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Happy668

Des Moines good?

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What's the problem with Des Moines? 5.5sec reload, should do more damage than Moskva or Hindenburg (12sec reload), but statistics show 64k vs 75k? range too short?

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7 minutes ago, Happy668 said:

What's the problem with Des Moines? 5.5sec reload, should do more damage than Moskva or Hindenburg (12sec reload), but statistics show 64k vs 75k? range too short?

Probably shoots dds more than spamming bbs for dmg farming. 

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More than range its the floaty shell arcs. It is hard(er) to hit at ranges of 13km+. It is also squishy from the sides.

That said. DM best CA.

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10 minutes ago, Happy668 said:

What's the problem with Des Moines? 5.5sec reload, should do more damage than Moskva or Hindenburg (12sec reload), but statistics show 64k vs 75k? range too short?

It plays differently than the Hindenberg and Moskva.  Those two cruisers excel at range and can take hits if properly angled.

The Des Moines has floaty shells which makes ranged combat harder, and it takes more damage.  It is best when dug into a strong position and able to rain death down from cover.  It plays similar to an Atlanta, though it is fatter and harder to get away with risky play given that Tier 10 gunnery is so damn accurate compared to Tier 7.

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DM's best partner is an island.. find one and make love to it

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Basically what has been said: floaty shells and takes a paddlin pretty easy...radar is fun though and being a straight up AA no fly zone is fun.

 

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DM is so far my favorite tier 10 ship. It can deal massive damage to BBs from behind islands even at longer ranges (because BBs are big and slow), and it can beat any cruiser at close ranges (10km or less) as long as it remains angled. It also comes with 27mm bow, which is a great incentive to put your man pants when facing BBs with 380mm guns. AA is godlike, radar lasts for ever and can force any DD to run away (and to those who try to stay, DM has 5.5 things to say to them). AP is great, HE is great. It just demands good positioning and map awareness from the players, and good aim adjustment to deal with the slow shells. There's a reason why it's called Des Memes.

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34 minutes ago, Happy668 said:

What's the problem with Des Moines? 5.5sec reload, should do more damage than Moskva or Hindenburg (12sec reload), but statistics show 64k vs 75k? range too short?

It's good NOW. Because it seems WG wants to make ISLANDS FOR EVERYONE a thing for new maps.

But once that changes, or radar gets a remake, Des Moines will be less optimal than other cruisers. A cruiser without torp armament is very frustrating at later half of the match when surviving enemy BBs are still too healthy to get burned down and is charging at you.

Edited by NeutralState

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DM has a very high skill floor.  Which means that unless you really understand what you're doing, people are going to suck driving a DM.  Moskva and Hindy are much more "average" player friendly.

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2 minutes ago, NeutralState said:

It's good NOW. Because it seems WG wants to make ISLANDS FOR EVERYONE a thing for new maps.

But once that changes, or radar gets a remake, Des Moines will be less optimal than other cruisers. A cruiser without torp armament is very frustrating at later half of the match when surviving enemy BBs are still too healthy to get burned down and is charging at you.

 

Islands are not going anywhere.  The old big open high tier maps are terrible and boring.

 

They went through a phase where they were doing backflips redesigning maps to make them more BBaddy friendly then they realized what a terrible game that ends up in.  

 

Radar isn't going anywhere either.  There are only a couple of people who are terrible at the game and refuse to learn that keep crying about it.  

 

And torpedos?  Really?  Zao has the best torps on any cruiser and short range Des Moines AP will kill a BB before the torps can travel the distance.  You don't "burn down" a BB late game. You pick a 1v1 fight, at close range.  If you catch a Yamatomato with guns forward and pop up on the side he won't even get a shot off.

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9 minutes ago, Pope_Shizzle said:

DM has a very high skill floor.  Which means that unless you really understand what you're doing, people are going to suck driving a DM.  Moskva and Hindy are much more "average" player friendly.

Hindy especially lends itself to kiting around raining 1/4 pen HE on BBs.  It's less valuable damage than blapping DDs, but there is a lot of it.

Even with a good captain in each the Hindy will average more damage, but the Des Moines will win more games.

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fire behind island? shells seems get blocked while red team has no problem reaching you... how does that work?

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The DM is a tough cookie. Although it can die fairly quickly if placed in a wrong spot.Use her strengths and you survive the battle with top scores everytime.

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51 minutes ago, Happy668 said:

What's the problem with Des Moines? 5.5sec reload, should do more damage than Moskva or Hindenburg (12sec reload), but statistics show 64k vs 75k? range too short?

Paper thin armor that can't stand up to ... anything. This prevents her from racking up larger amounts of damage, because as soon as anything shoots back, she dies.

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1 minute ago, FleetAdmiral_Assassin said:

Paper thin armor that can't stand up to ... anything. This prevents her from racking up larger amounts of damage, because as soon as anything shoots back, she dies.

That's not entirely true.

DM does excessively well against 381mm gunned and under battleships.

That said, it's very squishy to 406mm or larger and anything carrying torps.

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2 minutes ago, CLUCH_CARGO said:

The DM is a tough cookie. Although it can die fairly quickly if placed in a wrong spot.Use her strengths and you survive the battle with top scores everytime.

 

Tough?  It's literally the most fragile T10 ship if you count the Minotaur smoke and super heal. Second most fragile if you don't.

 

The trick is surviving while putting your insane DPM to work.

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5 minutes ago, MrDeaf said:

That's not entirely true.

DM does excessively well against 381mm gunned and under battleships.

That said, it's very squishy to 406mm or larger and anything carrying torps.

I have a Des Moines, and she is my favorite USN Cruiser (after Cleveland). However, she loses in most 1 v 1 fights against other cruisers (German cruisers even 2 tiers lower will WRECK a Des Moines). Every BB in the game will wreck a Des Moines.

My Gearing fears a Des Moines' radar, not her guns. If the Des Moines isn't angled perfectly, my Gearing will kill it faster than it can kill me.

They made the USN cruisers too weak. if they aren't at the perfect range and at the perfect angle - they'll get blown out of the water by just about everything.

Agree with what @Grizley said

Edited by FleetAdmiral_Assassin

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3 minutes ago, Grizley said:

 

Tough?  It's literally the most fragile T10 ship if you count the Minotaur smoke and super heal. Second most fragile if you don't.

 

The trick is surviving while putting your insane DPM to work.

Ok I worded this wrong Tough Cookie to learn. If you bothered to read beyond the first trigger you would've seen my point.

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The Des Moines has the slowest shells in the game of any Heavy Cruiser.

So she has floaty shells and pretty shory range for a Tier 10 Cruiser. On top of that she doesn't have great armor compared to the other Tier 10 heavy Cruisers, so hits HURT.

So she can do damage in a hurry, but doesn't excel in long range fights, which is most Tier 10 battles, and when she does get closer she's very vulnerable, which is very bad in the heavy BB meta.

This goes without mentioning she'll spend more time than her counter parts out of range and missing targets.

One of the reasons she's fallen so badly in Clan Wars is because the maps are more open, which we've seen give rise to the use of DDs as well, and another Hindenburg and only 1 Moskva in the standard setup for many clans.

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My DM is my very first choice for clan battles.  I will consistently average 60K damage.  And on a 1v1 against another cruiser, I will usually prevail (75%).    I love broadsides on any cruiser.  If I can't citadel the s*$t out of them, I can burn them to the waterline.  

In Randoms, I don't like it.  It is a target and anything with a gun is going to shoot at you.  You REALLY have to focus on positioning and situational awareness.  And one wrong turn, that Yamato just detonated your butt.  

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Basically what Pope said and the fact it's stats get brought down by the slew of players trying to do well in it that do not.

it is also not a big deal to average 80K in the DM.

You can contribute so much more to a match with it than just damage.

I like using the reload mod to get the reload down even more because range mod is for pusses and it also negates your good concealment if you are spamming HE shells from max range. 

It is best to maximize you ninja skill and Deliver that devastating AP.

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Average damage done is just for reference.
If we truly want to determine how they are doing in offence-wise, we need average % of health they dealt per match instead of absolute numbers.

Which WG rarely want to share with us, sadly.

Des Moines is not weak, just require more knowledge and intellect of player to be effective as some already mentioned.
I even believe US Cruisers aren't weak at all in every tier (yes,  pre-buff Pensacola was decent ship, although I admit it was also very difficult ship to play) 
If you think she is rather weak T10 cruiser, you clearly don't know what to do with her OR have not faced good DM players in random/CB, truly fortunate for you.

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I just got mine and play co-op with her, plays like a Atlanta on steroids except you don't have torpedoes.  Just for kicks and to find out how tough she is, I charged 2 battleships who are broadsided to me.  Managed to sink 1 and heavily damaged the other before I was blown out of the water.  Those fast pew pew pew heavy guns can really do a number on even of the most heavily armored ships.

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