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xalmgrey

The team with more DD's wins generally.

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Every match tonight i've continuously faced the other team with 1 extra DD and each of those times we lose.

I don't normally pull out the tin foil but after several matches in a row where we were a DD down we lost. The other team was simply able to spot and open fire before we could see it, so my hat is starting to feel rather comfy.

I thought WG was fixing this?

 

/flamesuit

Adding something educational to this topic:

36d2b138872126cd585e000ddb9fc32e.jpg

Edited by xalmgrey
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DD win games. Having one more DD does add some advantage depending on the DD and the player using it but it only have a huge impact the moment you lost every DD except that single one. I've won many battle where we had 1 less DD, but I also lost some battle.

 

Point is, it's not impossible to win but it reduce your error margin. I find more frustrating to have a team with lots of radar while mine only has 1 potential radar ship. I find more frustrating to have a team composed of mostly BB and some cruiser while the other team has 1 sneaky DD.  Combine those 2 factor and it can quickly becomes unplayable 

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10 minutes ago, CLUCH_CARGO said:

This style is more fun

pIsOBdx.jpg

 

You know, M. Night is a great director, this was in his lull. I absolutely love this movie, a favorite, the lady in the water...meh.... Regardless, am a fan.

 

 

 

The team with the good DDs win, the stupid af ones, they suck. Stop playing Destroyers you [edited]idiots....

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33 minutes ago, xalmgrey said:

Every match tonight i've continuously faced the other team with 1 extra DD and each of those times we lose.

I don't normally pull out the tin foil but after several matches in a row where we were a DD down we lost. The other team was simply able to spot and open fire before we could see it, so my hat is starting to feel rather comfy.

I thought WG was fixing this?

 

/flamesuit

Adding something educational to this topic:

36d2b138872126cd585e000ddb9fc32e.jpg

Not true. Yesterday, had three battles where we had 1 did more. Lost all of them. 

 

If if the standard was: whichever team has more DDs 7 mins in will win, I’d find that much more likely (and would have explained all my battles, too). 

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16 hours ago, xalmgrey said:

Every match tonight i've continuously faced the other team with 1 extra DD and each of those times we lose.

I don't normally pull out the tin foil but after several matches in a row where we were a DD down we lost. The other team was simply able to spot and open fire before we could see it, so my hat is starting to feel rather comfy.

 

The team with the extra DD wins marginally more often. Collect a couple of hundred such games. That is why WG is willing to address this "problem", because it is a non-problem.

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My personal hypothesis is it's not the team with more DD's winning.  It's the team with more cruisers losing, especially in the mid tiers.

Most games both teams have the matchmaker soft cap of 5 BB's per team, so if there's a difference in the number of DD's, it's usually because one team has an extra cruiser instead.

Most cruisers between tier 4 and 8 are fairly underpowered and have difficulty influencing the outcome of a game.  Low alpha damage and extremely susceptible to the alpha damage of other ship types, lacking the damage output, survivability and utility that makes cruisers so powerful at tier 10.  The amount of work you have to put in to feel like you actually carried the game on a mid-tier cruiser is generally absurd when a BB or DD can swing the game with a single well-timed salvo.

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Was just in a game where we were down 1 DD at the start.  Then within a very short amount of time we were down 2 because they killed 2 of ours (in a div) while I killed 1 of theirs on the same cap (I was in a Minotaur and spanked the Harekaze in no time flat).

The fact of the matter is that while, yes, it is an advantage, it's not the end of the world.  And it's less of an advantage when you have at least 3.  It's worse when they have more DDs than you in a battle with  3-4 domination caps and you don't have enough to cover all of the caps, but they do or at least can cover 1 more cap than your team can.

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No, No, the team with good Battleships normally wins. If a good CV is involved, they win. When Destroyers are left alone and unchecked, they will absolutely win. Everytime....

 

 

Good players "win"....

Edited by atPrick__

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3 minutes ago, atPrick__ said:

When Destroyers are left alone and unchecked, they will absolutely win. Everytime....

Yep, agree with that.  In my anecdotal experience it is the team that focuses and kills the enemy DD's is the one that wins, hands down.  You can almost pick the losing side by the first few engagements.

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when the other team has more DDs, i tend to find myself focusing them even more than usual (i always focus them, but in this case i go out of my way to do so). the smallest mistake in a DD can be extremely fatal if someone is watching for it, and (in my experience) when a team has extra DDs at least one or two of them think it's okay to slack off. if you manage to get them when they slip, the game is suddenly back on equal footing if not more in your favor.

bottom line; games usually don't get decided by the ship composition, but rather the players in those ships. don't get so discouraged when you see something you consider a disadvantage, and look for a way to level the field.

be the spark that ignites the flames of victory :cap_cool:

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1 hour ago, Taichunger said:

The team with the extra DD wins marginally more often. Collect a couple of hundred such games. That is why WG is willing to address this "problem", because it is a non-problem.

 

Pretty much this. You can of course cite plenty of individual instances where the team with fewer DDs or crappier DDs won, but over the long run, primarily on domination, that delta is going to be there.

EDIT: The issue isn't necessarily with DD imbalance, it's the way "objectives" in this game are designed. Capping wins games and capping is largely (though of course not exclusively) a DD role - if there were objectives that could win you the game that were geared toward the other classes, then DD imbalance would be much less of a problem. This is why Bastion was such a ****show: it amplifies the issue instead of mitigating it. Now your caps not only score you points, but can help defend themselves?

Edited by pikohan

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Maybe the other types should endeavour to fire (and maybe even hit) the ships the Destroyers are spotting? Makes a big difference in the DD vs DD "trade" that happens plenty enough.

Destroyers often just go poof when there is a lack of effort from the ships behind them. When you're the only thing to shoot at for miles it's going to be a bad time. 

Now, I'm not talking about some yolo charge in the opening minutes, but somewhere in the 6 or 8 minute mark where your team should be doing something other than telling the DD to spot so you can comfortably huck shells from the 10 line.

Match pressure is everything. 

It always kills me to pop smoke to save my hide, break vision and no one on my team had spots but me at the 1/2 way mark. 

Edited by Canadatron
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You can win down a DD, but the team has to adjust its play.  Its DDs have to play less aggressive and work to spot DDs instead of pushing CAP early.  The cruisers and BBs need to stay tight and focus fire on spotted DDs.  Nothing is worse than being down a DD and then losing one early.

Edited by Hobobeast

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I can rarely count on the DDs on my team to last more than 3 minutes regardless of who started with more.

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4 hours ago, Vaidency said:

My personal hypothesis is it's not the team with more DD's winning.  It's the team with more cruisers losing, especially in the mid tiers.

Most games both teams have the matchmaker soft cap of 5 BB's per team, so if there's a difference in the number of DD's, it's usually because one team has an extra cruiser instead.

Most cruisers between tier 4 and 8 are fairly underpowered and have difficulty influencing the outcome of a game.  Low alpha damage and extremely susceptible to the alpha damage of other ship types, lacking the damage output, survivability and utility that makes cruisers so powerful at tier 10.  The amount of work you have to put in to feel like you actually carried the game on a mid-tier cruiser is generally absurd when a BB or DD can swing the game with a single well-timed salvo.

This is what makes mid-tier cruiser battles so much fun... *whistles at 500+ Leander battles...*

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5 hours ago, Crucis said:

Was just in a game where we were down 1 DD at the start.  Then within a very short amount of time we were down 2 because they killed 2 of ours (in a div) while I killed 1 of theirs on the same cap (I was in a Minotaur and spanked the Harekaze in no time flat).

The fact of the matter is that while, yes, it is an advantage, it's not the end of the world.  And it's less of an advantage when you have at least 3.  It's worse when they have more DDs than you in a battle with  3-4 domination caps and you don't have enough to cover all of the caps, but they do or at least can cover 1 more cap than your team can.

That's my view, as well.  If each team has at least 3 DD's, an extra isn't much of a deal.  If it's only 1 or 2 on the map, it's a bigger deal.

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6 hours ago, xalmgrey said:

Every match tonight i've continuously faced the other team with 1 extra DD and each of those times we lose.

I don't normally pull out the tin foil but after several matches in a row where we were a DD down we lost. The other team was simply able to spot and open fire before we could see it, so my hat is starting to feel rather comfy.

I thought WG was fixing this?

 

/flamesuit

Adding something educational to this topic:

36d2b138872126cd585e000ddb9fc32e.jpg

Please note , Aluminum foil DOES NOT WORK for a tin foil hat(faraday cage), as aluminum is not really a metal, it is a metalloid  and is not really good at blocking EMP's/EMF's.  You need an actual metal to make a "tinfoil " hat , like real tin or steel or even better silver. Gold would be the "ultimate " tinfoil hat. 

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And here I thought that the team with the better captains generally wins regardless of anything else.

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8 hours ago, xalmgrey said:

Every match tonight i've continuously faced the other team with 1 extra DD and each of those times we lose.

I don't normally pull out the tin foil but after several matches in a row where we were a DD down we lost. The other team was simply able to spot and open fire before we could see it, so my hat is starting to feel rather comfy.

I thought WG was fixing this?

 

/flamesuit

Adding something educational to this topic:

36d2b138872126cd585e000ddb9fc32e.jpg

I agree to a point where I see a big difference some players who r in a Cruiser and r aggressive will take them on this is their main function, but many matches I have been in down 1 dd when the enemy dd's r expose wont even fire at them! and thats a lost, expose DD's is a must to be able to sustain a victory in a match next time when the ratio is in favor of the other take notice  what your team is doing 

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8 hours ago, atPrick__ said:

The team with the good DDs win, the stupid af ones, they suck. Stop playing Destroyers you [edited]idiots....

Good DDs will win games. People like me in a DD generally lose games hence I don't play them much in random. I don't like subjecting others to my incompetence unless its at work, then its ok.:Smile_smile:

 

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It's not the number of DD's at the start that matters.

It's who has the most DD's at the 6 to 8 minute mark.

There power and influence grows after that.

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Having 3 DDs at the beginning of the match when the other team has 4 doesn't in and of itself mean your team is going to lose.  It does mean that your team is more likely to run out of DDs before the enemy team does, which is when your team is going to lose.  Towards the end of the round, when one team has 4 BBs and 2 CAs versus the other team with 3 BBs, 1 CA and 2 DDs, the team with the DDs is almost certainly going to win barring some very bad play on the part of the DDs (unlikely if they've survived as long as they have). 

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12 hours ago, Snarky_Wombat said:

Yep, agree with that.  In my anecdotal experience it is the team that focuses and kills the enemy DD's is the one that wins, hands down.  You can almost pick the losing side by the first few engagements.

To add to this my Ranger has a winrate of 55% and this was from back when we had nothing but lose lose loadouts.  My tactic?  DD hunting.  Focusing solely on DD's at the start of the match until they were all wiped out,  and THEN working on hard targets.  It wasn't perfect,  but it let even a potato like me in a crud ship like the Ranger have a positive win rate.

Purely anecdotal,  of course.  But still,  for me it was an effective strategy.

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13 hours ago, Vaidency said:

My personal hypothesis is it's not the team with more DD's winning.  It's the team with more cruisers losing, especially in the mid tiers.

Most games both teams have the matchmaker soft cap of 5 BB's per team, so if there's a difference in the number of DD's, it's usually because one team has an extra cruiser instead.

Most cruisers between tier 4 and 8 are fairly underpowered and have difficulty influencing the outcome of a game.  Low alpha damage and extremely susceptible to the alpha damage of other ship types, lacking the damage output, survivability and utility that makes cruisers so powerful at tier 10.  The amount of work you have to put in to feel like you actually carried the game on a mid-tier cruiser is generally absurd when a BB or DD can swing the game with a single well-timed salvo.

Cruisers are jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none.  I hardly ever play them anymore because they can't carry nearly as well as a BB or DD.  A good cruiser captain in mid tiers can do 75K in fire damage instead of 30K damage (nice but not round-winning), whereas a good DD captain can obliterate a BB or two and cap so that the team gets enough points to win.

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