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NeutralState

A Set Map Rotation Is Beneficial

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WoWS needs a map rotation on a weekly bases. It'd make the "meta" more predictable, thus, empowering the players to be PRO-active in their ship/captain builds/selections.

A map rotation also solves the problem of map monotony and can bring out some "unpopular" maps (aka the ones that are actually well designed) to light every once a while.

A rotation also will make he map pool look bigger and lessen the demand for new maps. 

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I think making them predictable could be a mistake because you would have some players that just avoid certain days of playing and leave the server wait times much longer. I think they just need to add a little more spin to the bias of the map rotation and take it more towards rotating them on a "schedule" based off of the current meta and instead try and do a more RNG based system. (they may have this already what do I know)

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Nothing wrong with players choosing certain maps because they are good at them and like them.  After all many games have choices of maps in which to battle to their liking.  Heck you can have the MM programmed to have some maps NEVER to be played.

But as for New Maps - sooner or later you need some NEW maps with elements that they have which the old maps do not have. You can't keep churning the same old/new maps without some new developed maps.  New ships sailing in OLD maps will still not get it. WOW will have to learn that players get tired of the same old - same old.  As much as WOW spends on ship development - they will have to spend time on map development as well with no profit. It's just an investment so that players invest into the game. 

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31 minutes ago, dionkraft said:

Nothing wrong with players choosing certain maps because they are good at them and like them.  After all many games have choices of maps in which to battle to their liking.  Heck you can have the MM programmed to have some maps NEVER to be played.

But as for New Maps - sooner or later you need some NEW maps with elements that they have which the old maps do not have. You can't keep churning the same old/new maps without some new developed maps.  New ships sailing in OLD maps will still not get it. WOW will have to learn that players get tired of the same old - same old.  As much as WOW spends on ship development - they will have to spend time on map development as well with no profit. It's just an investment so that players invest into the game. 

Yes, there is absolutely something wrong with this.  Players should never be able to choose which maps to play and which ones to avoid.  They should have to play ALL maps.

I do agree that they need new maps.  Unfortunately, I have very little faith in these people to produce good maps.  IMO, the newest map Sleeping Giant is just another high tier clone map.  3 rows of open water North, 3 rows of open water in the south, and 4 rows of islands in between.  In other words, just another boring clone map.

 

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1 hour ago, NeutralState said:

WoWS needs a map rotation on a weekly bases. It'd make the "meta" more predictable, thus, empowering the players to be PRO-active in their ship/captain builds/selections.

A map rotation also solves the problem of map monotony and can bring out some "unpopular" maps (aka the ones that are actually well designed) to light every once a while.

A rotation also will make the map pool look bigger and lessen the demand for new maps. 

I think that there's already a map rotation, though perhaps not how you envision it.

I'm not entirely sure how you envision a map rotation, but if it's done on a weekly basis, it seems like that would make maps MORE monotonous, not less.

What I've advocated, but I haven't see any map changes in this direction is to create alternate versions of maps.  Not the maps themselves per se, but alternate versions of the cap and spawn locations.  It seems to me that when you place caps and spawns in different locations on familiar maps, those maps feel different and play differently.  And that would make the map pool feel larger than it really was, without requiring the creation of lots of truly new maps.

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Anyone who has experience in competitive shooters understands that many players will "game" a set map rotation.  In direct application, some will only bring certain ships to a map.  Some will avoid maps altogether that they do not fair well in.  While there are valid points to a set rotation, there are also some serious negatives.  And, with pressure to obtain the highest WTR and/or WR for Clan agendas, the possibility is undeniable.  I've been in games where players would wait for a certain map and never play the others, causing all kinds of imbalance and queue issues.  With the OP's already stated desire to build a ship and captain for a certain map, one can comprehend how this might play out.

 

More and better maps is the most logical solution.      

Edited by Uber_Ghost

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4 hours ago, Crucis said:

Yes, there is absolutely something wrong with this.  Players should never be able to choose which maps to play and which ones to avoid.  They should have to play ALL maps.

I do agree that they need new maps.  Unfortunately, I have very little faith in these people to produce good maps.  IMO, the newest map Sleeping Giant is just another high tier clone map.  3 rows of open water North, 3 rows of open water in the south, and 4 rows of islands in between.  In other words, just another boring clone map.

 

Well we fundamentally disagree on the map selection vs no map selection when playing.  But we both agree on NEW Maps being constructed in any event. The only thing I see here is that there seems to be a lack of interest in the player population to submit their creations and suggestion as to why that one should be considered. I have put up my own designs but there was little enthusiasm in others submissions.  Most game developer would LOVE to see submissions so that they can get some fresh ideas and thus more player draw into their game.  But not here...It's one thing to want to play a map because you know its little nuances and your good at it but playing on maps that just don't interest you just is a let down. Well thats my opinion and not everyone will agree as always.LOL!

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Maps are needed. Less Channel Fighting more tactical fighting more encouraged Team Effort types. I find believe it or not Operations has a good mix of all of the above. The actual battle dictates what and when something needs done. The Narrative  gives good direction. I don't like fighting bots but this is a relaxing fun time.

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41 minutes ago, CLUCH_CARGO said:

Maps are needed. Less Channel Fighting more tactical fighting more encouraged Team Effort types. I find believe it or not Operations has a good mix of all of the above. The actual battle dictates what and when something needs done. The Narrative  gives good direction. I don't like fighting bots but this is a relaxing fun time.

I wish that they'd rotate the operations on a daily basis rather than a weekly basis.

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2 hours ago, dionkraft said:

Well we fundamentally disagree on the map selection vs no map selection when playing.  But we both agree on NEW Maps being constructed in any event. The only thing I see here is that there seems to be a lack of interest in the player population to submit their creations and suggestion as to why that one should be considered. I have put up my own designs but there was little enthusiasm in others submissions.  Most game developer would LOVE to see submissions so that they can get some fresh ideas and thus more player draw into their game.  But not here...It's one thing to want to play a map because you know its little nuances and your good at it but playing on maps that just don't interest you just is a let down. Well that's my opinion and not everyone will agree as always. LOL!

Dion, what it comes down to for me is that I don't think that one should ever be able to skip out on any map or battle mode.  I think that you should have to play all of them, or play a different game.

As for the map thing, I could submit map ideas, but I'm not an artist so anything I submitted would be rather crude.  Now, I probably wouldn't mind so much if these were private submissions to the devs.  But to put them out in the forum publically would open me up for ridicule, which is unacceptable.  And it's not ridicule about map ideas.  it'd be the ridicule over how crude the map ideas might look due to a lack of artistic talent.

See, I think that there's at least two parts to map making.  There's the conceptual part, where you come up with the general layout, etc.   And then there's the production, the building of the actual in-game map.  I think that WG does a fine job with the latter, as the maps look excellent aesthetically. My problem is that I don't like their idea of good maps from a conceptual point of view.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Crucis said:

Dion, what it comes down to for me is that I don't think that one should ever be able to skip out on any map or battle mode.  I think that you should have to play all of them, or play a different game.

As for the map thing, I could submit map ideas, but I'm not an artist so anything I submitted would be rather crude.  Now, I probably wouldn't mind so much if these were private submissions to the devs.  But to put them out in the forum publically would open me up for ridicule, which is unacceptable.  And it's not ridicule about map ideas.  it'd be the ridicule over how crude the map ideas might look due to a lack of artistic talent.

See, I think that there's at least two parts to map making.  There's the conceptual part, where you come up with the general layout, etc.   And then there's the production, the building of the actual in-game map.  I think that WG does a fine job with the latter, as the maps look excellent aesthetically. My problem is that I don't like their idea of good maps from a conceptual point of view.

 

 

Okay how about this..You don't need to paint the picture but merely conceptionalize it for the artist to draw it later.  I mean..lots of artwork is not finalized right at the beginning..it goes thru a stage of  tweaks and even major revamps in order to make it better.

There gonna be some mistakes or worse whole sale erasure of some parts as there was a change of ideas..the original sounded good but got dropped kicked because either a better modification came out of development. Its one of those things..its a work in progress LOL!  It really is...No matter what though..you get credit it for it even if the end product was not what you totally envisioned.  In actuality - graphing the image is the easiest part...its the parts themselves and how they fit together is what takes grey matter!  

It all starts with some paper and pencil to doddle your concepts...Don't worry about what others say..can they do better or have they tried?   You know the answer to that.  Nyet!   We will see how this all pans out as we go!   

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On 2/20/2018 at 1:49 PM, Crucis said:

Yes, there is absolutely something wrong with this.  Players should never be able to choose which maps to play and which ones to avoid.  They should have to play ALL maps.

I do agree that they need new maps.  Unfortunately, I have very little faith in these people to produce good maps.  IMO, the newest map Sleeping Giant is just another high tier clone map.  3 rows of open water North, 3 rows of open water in the south, and 4 rows of islands in between.  In other words, just another boring clone map.

 

My clan loves sleeping Giant.  After failing the first attempt at it, we developed an aggressive and extremely ballsy strategy that has put us on a nice victory streak on that map.  All the while being chaotic, and full of surprise ambushes.  We're closing in on Typhoon and hope to see this map many more times. 

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Then people would complain that map rotation isn't random enough, you know, for unpredictability.

It never ends...

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2 hours ago, SFM_Hobb3s said:

My clan loves sleeping Giant.  After failing the first attempt at it, we developed an aggressive and extremely ballsy strategy that has put us on a nice victory streak on that map.  All the while being chaotic, and full of surprise ambushes.  We're closing in on Typhoon and hope to see this map many more times. 

Blah.  Like I said before, it's no different from any of the other clone maps.  3 rows of open water north, 3 rows of open water south, and 4 rows in the middle with islands arranged in whatever pattern suits the map designer's fancy that day.  Boring.  Same old, same old, time after time.  No originality.

 

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2 hours ago, Kuckoo said:

Then people would complain that map rotation isn't random enough, you know, for unpredictability.

It never ends...

Kuckoo, it's not random enough because there are too many maps that are so damned similar to each other that no matter how random the maps are, they're predictable because there's so little difference, particularly in the high tier maps.

 

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