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Plaatduutsch

Graf Z Needs to be Balanced

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We just went through a horrifying  match on Two brothers map, and our team successfully push through the west flank with 3 losses compared to 6 losses on the enemy team.

Then the team choose to chase this CV in the enemy base.

What happened later was just frightening. 

This CV knocked out all the pursuing ships in less than 5 minutes and killed 6 in the entire match.

We did not have the most ideal MM, we had Buddyyony, Leander, and La Ga for cruisers, but does it translate into a massacre by this CV?:Smile_ohmy:

 

 

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Maybe the team lost sight of the objective.

Maybe the CV player was really good and yours wasn't

Just because a player kills 6 people doesn't mean his ship needs to be re balanced

 

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5 minutes ago, Plaatduutsch said:

Then the team choose to chase this CV in the enemy base.

 

well; *cough*, your team's mistake.

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2 minutes ago, CriMiNaL__ said:

Maybe the team lost sight of the objective.

Maybe the CV player was really good and yours wasn't

Just because a player kills 6 people doesn't mean his ship needs to be re balanced

 

Yes, our CV was bad, but why is WG still using FPS MM for RTS type CV gameplay?

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1 minute ago, DarthZeppelin said:

well; *cough*, your team's mistake.

So what you mean is that the team should just let the CV flee?

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2 minutes ago, Plaatduutsch said:

So what you mean is that the team should just let the CV flee?

focus on the objectives, not on wasting your time chasing the cv. A classic way to lose a battle, whatever cv it is you are chasing. (See you in game, have seen a number of your clan mates divving tonight)

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Graf Zepplin is tier 8 and you mention tier 6 ships which are probably already damaged so....

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Just now, DarthZeppelin said:

focus on the objectives, not on wasting your time chasing the cv. A classic way to lose a battle, whatever the cv is you are chasing. (See you in game, have sseen a number of your clan mates divving tonight)

We did not lose b/c of objectives, we lost b/c that CV killed them all

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4 minutes ago, Plaatduutsch said:

We did not lose b/c of objectives, we lost b/c that CV killed them all

That does not mean a ship needs to be re balanced, look at it from the other side, if your cv killed 7 and you won would you be putting up a post saying your cv needs to be re balanced

This game is 20 min of glory or 20 min of failure, no one cares after its done

Edited by CriMiNaL__

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4 minutes ago, CriMiNaL__ said:

That does not mean a ship needs to be re balanced, look at it from the other side, if your cv killed 7 and you won would you be putting up a post saying your cv needs to be re balanced

This game is 20 min of glory or 20 min of failure, no one cares after its done

It does not matter which side can get 7 or 6 kills in less than 5 minutes. 

What matters is the fact that it can get 7 or 6 kills in less than 5 minutes. 

We've had broken stuff before, such as Saipan and Kaga, but WG is making a even bigger mistake now. 

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Graf Zeppelin is the poster child for everything that is wrong with WoWs: a completely broken ship in an already stupidly overpowered type, and Wargaming's reaction?

11e8zh.jpg

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1 minute ago, Plaatduutsch said:

It does not matter which side can get 7 or 6 kills in less than 5 minutes. 

What matters is the fact that it can get 7 or 6 kills in less than 5 minutes. 

We've had broken stuff before, such as Saipan and Kaga, but WG is making a even bigger mistake now. 

So if you had the GZ on your team you would of posted about a re balancing, I think you sore about a very good CV player who was able to do their job against a bunch of t6 ships.  

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Just now, CriMiNaL__ said:

So if you had the GZ on your team you would of posted about a re balancing, I think you sore about a very good CV player who was able to do their job against a bunch of t6 ships.  

Yes I would. It was no just T6 ships. KII and Richelieu were killed too. Kii is supposed to be the best AA IJN BB. 

I remember seeing that Richelieu lost 40k+ health in just one strike by that CV and there was nothing he could do. 

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Well hopefully you get that cv player on your team next time, but in all seriousness, it happens, WG will get to it eventually, till then you shouldn't worry about it

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Just now, CriMiNaL__ said:

Well hopefully you get that cv player on your team next time, but in all seriousness, it happens, WG will get to it eventually, till then you shouldn't worry about it

I do not care whether I get bad or good CV players on my side.

All I care is to get a even MM for CVs on both side. If both sides get bad CV players. fine!

If both sides get unicum CV players, that's great! 

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1 minute ago, Plaatduutsch said:

I do not care whether I get bad or good CV players on my side.

All I care is to get a even MM for CVs on both side. If both sides get bad CV players. fine!

If both sides get unicum CV players, that's great! 

But you do, you had a bad CV player and they had a good one, theirs carried the match, yours didn't

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29 minutes ago, Plaatduutsch said:

I remember seeing that Richelieu lost 40k+ health in just one strike by that CV and there was nothing he could do. 

At least I guess she did take more than a few planes down. A carrier of same tier can pretty much always strike a BB, even AA specced BB, if they are prepared to lose a few planes. 

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1 hour ago, Plaatduutsch said:

So what you mean is that the team should just let the CV flee?

A Carrier can run with up to 35.7 knots, which makes hunting down the CV a very time-consuming Task which can easily cost you the match.

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59 minutes ago, Plaatduutsch said:

Yes I would. It was no just T6 ships. KII and Richelieu were killed too. Kii is supposed to be the best AA IJN BB. 

I remember seeing that Richelieu lost 40k+ health in just one strike by that CV and there was nothing he could do. 

My izumo was nuked by one. Bad play on my part where I ate 6-7 torpedoes. GZ is fine you played to it's strengths and it cost you. Have your cv spot it and keep it on fire.

All ships can get nuked by a cv if they don't spec for it. Kii is no different 

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3 minutes ago, StoneRhino said:

My izumo was nuked by one. Bad play on my part where I ate 6-7 torpedoes. GZ is fine you played to it's strengths and it cost you. Have your cv spot it and keep it on fire.

All ships can get nuked by a cv if they don't spec for it. Kii is no different 

to nuke a Kii with GZ strike planes, takes luck and a Kii that has already been set on fire multiple times, knocking out its AA. If I sent my GZ strike planes to attack a full hp Kii, I would expect to lose 75%+ of my planes to AA. I suspect the OP is omitting such details. (speaking as a cv victim of broken OP Kii AA which def needs nerfing as one hurt my feelings last week!:Smile_child:)

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50 minutes ago, CriMiNaL__ said:

But you do, you had a bad CV player and they had a good one, theirs carried the match, yours didn't

Except even taking out fighters, it has 2 groups of 5 TB's, and 8-9 DB's in a single group. With a super accurate circle, an AP option, and if what I hear is true her HE bombs are like German HE rounds AKA increased pen HE. I have sen what it can do first hand. The GZ is a culmination of everything Wargaming has failed to learn. The damage it can dish out is beyond reasonable, were not even talking current 2,2,2 Midway bad, were talking original 2,2,2 midway when it deleted tier 10 BB's, which that and some high tier cruisers are about the only thing that stands a chance. On the of chance you survive the torp attack, the DB's finish the job. I lost between 20-30% of my HP to a single HE attack from a GZ before the bloody fires did anything, namely cause that was all I had left after the torp attack in my Scharn. The striking power of the ship is the definition of what people THINK CV's do normally realized.

 

And then you have the damned fighters. It's either 8-9 planes with almost the same damage as Lexington's. Which in a one on one fight still walk all over IJN's. 28.7% chance to down USN fighters, 23.9% USN downs it's, and IJN get's it worse. And this assumes tier 8 fighters if they are still tier 7, that's a 10% buff, meaning it'd actually jump to 31.5% against USN fighters. Not to mention the edge in speed and the fact that it's near 100 point higher overall DPS gives it an edge in strafing. And now Lex only has 1 fighter group. So, Lex is at a disadvantage to start, and about the only thing E and Shokaku got going for them is if their fighters survive long enough to lock GZ's single group with an exit strafe and strafe with the other in the same bull mechanics that have helped relegate Lexington to a bloody port decoration. Hell, I fought the thing with my AS Lex, built to fighters, and had to suddenly adapt to that tactic because while the AS skill at that time gave it 10 planes, it wrecked both my squadrons like they were nothing. While deleting ships at will.

The OP fighters of a USN CV, the heavy hitting of an IJN CV cross drop, AND DB's that are actually effective. It's the CV from hell. And I'm a CV player, I wanted GZ. I may disagree with her being tier 8, with her being a premium, having a setup with 2x TB groups, and the tiering of her aircraft being so hilariously inaccurate to history it hurts my soul, but I still want it. But not like this, not some monstrosity that will raise again the demand for AA buffs, not this mockery of history that takes the worst of everything about CV's current state and adds to it yet more to just make it an atrocity. A blight, a plague, an unholy addition to the game. 

Summed up best on everything GZ is -

 

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2 hours ago, Plaatduutsch said:

We just went through a horrifying  match on Two brothers map, and our team successfully push through the west flank with 3 losses compared to 6 losses on the enemy team.

Then the team choose to chase this CV in the enemy base.

What happened later was just frightening. 

This CV knocked out all the pursuing ships in less than 5 minutes and killed 6 in the entire match.

We did not have the most ideal MM, we had Buddyyony, Leander, and La Ga for cruisers, but does it translate into a massacre by this CV?:Smile_ohmy:

 

 

So your team went full potato... but it is the other teams CV's fault (who outplayed your potato team). And because your team went full potato and ignored the objectives... you didn't lose because they lost sight of the objective, but because the enemy CV........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................... There are literally no words... even Gordon Ramsay would be at a loss

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1 hour ago, geser98 said:

At least I guess she did take more than a few planes down. A carrier of same tier can pretty much always strike a BB, even AA specced BB, if they are prepared to lose a few planes. 

She took two down

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