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30 minutes ago, shadowsrmine said:

Dude I've  READ  Every one of his book's in the Honor Harrington series and  Loved  Every One One Of  Them!   And that comment about his series just proves  mine that everyone has their Opinion and just because you and a Few Opinionated other people don't like the series after Shadow  of Freedom  Doesn't Make YOUR Opinion right and EVERYYONE Else's  Wrong! (Come to that there were even more people posting the opposite opinion to Your and Your unfortunate Friend's Quoted Opinion) #2  Unless you delete the word Troll from Your  Comment  I will report you!   #3  You Now have two strike's.   As for You're VS  Your that is subjective you Frustrated English Professor......................What's the matter no school will Hire You and Pay You to Work for them?   (Get used to it you worthless piece of trash Grammar N#&@) instead of posting here and wasting everyone else's time go read a book instead of watching soap opera's 

The mods are gonna love this comment :Smile_popcorn:

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36 minutes ago, shadowsrmine said:

Dude I've  READ  Every one of his book's in the Honor Harrington series and  Loved  Everyone One Of  Them!   And that comment about his series just proves  mine that everyone has their Opinion and just because you and a Few other people don't like the series after Shadow  of Freedom  Doesn't Make YOUR Opinion right and EVERYYONE Else's  Wrong! (Come to that there were even more people posting the opposite opinion to Your and Your unfortunate Friend's Quoted Opinion) #2  Unless you delete the word Troll from Your  Comment  I will report you!   #3  You Now have two strike's.   As for You're VS  Your that is subjective you Frustrated English Professor......................What's the matter no school will Hire You and Pay You to Work for them?   (Get used to it you worthless piece of trash Grammar N#&@) instead of posting here and wasting everyone else's time go read a book instead of watching soap opera's 

 

Even the mods are going to be going 'wat' at this one.

People are allowed to state their opinion. Having a go at mofton and insulting him because he didn't like a book or series* just shows who is quicker on the 'I have no point thus I will insult' button. Any rules saying mofton is not allowed to say what he said, and that you had to go after him? :cap_hmm:(Closest equivalent to a thonking.png I could find).

 

*= Not sure which, I am rather lacking in the cultural department and have never read the series. Which might give away my age. Not like anyone can just guess it anyway.

 

Getting back to the topic at hand, I think Abruzzi shou- wait, she's not released yet, I cannae comment. :I

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2 hours ago, Trainspite said:

 

Even the mods are going to be going 'wat' at this one.

People are allowed to state their opinion. Having a go at mofton and insulting him because he didn't like a book or series* just shows who is quicker on the 'I have no point thus I will insult' button. Any rules saying mofton is not allowed to say what he said, and that you had to go after him? :cap_hmm:(Closest equivalent to a thonking.png I could find).

 

*= Not sure which, I am rather lacking in the cultural department and have never read the series. Which might give away my age. Not like anyone can just guess it anyway.

 

Getting back to the topic at hand, I think Abruzzi shou- wait, she's not released yet, I cannae comment. :I

My Issue was his stating it as a fact not opinion as for my having a go at him he's already had several go's at me before I'd ever said or anything else to him.   In addition to all too many personal attack's and correction's normally at least until repeatedly attacked and or provoked I'm a very laid back and mild fellow.   I do have a History and don't accept this kind of thing any longer,   I give someone only so many chance's

Edited by shadowsrmine
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This review is definitely discouraging. However, I will grab it nonetheless. Even if all it does is collect rust.

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Someone suggested I market LWM Bobble Heads.  I dunno, they kinda freak me out.

I'd totally buy one. Just let me know where to send the money and I'll PM you my shipping address :cap_like:.

 

"Not sure which, I am rather lacking in the cultural department and have never read the series. Which might give away my age. Not like anyone can just guess it anyway."

It really doesn't tell anyone anything solid about your age. The first Honorverse book (On Basilisk Station) was released in '92, and even a hardcore sci-fi fan like me never knew it existed until ~2010.

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By the Seven she is a sexy beast...but there is no way in any hell I can make her work. It is a relationship doomed to fail...but hot damn these Italian girls are hot...Gonna have to pass..but I won't like myself for doing so.... 

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Having played through most of the French CA line I have to say... she doesn't look that bad. The above-water citadel looks fairly similar in size to Algerie, and appears to be a good bit smaller below the waterline.

hXeHXWo.jpg

Algerie_citadel2.thumb.png.1d6e206db17f9919ec5dc8b139ee30e6.png

It also appears a good bit smaller than the higher-tier Charles Martel/Saint-Louis:

CharlesMartel_citadel2.thumb.png.dcef7ebe500a86c9da3637e93ef52b90.png

So while I'm not inclined to call the French CA line any kind of gold standard for tankiness, I'm a bit surprised to see Abruzzi's capability to be citadeled called out as such a crippling weakness. It seems the unfortunate state of CAs in this spread range to eat lots of citadel, not yet having the solid bow armor schemes that appear in higher tier cruisers, but beginning to meet BBs with decent dispersion and heavier shells within their matchmaking spread. The ability to mount a Repair Party on a ship with the speed and agility to slip out of combat looks like a very nice perk, as well - it's certainly solid on Graf Spee, which is not especially quick or nimble and has its own healthy appetite for citadels. 

I do think it's very disappointing that Duca degli Abruzzi doesn't have the rather nice AP shells of Duca della Aosta (which are impressively painful to be on the receiving end). HE damage and fires are not a strong suit for the Italian navy in the way that they are for some other lines, and 152mm pen is getting a bit strained moving into the T7+ matchmaking brackets. But those long range torpedoes, while not fast, are a very nasty surprise to run into. Being able to stealth-launch them even from a base hull is nothing to sneeze at, IMO. 

That said, though, one thing I find missing from the review is a DPM comparison - the AP pen is useful to know, but where does she stand relative to other CAs (and CLs) at T7? 

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On 4/27/2018 at 6:08 AM, LittleWhiteMouse said:
 The following is a review of Duca degli Abruzzi, a ship kindly provided to me by Wargaming. This is the release version of the vessel and these stats are current as of April 27th, 2018.
 

 

 
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1 hour ago, Solis_Obscuri said:

Having played through most of the French CA line I have to say... she doesn't look that bad. The above-water citadel looks fairly similar in size to Algerie, and appears to be a good bit smaller below the waterline.

hXeHXWo.jpg

Algerie_citadel2.thumb.png.1d6e206db17f9919ec5dc8b139ee30e6.png

It also appears a good bit smaller than the higher-tier Charles Martel/Saint-Louis:

CharlesMartel_citadel2.thumb.png.dcef7ebe500a86c9da3637e93ef52b90.png

So while I'm not inclined to call the French CA line any kind of gold standard for tankiness, I'm a bit surprised to see Abruzzi's capability to be citadeled called out as such a crippling weakness. It seems the unfortunate state of CAs in this spread range to eat lots of citadel, not yet having the solid bow armor schemes that appear in higher tier cruisers, but beginning to meet BBs with decent dispersion and heavier shells within their matchmaking spread. The ability to mount a Repair Party on a ship with the speed and agility to slip out of combat looks like a very nice perk, as well - it's certainly solid on Graf Spee, which is not especially quick or nimble and has its own healthy appetite for citadels. 

I do think it's very disappointing that Duca degli Abruzzi doesn't have the rather nice AP shells of Duca della Aosta (which are impressively painful to be on the receiving end). HE damage and fires are not a strong suit for the Italian navy in the way that they are for some other lines, and 152mm pen is getting a bit strained moving into the T7+ matchmaking brackets. But those long range torpedoes, while not fast, are a very nasty surprise to run into. Being able to stealth-launch them even from a base hull is nothing to sneeze at, IMO. 

That said, though, one thing I find missing from the review is a DPM comparison - the AP pen is useful to know, but where does she stand relative to other CAs (and CLs) at T7? 

 

Take a look at your own pictures. The abruzzi's citadel is clearly a massively larger target than that of either french ship you posted. I can only assume your forgetting that the water exists. Waterline or below citadels are significantly harder to hit than above water ones. And that means the total citadel volume above the waterline is the single biggest contributor to vulnerability. And thats somwhere where the Abruzzi is especially bad.

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Thank you for review.

It just saved me wasting my hard earned, I really  wanted  this ship but can't  justify  paying to play a frustrating ship.

WOW if you want to  make money produce a ship that's fun to  play with at least equal guns to her tier.

If you are buying a ship it should be slightly better then the free ones imho if  not defeats the purpose of spending money. 

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2 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

If I want to sail a super squishy Tier VII CL, I'll do Schors instead.  At least her 152mm guns are actually great.

At least Pensacola has 203mm guns

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3 minutes ago, crzyhawk said:

At least Pensacola has 203mm guns

Pensacola has a lot of problems, even after all her buffs for Tier VII, but her guns have never been an issue.  It's the one bright spot on that ship.

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Good review as usual. However I have learned my lesson after buying the Duca D'aosta. I'm used to ducking and diving with a delicate cruiser but usually you have decent guns to make it worthwhile. The Cesare is at least fun to sail even for crap BB players like me so that will do as an Italian trainer.

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The Emperor's Children fan in me wants to see Slannesh get spawned out of the Warp due to massive citadel sacrifices.

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2 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Pensacola has a lot of problems, even after all her buffs for Tier VII, but her guns have never been an issue.  It's the one bright spot on that ship.

Just the one buff that I can recall. That being to the concealment, which is greatly appreciated so that I don't have to play dancing queen at long ranges. Doing it at mid and shorter ranges is enough. 

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9 hours ago, Carl said:

 

Take a look at your own pictures. The abruzzi's citadel is clearly a massively larger target than that of either french ship you posted. I can only assume your forgetting that the water exists. Waterline or below citadels are significantly harder to hit than above water ones. And that means the total citadel volume above the waterline is the single biggest contributor to vulnerability. And thats somwhere where the Abruzzi is especially bad.

They actually appear pretty close. Particularly considering the space between Algerie's turrets is greater. 

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Well, I guess I'll pass on her for now. I have enough ships to play, just bought Ashitaka and Assashio too.

She would have been a pretty ship, maybe next run. Bills are adding up lately.

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7 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

If I want to sail a super squishy Tier VII CL, I'll do Schors instead.  At least her 152mm guns are actually great.

Both ships play completely different. When you compare them only by the guns you are missing half the ship.

 

Shchors is a long range HE spammer. Stay at max range and rain shells. Abruzzi is a front line cruiser. Stay close and support your DDs. 

 

Shchors is some to play, and you might farm some big numbers. Abruzzi is much harder to play, you wont farm those big numbers but you have more impact into the battle.

 

 

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I find her as I thougth she will be. She is a frontline cruiser first and foremost. The problem is that she sees Amagis, Iowas and NC frequently, she is not gonna last in a meta where you fight close to your DDs and the BBs have 11-odd km of concealment. That is a recipe for trouble. 

The disappointment is her AP performance, it seems the equation used to calculate penetration did a magnificent job screwing her up (yeah, they use an equation instead of going for fixed values, which explain some disparities in penetration values). Despite the AP having the same weight and lenght as her tier 6 "sister" (probably indicating it is the same shell), WG probably went with the later-issued shell that was lighter and had worst air drag. The problem is that those shells had better performance in reality than d'Aosta AP shell. This situation with the AP shell makes her no different than d'Aosta and definitely an over-tiered ships. This thing is not a tier 7 ship, just because her AP performance is worst than d'Aosta, had it been equal she could probably just be an underwhelming premium instead of what she is right now.

I don't think they will correct that AP shell issue until they have already make her go live and gather data. Which is a disappointment. Abruzzi COULD work at tier 7, but that issue with the AP shells screwed her hard. She literally has no means to do damage reliably, at least the d'Aosta has her AP shells (which are not the best but are workable).

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Hey

Great review LWM.  Sounds like the Italian cruisers are not for me.  Too Bad; the Giulio Cesare set the Italian bar pretty high and is a great boat, the Duca X2 , not so much.

 

Pete

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10 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Pensacola has a lot of problems, even after all her buffs for Tier VII, but her guns have never been an issue.  It's the one bright spot on that ship.

Yep.  that's how I view abruzzi right now.  A fast pensacola with torps, and lacking decent guns.,

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