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Panzer1113

Gneisenau and Power Creep

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Gneisenau was one of my tech tree keepers while grinding through the lines.  When the German BB line was released, was a revelation, tanky, good AA, could be spec'ed for secondaries, had only 6 main guns, but torps!.  Bought perm camo for, and have had her in port a long time, but more as a Port Queen.  Took her out for the first time in months, and it is amazing how the power creep in BBs with French and RN BB introductions have impacted her.  She, along with Colorado and Nagato are at the bottom of the tier 7 BB 2 week list, one of the lowest damage producers.  Going to retire this port queen, really no reason to play her.  I have many much better premium tier 7 BBs (Nelson, Sharn, DOY, Hood, Nelson) sitting in port and the Gneisenau (along with the older BBs) are not as competitive and not worth the limited time I have to play.

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If you just take the tech tree tier 7 BBs she is still one of the better ones, however if you own 2-3 of prem. ones there is little reason to keep Gneisenau. 

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Well most premiums have slightly inflated stats when compared with tech tree ships due to the players who are more likely to buy them and they don't have stock modules to deal with. I find the Gneisenau still does fine but many players don't know how to play her well.  You already have the Scharn though so you don't have a strong reason to keep the Gneisenau.

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Who cares how well it does compared to other ships, if you enjoy playing it and do well in it then keep sailing her. Sure your a little rusty but play some more games in her. My Colorado is my #1 played ship, I sail it better than most players and I have a great time every time I take her out even though she is considered a bad ship

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Power creep?  You want to talk power creep?  Look at New York, Omaha, Kuma, etc.  The original two nation lines have taken much more of a beating than anything German or since.

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Gneisenau power creeped? Really??? :Smile_amazed:

Still has amazing secondary guns for a T7, still has excellent AA, it's still just as tough and fast as ever, and it still has the big knock out punch with the torps. Only having 6 guns has been a weakness since day 1.  

Lyon and KGV are really good but they haven't passed Gneisenau in power creep mode. And I am not a fan of the ship either but I recognize it's strengths.

If anything I think it is more of a case where people have learned how to take on and beat Gneisenau and Scharnhorst now. It isn't that they aren't as good ships or that new ones are better than them. It is simply people have had time to play against them and figure out the best way to deal with them.

Gneisenau is still a very very good BB.

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The major issue with the Gnei is not the ship per se, it's the meta, and how that's changed with the intro of the new RN and Fr BBs (and soon Italian).

The ship itself doesn't really need a buff (other than maybe giving the 105mm on the stock hull the same /4 pen as the 128 and 150mm on the B hull).  

What has to change is the Captain skills.  You have to give up some of the pure secondary focus in order to deal with the much higher fire meta that exists today.  BFT is no longer a sane choice - BoS or SI is better.

But it's still a brawling monster, and the AA is still very powerful.  

Realistically, I see there being three good builds for the Gnei right now:

Pure Tank:  PT, EM, AR, BoS, SI, FP, AFT

Tank Brawler:  PT, EM, AR, BoS, SI, MFCSG, AFT,

Brawler:  PT, DCCA, AR, SI, MFCSG, AFT, FP

All of them use the same upgrade modules:  MAM1, DCSM1, SBM2, SGM2 (though some prefer DSCM2)

 

I have no problem against a Lyon in any of the above, as I can bow tank and bounce its 14" guns up until I can close to 8km, and the Gnei is significantly faster so it can force the engagement. Not to mention the Lyon can't bow tank, as the Gnei's guns overmatch the bow/stern.

The KGV/DoY are a bit harder, because of the fire meta they enforce. But again, their AP can't overmatch the Gnei's armor (while the reverse is not true), and they have really crappy secondaries. The problem dealing with them it they're nearly as fast as the Gnei, so closing is hard, and their HE is significantly OP both in damage and fire.  Which is where the anti-fire skills above come in.

But get any T7 BB within 8km of a Gnei, and the Gnei wins a fair fight easily.

Edited by EAnybody

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Hey

The biggest problem with the German line is the dispersion and there is no reason why it couldn't be buffed slightly to keep pace with the current meta that we see going to today.  With Gneisenau; it  does suffer from only 6 guns, so why not give it a slight buff in dispersion or even ROF slightly.


Pete

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I thought I would play my Gneisenau decently often after getting the Bismarck, I was wrong. It just doesn't feel competitive in the game's meta. I still haven't sold it for some reason though.

I like Nagato much better and have actually played it a bit since moving past it.

Could not sell Colorado fast enough, it's top speed being my only issue with it.

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On 3/30/2018 at 12:18 PM, desmo_2 said:

Power creep?  You want to talk power creep?  Look at New York, Omaha, Kuma, etc.  The original two nation lines have taken much more of a beating than anything German or since.

Actually I still take my Kuma out occasionally and only have 6 point Captain in her and she still does very well.

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On 3/30/2018 at 11:41 AM, Panzer1113 said:

Gneisenau was one of my tech tree keepers while grinding through the lines.  When the German BB line was released, was a revelation, tanky, good AA, could be spec'ed for secondaries, had only 6 main guns, but torps!.  Bought perm camo for, and have had her in port a long time, but more as a Port Queen.  Took her out for the first time in months, and it is amazing how the power creep in BBs with French and RN BB introductions have impacted her.  She, along with Colorado and Nagato are at the bottom of the tier 7 BB 2 week list, one of the lowest damage producers.  Going to retire this port queen, really no reason to play her.  I have many much better premium tier 7 BBs (Nelson, Sharn, DOY, Hood, Nelson) sitting in port and the Gneisenau (along with the older BBs) are not as competitive and not worth the limited time I have to play.

Give Gneisenau a few more battles to try to get the hang of using it again. It is still a good ship, but does require a bit of practice to use due to it’s various odd characteristics. I went on vacation came back and was like what happened to my ship??? Got back into practice with and was like oh lol, had forgotten a few things about using it.

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1 hour ago, Admiral_Thrawn_1 said:

Give Gneisenau a few more battles to try to get the hang of using it again. It is still a good ship, but does require a bit of practice to use due to it’s various odd characteristics. I went on vacation came back and was like what happened to my ship??? Got back into practice with and was like oh lol, had forgotten a few things about using it.

That is good advice, when a ship as been parked as a port queen for a long time ya forget the little idiosyncrasies of the ship... but in this case ended up selling my Gneisenau due to the number of Lyons and DOY in game, many spamming he.  Four 15 inch guns in front do not make up for the number of shells that other tier 7 BBs can spit out, from lower caliber to the 16 inchers (Nelson, Colorado and Nagato).  Also, have better tier 7 BBs in my port that are more competitive and fun to play, so best to sell the port queen and free up the captain and credits/modules then have something that I will not play sitting around crowding my carousel and taking up a slot.

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On 3/30/2018 at 12:41 PM, Panzer1113 said:

Gneisenau was one of my tech tree keepers while grinding through the lines.  When the German BB line was released, was a revelation, tanky, good AA, could be spec'ed for secondaries, had only 6 main guns, but torps!.  Bought perm camo for, and have had her in port a long time, but more as a Port Queen.  Took her out for the first time in months, and it is amazing how the power creep in BBs with French and RN BB introductions have impacted her.  She, along with Colorado and Nagato are at the bottom of the tier 7 BB 2 week list, one of the lowest damage producers.  Going to retire this port queen, really no reason to play her.  I have many much better premium tier 7 BBs (Nelson, Sharn, DOY, Hood, Nelson) sitting in port and the Gneisenau (along with the older BBs) are not as competitive and not worth the limited time I have to play.

I really can emphasize with this. I have her too and I don't really have a problem with her, it's just I prefer Hood, DOY and maybe even Lyon. Only reason I played her to the limited extent I did after her trials was when I had mission that required torps. Funny how back when WOWS had 3 lines she was king and now with 2 lines and a the flood of premiums, she's just meh. 

Edited by Aristotle83

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This does not bode well for me then. I've just rebought Bayern to grind out Gneisenau and Bismarck. Is Gneisenau really that bad? I have Sharnhorst so I'm familair with the basics. Just have to get used to lesser guns.

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22 hours ago, TypicalEngineer said:

This does not bode well for me then. I've just rebought Bayern to grind out Gneisenau and Bismarck. Is Gneisenau really that bad? I have Sharnhorst so I'm familair with the basics. Just have to get used to lesser guns.

I don't think anyone on here has said Gneisenau is bad. It's pretty good but T7 is a crowded tier for quality BB's and if you've got 2 or 3 ships that are better it just doesn't make sense to use it. If you are a German BB main nothing wrong with Gneisenau and it's actually pretty similar to Tirpitz in that's it got that torpedo gimmick  If you have the Scharnhorst and/or  Tirpitz though IMO I find it hard to see the point of getting the sister unless you are dead set on finishing the German tech tree. If I had a Scharnhorst I know I would have stopped at Bayern, I ended up stopping at Gneisenau because I have a Tirpitz and I saw no point in grinding for what is essentially the clone of a ship I already have. Not that there isn't more seperating Gneisenau and Scharnhorst. 

Gneisenau used to be the king of T7 but stuff happens and there's just so many OP monsters hanging around at the tier one of which would be Scharnhorst.  

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15 hours ago, Aristotle83 said:

I don't think anyone on here has said Gneisenau is bad. It's pretty good but T7 is a crowded tier for quality BB's and if you've got 2 or 3 ships that are better it just doesn't make sense to use it. If you are a German BB main nothing wrong with Gneisenau and it's actually pretty similar to Tirpitz in that's it got that torpedo gimmick  If you have the Scharnhorst and/or  Tirpitz though IMO I find it hard to see the point of getting the sister unless you are dead set on finishing the German tech tree. If I had a Scharnhorst I know I would have stopped at Bayern, I ended up stopping at Gneisenau because I have a Tirpitz and I saw no point in grinding for what is essentially the clone of a ship I already have. Not that there isn't more seperating Gneisenau and Scharnhorst. 

Gneisenau used to be the king of T7 but stuff happens and there's just so many OP monsters hanging around at the tier one of which would be Scharnhorst.  

I have a Sharnhorst which I greatly enjoy. Originally I was going down the german line for the Bismarck so I might still do that. Although I do wonder how relevant she is at tier 8 these days.

I'm taking my time grinding the lines so it might ne a while before I reach Bismarck.

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