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Midnitewolf

Did the Alsace get a last minute Nerf??

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So I managed to snag a Richelieu from one of the crates and diligently grinded XP to insure I could get the Alasce as soon as I got home from work last night.   I have exceptionally excited because the Youtube previews were singing its praises.  Decently tough, fast, excellent gun layout and accurate guns they said.  One even said don't bother with the aiming module because the gun accuracy was good enough that you didn't need it.

Whelp, I sure as hell am not seeing anything accurate about the guns.  They are shotgun at best and I  am having trouble landing hits on perfectly broadside targets at 12-15 km away.  Seems 90% of my shells either land long or short with zero consistency.

So does anyone know if they did a last minute nerf or something because it just doesn't seem the same ship that was previewed?

Also has the range on its guns always been this short.  It is just a huge shocker to go from the 26 km range on the Richelieu to 18-20 km range on the Alsace especially as far as I can tell they both use the exact same guns as well as turrets for that matter.  I know WG adjusts the max range to the height of the fire directors but from looking at images and plans, the Alsace seems to have it directors just has high as the Richelieu so with the same guns and turrets, shouldn't it have nearly the same firing range?

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Answered my own question.

Stat from Supertest from another post from November.

ST, French Battleship Alsace, tier IX

Hit points - 69000, plating - 32 mm, belt - 275 - 350 mm. Main battery - 3x4 380 mm. Firing range - 21.5 km. HE damage - 5400, AP damage - 11900. Reload time 30 s., 180 degree turn time - 36 s., maximum dispersion - 277 m. HE initial velocity - 830 m/s. AP initial velocity - 830 m/s. Sigma count - 2.0. Maximum speed - 30.4 kt. Turning circle radius - 910 m., rudder shift time - 23.2 s. Surface detectability - 16.7 km, air detectability - 15.1 km. Detectability after firing main guns in smoke - 15.4 km. Anti-torpedo defense damage reduction - 43%.

Looks like the stock stats show 21.5 km before fire control upgrade and a 2.0 sigma on the main guns.   That means it got a massive nerf to both range and gun handling.

Looks like it lost 3 km off its main battery gun range and got a massive sigma nerf since it now has a 1.7 sigma. Ouch.

Now I wish I hadn't spent 20 million credits and 500 gold purchasing, outfitting and retraining a captain for this POS.  No wonder that it just felt so painful to play last night.

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6 minutes ago, Midnitewolf said:

Answered my own question.

Stat from Supertest from another post from November.

ST, French Battleship Alsace, tier IX

Hit points - 69000, plating - 32 mm, belt - 275 - 350 mm. Main battery - 3x4 380 mm. Firing range - 21.5 km. HE damage - 5400, AP damage - 11900. Reload time 30 s., 180 degree turn time - 36 s., maximum dispersion - 277 m. HE initial velocity - 830 m/s. AP initial velocity - 830 m/s. Sigma count - 2.0. Maximum speed - 30.4 kt. Turning circle radius - 910 m., rudder shift time - 23.2 s. Surface detectability - 16.7 km, air detectability - 15.1 km. Detectability after firing main guns in smoke - 15.4 km. Anti-torpedo defense damage reduction - 43%.

Looks like the stock stats show 21.5 km before fire control upgrade and a 2.0 sigma on the main guns.   That means it got a massive nerf to both range and gun handling.

Looks like it lost 3 km off its main battery gun range and got a massive sigma nerf since it now has a 1.7 sigma. Ouch.

Now I wish I hadn't spent 20 million credits and 500 gold purchasing, outfitting and retraining a captain for this POS.  No wonder that it just felt so painful to play last night.

The nerf was not last minute. It happened back in December and was mentioned on the Dev Blog 

 

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6 minutes ago, Midnitewolf said:

Looks like the stock stats show 21.5 km before fire control upgrade and a 2.0 sigma on the main guns.   That means it got a massive nerf to both range and gun handling.

 

Looks like it lost 3 km off its main battery gun range and got a massive sigma nerf since it now has a 1.7 sigma. Ouch.

 

Ouch, I'll pass.

WG needs to a better job of communicating when stats are final.

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My first game in it I did 96k but it was a painful 96k.

Close range could not get anything to land at the water line, most of the shells hit the water way before the target.

I adjusted and stopped shooting waterline altogether and went for all upper armor belt or superstructure.

Other than that the ship performed well, I went with the full concealment, fastest reload possible set up. (screw the range)

I used a very generic captain skill build,  with BFT, AFT, adrenaline rush, concealment, and superintendent.

I even took the dispersion Module which did little to help, I guess after several games I will find that sweet spot where all the shells disperse nicely.

Edited by GUNSTAR_THE_LEGEND

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2 minutes ago, CaptainTeddybear said:

Ouch, I'll pass.

WG needs to a better job of communicating when stats are final.

I think they did alright.  None of the CCs previewed her with 2.0 sigma.  Any footage you saw of Alsace gameplay was with the current statistics.

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1 minute ago, LittleWhiteMouse said:

I think they did alright.  None of the CCs previewed her with 2.0 sigma.  Any footage you saw of Alsace gameplay was with the current statistics.

It is 1.7 Sigma and it also uses the German dispersion?

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12 minutes ago, LittleWhiteMouse said:

I think they did alright.  None of the CCs previewed her with 2.0 sigma.  Any footage you saw of Alsace gameplay was with the current statistics.

Yeah but I do not think it will do well in a tier X heavy match that is dominated by tier X BB's Mouse.

Just does not have enough punch and much like my Missouri I expect to be in tier X matches very often.

But will see the more games players have in it the more effective it may become when not facing tier VII and tier VIII.

But one on one against a Missouri, Iowa, Fred, Musashi, Izumo..... I am not predicting a good outcome so good thing it has speed boost lol

But still the fun factor of this ship is very high.

Edited by GUNSTAR_THE_LEGEND

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The sigma nerf was documented on the dev blog as well. Even then, Alsace is an excellent ship and one I will enjoy playing when I get there.

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Is the dispersion upgrade mandatory? I missed 14 of 16 shells at a broadside Colorado in my Lyon at 11k, I also failed to do more than 3800 to a Duca at 7k full broadside. Felt like I was taking crazy pills.

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Just now, Sweetsie said:

Is the dispersion upgrade mandatory? I missed 14 of 16 shells at a broadside Colorado in my Lyon at 11k, I also failed to do more than 3800 to a Duca at 7k full broadside. Felt like I was taking crazy pills.

I took it and after the match i had to go back and make sure i actually did put it on lol

 

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1 minute ago, GUNSTAR_THE_LEGEND said:

I took it and after the match i had to go back and make sure i actually did put it on lol

 

That is not encouraging. Yikes!

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6 minutes ago, Sweetsie said:

Is the dispersion upgrade mandatory? I missed 14 of 16 shells at a broadside Colorado in my Lyon at 11k, I also failed to do more than 3800 to a Duca at 7k full broadside. Felt like I was taking crazy pills.

Weird, Lyon is currently my favorite bote to take on the unclean masses, dang their dirty souls.

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Alsace is fine, a great ship. Make sure you slot Aiming Sys 1 in that 3rd upgrade, will help with obliterating dds and cruisers/

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I've done a full secondary build on the Alsace and I don't have a problem.  

I'm aggressive and push into secondary range (11.3km) and with the 26.4 second reload it's a blast.

I took her into co-op to complete most The Gold of France missions (400+ ribbons per game, most coming from secondaries) and played with play style to find what worked for me.

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I find Alsace to be hit-or-miss (having played her on PTS). The line in general appears to suffer from this.

That said, I find her fun, and my experience with PTS Alsace led me to having a good first game with her in the live release. She's best-suited to supporting an advance, rather than leading it. Push up alongside some Germans and add your firepower to theirs. If you spec for secondaries, Alsace can more or less match FdG/GK when fully spec'd, further adding to the firestorm while still bringing in a fair bit of punch. If you spec for main guns and survivability, you can cut the reload some with the reload module and use EM to regain some lost traverse.

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28 minutes ago, CaptainTeddybear said:

It is 1.7 Sigma and it also uses the German dispersion?

Yes, and twelve guns.  It's amazing the number of problems that are solved by having a lot of guns.

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Whats less encouraging is a guy in my Clan has the Tier X version.

I asked him what he thought because i was about to get it as well.

He said the dispersion was very annoying much like the big guns of the Conqueror only slightly better.

 

 

Edited by GUNSTAR_THE_LEGEND
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9 minutes ago, LittleWhiteMouse said:

Yes, and twelve guns.  It's amazing the number of problems that are solved by having a lot of guns.

 

Hard to have too much dakka dakka.

 

7boVRhK.jpg

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17 minutes ago, Battlecruiser_Lutzow said:

This whole tree in a single .gif:

3b7WZ.gif

The Tier 5 is just awful.  Bad gun firing arcs plus horrible accuracy. 

The Tier 6 is a bit better, but pray you don’t see Torpedo planes. 

The Tier 7 Lyon is a “gudbote” to borrow LWM’s term. 12 rifles do indeed make up for the nice open-choke shotgun dispersion.  It actually helps when shooting at DDs.  Only 10 battles in her but average damage is just under 70k with 1.4 kills per battle. (Not great for purple people eaters but good for me)

I'm excited about getting the Alsace eventually. 

Edited by Landing_Skipper

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1 minute ago, Landing_Skipper said:

The Tier 5 is just awful.  Bad gun firing arcs plus horrible accuracy. 

The Tier 6 is a bit better, but pray you don’t see Torpedo planes. 

The Tier 7 Lyon is a “gudbote” to borrow LWM’s term. 12 rifles do indeed make up for the nice open-choke shotgun dispersion.  It actually helps when shooting at DDs.  Only 10 battles in her but average damage is just under 70k with 1.4 kills per battle. 

I'm excited about getting the Alsace eventually. 

I've been very unimpressed - bordering on outright disappointed - with what I have seen from Richelieus thus far, however. Not that I would willingly play tier 8 these days...

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To be fair, the French cruisers also underwhelmed at launch and they've proven to be one of the most balanced lines introduced to date.  I have high hopes that the French battleships will have a similar track record.

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4 minutes ago, Landing_Skipper said:

The Tier 7 Lyon ~. 12 rifles ~

16 guns you mean. Even still I haven't particularly like the Lyon. Fuso and New Mex were shotguns, Lyon feels like I'm just tossing birdshot from my bare hands. Slow velocity and terrible accuracy.

Only Richie and Alsace could possibly save this line for me. Inspite of Dunk's accuracy, giving me that playstyle at tier 8 would be ok for me. And Alsace at least has the title for most guns on a tier 9 BB (12).

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55 minutes ago, CaptainTeddybear said:

It is 1.7 Sigma and it also uses the German dispersion?

It also has 12 guns, compared to 9 on the other T9 battleships.

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