear the land mass anyway.  But take into account that this is blind shooting on an unlocked target so you've got the inherent debuff in your accuracy already. 

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33 minutes ago, LemonadeWarrior said:

Press “m” twice quickly. Voila.

Actually, that's an abuse of the game system that should be removed.

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