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BB3_Oregon_Steel

What if scenarios: Two Wyomings vs Yamato - Tales from the Training Room

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I've always wondered how different ships would fare against each other in contests not allowed within WOWS matchmaking system.  The new and improved Training Room with It's new ability to set up bots using any tech tree ship with the ability to fire and move allows us to explore some of these questions. 

I and one of my clan mates set up a battle between our two Wyomings vs a Yamato and a Hashidate just to see what was possible.  For this battle we set the Yamato's AI intelligence to Low to give ourselves a reasonable chance.  As it turns out, we probably should have set it to medium to give the Yamato a better chance by I'm getting ahead of myself. 

During the battle we discovered a few things. 

1) A Wyoming's armor can, under the right conditions, bounce Yamato's 18 inch shells and offers worthwhile protection at other times.  

2) A Wyoming's 12 inch guns firing AP can penetrate Yamato's belt on the flat broadside and achieve citadel hits at fairly close range.  At longer ranges or against the Yamato with her armor reasonably angled, HE is your best friend. 

3) Two Wyoming's working together can defeat a Yamato and do so fairly handily under the above conditions.  

For those of you who have had access to Training Rooms like these in the past, this is probably old news, but I think having easy access to the new improved training room now built into the main WOWS interface gives players the ability to ask the age old question ... what if which is something the game has lacked up to this point. 

Anyway, just thought it was interesting enough to be worth sharing. :Smile_honoring:

 

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9 minutes ago, BB3_Oregon_Steel said:

our two Wyomings vs a Yamato and a Hashidate

I assume the Hashidate was there just to make up the numbers (2 v 2) and offer the least significant contaminant there could possibly be. How long did it last?

 

Interesting result. Will look forward to seeing how high the AI's intelligence can be pushed and the Wyomings can still win.

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I would have to look at the armor but it would overmatch the bow armor which means it would actually have to hit the bow. PvP a Yamato would still loss though. (Unless something like a detonation happened to make it 1v1

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15 minutes ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

I assume the Hashidate was there just to make up the numbers (2 v 2) and offer the least significant contaminant there could possibly be. How long did it last?

 

Interesting result. Will look forward to seeing how high the AI's intelligence can be pushed and the Wyomings can still win.

That's correct.  The game went about 11 minutes.  

I suspect that a Yamato operating at high AI would probably be able to beat us, but haven't tested that one out yet. 

I'm also interested in seeing if a pair of South Carolina's could duplicate the Wyoming's performance with the Yamato's AI set at low. 

I'm also intriqued with setting up actual historic battles using the training room using the actual ships (or at least ships from the correct classes) involved.  There's just a whole new world of things the new training rooms make possible. 

Edited by BB3_Oregon_Steel

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This is like the time in tanks that a few friends and I decided to to see what would win: A Maus, or a platoon of three KV-2s?

Turns out it's the KV-2s, and not by a small margin either.

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1 hour ago, UssIowaSailor said:

In PVP I am confident a Yamato could defeat four Wyoming or more.

Possibly.  We have a clan member who has almost acquired the Yamato so we might just try that out and see what happens.  Thanks for the idea.  :cap_like:

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You should have seen it when Tier II Umikaze could go into Tier X matches due to no MM restrictions like there are no.  Umikaze vs any Tier X BB.  Who ya got?

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The big question is V-25 DD vs tier X BBs. Lol stealthiest ship in the game and any Torpedo can hurt a ship...

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11 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

You should have seen it when Tier II Umikaze could go into Tier X matches due to no MM restrictions like there are no.  Umikaze vs any Tier X BB.  Who ya got?

Used to be fail divisions like that; players would kvetch, but that Umi has crazy-good concealment for higher tier games...

...heard a few horror stories about such battles...

1 minute ago, Admiral_Thrawn_1 said:

The big question is V-25 DD vs tier X BBs. Lol stealthiest ship in the game and any Torpedo can hurt a ship...

As long as no radar or hydro? (and no cat planes?) I bet on the destroyer.

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Flambass has a Sunday funday event where it was 12 player controlled tier 3 ships all versus him in an Alsace.

He was able to sink 3 or 4 ships before he was burnt and torped to death.

Even high tier can not overcome the impact of fires that even low tier can set.

The long delay between shots for a B.B. also was a big factor with so many targets.

I think a T10 cruiser may do better than a BB in these kinds of simulations 

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2 hours ago, BB3_Oregon_Steel said:

two Wyomings vs a Yamato and a Hashidate

Interesting scenario, more interesting if you could equalize the HP each ship had for their tier differences.

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2 hours ago, UssIowaSailor said:

In PVP I am confident a Yamato could defeat four Wyoming or more.

If the Wyomings only use AP at a distance, Yamato wins. If Wyoming’s use HE at distance, Yamato will burn and Wyomings win. If Wyomings are smart, they will rush the Yamato 2 on each side and citadel it. If Yamato kills 2 on one side, it must rotate turrets fully for the other 2. In other words 4v1 would be easy. 

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2 hours ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

Used to be fail divisions like that; players would kvetch, but that Umi has crazy-good concealment for higher tier games...

...heard a few horror stories about such battles...

As long as no radar or hydro? (and no cat planes?) I bet on the destroyer.

Great low tier DD concealment.

Super fast reloading torps.

 

If the BB didn't have help, i.e. CV aircraft, DDs to push Umikaze, the Tier II DD literally ran wild.  Remember, this was back before ships like DM got Radar, so even DM wasn't much help back then :Smile_teethhappy:

 

Otherwise, Umikaze in the hands of disciplined play, simply stayed in concealment dropping torps every few seconds.  The torp damage they did wasn't much, especially considering the high tier TDS.  But all you need is that flood to stick.

===

Still, with Bot AI back in for Training Room, it can be good torpedo training for some guys.

 

Your DD vs any number of Bot targets.

Mix it up with varying numbers and ship types, i.e. dealing with the late match DD scenario where multiple ships are trying to run you down, and you got no help to spot for you should you smoke up.  Even switch it up between Domination & Standard Modes, because that drastically changes what you need to do.

 

Of course, this never replaces actual thinking players trying to hunt you down, especially if some of those guys are actually good.  But some guys need to run through those DD pressure situations, and in Training Room, they can do this without jacking up their stats.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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3 hours ago, Visidious said:

Flambass has a Sunday funday event where it was 12 player controlled tier 3 ships all versus him in an Alsace.

He was able to sink 3 or 4 ships before he was burnt and torped to death.

Even high tier can not overcome the impact of fires that even low tier can set.

The long delay between shots for a B.B. also was a big factor with so many targets.

I think a T10 cruiser may do better than a BB in these kinds of simulations 

More than likely yes.  They can overmatch their armor.  They will have enough pen to get to the cit, while probably not overpenning if the target is angled.  Tho on some of those flat broadsides, they may not have enough armor to slow down/arm the shell.  You are also more nimble and generally have more tools you can use, on top of your DPM compared to a BB in this scenario. 

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12 hours ago, Belyy_Klyk said:

If the Wyomings only use AP at a distance, Yamato wins. If Wyoming’s use HE at distance, Yamato will burn and Wyomings win. If Wyomings are smart, they will rush the Yamato 2 on each side and citadel it. If Yamato kills 2 on one side, it must rotate turrets fully for the other 2. In other words 4v1 would be easy. 

If I was the Yamato captain I would kite, my speed can dictate when and where I fight. assuming the spawn point for the Wyoming was spread I fight two at ranges just outside of their guns. After I killed them I would move to the other two. For the Wyomings the Yamato has to let them engage, with their limited range and speed the Yammy can squash them with impunity.

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53 minutes ago, UssIowaSailor said:

If I was the Yamato captain I would kite, my speed can dictate when and where I fight. assuming the spawn point for the Wyoming was spread I fight two at ranges just outside of their guns. After I killed them I would move to the other two. For the Wyomings the Yamato has to let them engage, with their limited range and speed the Yammy can squash them with impunity.

I mean in order to keep them out of range, you’d have to have someone spot for you. You can’t spot them if they aren’t able to shoot at you. My point is 4 Wyomings spamming HE will burn a Yamato down pretty quickly. 

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