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retic1959

Bye Bye Colorado !

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1 hour ago, FirebirdXIV said:

Hey, I didn't say it had to be POPULAR, because it won't,  it will just as terrible as a premium as it was in the tech tree. As for the Nevada, its the first standard type battleship, so it will be a mix of the ny and new mex, with 10 14 in guns arranged in four turrets, a large superstructure with plenty of secondaries, and a smallish citadel with a higher speed. 

SbwsRQa7Wu0myQY3rzoHdgJt7g_SXsqX39bI8Kx3km0JTmtwFUanx5mttGeWbxPjIyOnRprmZBZ7YvEsrif5kXy1Gj6AdAr9zA6zw-TG-qYrMSerOXaT8YLE8TlFiwyzyGUP9aDV

I said Wut because the way you wrote it was badly written because it lacked any context

 

That said the Nevada has always been considered a "given" if there was a line split with the NY most likely getting a Texas style AA refit. They are also the same speed so there isn't any faster ship really

 

The problem with the Colorado, like the rest of the BB line before her, is that she isn't Noob or bad player friendly like the Germans or British are. 

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Hey, I'm about 2/3 of the way through my CO grind, but I'm liking the ship just fine. Yes, the ship's a tug, but that's its only fault. I'm able to hang with t9s just fine with its guns; and while it is slow, it's also smaller compared to most t8s and up. And getting into a match where you're high tier, the ship's a beast. You can hate the speed of the ship, but it's a perfect fit at t7.

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I was pretty happy to get my NC. No more floating garbage barge with guns.

 

garbagebargemagazinestoryphoto1.JPG

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As with any ship, the Colorado takes getting used to.

I wish she was a smidge faster. I wish she had better concealment. (3 km worse than the same sized New Mexico)

But she is what she is. She's pretty honest. She packs a good punch. I find she over-pens cruisers more often than I'd like, but oh well.

Personally, I play her "bob and weave" Keep her moving, don't get fixated on any one target. Just keep plinking whatever enemy ship gives you the best broadside.

My best game I've ever played, was in my Colorado. 6 sinks (4 of them BBs), Kraken (my second ever), Confederate, First Blood, High Caliber, Devastating strike. 147K damage 2400 base XP. I made good decisions, made good shots, kept out of tight spaces until the end when there weren't as many ships.

I still play her nearly every day, even though I've unlocked both the North Carolina and the Iowa.

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On 4/14/2018 at 11:00 PM, xalmgrey said:

I was pretty happy to get my NC. No more floating garbage barge with guns.

 

garbagebargemagazinestoryphoto1.JPG

Same here , I'll take a box stock NC over a fully upgraded Colorado anyday .

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1 minute ago, retic1959 said:

Same here , I'll take a box stock NC over a fully upgraded Colorado anyday .

Just finished a 79k damage game where i cit and det a hindy out from 18k

And my NC is stock. I don't feel at a disadvantage at all. This is a great ship.

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1 minute ago, xalmgrey said:

Just finished a 79k damage game where i cit and det a hindy out from 18k

And my NC is stock. I don't feel at a disadvantage at all. This is a great ship.

Agreed , can't wait to get mine upgraded , hoping to run her in ranked .

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On 4/10/2018 at 1:03 AM, Zionas said:

Colorado has been a comfortable, if not a bland ship for me. Having used the word 'bland', I don't think it's necessarily a 'negative' thing because I'd take a solidly performing vessel in my comfort zone over a 'gimmicky' ship any day. Colorado handles exactly the same as New Mexico, except that she has 16" guns with more penetrative power. She's one of the few ships I've done decently in, and I don't think she deserves her bad reputation at all. From what I've heard, her bad reputation is mainly from her pre-buff days, but she's become better since then. 

She's been buffed A LOT over the years, but she needed it, badly. The Colorado may still be, technically, the worst performing tier 7 BB, but I'd have to check that. The last real buff - giving her about 9,000 extra hitpoints so she's on-par with other BB's of her tier - was a nice gain, and another one that was badly needed. It was nutty that for years she had vastly inferior hitpoints to every other tier 7 BB - even fewer than the New Mexico?! All that in return for a "better than average" heal, which I can't even say ever did much of anything useful. Heck, I don't think it was ever really documented anywhere, at least not in game. It was a strange, completely out of place gimmick on a random ship, and I'm glad she behaves more like a normal Standard now, with appropriate hitpoints. She's dull, yes, but I've never had a real problem with her. I also, laughably, do far better with the Colorado than my North Carolina. Less random deaths from turning, and no constant up-tiering helps.

Edited by old_radagast

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18 hours ago, old_radagast said:

She's been buffed A LOT over the years, but she needed it, badly. The Colorado may still be, technically, the worst performing tier 7 BB, but I'd have to check that. The last real buff - giving her about 9,000 extra hitpoints so she's on-par with other BB's of her tier - was a nice gain, and another one that was badly needed. It was nutty that for years she had vastly inferior hitpoints to every other tier 7 BB - even fewer than the New Mexico?! All that in return for a "better than average" heal, which I can't even say ever did much of anything useful. Heck, I don't think it was ever really documented anywhere, at least not in game. It was a strange, completely out of place gimmick on a random ship, and I'm glad she behaves more like a normal Standard now, with appropriate hitpoints. She's dull, yes, but I've never had a real problem with her. I also, laughably, do far better with the Colorado than my North Carolina. Less random deaths from turning, and no constant up-tiering helps.

I wasn't able to get the NC ready for ranked , but I was gifted am Alabama , it plays like the NC and It's crazy and I know it won't last but 6 games in with her and I'm sitting at an 83% WR  in the Bama , with a 58% WR overall in ranked . I would expect the same results with the NC , I play them exactly the same way . NC's a bit more accurate than the Bama but overall there's little difference . I do quite well with the Missouri in randoms as well 57% WR  in her again same play style for the most part but the Colorado was a miserable boat for me , just couldn't get her to work for me , I did much better in the New Mexico , a slow boat being less of a disadvantage at tier 6 .

Edited by retic1959

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On 3/28/2018 at 3:49 PM, Das_Schlippo said:

The biggest problem I found with the Colorado is that the engagement can run away from you.  Many times I decided to push in one direction and then the flow of the battle changed.  You end up just whistling sea shanties to yourself while you futilely try to catch up with the battle.

Totally agree...but otherwise, I love my Colorado. I am not the most skilled captain in the world (probably because when I was actually in the Navy, I wasn't an officer-I worked for a living), and I saw drastic improvements in my play when I moved up to the NMX from the New York, but now in the Colorado, I'm making my NMX play look pathetic. The faster reloads and bigger guns on the Colorado more than make up for having four fewer, IMO. With rudder shift, she turns just about as well as the NMX, so give me a little stiffer armor and a better engine and I'd call it tier-perfect...but even as it is, I trust my Colorado against (almost) anything. I tend to tuck in behind the initial engagement, which means I have no problem getting within 14km or less, and damn do those 16" guns have some punch at that range!

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I sold my Colorado finally which I actually liked just because I finally got the Iowa and wanted to offset some of the cost plus use the captain from the Colorado. Keeping two turtles the Texas and New Mexico plus two rabbits the North Carolina and Iowa.:fish_nerv:Did the same thing when I just got the Frederich Der Grobe and sold the Gneisenau and moved the captain to the FDG.

Edited by dust340man

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2 hours ago, dust340man said:

I sold my Colorado finally which I actually liked just because I finally got the Iowa and wanted to offset some of the cost plus use the captain from the Colorado. Keeping two turtles the Texas and New Mexico plus two rabbits the North Carolina and Iowa.:fish_nerv:Did the same thing when I just got the Frederich Der Grobe and sold the Gneisenau and moved the captain to the FDG.

So...not to be the nit-picky a-hole, but it's der Grosse. the ß is actually called an eszett and it acts as "ss". 

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I think the slow speed gives you more time to think, and it turns on a dime so you rarely ever get hit by a torpedo. Also The AA is pretty nice. Cant say I mind being stuck in an engagement because of its inability to escape. As long as I'm keeping them at bay for a significant amount of time I'll go down fighting.
 

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On 3/28/2018 at 5:04 PM, Levits said:

By comparison, the Japanese tier 7 bb has little armor but great guns; it can dish out damage but can't take a hit.

Yeah, the Japanese guns have truly amusing accuracy. Like being able to cit a cruiser at 18-19 km with a bit of luck and proper leading. Never been able to do that in anything else, other than my North Carolina and the NC was shooting at a stationary target that had lagged out of the match.

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usn bb are crapuntil T8 because the iowa is iconic and they want to make money. Ship lines without popular ships will be more consistent in quality to the end (japan for example has real piles of trash at t9 and t6) and germany as always gets punished in a funny way for being germans. Like having zero armor on the citadel (secret documents) no concealment (game balance) and """"accurate"""" guns, and giving you a slightly larger bismark  for 8,9 and 10. But it's ok because the secondaries can shoot 12km. Another but unofficial blight on the german lines is that wolf larping furries love them. Not that there's anything wrong with being a furry, it's just these guys in particular have a perfect blend of the most irritating traits humanly possible.

The three lines worth it in the end are usn japan and british. usn is the worst grind but what you get in exchange is worth the suffering.

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Colorado is great with a 19pt commander, if you have a good understanding of map position.  That's the main challenge, which mostly involves staying central.  Wherever you put the Colo though, it is like a really mean tick that won't die.  Guns are great, AA is solid, manual secondaries surprisingly effective and unexpected.

I'd recommend keeping it to revisit with a full commander later.  Punishes things at range, brutalizes them if they get closer.

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The idea to shove them into the brawler role while they have less range and less speed (and less accuracy and less health and so on and so forth) than their Japanese counterparts made them imbalanced the moment they were released. They're so slow that they can't reposition and they're so short-ranged that they can't reach out to effect another position they can't get to. Ships this slow should have been long-ranged high-accuracy so that they could influence the map even if they couldn't reposition well. Instead, what Wargaming forced them to do was try to fulfill a role they just cannot. They don't have the speed or the range. And unlike Japanese BBs, to get a bit more range they sacrifice even more accuracy. Meanwhile, Japanese BBs get more speed, better range, better accuracy and the ability to make their already-better accuracy even better still without sacrificing anything. 

 

Players have always tried to justify the lack of range, speed, accuracy, reload and health of the US BBs by saying things like "They have more penetration" or "They have better armor". The differences are functionally minimal. Especially in comparison to enormous advantages the others possess over the US BBs. A 5mm penetration advantage doesn't balance out a 10 knot speed advantage, a 5km range advantage, a 5 second reload advantage and an enormous dispersion advantage. 

Meanwhile, actual, factual specifications that would've made these ships vastly superior, like their STS internal structures or their post-Pearl rebuilds having RADAR FCSs are completely ignored. For balance reasons. They should be firing at longer ranges with more consistent accuracy than their IJN counterparts, but nope. They're brawlers. Because national flavor. 

It's so tremendously broken. It's always been tremendously broken. And it's only gotten more tremendously broken as other ships have come along to further power creep them into obsolescence. 

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3 hours ago, ramp4ge said:

The idea to shove them into the brawler role while they have less range and less speed (and less accuracy and less health and so on and so forth) than their Japanese counterparts made them imbalanced the moment they were released. They're so slow that they can't reposition and they're so short-ranged that they can't reach out to effect another position they can't get to. Ships this slow should have been long-ranged high-accuracy so that they could influence the map even if they couldn't reposition well. Instead, what Wargaming forced them to do was try to fulfill a role they just cannot. They don't have the speed or the range. And unlike Japanese BBs, to get a bit more range they sacrifice even more accuracy. Meanwhile, Japanese BBs get more speed, better range, better accuracy and the ability to make their already-better accuracy even better still without sacrificing anything. 

 

Players have always tried to justify the lack of range, speed, accuracy, reload and health of the US BBs by saying things like "They have more penetration" or "They have better armor". The differences are functionally minimal. Especially in comparison to enormous advantages the others possess over the US BBs. A 5mm penetration advantage doesn't balance out a 10 knot speed advantage, a 5km range advantage, a 5 second reload advantage and an enormous dispersion advantage. 

Meanwhile, actual, factual specifications that would've made these ships vastly superior, like their STS internal structures or their post-Pearl rebuilds having RADAR FCSs are completely ignored. For balance reasons. They should be firing at longer ranges with more consistent accuracy than their IJN counterparts, but nope. They're brawlers. Because national flavor. 

It's so tremendously broken. It's always been tremendously broken. And it's only gotten more tremendously broken as other ships have come along to further power creep them into obsolescence. 

Can't believe I'm saying this, but uhh, vote to have the Colorado buffed again?  Statistically, it is one of the lowest performing ships.

  • Upgrade its armor belt and deck armor to its proper specifications? 
  • Have the 5"/38 dual purpose mounts added on the B hull? 

The Standards really were tough as nails ships.

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B-hull should be West Virginia. I don't care if the AA would be outrageous for a tier 7. That's supposed to be the US's thing. Let her shine somewhere. 

 

The Standards should have their STS modeled and should have the internal structures modeled as well. World of Tanks, at one time, had a homogenization statistic that let them dictate the hardness and resistance of the armor. They claim they don't use that anymore, but the fact remains that the engine is capable of it. Maybe it's time for WoWS to start modeling that. 

 

The Standards ingame have all of their historical weaknesses and none of their historical strengths. It's outrageous. 

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It's funny, I've been playing the Montana a while now, and it reminds me of the Colorado.

I think both would benefit from a small buff, not reducing as much speed during a turn.

Battleships don't do well in amongst the islands. So they hang-out outside of island groups. I think the faster speeds during turns would make the ships a bit more fun to play.

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On ‎3‎/‎28‎/‎2018 at 2:48 PM, retic1959 said:

Finally finished with the slow as crap Colorado and got the North Carolina . What a relief . I've had the Missouri for quite some time so the N.C. feels comfortable , the Colorado just doesn't belong at tier 7 IMO . I think the Alaska would be perfect for that tier and drop the Colorado and New Mexico down to 6 and 5 respectively and let the New York go completely .

Alaska is a large Cruiser, not a battleship or battle cruiser. The U.S. Navy has already made this fact clear, back in the 1940's.

The Colorado is a great ship, and is fine exactly where it is at Tier VII... Too bad you and several others dislike it. I don't know if you have played it, since it was upgraded or "buffed" twice in the last year or so.

The New York is a great ship and perfect at Tier V, although New York (and Texas) need a "buff" (probably Steering Gears Modification 2 and catapult launched aircraft), which would make all the difference in making the ship competitive again. The New York has gotten far less competitive since the introduction of the French and British Battleships.

To note, In a recent Wargaming Developers post, turret mounted aircraft catapults were said to be in development and near completion for implementation on in-game ships.

Photo Caption:

USS New York (BB-34) exercises with other units of the Pacific Fleet on 31 May 1934. (Featuring Turret mounted catapult aircraft)

013421b.jpg

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Could be I am just remembering the 'Good Times' in my Colorado, and maybe I shouldn't jinx myself or tip-off the Match-makers :Smile_coin:BUT (at least lately) it seems when I take the Colorado out of the stable I am fighting as a Top Tier ship as opposed to using the Bismarck where I am most often the Bottom Tier ship in the battle... And even in the Colorado I would rather be a Top Tier than Bottom Tier in anything in the German BB Line:Smile_facepalm: (except Scharnhorst from what I see others doing with it). Maybe its the WoWS way of 'making amends' to the Colorado drivers, who knows, but at least she is given a fighting chance at Top & Mid Tier placement.

Her shortcomings have been well documented throughout this thread and I will admit that with anything less than a 17 pt. Captain she under-performs BUT now that I have a 19-pointer she does OK for me (combined with the Match-making thing) in most engagements with ships of her equal tier (except for that pesky Nagato:Smile_izmena:). The biggest problem is speed & maneuverability which turns the Colorado into a flaming, flooding wreck in any battles with CVs (Captain skills & human driver capability of course a factor) once the planes show up :cap_rambo:and start dropping ordinance on & around her. A Bob-N-Weave fighter she is not!

All in all, I sort of like the Colorado (though I am learning to like the Nagato more) especially as a break :Smile_hiding:from Tier 10 battles. She's a thinking-mans ship :cap_yes:that takes a lot of on-the-fly planning to operate effectively and, I enjoy that. I just wish I could it better. 

PS

Please forgive the excessive use of emoticons...I am still on my first cup of coffee this 'morning'.

 

 

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1 hour ago, CIT_Happens said:

PS

Please forgive the excessive use of emoticons...I am still on my first cup of coffee this 'morning'

First cup?

Must have about a gallon capacity.  :Smile_smile:

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1 hour ago, Radical_20 said:

Must have about a gallon capacity

Nah...I only use emos when I am tired...Now after three cups I probably won't use another one the rest of the day :Smile_Default:… ok, ONE Last One.

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On 6/24/2018 at 11:10 AM, Ben_CA68 said:

Alaska is a large Cruiser, not a battleship or battle cruiser. The U.S. Navy has already made this fact clear, back in the 1940's.

The Colorado is a great ship, and is fine exactly where it is at Tier VII... Too bad you and several others dislike it. I don't know if you have played it, since it was upgraded or "buffed" twice in the last year or so.

The New York is a great ship and perfect at Tier V, although New York (and Texas) need a "buff" (probably Steering Gears Modification 2 and catapult launched aircraft), which would make all the difference in making the ship competitive again. The New York has gotten far less competitive since the introduction of the French and British Battleships.

To note, In a recent Wargaming Developers post, turret mounted aircraft catapults were said to be in development and near completion for implementation on in-game ships.

Photo Caption:

USS New York (BB-34) exercises with other units of the Pacific Fleet on 31 May 1934. (Featuring Turret mounted catapult aircraft)

013421b.jpg

Yeah , large cruiser eyeing Scharnhorst at tier 7 .

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