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Reymu

SSD coming up

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Come Monday I'm getting my HD replaced (current one is fragmented some) and getting an SSD added. HD will still be the boot drive.

Now, way I understand this is once new OS and all is working normally and the SSD is partitioned, just install WOWS in the SSD, let it make its own folder. Are there any potential issues I should be aware of insofar as performance?

SSD needs about 40% of its max capacity free for its 10-15 year life as well as its performance. This right?

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No.

 

EDIT: I read your other thread like a week ago. Do *NOT* ever defrag an SSD. If you're still running Windows 7 check your task scheduler and make sure it's not running at like 3 am (I believe this is off in 10 by default). SSDs write across the memory, defrag tries to make things sequential working directly against the way SSDs are designed to work and it will shorten its life.

 

EDIT2: https://mashtips.com/maximize-performance-and-increase-life-of-ssd/

I consider most of this to be over kill. If you're like me you will be cloning your drive in to a bigger one and extending the partition every year or two anyway and none of this matters. No one will be keeping a drive for 15 years :cap_old:

Edited by w4spl3g

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The standard is to keep 25% or more free for optimum speed.  Life time is crapshoot.  You just make an offering to your rig and hope it is satisfied.

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2 hours ago, w4spl3g said:

No.

 

EDIT: I read your other thread like a week ago. Do *NOT* ever defrag an SSD. If you're still running Windows 7 check your task scheduler and make sure it's not running at like 3 am (I believe this is off in 10 by default). SSDs write across the memory, defrag tries to make things sequential working directly against the way SSDs are designed to work and it will shorten its life.

 

EDIT2: https://mashtips.com/maximize-performance-and-increase-life-of-ssd/

I consider most of this to be over kill. If you're like me you will be cloning your drive in to a bigger one and extending the partition every year or two anyway and none of this matters. No one will be keeping a drive for 15 years :cap_old:

Don't need the reminder about not defragging an SSD, and presumably it's going to Windows 10, but was going to check no defrag utility is targeting the SSD.

I don't use Hibernate though, and only WOWS at present will go on the SSD. Nothing else, so I'm expecting it'll have a solid 6-10 year life.

 

1 hour ago, LT_Rusty_SWO said:

Which drive did you get? Tell me you got the Samsung, please?

Samsung 240 GB.

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Windows 10 doesn't even let you defrag an SSD via OS. Also, no.. you definitely want the SSD to be the boot drive, otherwise you're negating the primary benefits of the drive. 

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Windows 10 defrag now auto detects what you have. If you have a HDD it will still defrag that drive and if you have an SSD it will trim it. So don't turn it off.

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8 hours ago, Counter_Gambit said:

Use the SSD as the boot drive, not a drive for you game.
 

Next computer I build or buy will do that. Not in a position where 30-second boot time is mandatory.

 

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41 minutes ago, Reymu said:

Next computer I build or buy will do that. Not in a position where 30-second boot time is mandatory.

 

A 240 is more than enough for the OS and the game and some other things like a browser, utilities, etc.

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Why not put OS on it? It makes a huge difference. I have windows, world of warships, and overwatch on my SSD and that's it.

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Just now, CarbonButtprint said:

Why not put OS on it? It makes a huge difference. I have windows, world of warships, and overwatch on my SSD and that's it.

Why get so attached to technology that it dictates my every move? Not working a job or anything that requires fast boot-up times.

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1 hour ago, w4spl3g said:

A 240 is more than enough for the OS and the game and some other things like a browser, utilities, etc.

Don't want to put too much. The Inherent Write Tolerance of NAND Flash Memory (makes up majority of all SSDs), will quickly be reached, if too much information is written to it. Anything that has regular updates and continuous patches, would be better off going on a HDD, because of the "Cost per GB" being superior.
 

1 hour ago, Reymu said:

Next computer I build or buy will do that. Not in a position where 30-second boot time is mandatory.

 

Then you do not need the SSD, because there is 0 benefit to having a game like WoWS, stored on one. WoWS requires RAM, CPU processing, and GPU processing, and internet bandwidth. The better those 4 statistics, the better performance you can get from the game. Storage medium of the client, provides 0 benefits. With the regular updates, and patches, you'll reach the write tolerance of the NAND Flash Memory, very quickly.

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9 minutes ago, Counter_Gambit said:

Don't want to put too much. The Inherent Write Tolerance of NAND Flash Memory (makes up majority of all SSDs), will quickly be reached, if too much information is written to it. Anything that has regular updates and continuous patches, would be better off going on a HDD, because of the "Cost per GB" being superior.
 

Then you do not need the SSD, because there is 0 benefit to having a game like WoWS, stored on one. WoWS requires RAM, CPU processing, and GPU processing, and internet bandwidth. The better those 4 statistics, the better performance you can get from the game. Storage medium of the client, provides 0 benefits. With the regular updates, and patches, you'll reach the write tolerance of the NAND Flash Memory, very quickly.

That defines an OS as well. You're saying it's not good for anything; lol. I have had this game on both HDD and SSD and SSD is noticeably better. Whatever, do what you want, I've been running SSDs for years for the OS, maybe a couple games and lots of smaller programs with 0 issues and superior performance. Do you need it for a big media archive with multiple terabytes of movies and whatnot? No.

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1 hour ago, Counter_Gambit said:

 

Then you do not need the SSD, because there is 0 benefit to having a game like WoWS, stored on one. 

Not completely true. For whatever reason, an SSD improves loading times for matches. With an HDD, it's entirely possible you could not load in until 30 seconds or more after the match started.

I know myself, I went from loading in 10-15 seconds late with an HDD, to 30 seconds early with an SSD.

As an aside, it also reduces the length of AI turns considerably in Civ5, which can become monstrous on a huge map at mid-game and later.

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I see lots of conflicting information and opinions here which I guess is understandable.

You should place the OS on the SSD.  The benefits are far larger reaching than just lowering the boot times.  Everything your computer does will be faster.  Playing games, surfing the internet, opening up a spreadsheet, pretty much anything the computer does will be faster.  Everything the computer does touches the OS in some way and if the OS is on an SSD then everything will see a performance increase.

People concerned about the life time of the SSD have very little to worry about these days.  Anytime a file is written to an SSD it chips away at its total lifespan,  this is true for all SSD.  Newer software techniques and hardware manufacturing have greatly increased expected life span of SSDs.  You can check out a few reports on SSD lifespan in the links below.
Tech Report
PC World
Here is a quick excerpt from the PC World article.

Quote

TR recently reported that after a year of testing the durability of six SSDs, four died after reaching between 728 terabytes and 1.2 petabytes of data writes, all of which is far beyond the specified life span for the drives.  Two other SSDs—a Samsung 840 Pro and a Kingston HyperX 3K—are still going after crossing the 2 petabyte data write benchmark. That's utterly insane.

Defraging the SSD is turned off by default in Windows 8, 8.1, and 10.  It is also turned off on Windows 7 after one of the windows updates.  If you are on Vista or XP then god help you.  I can't speak for any Linux or Mac distros.

SSDs are probably the biggest upgrade you can make to a computer now days and they have very few downsides compared to their hard disk brethren.  I have been using the RAIDR Express PCIe SSD for my OS drive and a Samsung 840 EVO 1TB for all of my game installs.  Both of them hit 4 years old a couple of months ago and neither are showing any signs of degradation.  If you set them up right and use them reasonably then they will last a really long time.

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11 hours ago, Reymu said:

Next computer I build or buy will do that. Not in a position where 30-second boot time is mandatory.

 

I run my game from my OS's SSD.  No reason to not have the game and your OS on there.

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9 hours ago, Counter_Gambit said:

Then you do not need the SSD, because there is 0 benefit to having a game like WoWS, stored on one. WoWS requires RAM, CPU processing, and GPU processing, and internet bandwidth. The better those 4 statistics, the better performance you can get from the game. Storage medium of the client, provides 0 benefits

Not sure I agree about that.  When WoWS "detects" a new ship it loads the model and textures from file (disk).  If you're experienced minor lag on new detects, an SSD should help a lot.

 

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Just now, iDuckman said:

Not sure I agree about that.  When WoWS "detects" a new ship it loads the model and textures from file (disk).  If you're experienced minor lag on new detects, an SSD should help a lot.

 

^ This. It did seem to make a significant difference in lag issues in game...

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9 hours ago, Kyralee said:

I see lots of conflicting information and opinions here which I guess is understandable.

You should place the OS on the SSD.  The benefits are far larger reaching than just lowering the boot times.  Everything your computer does will be faster.  Playing games, surfing the internet, opening up a spreadsheet, pretty much anything the computer does will be faster.  Everything the computer does touches the OS in some way and if the OS is on an SSD then everything will see a performance increase.

People concerned about the life time of the SSD have very little to worry about these days.  Anytime a file is written to an SSD it chips away at its total lifespan,  this is true for all SSD.  Newer software techniques and hardware manufacturing have greatly increased expected life span of SSDs.  You can check out a few reports on SSD lifespan in the links below.
Tech Report
PC World
Here is a quick excerpt from the PC World article.

Defraging the SSD is turned off by default in Windows 8, 8.1, and 10.  It is also turned off on Windows 7 after one of the windows updates.  If you are on Vista or XP then god help you.  I can't speak for any Linux or Mac distros.

SSDs are probably the biggest upgrade you can make to a computer now days and they have very few downsides compared to their hard disk brethren.  I have been using the RAIDR Express PCIe SSD for my OS drive and a Samsung 840 EVO 1TB for all of my game installs.  Both of them hit 4 years old a couple of months ago and neither are showing any signs of degradation.  If you set them up right and use them reasonably then they will last a really long time.

You're all being persistent about promoting the OS to Super Sonic Drive, you know?

 

2 hours ago, crzyhawk said:

I run my game from my OS's SSD.  No reason to not have the game and your OS on there.

Alright.

How hardy is a Samsung 860 EVO? That's what I already bought. 240 GB.

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19 minutes ago, Reymu said:

You're all being persistent about promoting the OS to Super Sonic Drive, you know?

 

Alright.

How hardy is a Samsung 860 EVO? That's what I already bought. 240 GB.

Most SSD's will probably outlast your computers useful life

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11 hours ago, Kyralee said:

Defraging the SSD is turned off by default in Windows 8, 8.1, and 10.  It is also turned off on Windows 7 after one of the windows updates.  If you are on Vista or XP then god help you.  I can't speak for any Linux or Mac distros

Yes, since windows 7 (SP1, I believe) SSD's when recognized by the system, will not auto-defrag, and unless I am mistaken, they even pop up when you try to "not recommended". To my knowledge Linux has been doing this since before windows, apple may have lagged behind, but so many proprietary hardware issues I can't say for sure.

Option A

SSD's should contain your OS (windows), intense processing programs (CAD software/Video Editing software/Database software) ie bootdrive, and long-loading/processing software.

SSD's may contain programs you want the faster performance from (browsers, encryption, office suites, graphics games, etc) Bearing in mind many times these programs may have high amounts of updates, you may wish to choose manually update all "optional" programs on the drive, and then do them once a month to reduce re-writes of the SSD

SSD's should most likely not contain: random data storage such as pictures, movies, documents, low end games (solitare/minesweeper/bejewled). Unless for some reason you need that data regularly and you are waiting for it to load.

Option B

SSD contains only the program you want to run quickly (dedicated game drive) This has a disadvantage if the games you install need to use the regular hard drive elements of the operating system and/or drivers to operate.   I dont recommend this, but if you are fully aware of what your game needs from the rest of your system, this could be a way to go. The advantage is buying a smaller drive/higher performing drive than you could afford to put all the things on. unlikely in this case.

 

If you want to get fancy, download a drive cloner program and use your old hard drive as a back-up disk, regularly backing it up, and storing it elsewhere. Then in the event of catastrophic failure, you just plug in old drive and press power to be running again. (may necessitate changing settings in bios to boot old drive though)

 

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I'll be the one who says you DO NOT NEED to move your OS to the SSD if it's not a priority or necessity, and instead leaving the SSD for your favorite games for faster loading (or for games with sorry optimization, like Fallout, or games with large open-world areas rather than linear or "on-rails" gameplay).

It's been proven in several threads that moving WoWs to an SSD improves loading times into a match, for whatever reason. Something about how the game makes a large "call" to the installation folder for the necessary assets for the match in order to load it all up, and permitting a faster initial entry into the match itself (usually with 20-30s to spare while others are still loading in).

Other MMOs also have that quirk, where an SSD installation helps with loading up large maps, raid zones, dungeons, or other certain modes, faster than loading from an HDD. Of course, having a good internet connection (in the event some of the assets are server-side) and a decent CPU and GPU, also helps.

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10 hours ago, Reymu said:

You're all being persistent about promoting the OS to Super Sonic Drive, you know?

 

Alright.

How hardy is a Samsung 860 EVO? That's what I already bought. 240 GB.

Samsungs are good drives, better than my old SanDisks.  I used a 240g drive as my primary drive for a long time on my old tower machine, it's been demoted to external/travel use for my old laptop (primary machine is a Razer Blade gaming laptop).  When I still used my tower as my primary PC, I had the OS and games I played often installed to the 240g drive.  I kept an old 7200RPM drive in there for document storage, downloads etc.

That's pretty much how I do it on the blade as well, my storage goes to a NAS, OS and games from the internal SSD

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