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hyuuu

Detonation update mechanic flaw

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Having played frequently enough to see detonations still a regular occurrence in my games, I note an interesting observation that actually questions the effectiveness of the detonation mechanic change update. 

One issue about the detonation update is that "full health" detonation can still occur when you consider the fact that not all shells land hits at the same time in a full salvo.

In a full salvo, the first shell might be a citadel hit and drop the ship's HP down below the 75% threshold.
And then in the next few frames, perhaps a few ms apart, the next shells hit, allowing for a detonation probability to occur because the logic is coded to read the ship hp in that instant.

Then in this case, a ship can actually still detonate from full health in practice because there's no separation requirement for the timing of shells hitting the ship below the 75% hp requirement. 

I have done this more than a few times on full health DDs when firing from a BB during this update.
My first "hit" is a regular pen, and then the second hit is an instant detonation since it is incredibly easy to bring down a DD health pool below 75% with a single shell.

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1 hour ago, hyuuu said:

I have done this more than a few times on full health DDs when firing from a BB during this update.

 No, you did not. Sorry.

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45 minutes ago, MidnightShamalan said:

i'm pretty sure the change is anecdotal, not meant to actually fix anything.

 

I kind of feel this way too. It seems like the "fix" is only for an edge case.

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3 hours ago, hyuuu said:

Having played frequently enough to see detonations still a regular occurrence in my games, I note an interesting observation that actually questions the effectiveness of the detonation mechanic change update. 

One issue about the detonation update is that "full health" detonation can still occur when you consider the fact that not all shells land hits at the same time in a full salvo.

In a full salvo, the first shell might be a citadel hit and drop the ship's HP down below the 75% threshold.
And then in the next few frames, perhaps a few ms apart, the next shells hit, allowing for a detonation probability to occur because the logic is coded to read the ship hp in that instant.

Then in this case, a ship can actually still detonate from full health in practice because there's no separation requirement for the timing of shells hitting the ship below the 75% hp requirement. 

I have done this more than a few times on full health DDs when firing from a BB during this update.
My first "hit" is a regular pen, and then the second hit is an instant detonation since it is incredibly easy to bring down a DD health pool below 75% with a single shell.

When this change in the detonation rules first applied many were thinking (as I had) that you could go from 100% to 75% with one shot or volley and thats it..meaning there is some time to 'survive' and then possible get hit with another then your done. Now that time interval of 'survive' is not defined ofcourse LOL!  But most felt it was not mili-seconds but some time.. not that it was defined that you could still function and play. Thats the gist I got when it was announced. Well, after the patch we can see that was true but not always true.  As with anything else...you have to keep on complaining to get any attention from WOW to change anything.  Thats seems the way it is and probably always will be.  

On Topic but related to:  Some are wanting the detonation is truly INDICATE they have been detonated visually. Some can't tell if they have. I propose the ship be split in half to totally confirm of that indication and indignation. 

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Yeah it wasn't a big change and WG should go further but at least it got rid of splash damage detonations from full health. 

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It was said from the beginning that no detonation would occurs unless you have less than 75% HP but it was never said you could no longer detonate someone with 1 salvo. Taking 25% HP is easy against DD.  That's why I said, for DD player it will change nothing, this change is only beneficial for BB and some cruiser.

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18 hours ago, MidnightShamalan said:

i'm pretty sure the change is anecdotal, not meant to actually fix anything.

Yep. It is a totally cosmetic change. Lost two games this weekend alone to dets, an early one of a capping DD, a late one of a BB in a game that we lost by 17 points. Nothing meaningful has changed. Sucks.

I have no idea why WG so desperately needs detonations in games. Sometimes I think they just enjoy having the power to screw others. Because there is absolutely no gameplay-based reason to have a mechanic that punishes people for playing hard and working for the team. 

WG devs complain that there are too many BBs. One reason is stoopid-beyond-belief mechanics like detonations. BBs seldom detonate. DDs, commonly. People in BBs know they can take punishment without detonating. They know they have the health pool to deal with game-degrading high ROF ships like Akizuki and Minotaur. DDs don't. So if you want to be in-game for a while before dying, a BB is a good choice.

Want people to play cruisers and DDs more? Getting rid of crap mechanics like detonations would be a good start. 

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It still gets rid of that pesky 'single' torpedo hit situation where one is deleted at the start.

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46 minutes ago, Taichunger said:

Yep. It is a totally cosmetic change. Lost two games this weekend alone to dets, an early one of a capping DD, a late one of a BB in a game that we lost by 17 points. Nothing meaningful has changed. Sucks.

How could you know that? How can you be sure that someone else on your team would have done a full HP det, but didn’t on the basis of the 75 per cent rule? How do you know that three enemy ships didn’t detonate for the same reason, throwing the match back in your favour?

Short of WG introducing some form of notice for when you should have detonated but didn’t (some form of WG angel animation perhaps) or seeing your gunfire det someone who was similarly spared, you have no real anecdotal way of establishing the impact the mechanic change has had on your experience. 

Personally, I welcome the change. Far fewer utterances of “Fun and engaging” in global chat whenever it happens. 

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1 hour ago, Taichunger said:


I have no idea why WG so desperately needs detonations in games.

Don't they speed up games? Would have figured you'd be all over that lol.

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Because there is absolutely no gameplay-based reason to have a mechanic that punishes people for playing hard and working for the team. 

Except it doesn't discriminate like that.

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 People in BBs know they can take punishment without detonating.

I think you give the masses too much credit. Most have no idea why detonations happen to them, let alone that one of their ship types is less prone to it than another.

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They know they have the health pool to deal with game-degrading high ROF ships like Akizuki and Minotaur. DDs don't. So if you want to be in-game for a while before dying, a BB is a good choice.

That's a major reason why people play BBs. More HP = greater survivability. A staple of pretty much every game out there. Another big reason is their simplicity.

If you want people to play DDs and cruisers more, make BBs more difficult and less comfortable to play.

 

 

 

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I personally never thought it was "Broke" in the first place and would have much better prefered it to have been left alone.  I hate it when the dev's listen to the butterflies.   I consider the "Fix" worse than what it replaced and if anything I see more detonations happening now then I did before.  (at least that's what it feels like.. and since when have people as a whole let inconvenient facts get in the way of what they believe?...  that include ME!)

We're driving warships that are loaded up with all types of nasty things that go boom in spectacular ways.    Some folks just don't get this.

 

 

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In my 1k and more games I've played, you wanna know how many times I've een detonated?

2 times. Once in randoms, once in co-op.

 

Wanna know how many times I've detonated someone else?

Maybe 3 times? Thing is, they were never full hp, and it was always about half way or more through the battle.

 

Stop complaining about detonations, when there are other, more broken things in this game that need to be fixed. Detonations are fine as they are.

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2 hours ago, Kitsunelegend said:

In my 1k and more games I've played, you wanna know how many times I've een detonated?

2 times. Once in randoms, once in co-op.

 

Wanna know how many times I've detonated someone else?

Maybe 3 times? Thing is, they were never full hp, and it was always about half way or more through the battle.

 

Stop complaining about detonations, when there are other, more broken things in this game that need to be fixed. Detonations are fine as they are.

I'm with this. I can't remember the last time I got detonated.. I detonated someone ironically last night, but that was the first time since.. damn I can't even remember... Not only that but there are so many of those flags with -100% chance of detonation you never see it.. I run that flag exclusively on my Cruisers, and I have like 500 of those things. They are stupid easy to get through the boxes, and rewards..

No, there are far bigger problems... How about those carriers? An entire class of ships that is utterly broken beyond belief, completely imbalanced between each other tier for tier, and is either disgustingly OP, or nearly useless...

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Lyon shoots 16 guns. the first 15 hit you to below 75%. The last one detonated you. 

:fish_boom:

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3 hours ago, TL_Warlord_Roff said:

I personally never thought it was "Broke" in the first place and would have much better prefered it to have been left alone.  I hate it when the dev's listen to the butterflies. 

Me too.

There is some truth the allegation of "cosmetic only" -- not because it is that, but because *y'all* misunderstood the meaning of the change, which has been discussed here at length.

In addition to the fact that a salvo does not land simultaneously, the mechanism is that "hit" damage is applied first, then the chance of a detonation is applied. 

This means that for a smaller ship with a torpedo or heavy shell hit, the change was not a change.  Where there is a change is for light shell storms on healthy ships, with intact armor.   There is a very small chance of a det for light shells.  The recent change prevents that from happening on large, healthy ships.  The practical effect on small ships is nil.

 

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