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xovian

If you could change one thing about playing a DD

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On ‎3‎/‎4‎/‎2018 at 11:59 PM, Crucis said:

No, you really, really don't.  I can choose to write whatever I want that's on topic.  And dissecting other people's ideas are very much on topic.  It's NOT "judging" people.  It's called a DISCUSSION.  So get off your high horse.

And if I choose to include something, maybe I will.  And maybe I won't.

and maybe you should !! or maybe you shouldn't...   I don't have a horse, even a low one, nor a unicorn. but if I did, I would NOT get off to participate in a discussion. actually, I am not sure what you were trying to say. 

radar as it is now blows. utterly. but torp detection range blows across all tiers. even if you were able to creep a bit closer, or charge around an island you weren't detected thru, you would still miss pretty much with all of them, if they can see them from more than a mile away.

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3 hours ago, not_acceptable said:

and maybe you should !! or maybe you shouldn't...   I don't have a horse, even a low one, nor a unicorn. but if I did, I would NOT get off to participate in a discussion. actually, I am not sure what you were trying to say. 

radar as it is now blows. utterly. but torp detection range blows across all tiers. even if you were able to creep a bit closer, or charge around an island you weren't detected thru, you would still miss pretty much with all of them, if they can see them from more than a mile away.

Jesus, what are you, 10 years old?  How can you not know what it means when someone says to "get off your high horse"???  :Smile_facepalm:

 

Of course the implementation of radar stinks (i.e. being able to see through islands).  I don't think that any player defends it.  Some understand why it is what it is, but they don't really defend it.  I wish it couldn't see through islands.  (Ditto for hydro.)  I also wish that only the ship mounting the radar could actually see what he's shooting at on his HUD, while team mates could only see the radar spotted ship on their minimaps.  (Heck, if I really and truly had my druthers, I'd LOVE to see the HUD turn "radar screen green" while radar was active.  I think that the immersive effect would be great.)

 

As for torp detection ranges, I assume that they are what they are because WG is somewhat pandering to the torpedo hating part of the BB community.  Because heaven forbid that BBs actually use WASD hax to change course or speeds occasionally to generate misses before enemy torps are even detected.  Or possibly take the vigilance skill to enhance torp detection.

 

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4 hours ago, Crucis said:

Jesus, what are you, 10 years old?  How can you not know what it means when someone says to "get off your high horse"???  :Smile_facepalm:

 

Of course the implementation of radar stinks (i.e. being able to see through islands).  I don't think that any player defends it.  Some understand why it is what it is, but they don't really defend it.  I wish it couldn't see through islands.  (Ditto for hydro.)  I also wish that only the ship mounting the radar could actually see what he's shooting at on his HUD, while team mates could only see the radar spotted ship on their minimaps.  (Heck, if I really and truly had my druthers, I'd LOVE to see the HUD turn "radar screen green" while radar was active.  I think that the immersive effect would be great.)

 

As for torp detection ranges, I assume that they are what they are because WG is somewhat pandering to the torpedo hating part of the BB community.  Because heaven forbid that BBs actually use WASD hax to change course or speeds occasionally to generate misses before enemy torps are even detected.  Or possibly take the vigilance skill to enhance torp detection.

 

oh, so you were referring to a saying!!

soon, WG will get off their high unicornskis, shock, surprise, and prove they really do care about all of us.

(edit. note: you were very, very close! at 64, only about a half century off.)


 

Does anyone know the difference between 'then' and 'than'?  It's "better THAN", not "better then".  "Than" is a comparative word!!! And it's "if this happens, THEN that happens".  "Then" is a temporal word!!!

semantics are fun. better then than it is now, yet then had more than now, comparatively, in terms of that which mattered then. in some ways, it was all better then, relatively.

 

Edited by not_acceptable

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change one thing ? one is not enough.

but the first thing I wanted get change is radar cannot go through mountains. I think radar is neccessary to counter stealthy / smokey ships, yet sitting behind island and use radar for the team is too high reward with low risk. (I can't even count how many new orleans sit behind island doing nothing just to use their radar in the last rank season and stall out the whole game)

second, IJN torp reaction time. 5 more kt can do the trick....they just need to be 5 kt faster (Lets be fair here, give them the same reaction time as the other nations)

Third, BB super pen. German DD know how painful it is. but others get this as well......stop that 43% damage hit already

 

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Hey

I wish DD guys would quit complaining about BB AP doing so much damage; what would happen in real life if a DD took a 14" or 16" round through it, much less several at once?  Massive permanent damage to machinery, men, or worse, how many times have you as a BB sent 2, 3, or 4 rounds into a DD only to have nothing but overpens and he turns and torps you , [edited].  

As a DD driver myself; I wish there was a way to encourage more team play, maybe incentives of some kind so that you get support from cruisers and BB's.  There is more BB camping, sitting back and doing little than ever before.  To be fair, I have had my share of cruisers and DD's leave me to die after I did go in to give my support, it's not as easy to relocate a BB due to slow ships, slow maneuvering, 30 second reloads, sometimes garbage secondaries, and then your team takes off and leaves you to die.  So don't always blame BB's for everything.  Team play is getting worse which is why I prefer to play in a division, good communication and having each others back no matter what class of ship your in.

 

Pete

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On ‎3‎/‎4‎/‎2018 at 5:13 PM, El_Swamp_Rat said:

Radar thru islands is bad.

Don't forget Hydro. 

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There are too many BB drivers that know WASD hacks! I think I saw one back in October! :Smile_teethhappy:

Of 2016...

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Stupid spotting mechanics that make a North Carolina (222m long, 34000tons) more difficult to detect than a Kiev (122m, 3200Ton).

 That is simply ridiculous.

Edited by Patosentado

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If I wanted to ask the impossible...

Less distance compression.

Being able to score hits at 6km on a destroyer for a battleship should be a harder dice roll. Torpedoes and ships however would be slower and proportionately more nimble as a result.

6 seconds shell flight to 10km is FLAT OUT WRONG for the stated muzzle velocities.

This would also force BBabies to come closer, or they won't hit anything ever.

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22 hours ago, sasquatch_research said:

Hey

I wish DD guys would quit complaining about BB AP doing so much damage; what would happen in real life if a DD took a 14" or 16" round through it, much less several at once?  Massive permanent damage to machinery, men, or worse, how many times have you as a BB sent 2, 3, or 4 rounds into a DD only to have nothing but overpens and he turns and torps you , [edited].  

As a DD driver myself; I wish there was a way to encourage more team play, maybe incentives of some kind so that you get support from cruisers and BB's.  There is more BB camping, sitting back and doing little than ever before.  To be fair, I have had my share of cruisers and DD's leave me to die after I did go in to give my support, it's not as easy to relocate a BB due to slow ships, slow maneuvering, 30 second reloads, sometimes garbage secondaries, and then your team takes off and leaves you to die.  So don't always blame BB's for everything.  Team play is getting worse which is why I prefer to play in a division, good communication and having each others back no matter what class of ship your in.

 

Pete

I wish guys like you would understand that the current AP mechanics are bugged permitting an AP shell to double dip.  This could be a double over pen, or a pen and over pen, or the dreaded double pen with a single shell.  This bug has been recognized by WG for a very long time. Its one thing to have an enemy make a great shot, even suffering at the hands of RNG is fine, but suffering damage that by WG's own admission shouldnt be possible is unacceptable.  That is why so many, including myself are up in arms about AP damage. 

There is more camping, as the skill level of the player base gets worse and worse.  These bad players will gravitate more to BBs as they are not as readily punished, and even at near max range can still put up ok damage numbers, but due to their poor positioning have negligent effect on the out come of the battle.  Having your CAs "leave" you is a sure sign you over extended to the point CAs and DDs will melt if they stay with you.  Its not a suicide pact.  The state of BB play is so bad, I plan my moves like my BBs never existed.  The only exception to that is BBs from competitive clans I recognize.

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11 hours ago, Destroyer_KuroshioKai said:

I wish guys like you would understand that the current AP mechanics are bugged permitting an AP shell to double dip.  This could be a double over pen, or a pen and over pen, or the dreaded double pen with a single shell.  This bug has been recognized by WG for a very long time. Its one thing to have an enemy make a great shot, even suffering at the hands of RNG is fine, but suffering damage that by WG's own admission shouldnt be possible is unacceptable.  That is why so many, including myself are up in arms about AP damage. 

There is more camping, as the skill level of the player base gets worse and worse.  These bad players will gravitate more to BBs as they are not as readily punished, and even at near max range can still put up ok damage numbers, but due to their poor positioning have negligent effect on the out come of the battle.  Having your CAs "leave" you is a sure sign you over extended to the point CAs and DDs will melt if they stay with you.  Its not a suicide pact.  The state of BB play is so bad, I plan my moves like my BBs never existed.  The only exception to that is BBs from competitive clans I recognize.

Hey

The point is simple you don't screw over the BB who is willing to push with your division and who went out of their way to be a team player and then bail on them to die.  As for being over extended; I was merely in the cap zone that we had just capped, when they all turned tail and run.  Being supportive of your team goes multiple ways; supporting the DD trying to cap just as much as helping to protect the BB under fire.  Too much selfish game play these days on all sides.  I will agree with skill level seemingly getting lower,  and high tier is not much better these days, where we see more and more camping, shoot from behind islands, DD's that ignore caps, cruisers that seem to do a lot of the work that BB's should be doing but of course are not as durable.  But then why push you DD in support if your fellow players are going to bail on a position at the first sign of trouble.  The days of playing the objective first and foremost, supporting members f your team seem like a thing of the past.

 

Pete

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As someone who's playing a DD line for the first time I'd say change the gun firing spotting distance or time spotted. DD guns are no larger than BB or CA secondary guns and those don't have a 10+ km spotting distance and being visible for 20 seconds in addition really doesn't make sense.

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On 3/4/2018 at 4:51 PM, xovian said:

So the question is, what one thing in the entire game would you change, or would want to see when you are playing a DD?

For me it is simply, we are "required" for spotting and caps, but there's nothing worse then a team that refuses not only support but out right abandons the mission objectives so they don't get their paint scratched.

This is just my one change, what would be yours when you play  a DD?

Most players don't understand this game.  They think just sailing around killing ships wins.  They don't get that on multi-cap games getting caps early wins most games.  And, that supporting caps and DDs wins most games.  Then, there is the "all about me" factor, as well as a basic failure to grasp game strategy and team play.  This will never change and you're at the whim of MM.  Deal.

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Add 'consensus team kill'. Three or more players highlight a 'friendly' player that's a total [edited]and hit the Alt-D key.. he detonates.

;)

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Eliminate CV's from the game completely because they are absolutely broken, and make hydro/radar work by LoS only.  No radaring through mountains.

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On ‎3‎/‎18‎/‎2018 at 9:40 PM, sasquatch_research said:

Hey

I wish DD guys would quit complaining about BB AP doing so much damage; what would happen in real life if a DD took a 14" or 16" round through it, much less several at once?  Massive permanent damage to machinery, men, or worse, how many times have you as a BB sent 2, 3, or 4 rounds into a DD only to have nothing but overpens and he turns and torps you , [edited].  

As a DD driver myself; I wish there was a way to encourage more team play, maybe incentives of some kind so that you get support from cruisers and BB's.  There is more BB camping, sitting back and doing little than ever before.  To be fair, I have had my share of cruisers and DD's leave me to die after I did go in to give my support, it's not as easy to relocate a BB due to slow ships, slow maneuvering, 30 second reloads, sometimes garbage secondaries, and then your team takes off and leaves you to die.  So don't always blame BB's for everything.  Team play is getting worse which is why I prefer to play in a division, good communication and having each others back no matter what class of ship your in.

 

Pete

The odds of a BB getting a hit with main guns at any range at a fast small target like a DD historically was ridiculously low. In game it is common. Main battery BB guns are ridiculously accurate in game. That's the problem.

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14 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said:

Three words change "Deep Water Torps"

You don't like DWTs? As a DD driver? :Smile_amazed:

Or are you a deep draft driver that doesn't like the short detections?

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23 minutes ago, Thornir said:

You don't like DWTs? As a DD driver? :Smile_amazed:

Or are you a deep draft driver that doesn't like the short detections?

IMO,  if your going to limit an armament that will only hit CA, BB, and CVs. I would probably give them the best concealment to execute successful strikes. My reasoning to why its a disaster, it limits the PAN ASIA line to be competitive compared to other nations in any tier.  Its basically a cut and paste gun version of a ShimaKaze.

Pan ASIA DD LINE

  • great guns in some tiers,
  • debilitating torps which holds it back

ShimaKAze

  • Torps/concealment is like the Pan asia DD
  • Guns are ok but atleast it holds up to other nations.

War gaming did not help it either hyping it as the best concealment/torp ranges in the game. When you actually drive the PAN ASIA DD, tier for tier there are other DD with better concealment to torp range ratio (upper tier PAN ASIA DDs are fun to play as gun boats that is cool). Only mentioning the standards of a good torp DD, other nations are better. Needless to say, I was disappointed. There is no superior  torp/concealment DD, with decent torp reloads in the high tiers (Tier x American DD but its a hybrid). CHeers!

Edited by Navalpride33

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5 hours ago, Thornir said:

The odds of a BB getting a hit with main guns at any range at a fast small target like a DD historically was ridiculously low. In game it is common. Main battery BB guns are ridiculously accurate in game. That's the problem.

Hey

And what were the odds of DD's using their main guns to set BB's on fire like they do in game either, much less getting the number of torps to strike like they do in game since we don't take into account torps that fail to detonate, some that were errant in their path.  You also have the fact that in game BB main guns are limited in range which is not realistic either, being that in real life they could shoot much farther.  Not to mention that many BB's had surface radar to which the Americans used to deadly effect on the Japanese during nighttime operations and to which was always available as long as it was on, it didn't last for 30sec. and have a 2min cooldown period like in game.  So if you really want to discuss historical facts and how they relate in game we can do so.  Like spotting aircraft that could be launch and could search for a couple of hours and actually straf your DD if needed, we don't have that in game, you also didn't have cool-down periods on repair parties and the list goes on. 

 

Pete

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5 hours ago, Thornir said:

The odds of a BB getting a hit with main guns at any range at a fast small target like a DD historically was ridiculously low. In game it is common. Main battery BB guns are ridiculously accurate in game. That's the problem.

Not only are they ridiculously accurate, they do damage twice. Even on hits that don't touch anything going through. That's broken.

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Planes spotting torpedoes, every fcking ship at high tiers have 1-2 planes circling them, not including cvs.

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The AP damage on dds.  This is an arcade.  If you as a BB player see  a DD up ahead.  Think ahead 30 seconds and switch to HE or not and die.  

As it stands now BBs can get out of issues just by shooting AP at it and praying to RNG.  DDs need to think in advance about 2 minutes to avoid situations where they will be trapped by big guns, not to include having to deal with radar, hydro, etc.  Removing one of the things to worry about would vastly improve DD play.   

 

if if you want to bring the real world into this... look at the Johnston.  Supposedly took 3 18 inch shells like a champ and, after a short repair time, got back into the fight.  

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Nothing here that hasn't already been said..

1.  Reduce/eliminate permaspotting of torpedoes by aircraft.

2.  Lower gun bloom duration based on caliber.

3.  Eliminate radar/hydro through islands.

Not that I see any of the aforementioned changes being made, its nice to dream.

B

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On 3/4/2018 at 4:51 PM, xovian said:

Lots of people play DD's. Some off and on, some as mains, and of course there are some that never do.
As far as damage/XP earned I feel DD's are high risk but not high reward.  This is what appeals to many.

So the question is, what one thing in the entire game would you change, or would want to see when you are playing a DD?

For me it is simply, we are "required" for spotting and caps, but there's nothing worse then a team that refuses not only support but out right abandons the mission objectives so they don't get their paint scratched.

Exhibit A:

detonatetobehere.thumb.png.97afc7400873c91b67921f0500b20a1f.png

 

The marked area for maps of this type I'd change it to where after the first 5 minutes of the game, excluding CV, you enter this area, you detonate...no questions asked, and no rewards...just a repair bill.
If a flag was added similar to TK, would be even better, but that would be more then one thing, so i digress.
Abandoning your comrades, and completely ignoring the mission objectives would be considered treason by many countries.

Every DD has seen the exact scenario i show above, where just one enemy is there but you are abandoned  to fend for yourself. This type of play IMO should be punished.
 

This is just my one change, what would be yours when you play  a DD?

^This type of play is getting worse and worse as more and more players don't understand how to win at this game.  They're more concerned with kills and not dying than playing caps and game objectives for a team win.

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